F-35 Joint Strike Fighter

[Bhurki]

Firstly, not all Brahmos must be intercepted with SM-6, some can be intercepted with ESSM, some can be intercepted with RIM-116
Secondly, AB destroyer has 96 VL cells, if it use 48 SM-6 to intercept missiles, the other 48 SM-6 can be used to attack enemy destroyer. How many missiles will the Indian destroyer use to intercept 48 SM-6?

Rim116 is not deployed on destroyers...

But the most likely loadout for a destroyer in anti air mission is
128 essm in 32 quad packed cells +
32 SM6

This leaves another 32 vls for specialised systems like ABM SM3, Asroc, Tomahawk TLAM and AShM.

 

[asianobserve]

Nirbhaya air lauch version will attack moving targets .

How will carrier air wing attack the jets throwing missile from 500 km away that too from unknown directions. That carrier air wing will also be engaged by other jets of Indian air force in air to air battle. Not to mention if carriers are near Indian shore they will be attacked from all kinds of land based cruise missiles including hypersonic shourya with 1800km range.



These are too simplistic scenarios and therefore meaningless.

US military have hundreds of satellites in space to monitor enemy movements. CBGs, being one of the most if not the most important mobile US military asset is always operate under satellite coverage aside from maritime drones, Hawkeye, Poseidon and carrier based fighters' sensors. And now with F-35C which has God-like sensors, no enemy can sneak up on US CBGs.

 

[IndianHawk]

US military have hundreds of satellites in space to monitor enemy movements. CBGs, being one of the most if not the most important mobile US military asset is always operate under satellite coverage aside from Hawkeye, Poseidon and carrier based fighters' sensors.

Thats all good. Once a carrier uses its air wing it's cover is lost. You want your Carrie to be not be found by enemy don't fly plane of it. Cause once a bird takes of the carries it all be tracked back to the carrier.

And if you are in enemy waters their regional satellites will be watching you. For example irnss will keep eye anywhere about 1500-2000km from Indian shore at present state. No carrier can hide within this.

 

[asianobserve]

To maximize its range Bhramos climbs to high altitude in a ballistic trajectory before diving at a certain distance to target.

Now here's an F-35 DAS detecting a rocket from more than 800 (1,300 kms) miles:


So a Bhramos lunched from 500 kms away with its rocket booster and ramjet will be like a spoon full of food before you put it inside your mouth to DAS.

 

[asianobserve]

Thats all good. Once a carrier uses its air wing it's cover is lost. You want your Carrie to be not be found by enemy don't fly plane of it. Cause once a bird takes of the carries it all be tracked back to the carrier.

And if you are in enemy waters their regional satellites will be watching you. For example irnss will keep eye anywhere about 1500-2000km from Indian shore at present state. No carrier can hide within this.

Satellites will not give away CBGs location and so are F-35Cs in full stealth mode.

 

[IndianHawk]

To maximize its range Bhramos climbs to high altitude in a ballistic trajectory before diving at a certain distance to target.

Now here's an F-35 DAS detecting a rocket from more than 800 (1,300 kms) miles:


So a Bhramos lunched from 500 kms away will be like a spoon full of food before you put it inside your mouth to DAS.

What's the point of watching it when you have nothing to stop it. Lol.

For all it's bluster USA hasn't demonstrate supersonic intercepted in terminal S manuvering.

Show me proof.

 

[IndianHawk]

Satellites will not give away CBGs location and so are F-35Cs in full stealth mode.

Bwahaha. You sweet summer child. We are already tracking every single US ship in Indian Ocean . I wish I could show you but pics can't be released. Lol.

 

[asianobserve]

Then here's a good article on the anti-cruise missile capability of F-35.

F-35 sensors help ground interceptors engage “air-breathing” targets
The work took place at White Sands Missile Range in December 2019, according to Lockheed Martin. A pair of US Air Force F-35s were integrated with the US Army’s Integrated Air and Missile Defense Battle Command System (IBCS), with the fighters “providing an airborne sensor capability to successfully detect, track and intercept near simultaneous air-breathing threats.”
https://www.flightglobal.com/fixed-...s-engage-air-breathing-targets/136270.article

Imagine lunching Bhramos which climbs on a ballistic trajectory to extend range before coming down to cruise missile flight path to target.

On the first phase alone F-35Cs will already detect Bhramos lunch (remember the 800+ miles DAS rocket detection test). Then on the second cruise phase to target the F-35C will still be glued to Bhramos which unlike subsonic cruise missiles (the article above talks of testing against air-breathing subsonic cruise missiles) emits more heat due to its ramjet engine.

 

[asianobserve]

What's the point of watching it when you have nothing to stop it. Lol.

