DRDO, PSU and Private Defence Sector News

[BrigadierRPS]

Some silicon/boron carbide based materials were already developed 10 to 12 years ago. They are being used in MRVs of Agni series missiles and intended to be used in our own space shuttle as well. The have made few new materials since then which are more efficient

One of our bottlenecks currently is in CMCs of Zirconium Diboride matrix reinforced by Silicon Carbide fiber. If we want to build a hypersonic bomber or even a long range HGV, we need this tech.

 

[Chinmoy]

Simulations were carried out in IIT Kanpur keeping pressurized liquid hydrogen in mind.

For RLV, yes.
But it too showed its limitation in same way as it has shown in others programmes worldwide. But still ISRO is persuing RLV design based on it. But again, its not a jet engine.

 

[Okabe Rintarou]

Some silicon/boron carbide based materials were already developed 10 to 12 years ago. They are being used in MRVs of Agni series missiles and intended to be used in our own space shuttle as well. The have made few new materials since then which are more efficient

Yeah, you are talking about the carbon-carbon and SiC-carbon composites. But their performance in TPS is an order of magnitude below that of ZrB2 matrix-SiC fiber composites.
Plus, our SiC fiber tech is not that great yet. The Americans and Japanese are building SiC fibers with grain sizes above 100 microns. Their SiC-SiC CMCs are so good, they are planning on replacing Ni-superalloys with it in jet engines.

 

[BrigadierRPS]

It's not a jet engine. Nobody is looking for a jet engine either. You can at max modify a jet engine with variable throat compression cone and make it go up to mach 5 at max. But the mach range this hybrid rocket engine is targeted at is much higher, mach 8 to mach 10 in general. You can go even faster than that. But the initial capability is targeted at this range and that is a very grave situation either. Also, there was a simulation going on with liquid methane as well. Don't know about the status now. Liquid methane engines in india are rare whereas many startups in China are targeting liquid methane engines. They have a headstart in this case.

 

[BrigadierRPS]

Yes the next generation of their jet engines will feature CMC blades. And they should be greatful to this gentleman for that

Jayanta Kapat

Jayanta Kapat is a professor at the UCF Department of Mechanical and Aerospace Engineering and the director of the Center for Advanced Turbomachinery and Energy Research.

mae.ucf.edu

Yeah, you are talking about the carbon-carbon and SiC-carbon composites. But their performance in TPS is an order of magnitude below that of ZrB2 matrix-SiC fiber composites.
Plus, our SiC fiber tech is not that great yet. The Americans and Japanese are building SiC fibers with grain sizes above 100 microns. Their SiC-SiC CMCs are so good, they are planning on replacing Ni-superalloys with it in jet engines.

 

[Okabe Rintarou]

It's not a jet engine. Nobody is looking for a jet engine either. You can at max modify a jet engine with variable throat compression cone and make it go up to mach 5 at max. But the mach range this hybrid rocket engine is targeted at is much higher, mach 8 to mach 10 in general. You can go even faster than that. But the initial capability is targeted at this range and that is a very grave situation either. Also, there was a simulation going on with liquid methane as well. Don't know about the status now. Liquid methane engines in india are rare whereas many startups in China are targeting liquid methane engines. They have a headstart in this case.

BTW, the thing with these hypersonic bombers is that they'll have to be unmanned. Can you imagine how predictable their trajectory would be flying at Mach 8-10 with the g-limits a human imposes on the maneuvers? And then there is the issue that they'll have a plasma sheath that makes them glow like Diwali lights on IIR sensors. Once we have our own space-based IIR sensor fleet for tracking, we'd be able to use our BMD missiles to shoot them down. This makes me think HGVs are better suited for these jobs, one way trip and no human.
Tactically speaking, subsonic stealth drones would continue to be better, hypersonic bombers won't cut it.

 

[Chinmoy]

It's not a jet engine. Nobody is looking for a jet engine either. You can at max modify a jet engine with variable throat compression cone and make it go up to mach 5 at max. But the mach range this hybrid rocket engine is targeted at is much higher, mach 8 to mach 10 in general. You can go even faster than that. But the initial capability is targeted at this range and that is a very grave situation either. Also, there was a simulation going on with liquid methane as well. Don't know about the status now. Liquid methane engines in india are rare whereas many startups in China are targeting liquid methane engines. They have a headstart in this case.

If you have written this on response to my reply, I would say that the only successful flying design of precooled engine was a jet engine. Not the hybrid rocket engine.
When I told that studies are in progress on precooled engine, I specifically meant jet engine rather then RLV.

 

[Okabe Rintarou]

It's not a jet engine. Nobody is looking for a jet engine either. You can at max modify a jet engine with variable throat compression cone and make it go up to mach 5 at max. But the mach range this hybrid rocket engine is targeted at is much higher, mach 8 to mach 10 in general. You can go even faster than that. But the initial capability is targeted at this range and that is a very grave situation either. Also, there was a simulation going on with liquid methane as well. Don't know about the status now. Liquid methane engines in india are rare whereas many startups in China are targeting liquid methane engines. They have a headstart in this case.

