Defective T-72 Tanks

[hest]

This self-made table is full of errors and is based on arbitrary values.

Performance of the round depends on the coefficient of the armour against it, not on homogeneous steel, 3BM42 performance was advertised against different composite structures imitating frontal and turret side tank armour, posted in the same Otvaga forum.

 

[Kunal Biswas]

There are pictures of busted out T-72M1 barrels from mid-90s, Not OFB made T-72..

so this 2001 news you dig out 12 years later as relevant, dont you think tanks under go firing test every year ?

IA dont have working tank, night blind, no artillery guns, they always cry for rifles, tank ammo, if this is all true, then someone is sleeping on the job.

 

[Austin]

@Austin

Why does this article look like a re-hash of an early 2000 article where there were barrel bursts due to faulty DRDO designed shells?

What gave it away is the mention of Krasnopol (DDM spelt it wrong in the article) which had teething problems just after Kargil.

Not sure why but Sensationalism Sells , So Sensational Headlines even when rehashed sells same goes for Catherine TI news wont be surprised to find the same news 10 years from now.

Second thing is a possibility that OFB might have not implemented all that is needed to be done to rectify the issue when though they solutions would be documented

Could be something else , its hard to say since there is no way to verify the authenticity of such news from independent sources.

 

[arnabmit]

India to replace bursting tank barrels under Rs 1,500 cr deal | idrw.org

Seeking to address the issue of bursting barrels of Army tanks due to ammunition, the government is planning to replace them with canons of T-90 tanks in collaboration with Russia.

T-72 tanks, the mainstay of the Indian armoured fleet, are facing problems with their ammunition as they sometimes bursts in the barrel and 200 such cases have been reported causing concern in the Army.

The Defence Ministry is planning to replace the barrels of the T-72 tanks with the ones fitted in the T-90 tanks. Under the plan, around 800 barrels are to be procured from Russia under a deal expected to be worth around Rs 1,500 crore, government sources said.

The issue is expected to be taken up for discussion during the high-level talks between India and Russia during the visit of Defence Secretary Radha Kant Mathur to Moscow next week, they said.

Earlier this year, the Army told a Parliamentary panel that barrels burst sometimes due to ammunition and wondered whether its troops will be "afraid" to fire even after seeing the enemy.

"It (the T-72 ammunition) used to burst in the barrel. If it bursts in the barrel, then the firer is afraid to fire his own gun, which is not a correct thing. If he is afraid to fire his own gun, then even if he sees the enemy he will not fire," the Army had told the Standing Committee on Defence.

The Army informed the government and the Parliamentary Committee that over a period of time, there have been 200 such accidents involving the ammunition and "it brings down the confidence of the firer, especially, with regard to tank ammunition".

In terms of the numbers, the T-72 tanks are the backbone of the Indian armoured fleet and have undergone several upgrades since their induction to be able to fight effectively in the battlefield.

 

[ersakthivel]

so this 2001 news you dig out 12 years later as relevant, dont you think tanks under go firing test every year ?

IA dont have working tank, night blind, no artillery guns, they always cry for rifles, tank ammo, if this is all true, then someone is sleeping on the job.

Of the barrels that burst 14 were imported and 12 were made here. So just blaming OFB alone won't solve the problem for IA.

But what ever shit of pile the IA is sitting on still the DGMF won't consider replacing even 500 of these 1970s relics called T-72 with Arjuns even for desert Rajasthan Indo-Pak border region,

Let the crew get killed in exploding barrels , pour good money over bad money by spending billions in upgrading these vintage T-72s

but make sure orders for Arjun never exceed the holy 124 number mark!!!!!!

All the while sleep walking with 50 ton 4 men crew ammo safe storage marvel comics FMBT specs.

 

[W.G.Ewald]

Of the barrels that burst 14 were imported and 12 were made here. So just blaming OFB alone won't solve the problem for IA.

But what ever shit of pile the IA is sitting on still the DGMF won't consider replacing even 500 of these 1970s relics called T-72 with Arjuns even for desert Rajasthan Indo-Pak border region,

Let the crew get killed in exploding barrels , pour good money over bad money by spending billions in upgrading these vintage T-72s

but make sure orders for Arjun never exceed the holy 124 number mark!!!!!!

All the while sleep walking with 50 ton 4 men crew ammo safe storage marvel comics FMBT specs.

Never saw an incident of burst barrel when I trained in tanks, thank God. In fact, is the event always fatal to the crew?

India to replace bursting tank barrels under Rs 1,500 cr deal - Firstpost

"It (the T-72 ammunition) used to burst in the barrel. If it bursts in the barrel, then the firer is afraid to fire his own gun, which is not a correct thing. If he is afraid to fire his own gun, then even if he sees the enemy he will not fire," the Army had told the Standing Committee on Defence.

The quote implies no deaths ensue from a burst barrel.

Also, are we talking about defective barrels or defective ammunition?

 

[Damian]

It is more likely a defective ammunition, however defective barrel can also be the case.

And such event can be very dangerous for crew.

