Eurofighter EF-2000 Typhoon

[BON PLAN]

Options for the buyer is also the reason why the F-16 was a sucessful program and why F-35 will follow.

F16 was a very nice fighter, built on totally others specs than F35.
It's not without reasons than the fighter mafia guys are fully against F35.

 

[BON PLAN]

The US saved its NATO ally France's ass in Lybia

They gave us tanker assistance.
and what? some cruise missile? no need of it. we came first, as in Mali.

 

[BON PLAN]

google document regarding Lockheed's Patent on fiber-mat technology capable of absorbing EM waves from 0.1 to 60 Mhz.

and all coming from LM is true?
1) what is the dB attenuation in each wave length? My pant also is absorbing waves from 0,1 to 60 Mhz
2) L land is 1 to 2 Ghz.
3) ask Italy, GB and some others about the LM promises.... about cost, perf, delay

 

[Immanuel]

it's not a F35 ! you describe us that kind of BS :
View attachment 23309

your claim is : :bs:

The only fool here is you, detection of missile artillery, rocket launches at 800NM by DAS, 50-60 NM tracking of targets in EOTS and with APG-81 detection ranges for large rcs objects begins at well over 400 km is all demonstrated, you should look up some videos. The only BS here comes from French cow country.

 

[Armand2REP]

The US saved its NATO ally France's ass in Lybia and yet France does not buy US fighter jets (instead compete with it and through its snake oil salesmen try to disparage it with silly claims)...

The way I remember it Obama was sitting on his hands while French were doing this to protect civilians...

 

[BON PLAN]

The only fool here is you, detection of missile artillery, rocket launches at 800NM by DAS, 50-60 NM tracking of targets in EOTS and with APG-81 detection ranges for large rcs objects begins at well over 400 km is all demonstrated, you should look up some videos. The only BS here comes from French cow country.

God F35 !!!

seeing all 800nm around....

It's not a plane, it's Sauron eye itself.

mega LOL

PS : Please advice Boeing and Gruman to close their Awacs and E2D factory.

 

[asianobserve]

They gave us tanker assistance.
and what? some cruise missile? no need of it. we came first, as in Mali.

There's ZERO chance of France succeeding in Lybia without US help, ZERO! Just ask the NATO post-operations review of the Lybian action.

Mali is a French area, so you expect French to give at least some basic assistance to US forces there. They're NATO allies, assisting and defending each other is what they do, whether they buy weapons from each other or not...

 

[asianobserve]

The way I remember it Obama was sitting on his hands while French were doing this to protect civilians...

It's true that it was the French and the British who wanted to topple Gaddafi. Obama did not have a choice but to support US allies in Lybia. The US did not need to since US has entered into a new phase of rapprochment with Gaddafi at the time after Gaddafi verifiably abandoned his nuclear weapons program.

And look at Lybia now, do you call it a success. France and UK committed the same mistakes that the US did in Iraq after Saddam was toppled, they did not commit enough resources for the stabilization of Lybia.

 

[asianobserve]

and all coming from LM is true?
1) what is the dB attenuation in each wave length? My pant also is absorbing waves from 0,1 to 60 Mhz
2) L land is 1 to 2 Ghz.
3) ask Italy, GB and some others about the LM promises.... about cost, perf, delay

UK and Italy are far as I know are buying F-35. UK is even considering of buying F-35As for future tranches while they have no plans of buying more EFs. And there's certainly not much appetite on their parts to develop their own consortium of F-35 competitor, so yes I'm pretty sure they are very satisfied with LM's current offering.

They certainly are not begging France to supply them Rafales....

 

[Armand2REP]

It's true that it was the French and the British who wanted to topple Gaddafi. Obama did not have a choice but to support US allies in Lybia. The US did not need to since US has entered into a new phase of rapprochment with Gaddafi at the time after Gaddafi verifiably abandoned his nuclear weapons program.

And look at Lybia now, do you call it a success. France and UK committed the same mistakes that the US did in Iraq after Saddam was toppled, they did not commit enough resources for the stabilization of Lybia.

I guess you forgot that Gaddafi was only hours away from ethnic cleansing in Benghazi. It has been a hard road but you won't find many Libyan's who wish to go back to the "good old days." They were the ones willing to fight and die for their freedom which was the complete opposite in Iraq. I wonder if the Americans wanted to go back to British rule after being liberated by France.

 

[Immanuel]

God F35 !!!

seeing all 800nm around....

It's not a plane, it's Sauron eye itself.

mega LOL

PS : Please advice Boeing and Gruman to close their Awacs and E2D factory.

