India-China 2020 Border conflict

Suhaldev

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By patrolling, we dominate area, NOT control. Control is of situation, battlefield , operations etc. Patrol is an op that enables domination by observation n fire. They check, remove any unwanted element and return to their base. That’s why armies don’t occupy every inch.

 

Suhaldev

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On 2 front war

This should be answered by Political leadership and MoD. I was in attendance of a presentation on two front war. At the end of the discussion the Def Secy commented India will not fight any conventional war in next 2 decades atleast & thus Army should focus on proxy war in J&K.

Mil Generals were mocked by Diplomats, bureaucrats & politicians whenever they raised issue of 2 front war. Diplomats always thundered they will manage one front & mil must manage other front. Unfortunately we dont have Maneckshaw today who could ask questions from Political ldrs



 

mokoman

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Gokhale & Gen Panag combo

My assessment purely based on terrain analysis&open domain info. I do not interact with serving soldiers or govt/mil sources in Delhi. I do have the benefit of having physically been everywhere except Black Top. I have no hesitation in correcting myself.


:dude: Sounds like he just got a beating from top.

Good or bad news , better not believe anything on social media .
 

ezsasa

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New Expression:

“Don’t pull a cheeni” : Say one thing and do something else all together.

Usage :

1) John told me yesterday he will hold his end of the bargain , today he bailed on me and sold it to the other guy. John pulled a cheeni on me.

2) I asked David to stop his construction work as it on my property, he said we will negotiate, while we were negotiating at the bar other side of the town, his people went ahead with the construction, David pulled a cheeni on me.
 
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Bhadra

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Guys a lot of misinformation if floating around Depsang, lets break it.

1. whole 1k sq km lost is wrong (thehindu), 900 sq km lost is wrong too (wire, Sushant singh which wrote that piece was fired from IE few days back due to such dubious claims in his columns)

2. PLA never went back to Indian claimed LAC during 2013, succesfully did salami slicing. (loss of that territory is trying to be compensated in these big claims)

3. Reality: yes patrolling points are not accessible but PLA is also not physically presently on that terrain but whenever we are trying to patrol those area, they suddenly come and stops us. Probable reason behind can be increase infra radar etc on there side (see detrsfa) through which they can easily detect out movements.

The Chinese instrument of browbeating the Indian Army's professional advice by pushing contentious issues to CSG must clarify what they did about Chinese intrusion in Depsang in and after 2013. Was the Indian Army told to restore the sanctity of LAC in no unambiguous terms.

If my guess is correct - they must have overruled Army and given new patrolling limit to ITBP as SSN was / is with ITBP. The new patrolling limit must have been just quite short of Chinese intrusions. MMS could not have afforded a hulla-gulla in public when elections were following in 2014.

This certainly puts spotlight on role and functioning of CSG ..
 

doreamon

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Guys, i know it's gobar times but this is some serious escalation.
Nothing new .. They keep posting stuff like this.. To keep china man on edge . I have noticed atleast 3 times chinese soldiers on taiwan front or indian front writting last letter to their families . Showing war is near..

But nothing happens..They might have written so many letters by now that their family members wld have been bored by it .. whn ev next letter comes they ll say " here it comes again .. next time fckng call okay !!"
 

ezsasa

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On 2 front war

This should be answered by Political leadership and MoD. I was in attendance of a presentation on two front war. At the end of the discussion the Def Secy commented India will not fight any conventional war in next 2 decades atleast & thus Army should focus on proxy war in J&K.

Mil Generals were mocked by Diplomats, bureaucrats & politicians whenever they raised issue of 2 front war. Diplomats always thundered they will manage one front & mil must manage other front. Unfortunately we dont have Maneckshaw today who could ask questions from Political ldrs



The guy should also mention which year was this..

It looks like Folks are crawling out of their caves to create a wedge between MEA & MoD.
 

cereal killer

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On 2 front war

This should be answered by Political leadership and MoD. I was in attendance of a presentation on two front war. At the end of the discussion the Def Secy commented India will not fight any conventional war in next 2 decades atleast & thus Army should focus on proxy war in J&K.

