China Economy: News & Discussion

[ym888]

Beijing's spies stole Canadian nuclear secrets

Clone of Slowpoke reactor developed

www.theglobeandmail.com

Thank you for your post, I saw this story for the first time, I don't know if it is true, but it is very wonderful and touching.

In the 1960s, China was very backward. I was moved by the Chinese secret agent in the story. He was loyal to his duty and completed his mission bravely.

 

[Rudra72930]

Chinese Labour uprising.
More power to the poor Chinese labourers fighting against the atrocities of CCP.

"Zhengzhou Foxconn, a true hero, my brother uses Fangtong to fight against the Zhao family dog, without fear!"

 

[Varzone]

Chinese Labour uprising.
More power to the poor Chinese labourers fighting against the atrocities of CCP.

"Zhengzhou Foxconn, a true hero, my brother uses Fangtong to fight against the Zhao family dog, without fear!"

But China's GDP per capita is far greater than India so this doesn't matter

 

[Rudra72930]

But China's GDP per capita is far greater than India so this doesn't matter

This is what happens when a country doesn't provide basic fundamental rights to its citizens & treat them as a flock of sheeps.

Even pressure cookers have a valve to prevent it from exploding.

The Western Tech companies have to adhere to human rights clause to do business in US & Europe. These Uprising can be very well be cited to punish those companies & expedite their exodus from China.

Specially at a time when the Chinese are trying to punch above their waist to dethrone the US on top.

The Foxconn production facility in India is going through a huge expansion. I believe we can gain much more from this bargain, provided the chip foundries are setup on time.

 

[SexyChineseLady]

But China's GDP per capita is far greater than India so this doesn't matter

Well, compared to the era when China entered the WTO, these Apple riots really don't mean much.

When 30M state workers were sacked between 1995 and 2003 during the WTO entry period, hundreds of riots happened across the country. Millions of workers were involved.

But we all know what happened after those riots.

Its real GDP (PPP) went from 3% of the world's to crossing the US as the world's largest economy in 2013 and now stands at 25% of the world's total.

China’s Worker Protests: A Second Wave of Labor Unrest?

THERE HAS BEEN a 30% rise in collective riots in China in recent years. Whereas in 1993, there were 10,000 reported cases with 700,000 participants, in 2003 it jumped to 60,000 with 3 million…

againstthecurrent.org

The first wave of labor protest was mainly by workers in the State-Owned Enterprises (SOEs) against outright privatization or restructuring into modern enterprises. It started in the early 1990s, and by the turn of the twenty-first century it became sharper and involved more workers. The DaQing oil field and the LiaoYang example have been the most widely reported cases.

In March 2002, 50,000 oil workers at the DaQing oil field protested for many days against downsizing. The oil industry had undergone immense restructuring to compete with foreign oil giants in the domestic market. Earlier, in 2001 a metal plant in LiaoYang, located in the North East as is the DaQing field, went bankrupt with public property looted by management and local officials. Workers took to the streets to protest.

Whereas the DaQing case was outstanding for the large number of protesters and their call for independent trade unions, the LiaoYang case was spectacular for its effort in trying to link up with other factory workers to fight against privatization.

Both cases were severely suppressed by the authorities, and LiaoYang had its two central leaders sentenced to between four and seven years imprisonment. The Liao Yang factory was subsequently bankrupted. For the oil industry, eventually 600,000 oil workers were sacked.

There may be hundreds or even thousands of cases of SOEs workers fighting back in the last ten years, but generally they have lost the battles. Up to 30 million SOEs workers were sacked, and women workers were generally the first to go. Between 1993 and 2003, SOEs industrial output in relation to total industrial output went down from 47% to 38%.

Under the policy of “retaining the large (SOEs), letting the small go” (in fact many medium SOEs have been let go as well), many medium and small enterprises had been privatized. As for big SOEs, they have been restructured as commercial entities whose ultimate ambition is to transform themselves into Trans National Corporations (TNCs) and compete in the global market with Mobile, or Fords. Whether they can succeed is another matter.

