Defective T-72 Tanks

[SilentKiller]

You need to take in to consideration economics and logistics.

IMHO I would leave all current designs, be it T-72, T-90 and Arjun as their are and abandone their further evolution.

Instead there is a nececity for radical rethinking the vehicle design, and there are several questions to answer.

Do you need a dedicated base platform? No, it is better to design an unified platform (you can design several such platforms in different weight classed, be it wheeled or tracked).

Such solution is logical, unified platform means you do not waste huge pile of money and time as well as other resources on different dedicated platforms but a platforms with unified components like suspension, engine, transmission, electronics etc.

You can have both an Main Battle Tank and Heavy Infantry Fighting Vehicle for army heavy brigades, well armored, unified, which reduce production costs, logistic problems (they can for example use exactly the same engine, transmission and suspension, as well as wheeld and tracks), and also training, remember that you train not only crews but also maintnance personell.

On such platforms you can place also special variants, like Armored Revocery Vehicles, Command Vehicles, SPAAG's, SPGH's, MEDEVAC's etc.

With such concept in mind, it is foolishness to waste all avaiable resources on existing vehicle designs.

Sir, that's why i suggested that we can start replacing all T-72 tanks with MBT arjun tanks, say 100-200 each year.
then we can convert these T-72 in light 105 mm tanks, heavy IFV's etc.
Israel also do same with its old tanks.
we are familiar with T-72 tanks so this should be not an issue.

 

[Kunal Biswas]

Theoretically, One better start upgrading all T-72M1 / T-55 Into TANK-EX configuration with Upgraded Arjun MK2 inputs ..

Practically, We cannot modify existing T-72M1 but no sure about T-55, The Only Solution make more Arjuns to replace mainstay of T-72M1..

 

[Kunal Biswas]

@Damian, Would it be an good idea to upgrade T-55 to TANK-EX configuration ?

Indeed, It wont have the superb mobility as Arjun, T-72/90 but in-terms of protection and firepower it will great upgrade ..

 

[p2prada]

Tank-Ex was an experimental tank. It wasn't made for induction.

250 T-72s have been upgraded to date with new Russian V-46 engines which were ordered in 2002. We will know what the upgrades will be once IA has decided on upgrades for T-90S also.

Anyway, IMHO, get the T-72s upgraded so they can be used until 2025 at least. The last T-72 came out of the production line in 2006. Have them replaced with the FMBT from 2020 onwards. At 100-150 tanks a year we can have all T-72s replaced by 2030. A FBMT Mk2 or even Mk3 can be made to replace the T-90s from 2035 onwards. So by 2040 we will have a one tank army. The Armata and Arjun Mk2 can be fall back programs.

It would be quite like what @Damian suggested. Get on the 4th gen bandwagon instead of working on existing technology even in the future. Anyway, that's what's planned, so not a big problem seeing where the Army is looking for.

 

[sayareakd]

we should use these T72 to act as unmanned tank to clear mine field and take on tank defence head on with controller tank in view of sight.

 

[Kunal Biswas]

That is a good Idea, But only after we induct good amount of Arjun MK1/2..

 

[Waffen SS]

That was because T-72M's turret front is not even enough to protect against Arjun's APFSDS or even the stupid old RPG-7's 1960's PGM-7VL HEAT warhead with probe.

Where did you find Arjun in 1991 Gulf war?They were Challenger 1 and M1 Abrams.Also Iraqi crews were not trained.

But we can use those 125 mm cannons to support infantry and as an artillery piece.And then change T 72 Chassis for making new APCs,bridge laying vehicle.

BMPT is one example.

 

[SilentKiller]

can T-72 be modified into Heavy IFV's?

 

[The Last Stand]

Where did you find Arjun in 1991 Gulf war?They were Challenger 1 and M1 Abrams.Also Iraqi crews were not trained.

Just gave an example. Jeez.

 

[arnabmit]

Whatever T-72s are left, get them night vision and send them fast to Ladakh, Uttaranchal, Sikkim & Arunachal.

Keep only Arjuns for Rajasthan and T-90s for Punjab.

 

[Damian]

can T-72 be modified into Heavy IFV's?

Yes, every tank can be converted but you must think also about cost-effectiveness relation of such modification.

Russians for example use a special heavy APC BMO-T based on T-72, that is used to transport infantry squads with rocket flamethrowers like RPO-A.