Laugh all you want, we'll be back in around 7 years when the Rafale line is closing because of no more orders coming through.

 

[BON PLAN]

There's ZERO chance of France succeeding in Lybia without US help, ZERO! Just ask the NATO post-operations review of the Lybian action.

Mali is a French area, so you expect French to give at least some basic assistance to US forces there. They're NATO allies, assisting and defending each other is what they do, whether they buy weapons from each other or not...

Sorry, I forgot You are a world wide military expert !!!

US fired tomahawks. We can used our SCALP instead.
US gave us tanker help. Without we just need some more days to move our planes from St Dizier (north east of France) to Corsica.
No need of US help. They did that to be among the winners to have political and economical return.

Mali : what the hell the US are doing here? We smashed the islamist terrorists totaly alone. It's very recently that GB and Germany send some troops and 4 or 5 helo....

You don't master this subject Bro, so shut up.

 

[BON PLAN]

UK and Italy are far as I know are buying F-35. UK is even considering of buying F-35As for future tranches while they have no plans of buying more EFs. And there's certainly not much appetite on their parts to develop their own consortium of F-35 competitor, so yes I'm pretty sure they are very satisfied with LM's current offering.

They certainly are not begging France to supply them Rafales....

Italy wil NEVER take the 90, and GB will NEVER take the 138.
It's like 2+2=4 ! (as ever)

 

[BON PLAN]

Laugh all you want, we'll be back in around 7 years when the Rafale line is closing because of no more orders coming through.

Another subject you don't master.
Rafale line IS ASSURED until 2030.
12 more rafale to come from Egypt (only a ITAR pb with SCALP)
France 5th tranche is inked in the next programmation law (30 planes at least).
India will take a second batch of 36 (after that 2nd batch I don't know. Or 0 or... 200). Maybe 57 for Navy.
Malaysia economy is in a better shape than intended. 18 Rafale more soon ?

And perheaps some good news to come :
UAE.
Swiss.
Belgium.

We all agree the EF line will close far earlier

 

[Immanuel]

Another subject you don't master.
Rafale line IS ASSURED until 2030.
12 more rafale to come from Egypt (only a ITAR pb with SCALP)
France 5th tranche is inked in the next programmation law (30 planes at least).
India will take a second batch of 36 (after that 2nd batch I don't know. Or 0 or... 200). Maybe 57 for Navy.
Malaysia economy is in a better shape than intended. 18 Rafale more soon ?

And perheaps some good news to come :
UAE.
Swiss.
Belgium.

We all agree the EF line will close far earlier

Swiss nah, Belgium, nah, Malaysia nah, Egypt (may be if you finance them), India (may be if you bribe consistently like till now). Indian IN Carrier nah (SH Block 3 is better suited). 200 Rafale in India ? hell nah, France doesn't have the kind of lobbying or strategic pull that Russia or US have. France doesn't offer any strategic advantage of any kind to India, being strategic partner with France is like being strategic partners with a Banana republic, it has little value for India.

The EF is already a far bigger success than Rafale ever was or can be. If the line is open beyond 2025, it would take another 10-12 years before Rafale sales can even reach EF levels even if EF was sold only to limited customers. With F-35 ramping up to full speed by 2023, Rafale, Gripen and EF will be outsold 3-1 by the F-35.

None of the 4.5 gen birds can match capability to price

 

[nongaddarliberal]

F16 was a very nice fighter, built on totally others specs than F35.
It's not without reasons than the fighter mafia guys are fully against F35.

Let's face it. F 35 is the F 16 of 5th gen aircraft. There will be better 5th gen aircraft for export in the future, but this is the standard option most countries will take. Similar to how there were many superior 4th gen aircraft after F 16, but it still became a success. Stealth is an undeniable advantage even considering the counter measures. With French aviation expertise, I don't know why you guys haven't started work on a stealth fighter yet. It would be a great addition to the fighter market if there was an alternative French or European 5th gen option. Right now most countries who want to replace their old f 16s, mirage 2000s, f 18 etc have no other choice except F 35.

 

[asianobserve]

Sorry, I forgot You are a world wide military expert !!!

US fired tomahawks. We can used our SCALP instead.
US gave us tanker help. Without we just need some more days to move our planes from St Dizier (north east of France) to Corsica.
No need of US help. They did that to be among the winners to have political and economical return.

Mali : what the hell the US are doing here? We smashed the islamist terrorists totaly alone. It's very recently that GB and Germany send some troops and 4 or 5 helo....

You don't master this subject Bro, so shut up.

Clueless as ussual...