ISRO is planning Liquid methane engines, they are planning a 30kN methalox by 2025 and a full-fledged 800kN methalox by 2030. A tech demonstrator for the same was tested recently.

 

[BrigadierRPS]

Our scientists had developed two types TPS for Agni series. One was boron based on which we have not heard anything for long time, and another one was SiC based which is more common and occasionally heard. They even showed it in TV also I guess. Once there was a paper I saw on Anisotropic thermal conductivity of a 2.5D braided CMC from DMRL and IIT Delhi guys. So I guess our CMC development is heading in right direction. We may have to pay some penalty in terms of weight and maintainability but that is ok because systems get better and better with trials, tests and feedbacks.

 

[fire starter]

Yeah, you are talking about the carbon-carbon and SiC-carbon composites. But their performance in TPS is an order of magnitude below that of ZrB2 matrix-SiC fiber composites.
Plus, our SiC fiber tech is not that great yet. The Americans and Japanese are building SiC fibers with grain sizes above 100 microns. Their SiC-SiC CMCs are so good, they are planning on replacing Ni-superalloys with it in jet engines.

ZrB2-Sic composite have been developed by DMRL.

 

[Okabe Rintarou]

ZrB2-Sic composite have been developed by DMRL.

Source?

 

[fire starter]

Source?

VARIOUS R&D PROJECTS TAKEN UP BY DRDO

Defence Research & Development Organisation (DRDO) undertakes various R&D projects. The lab-wise det

pib.gov.in

 

[BrigadierRPS]

Yeah the japs...In 2010 i guess. But that was flown under mach 2. But that was a complete different thing than this one.

If you have written this on response to my reply, I would say that the only successful flying design of precooled engine was a jet engine. Not the hybrid rocket engine.
When I told that studies are in progress on precooled engine, I specifically meant jet engine rather then RLV.

 

[Okabe Rintarou]

VARIOUS R&D PROJECTS TAKEN UP BY DRDO

Defence Research & Development Organisation (DRDO) undertakes various R&D projects. The lab-wise det

pib.gov.in

Holy $hit this is a treasure trove of info. brb.
Do post this in NGMBT thread and in APFSDS thread.

RCI says they deveoped "Miniature High Dynamics Global Navigation Satellite System (GNSS)". Da faq?

One more: LRDE says " First Ground based radar with Dual Frequency of operation for operation in inclement weather conditions" and "Detection algorithms for small RCS targets (boats & dingies) in presence heavy sea clutters".
Maybe our Project-18 destroyers would see dual band MF radar in S and X band.

 

[nixin]

VARIOUS R&D PROJECTS TAKEN UP BY DRDO

Defence Research & Development Organisation (DRDO) undertakes various R&D projects. The lab-wise det

pib.gov.in

Study by BARC also.

 

[BrigadierRPS]

See this one by CAIR
Multi Agent Robotics, Secure Handset/Mobile, Secure OS

So finally, can we see a TORCH-X type BMS for our army ?

Holy $hit this is a treasure trove of info. brb.
Do post this in NGMBT thread and in APFSDS thread.

RCI says they deveoped "Miniature High Dynamics Global Navigation Satellite System (GNSS)". Da faq?

One more: LRDE says " First Ground based radar with Dual Frequency of operation for operation in inclement weather conditions" and "Detection algorithms for small RCS targets (boats & dingies) in presence heavy sea clutters".
Maybe our Project-18 destroyers would see dual band MF radar in S and X band.

 

[ezsasa]

VARIOUS R&D PROJECTS TAKEN UP BY DRDO

Defence Research & Development Organisation (DRDO) undertakes various R&D projects. The lab-wise det

pib.gov.in

If possible, copy the content and paste it in a post. Members will be able to search later.

 

[Okabe Rintarou]

See this one by CAIR
Multi Agent Robotics, Secure Handset/Mobile, Secure OS

So finally, can we see a TORCH-X type BMS for our army ?

You mean by the secure OS part? Not sure, but this seems to be more for replacing whatever OS Army uses on its office computers, likely a custom Linux distro, though that would be more of a C-DAC thing than a CAIR thing. For something like Torch-X, DRDO needs to get its SDR act together. And Army needs to stop the stupid turf wars between Signals and DGIS that scuttled important programs like ASTROIDS and CIDSS.

 

[BrigadierRPS]

Actually I think it is going to be a complete BMS. CAIR was already working on heterogeneous swarms with minimal human intervention, I think they are already integrating the command and control abilities to the OS and the smartphone.

You mean by the secure OS part? Not sure, but this seems to be more for replacing whatever OS Army uses on its office computers, likely a custom Linux distro, though that would be more of a C-DAC thing than a CAIR thing. For something like Torch-X, DRDO needs to get its SDR act together. And Army needs to stop the stupid turf wars between Signals and DGIS that scuttled important programs like ASTROIDS and CIDSS.

 

[THESIS THORON]

Thread please...

are you suggesting this thing to me ??
if yes I have read it yesterday only.
nice thread btw.

but it does not solve the problem of we are not working on saber engine tech.

actually imo we should work on diff tech parallelly like US. it is funding reasearch for sabre engine and at same time it is working on sr72 and also working on fusion based rockets.