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NutCracker

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Canards anyone?? That's a big honking radar reflector no matter how you slice that.
Only against ground based radars.
Against A2A radar, unless it's doing some serious maneuvers it will fall into same plane as of its wings. So effect will be really small. Any way you have to admit that it's a really- really-really Low Observability aircraft .
 

Gyyan

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Bruh I can even see a f22 and it's pretty large you are taking visual stealth for radar stealth.View attachment 230768
This is the best i could come up with with my shitty drawing skill but if you could show some angles that suggest huge radar returns please do and do keep in mind modern fighters calculate the position of canards such that they send the least return in the specific case.
 

Samej Jangir

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''EW like Spectra'' is useless
Currently there is no countermeasure exist , may be land/ship based ones
Q- are we talking about same thing ? EOTS ?
In the case of stealth, US already having the tech, maybe they already developed one
Let me explain in layman language- Spectra is like a smoke grenade. Now, imagine you are walking in a flat desert and suddenly you spot an area of 50sqm covered in think smoke. You will immediately realise that there is someone there. Although you won't be able to pinpoint the location of the person who measures only 0.3sqm in area, you will know that there is a person within that 50sqm.

Spectra is something like this- you can't pinpoint the plane but can see that some random waves are being generated from some area in the sky which you can quickly assume to be from an enemy plane. This is why EW stealth is not same as actual stealth
 

jai jaganath

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This is the best i could come up with with my shitty drawing skill but if you could show some angles that suggest huge radar returns please do and do keep in mind modern fighters calculate the position of canards such that they send the least return in the specific case.
Moreover usage of canards can be restricted to maneuvering rest during most of its fight part it could stay aligned with body
And moreover they were able to achieve a low observable aircraft and sorting out the balancing issues
Besides there is nothing as such absolute stealth
 

Samej Jangir

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I see, then I wonder if IN would ever look at Prachand or Rudra forks (naval variants with folding blades and rear tail section maybe?) for these kind of roles in future...
MH-60R is nice but it's a big utility, general purpose 'jack-ov-all' type heli - but having a Prachand-N with dhrvastra, rockets and that 20mm gun would be far better combo for an attack heli for offshore targets me thinks
Mh60R is suitable for amphibious attacks which is what US navy intends. But India needs helicopters for ASW & patrolling of pirates and boats. Indian navy is not capable of amphibious landing or fighting. USA navy has many aircraft carriers and its naval fighter jets number 600 which is as much as the IAF fighter jets! Without such carriers and naval fighter jets, the amphibious attack doctrine won't work.

For ASW & patrol, Rudra & ALH will be the best suited. MH60 is bulky, needs much more fuel (fuel supply in the middle of a sea is not easy) and provides no additional benefits for these roles.
ADE spent hundreds of crores and ten years but failed in Tapas. Now it wants a pvt Co to do their job in 5 month
This is called privatisation. India is developing private industry by giving TOT from DRDO. ADE has developed the technology and only wants the private company to design it and then manufacture/assemble it with DRDO's help
I understand, but in absence of that maybe we could put it on small tonnage boats like Corvettes and so, in association with landing crafts these could give a work-able amphibious warfare group for starters?
Imaging using helicopters to fight against Pakistani coastal defence! That will be suicide. Amphibious warfare requires one to have huge aircraft carrier groups and carrier based fighter jets to first clear the way. It is not feasible for India at all even if India buys hundreds of Mh60 helos.
 

another_armchair

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It's been discussed to the death that We need heavy press for churning out lighter bulkheads and other componenets.
30-40k Tonne press costs 150-200M$ . Considering the exponential growth in our defence and aerospace investment, I hope govt invests into till Tejas MK2 reaches to mass production stage. Same press can be utilised further for TEDBF AND AMCA.
They will roll out the RFI when inflation would've raised the cost of the press to $ 500M.
 