"Nato commander: EU could not do Libya without US"

Nato major-general Marcel Druart, addressing the European Parliament committee on security and defence on Tuesday (20 March), said

Nato relied heavily on US military expertise on intelligence, surveillance and reconnaissance (ISR) capabilities.

"ISR is not just a force multiplier, it is critical in the planning and execution," said the general.

"European allies provided most of the assets but only the United States could offer these capabilities. The EU needs to ensure that similar capabilities are available."

Relying on just a dozen or so US predator drones, or unmanned aerial aircraft, Nato allies were able to distinguish between rebels and Gaddafi’s army. Europe lacks similar military technical capacity and skilled personnel to operate such equipment, said the general.

The shortcoming was highlighted by Nato chief Anders Fogh Rasmussen on 12 March in Copenhagen, who said

the Libyan operation pointed to "significant shortfalls in a range of European capabilities - from smart munitions, to air-to-air refuelling, and intelligence surveillance and reconnaissance."

https://euobserver.com/news/115650

 

[asianobserve]

Let's face it. F 35 is the F 16 of 5th gen aircraft. There will be better 5th gen aircraft for export in the future, but this is the standard option most countries will take. Similar to how there were many superior 4th gen aircraft after F 16, but it still became a success. Stealth is an undeniable advantage even considering the counter measures. With French aviation expertise, I don't know why you guys haven't started work on a stealth fighter yet. It would be a great addition to the fighter market if there was an alternative French or European 5th gen option. Right now most countries who want to replace their old f 16s, mirage 2000s, f 18 etc have no other choice except F 35.

If developing 4th gen Rafale was too heavy a financial and technical burden for France that it took it almost 20 years to develop it, the more will be a 5th gen project. France simply cannot develop a 5th gen fighter on its own. It needs to partner with countries like Germany and UK to share the burden. But the problem with the proud French is that they want to do it their way, so it's doubtful that they will ever come to agreement on developing a 5th gen fighter.

And in case they do develop a 5th gen fighter, by the time it is induced into service the US and other countries would have already upgraded many times their F-35 (F-22s, J-20s or PAKFAs) or worse would have already moved on to 6th gen fighters.

 

[asianobserve]

Swiss nah, Belgium, nah, Malaysia nah, Egypt (may be if you finance them), India (may be if you bribe consistently like till now). Indian IN Carrier nah (SH Block 3 is better suited). 200 Rafale in India ? hell nah, France doesn't have the kind of lobbying or strategic pull that Russia or US have. France doesn't offer any strategic advantage of any kind to India, being strategic partner with France is like being strategic partners with a Banana republic, it has little value for India.

The EF is already a far bigger success than Rafale ever was or can be. If the line is open beyond 2025, it would take another 10-12 years before Rafale sales can even reach EF levels even if EF was sold only to limited customers. With F-35 ramping up to full speed by 2023, Rafale, Gripen and EF will be outsold 3-1 by the F-35.

None of the 4.5 gen birds can match capability to price

EF ------ 623 built

Rafale ------ 164 built

Even a 3-year old will know how to distinguish the bigger success between the EF and Rafale. But I would not be surprised if our French friend here will not be able to distinguish the numbers above.

 

[BON PLAN]

Swiss nah, Belgium, nah, Malaysia nah, Egypt (may be if you finance them), India (may be if you bribe consistently like till now). Indian IN Carrier nah (SH Block 3 is better suited). 200 Rafale in India ? hell nah, France doesn't have the kind of lobbying or strategic pull that Russia or US have. France doesn't offer any strategic advantage of any kind to India, being strategic partner with France is like being strategic partners with a Banana republic, it has little value for India.

The EF is already a far bigger success than Rafale ever was or can be. If the line is open beyond 2025, it would take another 10-12 years before Rafale sales can even reach EF levels even if EF was sold only to limited customers. With F-35 ramping up to full speed by 2023, Rafale, Gripen and EF will be outsold 3-1 by the F-35.

None of the 4.5 gen birds can match capability to price

Swiss : Rafale was L1 ....
Belgium : to see. F35 is costly and already out of budget....
Malaysia : it's the same history, with you and some others, than with India....
Egypt : no payment problem (see below)

Saying "Nah" as in the past with india first batch just show your ignorance of the subject.

EF : just divide que Qty by four. ie 155. And an booklog very narrow....
Rafale : 180 (france firm order) + 36 (india) + 26 (Qatar) + 24 (Egypt) = 276. and some others to come.... (30 + 12 + ....)

***

https://www.latribune.fr/entreprise...856.html#xtor=EPR-2-[l-actu-du-jour]-20180219
a small extract in french (use google) : "Et ce n'est pas une question de financementcomme par le passé."