 

[Varzone]

This is what happens when a country doesn't provide basic fundamental rights to its citizens & treat them as a flock of sheeps.

Even pressure cookers have a valve to prevent it from exploding.

The Western Tech companies have to adhere to human rights clause to do business in US & Europe. These Uprising can be very well be cited to punish those companies & expedite their exodus from China.

Specially at a time when the Chinese are trying to punch above their waist to dethrone the US on top.

The Foxconn production facility in India is going through a huge expansion. I believe we can gain much more from this bargain, provided the chips foundries are setup on time.

Indian bureaucrats and attitude is what's keeping us from achieving targets.
At every level there are absolute twits in charge of affairs and then come the local power circle politics.

That's the cost of doing business in India, but alas, we walk on....walk on....to better days slowly slowly.

 

[Varzone]

Well, compared to the era when China entered the WTO, these Apple riots really don't mean much.

When 30M state workers were sacked between 1995 and 2003 during the WTO entry period, hundreds of riots happened across the country. Millions of workers were involved.

But we all know what happened after those riots.

Its real GDP (PPP) went from 3% of the world's to crossing the US as the world's largest economy in 2013 and now stands at 25% of the world's total.

China’s Worker Protests: A Second Wave of Labor Unrest?

THERE HAS BEEN a 30% rise in collective riots in China in recent years. Whereas in 1993, there were 10,000 reported cases with 700,000 participants, in 2003 it jumped to 60,000 with 3 million…

againstthecurrent.org

The first wave of labor protest was mainly by workers in the State-Owned Enterprises (SOEs) against outright privatization or restructuring into modern enterprises. It started in the early 1990s, and by the turn of the twenty-first century it became sharper and involved more workers. The DaQing oil field and the LiaoYang example have been the most widely reported cases.

In March 2002, 50,000 oil workers at the DaQing oil field protested for many days against downsizing. The oil industry had undergone immense restructuring to compete with foreign oil giants in the domestic market. Earlier, in 2001 a metal plant in LiaoYang, located in the North East as is the DaQing field, went bankrupt with public property looted by management and local officials. Workers took to the streets to protest.

Whereas the DaQing case was outstanding for the large number of protesters and their call for independent trade unions, the LiaoYang case was spectacular for its effort in trying to link up with other factory workers to fight against privatization.

Both cases were severely suppressed by the authorities, and LiaoYang had its two central leaders sentenced to between four and seven years imprisonment. The Liao Yang factory was subsequently bankrupted. For the oil industry, eventually 600,000 oil workers were sacked.

There may be hundreds or even thousands of cases of SOEs workers fighting back in the last ten years, but generally they have lost the battles. Up to 30 million SOEs workers were sacked, and women workers were generally the first to go. Between 1993 and 2003, SOEs industrial output in relation to total industrial output went down from 47% to 38%.

Under the policy of “retaining the large (SOEs), letting the small go” (in fact many medium SOEs have been let go as well), many medium and small enterprises had been privatized. As for big SOEs, they have been restructured as commercial entities whose ultimate ambition is to transform themselves into Trans National Corporations (TNCs) and compete in the global market with Mobile, or Fords. Whether they can succeed is another matter.View attachment 183616

My child, what is correlation between sacking people who are protesting privatisation and people protesting for simply not getting paid by private entities and GDP growth?

Kuch bhi?

 

[Varzone]

 

[SexyChineseLady]

My child, what is correlation between sacking people who are protesting privatisation and people protesting for simply not getting paid by private entities and GDP growth?

Kuch bhi?

Just saying, China had much bigger riots and many more of them before and those marked a transition to a period of massive growth

 

[Rudra72930]

Well, compared to the era when China entered the WTO, these Apple riots really don't mean much.

When 30M state workers were sacked between 1995 and 2003 during the WTO entry period, hundreds of riots happened across the country. Millions of workers were involved.

But we all know what happened after those riots.

Its real GDP (PPP) went from 3% of the world's to crossing the US as the world's largest economy in 2013 and now stands at 25% of the world's total.