Mil Generals were mocked by Diplomats, bureaucrats & politicians whenever they raised issue of 2 front war. Diplomats always thundered they will manage one front & mil must manage other front. Unfortunately we dont have Maneckshaw today who could ask questions from Political ldrs



Goodness gracious when did this happen? Do these politicians live in a hole somewhere that they don't even know about the threat & then casually laugh about. I don't agree with the things written by the author.. But what other dude is claiming is shocking. I hope for heavens sake this ain't true
 

bajiraopeshwa

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Article in the Week


In the article Lt. Gen. Ahuja says

“He (Xi) is unlikely to be able to take any substantial punitive action against India with any degree of guaranteed success.”
 

DownWithCCP

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Goodness gracious when did this happen? Do these politicians live in a hole somewhere that they don't even know about the threat & then casually laugh about. I don't agree with the things written by the author.. But what other dude is claiming is shocking. I hope for heavens sake this ain't true
Some random dude on the internet: Bro *makes a crazy amusing statement*
Some other dude: Sources
That dude: Trust me bro I was there.
 

shade

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Goodness gracious when did this happen? Do these politicians live in a hole somewhere that they don't even know about the threat & then casually laugh about. I don't agree with the things written by the author.. But what other dude is claiming is shocking. I hope for heavens sake this ain't true
Politicians, top brass, babus etc have large sums of cash offshore, kids either settled in Anglophone countries or in the process of being settled, etc etc.
So in the event that their ass is in the firing line, either politically after losing a war or after occupation by the enemy, they can simply be on a flight to whatever foreign country there is.
In other words, nothing is at stake, they do not care.

Some random dude on the internet: Bro *makes a crazy amusing statement*
Some other dude: Sources
That dude: Trust me bro I was there.
Those tweets maybe jhumlebaazi, but seeing the behavior of GoI all these years you can be sure the possibility of a two front war( or even a single front conventional war ) is not taken seriously in the corridors of power.


China is going exactly as Nazi Germany. It will fight a multi-front war.
Nazi Germany started out nibbling tiny morsels like the Czech country, Austria, Nederlands, Belgium etc etc.
Multi front war bad me aya.
 

Cactus09

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Taiwan scrambles fighter jets as 18 Chinese planes buzz island

 

cereal killer

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Synergy

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Nepal needs to remember that according to UN charter, a country has right to counter attack and hold territory if necessary in self defense.
I think, as soon as we will be able to sort out China, Oli will completely stop barking and can even offer us "Sijda" and "Paibos".

Oli is like a child who is seeking attention but nobody is giving him any.
I'm not against the common people of Nepal but if the majority also think/continue to think us as enemy, we just need to completely seal our border. let China supply them all the commodities.
and just for a reference, one month's cost for that will be couple of times of Nepal's gdp.

at first let them survive without us, then we can think/judge if we will continue to be enemies or friends.

at this point in time, Oli is just a distraction and we'd eliminate any distraction to concentrate on the matter in question.
 

Synergy

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With the hell-like winters of the Himalayas setting in along Eastern Ladakh, India could be preparing to teach China lesson, if the need arises. While many would believe that such an offensive would be limited to the Indian armed forces pushing China into its own side of the Line of Actual Control, it is highly possible that the Indian establishment authorises the very physical integration of Aksai Chin, currently under illegal Chinese occupation, with India. For the same, the Modi government is leaving no stone unturned and has mounted a huge logistics support exercise, transporting essentials for the Indian Army to brave the winters this year.

Whether it be winter clothes and military gear, ammunition or food and oil, the Indian side is stocking up as though an all-out war with China is imminent. The same makes much sense too, as the ‘quiet’ along the LAC in Eastern Ladakh, or for that matter, along the entire de facto border with China is momentary, and one does not know when the tensions between both the sides will spiral out of control. When they do, it would make complete sense for India to take back what has been lost from it, and integrate Aksai Chin with Ladakh once and for all.

During the 1950s, the People’s Republic of China built a 1,200 km (750 mi) road connecting Xinjiang and western Tibet, of which 179 km (112 mi) ran south of the Johnson Line through the Aksai Chin region claimed by India, thereby proving how China had undertaken construction activity in sovereign Indian territory. Post the 1962-war, which India lost due to a dilapidated political leadership, the region has been under the firm yet illegal occupation of China.