Blademaster

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First of all write the user name
But for that u have to be Indian
Anyways
So basically if someone has different opinion and in this case true opinion and due to ur lesser knowledge regarding the platform can't be true
Wow
Yeah ofc j-20 is not 5th gen
Their engines are damn poor
They numbers are false
Their capabilities are exaggerated
We face no threat
Anything else great Indian patriot sitting in usa
Anyways this post may derail so @Gyyan we may take this discussion to relatable thread
You telling me how to be an Indian you Chinese simp?? :bplease::rofl::rofl::rofl:

At least I’m not the one who keeps liking and simping Chinese post after Chinese post. Living in India does not necessarily make you a true Indian Mr Sherlock Holmes.
 

Blademaster

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Bruh I can even see a f22 and it's pretty large you are taking visual stealth for radar stealth.View attachment 230768
then don’t use the analogy of using light rays. Use something else. The canards will prevent your planes from ever being stealthy no matter what because it cannot prevent the radar rays from being reflected back towards the receiver.
 

Blademaster

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Only against ground based radars.
Against A2A radar, unless it's doing some serious maneuvers it will fall into same plane as of its wings. So effect will be really small. Any way you have to admit that it's a really- really-really Low Observability aircraft .
IAF and USAF disagree with you. They have spotted them using MKI radars and AWACs from hundreds of miles away.
 

Blademaster

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This is the best i could come up with with my shitty drawing skill but if you could show some angles that suggest huge radar returns please do and do keep in mind modern fighters calculate the position of canards such that they send the least return in the specific case.
I’m typing on a iPhone right now. So can’t really draw. It doesn’t matter what angle is optimum because the problem is that the canards are movable objects. In order to maintain flight stability and stealthy it has to be locked in one position. That’s great and fine if the plane is only moving in a straight line. But planes don’t. They have to move around and maneuver. The minute they do that the stealth is compromised because they have to move the canards in order to turn and maneuver and that optimum angle goes away. They will light up on the radar screen in seconds.
 

jai jaganath

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You telling me how to be an Indian you Chinese simp?? :bplease::rofl::rofl::rofl:

At least I’m not the one who keeps liking and simping Chinese post after Chinese post. Living in India does not necessarily make you a true Indian Mr Sherlock Holmes.
Comon mate
Hypocrisy has a limit :pound:
Sitting in America and simping for a party makes u Indian
Is that what u think?
Bared from language culture tradition and then simping for a party doesn't make u Indian
Better have a introspection before questioning other's nationality

I responded bcoz u started it
Now this convo may derail the thread
Nor I am interested to drag it further to other thread
 

johnj

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Let me explain in layman language- Spectra is like a smoke grenade. Now, imagine you are walking in a flat desert and suddenly you spot an area of 50sqm covered in think smoke. You will immediately realise that there is someone there. Although you won't be able to pinpoint the location of the person who measures only 0.3sqm in area, you will know that there is a person within that 50sqm.

Spectra is something like this- you can't pinpoint the plane but can see that some random waves are being generated from some area in the sky which you can quickly assume to be from an enemy plane. This is why EW stealth is not same as actual stealth
LOL
Once again - ''EW like Spectra'' is useless
Still you don't understand -
Both spectra and F35 EW suite are useless
Spectra, F35 EW suite and F18G EW suite are useless
Do you know why, becz it designed to counter, attack RF signals not EO signals
Hence the question is - DO you know the difference between EO EMW nd RF EMW ???
FYI - Rafale having OSF, which is immune to Spectra
Rafale F5 comes with more advanced OSF and new BVR with EO seeker to hunt down stealth aircraft
EOTS can see the 50sqm covered in think smoke, and can strike the source of smokie, becz it uses multiple sensors. Bottom line - your EW stealth is useless against EOTS.
 
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Blademaster

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Comon mate
Hypocrisy has a limit :pound:
Sitting in America and simping for a party makes u Indian
Is that what u think?
Bared from language culture tradition and then simping for a party doesn't make u Indian
Better have a introspection before questioning other's nationality

I responded bcoz u started it
Now this convo may derail the thread
Nor I am interested to drag it further to other thread
Your post makes me laugh.😂 Keep it up. I suppose we all need our village clown to keep us amused.
 

Blademaster

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jai jaganath

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It's called coping.
One with pseudo superiority complex and no technical reasoning won't understand mate
Better treat them as jokers
 

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