China’s Worker Protests: A Second Wave of Labor Unrest?

THERE HAS BEEN a 30% rise in collective riots in China in recent years. Whereas in 1993, there were 10,000 reported cases with 700,000 participants, in 2003 it jumped to 60,000 with 3 million…

againstthecurrent.org

The first wave of labor protest was mainly by workers in the State-Owned Enterprises (SOEs) against outright privatization or restructuring into modern enterprises. It started in the early 1990s, and by the turn of the twenty-first century it became sharper and involved more workers. The DaQing oil field and the LiaoYang example have been the most widely reported cases.

In March 2002, 50,000 oil workers at the DaQing oil field protested for many days against downsizing. The oil industry had undergone immense restructuring to compete with foreign oil giants in the domestic market. Earlier, in 2001 a metal plant in LiaoYang, located in the North East as is the DaQing field, went bankrupt with public property looted by management and local officials. Workers took to the streets to protest.

Whereas the DaQing case was outstanding for the large number of protesters and their call for independent trade unions, the LiaoYang case was spectacular for its effort in trying to link up with other factory workers to fight against privatization.

Both cases were severely suppressed by the authorities, and LiaoYang had its two central leaders sentenced to between four and seven years imprisonment. The Liao Yang factory was subsequently bankrupted. For the oil industry, eventually 600,000 oil workers were sacked.

There may be hundreds or even thousands of cases of SOEs workers fighting back in the last ten years, but generally they have lost the battles. Up to 30 million SOEs workers were sacked, and women workers were generally the first to go. Between 1993 and 2003, SOEs industrial output in relation to total industrial output went down from 47% to 38%.

Under the policy of “retaining the large (SOEs), letting the small go” (in fact many medium SOEs have been let go as well), many medium and small enterprises had been privatized. As for big SOEs, they have been restructured as commercial entities whose ultimate ambition is to transform themselves into Trans National Corporations (TNCs) and compete in the global market with Mobile, or Fords. Whether they can succeed is another matter.View attachment 183616

I realised your a fuckin parrot

This isn't 2001, China is not in the same position. Every country is investing heavily to move their supply chain out of China be it US, Europe, Japan or India.

At this point trade with China is a liability because of the trust deficit. And it's only heldge of cost effectiveness, is eroding fast. As countries like Vietnam, Mexico & India gets more competitive.

This is not 2001 any more.

• The World market is already saturated with cheap Chinese products unlike in 2001, so there isn't any scope of Global Scalability as was after the WTO agreement.
• Chinese real estate & infrastructure sector is completely saturated, to an extent that it has lead to a banking crisis. Unlike in 2001.
• So the biggest cash cow of the Chinese financial sector to generate captial, through investment in high margin sectors has been severely crippled.
• China has reached a certain level of HDI, as a result of which they cannot bank on cheap labour to achieve high productivity. Which wasn't the case in 2001.

Now you might point at the heavy incentives offered to industries by CCP to help reduce production cost.

But the fact is, productivity of capital diminishes over time. So more capital isn't a solution.

The biggest cash generating sectors of China are over saturated. So the financial agencies will find it harder to raise the amount of capital as easy as before.

China will have to increasingly depend on high tech sectors for growth, which provides a lower margin with diminishing returns over time. So a much slower growth rate.

And also western tech companies are racing to diversify their supply chain outside China. So the trends are polar opposite to that of 2001.

This time the damage will very well be permanent.

 

[Varzone]

Just saying, China had much bigger riots and many more of them before and those marked a transition to a period of massive growth

No, you are not saying anything but mumble jumble. You want us to believe that protests are sign of something great happening down the line whereas it was WTO admission and FDI flood to China that actually resulted in boosting economic growth.

What do you think I'm stupid like the rest of them?

 

[Varzone]

No don't post china suv sales again and make hakka noodle of my brain

 

[Rudra72930]

No don't post china suv sales again and make hakka noodle of my brain

Automobile & electrics sector provides the lowest margin, due to their competitive market & the return on investment in these sectors decrease over time as a country moves up the value chain.