 

[Blackwater]

privatize DRDO, sign MOU with German leopard 2 tanks company. build new tank from drawing board or make changes in existing leopard 2 tank only for India specification.

or buy A1M2 straight from USA

 

[Kunal Biswas]

Army Worried Over Mal-Functioning T-72 Tanks
New Delhi | Jun 13, 2013

India's T-72 tanks are facing problems with its ammunition as it sometimes bursts in the barrel and 200 such cases have been reported making the Army wonder whether its troops will be "afraid" to fire even after seeing the enemy.

"It (the T-72 ammunition) used to burst in the barrel. If it bursts in the barrel, then the firer is afraid to fire his own gun, which is not a correct thing. If he is afraid to fire his own gun, then even if he sees the enemy he will not fire," the Army has told a Parliamentary Standing Committee on Defence.

The Army informed the Government and the Parliamentary Committee that over a period of time, there have been 200 such accidents involving the ammunition and "it brings down the confidence of the firer, especially, with regard to tank ammunition."

In terms of the numbers, the T-72 tanks are the backbone of the Indian armoured fleet and have undergone several upgrades since their induction to be able to fight effectively in the battlefield.

Source : :: Bharat-Rakshak.com - Indian Military News Headlines ::

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OFB ammo were discarded not just propellents but also the rods, due to ammo burst in guns the blame we OFB produce faulty ammo..

Now we have conform reports that Russian ammo too burst in guns, Now the blame would also go on OFB perhaps..

 

[Kunal Biswas]

Related News :Army saddled with 900 unreliable T-72 tanks

India's main battle tank the T72 is in bad shape. An internal audit report of the army which says that about 900 T-72 tanks are inoperational or unreliable, all because their overhaul is far behind schedule. The security implications are huge because without the T72 tank India's tank regiments find themselves at a great disadvantage.

Army saddled with unreliable tanks-News-Exclusives-TIMESNOW.tv - Latest Breaking News, Big News Stories, News Videos

 

[Austin]

Ajai Shukla mentions in one report that barrel busting is due to OFB not following OEM document specs

btw, the exploding guns had NOTHING to do with bad ammunition, fatigue, or prematurely exploding HE shells. Most of the barrels burst while firing APFSDS, not HE.

I happened to be in a position in those days to know what was happening. This matter was thrashed out fully at a major meeting in OFB Kanpur in 1998, attended by the OFB people, the DGMF people, the Deputy Chief and a full-fledged Russian delegation at which this matter was thrashed out. Broadsword (then young, unwrinkled and a Lt Col) was there too, taking notes. The reason for the bursting barrels, the meeting concluded, was SINGLE-FOLD: tempering at 690 degrees instead of the 725 (I could be very slightly off on the figures... it was 12 years ago) that the Russian manufacturing documents specified.

Broadsword: Arjun tank outruns, outguns Russian T-90

 

[AVERAGE INDIAN]

scrap them replace it with Arjuns

 

[pmaitra]

scrap them replace it with Arjuns

Or sell them to anyone who is willing to buy them. Divert the proceeds to either buy more tanks, or use it for a brand new tank manufacturing facility.

We need to make sure our entire mainstay fleet is that of T-90 and Arjun.

If we act on a contingency basis, this could be a blessing in disguise.

 

[pmaitra]

OFB ammo were discarded not just propellents but also the rods, due to ammo burst in guns the blame we OFB produce faulty ammo..

Now we have conform reports that Russian ammo too burst in guns, Now the blame would also go on OFB perhaps..

Blame for faulty Russian made ammo should not go to OFB, but OFB must be brought to book if there is fault with OFB made ammo.

I am also not sure whether the problem is with the ammo or with the guns. I doubt it is with the guns.

 

[Kunal Biswas]

Old Guns with latest gen ammo with more powerful propellents, these guns cannot handle the Chamber pressure causing the gun to explode while crew still inside..

Back then it was convenient to put the blame on OFB propellent bags ( True that some of them were faulty so does Russian ) but strangely perpetrators were also destroyed, And next was large import of Russian ammo, While the major issue was never looked upon..

I am also not sure whether the problem is with the ammo or with the guns. I doubt it is with the guns.

 

[pmaitra]

Old Guns with latest gen ammo with more powerful propellents, these guns cannot handle the Chamber pressure causing the gun to explode while crew still inside..

Back then it was convenient to put the blame on OFB propellent bags ( True that some of them were faulty so does Russian ) but strangely perpetrators were also destroyed, And next was large import of Russian ammo, While the major issue was never looked upon..

Thanks for the info.

So this is not really a defect, rather, old gun that is incapable of handling modern (more powerful) ammo.