For all it's bluster USA hasn't demonstrate supersonic intercepted in terminal S manuvering.

Show me proof.

It's either you're sorely misinformed or just not open to facts. Here's a video of US Navy's GQM-163A Coyote Mach3+ maneuvering target missile. Do you think the Americans have not perfected shooting this kind of threat by now?

The USN has been practicing against supersonic AShM since USSR had it.


Note this test was done in March 2005 or 15 years ago. That's more than 10 years of testing experience and data and tactics on the USN's part.

 

[StealthFlanker]

Rim116 is not deployed on destroyers..

Check this out
https://www.navy.mil/submit/display.asp?story_id=93551

 

[asianobserve]

As of July 2018 Coyote purchase has been on 12th Lot for 18 missiles. This lot included FMS possibly to Japan, Australia or France.

This should tell us a lot about USN's preparednesss against Bhramos class AShM.

 

[StealthFlanker]

Nirbhaya air lauch version will attack moving targets .
How will carrier air wing attack the jets throwing missile from 500 km away that too from unknown directions. That carrier air wing will also be engaged by other jets of Indian air force in air to air battle. Not to mention if carriers are near Indian shore they will be attacked from all kinds of land based cruise missiles including hypersonic shourya with 1800km range.
These are too simplistic scenarios and therefore meaningless.

Even the air launched Nirbhaya doesn't have IIR or radar seeker so I dont see how it is possible for it to attack moving target.
AEW&C can detect air target from 600 km and they don't even have to station right above the carrier, they can loiter 250-350 km infront of the fleet, and toward the thread direction, any thing want to attack the carrier will be detected by it then attacked by carrier air wing.
Besides, the Nimitz alone can carry about 70-80 fighters, and there are also support from Aegis destroyers, so how many planes does Indian intended to lose in such attack? 100? 200? Or 300 air plane?
Last but not least, I have explained earlier, the combat radius of F-18 alone is 1300 km, increase to 1800 km with XQ-25 tanker, JASSM-XR range is 1600 km, that make a total of 3400 km, so why would the carrier even want to park 1800 km from the shore?
And if you want to talk hypersonic, the HSCW which can be launched from fighter will have double digit Mach speed and range in thounsand of miles, which mean the carrier fleet can literally strike Indian land target with immunity

 

[asianobserve]

Ironically, it might not be kenetic interceptors that are the most potent ship defense systems of USN but EW systems.

AN/SLQ-32

The most well known of these systems is the long-serving and still evolving AN/SLQ-32 Surface Electronic Warfare Improvement Program (SEWIP) found on nearly all large US Navy vessels. In its contemporary form, it has gained the ability to passively detect and geolocate many types of emissions and emitters in the battlespace, significantly adding to situational awareness of the vessels that it is installed on, as well as other platforms they are connected with via data link, and thus enhancing their collective survivability. It also allows for its guileful electronic warfare capabilities to be employed against communications systems, ships' radars, and other emitters, not just marauding anti-ship cruise missiles and aircraft.

AN/SLQ-59

Transportable Electronic Warfare Module, or TEWM for short was designed from the outset to be rapidly replicated if need be and installed on additional vessels. It is modular and highly adaptable in nature. In other words, it can be reconfigured easily to address emerging threats and can be easily moved physically and integrated onto new platforms or even land installations. Its self contained, shock-resistant, weatherized enclosure was built to be ported over from ship-to-ship as needed. So, while AN/SLQ-32 is highly integrated into the ship it is installed on, AN/SLQ-59 is more of a plug-and-play design. It is also the core component under the regionally tailored SEWIP Block 3T initiative that is now being fielded across the 7th Fleet.

As far as its applications, it is only described as a counter-terminal threat defensive system. In other words, it is built, atleast primarily, to fend off enemy missiles—or other weapons—during their end-game attack on the ship itself. It is also fully networked enabled and can be controlled either by the host ship itself or remotely as part of a larger integrated electronic warfare employment strategy.

Bhramos is particularly vulnerable by EW defenses since it relies on radar homing for terminal guidance.

 

[Assassin 2.0]

Every anti missile system is handi and dandi till the time it get tested in the war zone.
Same things were claimed by patriot and other thaad billion $ systems but they were overpowered by third grade drones.

Even Pakistani also post videos of their some anti ship missile doing maneuvers and BS. But on ground things remain totally different.
Practice against targets is different and practice against real thing is different.

NEW DELHI: The Defence Acquisition Council (DAC), chaired by Defence Minister Rajnath Singh, on Thursday approved procurement of indigenous Software Defined Radio (SDR Tactical) and Next Generation Maritime Mobile Coastal Batteries (Long Range) for the Indian Navy, an official said.