India to this day claims Aksai Chin as a part of its own territory. To the same effect, Defence Minister Rajnath Singh, while addressing the Rajya Sabha on Thursday, stated, “China continues to be in illegal occupation of approximately 38,000 sq. kms in the Union Territory of Ladakh.” “In addition, under the so-called Sino-Pakistan ‘Boundary Agreement’ of 1963, Pakistan illegally ceded 5,180 sq. km of Indian territory in PoK to China. China also claims approximately 90,000 sq. kms of Indian territory in the Eastern Sector of the India-China boundary in Arunachal Pradesh,” he added.

Last year, Union Home Minister Amit Shah had made an aggressive pitch in the country’s parliament for the reclamation of territories like Pakistan-occupied-Kashmir and Aksai Chin, which were under illegal occupation by Pakistan and China respectively, as he went on to say that he and the government are willing to lay down their lives for the said territories.

The Indian military has already moved more than 150,000 tonnes of materials into Ladakh which includes vast quantities of ammunition, equipment, fuel, winter supplies and food. This shows how India is digging its heels deep into the snow and ice of Ladakh, as it prepares to brave the Winters, and perhaps even free Aksai Chin from the clutches of the Chinese if it gets the go-ahead from New Delhi.

China is visibly shocked, and their silence for the past one week in Eastern Ladakh is more of a sign of confusion than that of surrender. Ever since the Indian Army, SFF and ITBP turned the tables on the PLA by occupying a number of strategic heights along the Pangong Tso lake, the Chinese are scratching their heads and wondering as to what hit them. Further, they realise that the Indian side has a far greater advantage over them in Pangong Tso lake now, which is also the greatest friction point between the two countries.

Caught in an unbearably disadvantageous position, and knowing that an all-out Indian offensive for any Chinese mischief was now imminent, Xi Jinping deputed his Defence Minister to beg for a meeting with his Indian counterpart, Rajnath Singh, who on the sidelines of the SCO summit no less than straightened the Chinese Defence Minister for his country’s trespasses in Eastern Ladakh.

Dr S. Jaishankar, India’s Foreign Minister also conveyed to Wang Yi, his counterpart from China that India was willing to disengage, but the onus around the same would lie solely with China, which is rather infamous for walking back on its commitments. With no visible change in the ground situation yet, and an uneasy calm prevailing along the LAC for the past one week, it is highly likely that China is willing to surrender. It is also likely that they are strategizing their next offences against India, in which case they will have to part ways with Aksai Chin.

The Chinese PLA is in no position to fight a winter war with India. While Indian troops are battle-hardened and seamlessly brave each winter being acclimatised to the region, the bulk of Chinese forces have been pulled into the region only very recently, with none of them having experienced, leave alone survived the Himalayan winters ever before. Fighting a war in such conditions is a no brainer for them. If matters escalate hereon, China will lose what it calls Aksai Chin forever. India is both irritated with the red-rogue country and also frustrated with it. If China does not revert to status quo ante prior to May 2020, India might just force a new status quo down their throats forcibly, which will have them crying for the remainder of their lives.


Yes. many eminent personalities were/are saying T90 isn't there for defence, it's for offence.
 

shade

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I think, as soon as we will be able to sort out China, Oli will completely stop barking and can even offer us "Sijda" and "Paibos".

Oli is like a child who is seeking attention but nobody is giving him any.
I'm not against the common people of Nepal but if the majority also think/continue to think us as enemy, we just need to completely seal our border. let China supply them all the commodities.
and just for a reference, one month's cost for that will be couple of times of Nepal's gdp.

at first let them survive without us, then we can think/judge if we will continue to be enemies or friends.

at this point in time, Oli is just a distraction and we'd eliminate any distraction to concentrate on the matter in question.
Oli is too filled by Chinese money to do that.
Even if Chongs are humiliated by us PR or Optics wise.

btw you are right, average Nepalols, Bangladeshis, Lankans all see us as enemies, and are more than happy to prostitute their countries to China if it strengthens them against India, these people unironically think that by selling their souls to the Yellow Devil, they can "compete" with India :pound:
It is GoI's fault that these countries aren't shown their place.
 

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