China's real estate & infrastructure sector are crushed. And they have a banking crisis due to the mortgage issue arising from it.

Their financial institutions wouldn't be able to generate the same amount of capital as before, nor will their investments provide the same returns.

China will face a Japan type collapse in GDP. And these Labour Uprising will only expedite their impending doom.

 

[SexyChineseLady]

No, you are not saying anything but mumble jumble. You want us to believe that protests are sign of something great happening down the line whereas it was WTO admission and FDI flood to China that actually resulted in boosting economic growth.

What do you think I'm stupid like the rest of them?

What are you trying to say? This is a new era of doom?

Even more people in the West at the 2000 time frame were predicting "The Coming Collapse of China" from those previous riots and other turmoil. It ended with China passing the US in the real GDP (PPP) by 2013.

China is going through another change right now. For the first time, China has passed or on par with the US in a variety of technological fields. There are more Chinese colleges among the top engineering schools than American ones. There are more Chinese research papers produced and cited than American ones. More patents are produced in China than anywhere in the world. China dominates the industrial components for electronics, for EVs, for HSR and will be building about 90% of all nuclear power plants slated in the coming years. Those are the reasons for the embargoes from US

In 2000, China did not have any of these things. So while you are predicting doom others say we are at the cusp of a new Chinese economy driven by domestic innovation. The electronics and EV eco-systems are just the start

China’s New Innovation Advantage

Long considered a global copycat, China is now home to many of the fastest start-ups to reach a $1 billion valuation globally. Whatever has propelled Chinese companies to the top, the metrics we use to evaluate innovation have missed it. The author argues that China today has a resource that no...

hbr.org

 

[Rudra72930]

What are you trying to say? This is a new era of doom?

Even more people in the West at the 2000 time frame were predicting "The Coming Collapse of China" from those previous riots and other turmoil. It ended with China passing the US in the real GDP (PPP) by 2013.

China is going through another change right now. For the first time, China has passed or on par with the US in a variety of technological fields. There are more Chinese colleges among the top engineering schools than American ones. There are more Chinese research papers produced and cited than American ones. More patents are produced in China than anywhere in the world. China dominates the industrial components for electronics, for EVs, for HSR and will be building about 90% of all nuclear power plants slated in the coming years. Those are the reasons for the embargoes from US

In 2000, China did not have any of these things. So while you are predicting doom others say we are at the cusp of a new Chinese economy driven by domestic innovation. The electronics and EV eco-systems are just the start

China’s New Innovation Advantage

Long considered a global copycat, China is now home to many of the fastest start-ups to reach a $1 billion valuation globally. Whatever has propelled Chinese companies to the top, the metrics we use to evaluate innovation have missed it. The author argues that China today has a resource that no...

hbr.org

If Chinese are not Pokemons. The collapse of Chinese GDP is pretty much set to happen.

High tech sectors may sound fancy but the return on investment these sectors provide isn't enough to sustain a large economy.

The real estate sector contributes more than 30% to Chinese economy. And like every other country they are facing a crisis in this sector.

In the manufacturing sector your Labour Uprising has ensured the World should always have alternative in place to avoid sabotage, like the issue of chip shortage a few months backs. And your gonna face the consequence with in the next 4-5 years.

Japan, Soth Korea all have faced the same crisis but being a vessel state of US they have been shielded to some extent. China is on the wrong side of the game.

 

[SexyChineseLady]

If Chinese are not Pokemons. The collapse of Chinese GDP is pretty much set to happen.

High tech sectors may sound fancy but the return on investment these sectors provide isn't enough to sustain a large economy.

The real estate sector contributes more than 30% to Chinese economy. And like every other countries they are facing a crisis in this sector.

In the manufacturing sector your Labour Uprising has ensured the World should always have alternative in place to avoid sabotage, like the issue of chip shortage a few months backs.
And your gonna face the consequences with in the next 4-5 years.

Japan, Soth Korea all have faced the same crisis but being a vessel state of US they have been shielded to some extent. China is on the wrong side of the game.