 

[Kunal Biswas]

A 2001 report quoting CAG

while hundreds of t-72 main battle tanks (mbts) of the army are long overdue for overhaul, another disturbing fact is that a few hundred of them were fitted with defective barrels, which could cause accidents. the barrels were found defective because they had not been tempered as per specifications. this has been reported by the comptroller general of india (cag). while 454 barrels valued at rs 4 4 crore were rejected because tempering specifications were not followed, an investigation had been ordered into the remaining 305 barrels fitted on the tanks. until march 1998, 35 accidents had taken place in which more than 10 barrels either cracked or burst, said the cag report of last year. according to sources, the defence metallurgical research laboratories (dmrl) in hyderabad also investigated the failure of the 125 mm gun barrels of the t-72 tank and pointed out that the breakages were because of tempering problem. the department of defence production and supplies had awarded the order to supply 774 barrels at a cost of rs 67.73 crore to be fitted on the t-72 tanks. by alloying elements with steel, midhani made hot rolled bars which were sent to ordnance factory, kanpur, for forging. subsequently, they were sent to field gun factory, kanpur, for machining. however, the field gun factory at kanpur carried out heat treatment on the forgings at reduced temperature, which was against the specifications from the original designers. when the heat treatment should have been carried out at 520-570 degrees c, it was done below 430 degrees c, the report said."this has resulted in the defective manufacture of barrels affecting the performance of t-72 tanks,"the cag said.

Defects boom out of T-72 barrels - Times Of India

 

[Kunal Biswas]

scrap them replace it with Arjuns

Make more Arjuns ..

Old Guns with latest gen ammo with more powerful propellents, these guns cannot handle the Chamber pressure causing the gun to explode while crew still inside..

Back then it was convenient to put the blame on OFB propellent bags ( True that some of them were faulty so does Russian ) but strangely perpetrators were also destroyed, And next was large import of Russian ammo, While the major issue was never looked upon..

Related News :Army saddled with 900 unreliable T-72 tanks

Army saddled with unreliable tanks-News-Exclusives-TIMESNOW.tv - Latest Breaking News, Big News Stories, News Videos

Defects boom out of T-72 barrels
November 16, 2001 | Ch Sushil Rao , TNN
hyderabad: while hundreds of t-72 main battle tanks (mbts) of the army are long overdue for overhaul, another disturbing fact is that a few hundred of them were fitted with defective barrels, which could cause accidents. the barrels were found defective because they had not been tempered as per specifications. this has been reported by the comptroller general of india (cag). while 454 barrels valued at rs 4 4 crore were rejected because tempering specifications were not followed, an investigation had been...
Source:- Times of India

 

[p2prada]

Never saw an incident of burst barrel when I trained in tanks, thank God. In fact, is the event always fatal to the crew?
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The quote implies no deaths ensue from a burst barrel.

Also, are we talking about defective barrels or defective ammunition?

Defective barrels and it has caused deaths. The defective ammunition issue was separate.

Anyway, this is very old news. As in a decade old.

The journos have decided to attach bursting barrels news to a T-72 upgrade program with T-90 barrels, it seems.

 

[Dazzler]

Defective barrels and it has caused deaths. The defective ammunition issue was separate.

Anyway, this is very old news. As in a decade old.

The journos have decided to attach bursting barrels news to a T-72 upgrade program with T-90 barrels, it seems.

Rememeber reading that newspiece few years back, i think the journalist rephrased some words here and there

 

[p2prada]

Rememeber reading that newspiece few years back, i think the journalist rephrased some words here and there

What else is new here?

Even Shukla has done it.

 

[Dazzler]

What else is new here?

Even Shukla has done it.

Seems like journalists on both sides have a great deal of knowledge regarding defense equipment.

 

[sesha_maruthi27]

I hope that the Arjun MKII trials finish quickly and they would be inducted in large numbers say around 3000 to 5000 tanks..........

 

[sayareakd]

I hope that the Arjun MKII trials finish quickly and they would be inducted in large numbers say around 3000 to 5000 tanks..........

IA officials wont allow this to happen. They will make up 10000000000000000000000000 of excuses for not inducting MK-II. May go for T90MS or FMBT from Russia, depending upon who give strong kick back.

 

[ladder]

I don't think this is just rephrased article.
And the article is written with inputs from here and there.

And nowhere it is mentioned that the previous up-gradation catered for the whole inventory of T-72 with IA.

OFB is having problems of its own in T-90 production and T-72 up-gradation and scheduled maintenance is way behind schedule.
So, if a known problem is addressed by importing barrels what's wrong in it?

Also, to remember that along with delays in T-90 production the first Arjun mk2 can only roll out 24-30 months after orders are placed.

So, it will be quite some time for them to become primary tank of IA.

And so, it is prudent to employ any solution available at our hand to keep the T-72 tanks ready.

 

[W.G.Ewald]

I hope that the Arjun MKII trials finish quickly and they would be inducted in large numbers say around 3000 to 5000 tanks..........

Erwin? Erwin Rommel? Is that you?

 

[sesha_maruthi27]

Erwin? Erwin Rommel? Is that you?

What happened bhai... not able to believe that Arjun will be inducted in such large numbers?.........

Ha ha ha ha

 

[sesha_maruthi27]

The much awaited change and increase in induction of indigenous equipment is going to come........

 

[Kunal Biswas]

Bursting of barrels are occurring since early 90s, there is nothing new to it & T-72 only existed coz its forced to, by political means ..

Logical solution is to Induct Arjun MK1 to replace T-72M1, Arjun MK1 is proven better than T-90S in trails ..

====================

Inducting MK1 will make Arjun Production line active also it will reduce its cost dramatically and increase its home made component more specially the engine, This tank as its ours can be upgraded and modified specific to our needs in near future..

I don't think this is just rephrased article.
And the article is written with inputs from here and there.

So, if a known problem is addressed by importing barrels what's wrong in it? Also, to remember that along with delays in T-90 production the first Arjun mk2 can only roll out 24-30 months after orders are placed.