The SDR is a complex and state of art communication system, which has been indigenously designed and developed by Defence Research Development Organisation, Bharat Electronics Ltd and Weapons Electronics System Engineering Establishment (WESEE).
It would enable information sharing, collaboration and situational awareness through high-speed data and secure voice communication with anti-jamming capability, the official added
.

 

[asianobserve]

Let me add other missile decoy system on USN's ships.

Good old Chaff


Mk 59 decoy launching system

Nulka


Nulka is a state-of-the-art autonomous hovering rocket decoy that uses sophisticated electronic signals to ‘seduce’ anti-ship missiles away from their targets

 

[IndianHawk]

Even the air launched Nirbhaya doesn't have IIR or radar seeker so I dont see how it is possible for it to attack moving target.

It's in development .rest assure it will have variants to cover full spectrum of threads.

AEW&C can detect air target from 600 km and they

They'll be the first to be shot down and the can be shot down from 300km away with meteor type sfdr missiles. Same goes for tankers. F18 won't be that's why carrier will have to come near.

Anyway su30 can fly 3000 without any refuelling.
F18 won't be able to touch it open sky's. It will run rings around f18.

Besides, the Nimitz alone can carry about 70-80 fighters, and there are also support from Aegis destroyers, so how many planes does Indian intended to lose in such attack? 100? 200? Or 300 air plane?

It will sinks with airgroup . It's runway will be rendered useless in first wave of supersonic /hypersonic missiles. Unless it stays 2000km away. And if stays 2000km away it can't attack India with f18 or f35.

And if you want to talk hypersonic, the HSCW which can be launched from fighter will have double digit Mach speed and range in thounsand of miles, which mean the carrier fleet can literally strike Indian land target with immunity

You mean HSSW? Then count in bramhos 2 hypersonic missile or russian zircons too in your calculations and see again if your carriers can survive.

Like I said before American haven't demonstrated anything solid to be able to intercept hypersonic/ supersonic weapons. All words no proof.

 

[IndianHawk]

Even the air launched Nirbhaya doesn't have IIR or radar seeker so I dont see how it is possible for it to attack moving target.

It's in development .rest assure it will have variants to cover full spectrum of threads.

AEW&C can detect air target from 600 km and they

They'll be the first to be shot down and the can be shot down from 300km away with meteor type sfdr missiles. Same goes for tankers. F18 won't be that's why carrier will have to come near.

Anyway su30 can fly 3000 without any refuelling.
F18 won't be able to touch it open sky's. It will run rings around f18.

Besides, the Nimitz alone can carry about 70-80 fighters, and there are also support from Aegis destroyers, so how many planes does Indian intended to lose in such attack? 100? 200? Or 300 air plane?

It will sinks with airgroup . It's runway will be rendered useless in first wave of supersonic /hypersonic missiles. Unless it stays 2000km away. And if stays 2000km away it can't attack India with f18 or f35.

And if you want to talk hypersonic, the HSCW which can be launched from fighter will have double digit Mach speed and range in thounsand of miles, which mean the carrier fleet can literally strike Indian land target with immunity

You mean HSSW? Then count in bramhos 2 hypersonic missile or russian zircons too in your calculations and see again if your carriers can survive.

Like I said before American haven't demonstrated anything solid to be able to intercept hypersonic/ supersonic weapons. All words no proof.

 

[IndianHawk]

It's either you're sorely misinformed or just not open to facts. Here's a video of US Navy's GQM-163A Coyote Mach3+ maneuvering target missile. Do you think the Americans have not perfected shooting this kind of threat by now?

The USN has been practicing against supersonic AShM since USSR had it.


Note this test was done in March 2005 or 15 years ago. That's more than 10 years of testing experience and data and tactics on the USN's part.

Coyote is just Mach 2.6 that too at 15-20km .
Also it's range is just 50km . To compare it to bramhos just shows how stupid you are.

No more technical discussion with you. Go home and study for few years.

 

[asianobserve]

Whoa! Why the ad hominem?

Anyway, even Bhramos won't achieve Mach3 at several feet above sea level. Especially not if it's maneuvering. Second, coyote is merely a target missile to test US ship defenses reaction at terminal phase. Coyote does not have to simulate the whole Bhramos travel range since Bhramos will always be detected from lunch. So there's no surprise there.

And why are we tslking about Indian Bhramos sinking USN CBG? That's like sun bathing on the moon! This conversation is pointless and absurd. Besides, as I said this is an F-35 thread. If you want to talk about Bhramos then link it with F-35.

 

[IndianHawk]

Coyote does not have to simulate the whole Bhramos travel range since Bhramos will always be detected from lunch. So there's no surprise there.

Because bramhos terminal manuever is longer than the entire range of this coyote toy . But suit yourself practice with it . It will really help to grow up.