Good! We will see in 4 or 5 years time whether China collapses

Margins and ROE are important to individual wealth but they certainly aren't needed to "sustain" a large economy. If that were case, India's economy would have collapsed. Agriculture is the biggest part of the Indian economy and agriculture has pitifully low margins.

Electronics and high tech margins are not very low by any means. It might be low when they are commoditized (mainly by China itself through economy of scale.)

Electronics is what propelled Japan, Korea and Taiwan into the first world. China is in middle income with a good ways to go. It also was propelled by elecronics but China has a few more things that Japan/Korea/Taiwan don't have and that is a huge commercial space, nuclear energy and aerospace industries.

 

[ym888]

Chinese companies have increased their global share in 13 categories of high-tech products



2022/11/23PRINTEMAIL

The presence of Chinese companies in the global high-tech sector has been further strengthened. In a 2021 global market share survey of major products and services compiled by Nikkei, Chinese companies increased their market share in 13 categories of high-tech products, including pure electric vehicles (EV) and advanced materials for batteries. The supply chain's dependence on China is once again evident.


Nippon Keizai Shimbun conducted a "market share survey of major products and services" for final products, services, core components and materials in 56 categories important to global economic activity, and surveyed the top five companies in each category. Chinese companies expanded their market share in 13 out of 28 major high-tech products, including final products such as battery electric vehicles (EV) and smartphones and components, while their share decreased in six. The remaining nine categories had no Chinese companies in the top five.


The Biden administration has imposed strict restrictions on the export of advanced semiconductors to China as the U.S. and China are in sharp conflict over economic security. The United States is pressuring Japan to follow the restrictions on China. Japan and the US need to reassess their supply chains in order to cope with emergencies in the Taiwan Strait, but the survey results show that Chinese companies have a high market share.


The most prominent is the area related to EV. CATL (Ningde Times New Energy Technology), the world's largest vehicle battery market, has a share of 38.6 percent, up more than 12 percentage points from 2020. Together with BYD, Chinese companies have a 46 per cent market share in vehicle-mounted batteries.


Byd also moved up to fourth place in the EV segment, overtaking the Renault-Nissan-Mitsubishi Japan-France alliance. Byd controls EV prices by taking advantage of its strength in in-house production of key components such as onboard batteries. Byd ranked second behind Tesla in EV sales between January and June 2022.


In the isolating layer (insulating film) that separates the positive and negative electrodes of key battery components, Shanghai Enjie New Materials Technology has expanded its market share with government subsidies by investing in production, which has risen to 28.7 percent, ahead of the second largest Asahi with 10.7 percent. In the rapidly expanding EV supply chain, Chinese companies are strengthening their presence from upstream to downstream.

In LCD panels, where Japanese and South Korean companies used to compete fiercely, Chinese companies such as BOE, which has the largest share of large, medium and small sizes, are gaining market share. Boe's OLED panels are also used in Apple's iPhone, catching up with South Korea's Samsung Electronics Co LTD, which is leading the market.

On the other hand, while Huawei maintained its top share of mobile base stations, its share dropped from 38 percent to 34 percent due to US sanctions.

Among the 56 categories surveyed, 32 Chinese companies have entered the top five in terms of market share, 21 of which have increased their market share and 11 of which have decreased. Due to the epidemic prevention and control, China's economic recovery has lagged behind that of Europe and the United States, with sluggish domestic demand and declining market share of construction machinery and medium and heavy trucks.


American companies have the largest market share and the largest number in 18 categories, followed by China with 15. Japan still has seven. SONY Group is a leader in CMOS image sensors and Sumitomo Chemical Group is a leader in polarizers for LCD panel components.


KPMG FAS partner Masahisa Inagaki said that "global companies are responding by dividing their supply chains into 'China' and 'non-China', among other things, on the back of heightened tensions between the US and China". Daikin Industries in Japan is building a system that can produce air conditioners without Chinese-made components.

 

[ym888]

Global patent applications hit a new high, with China leading the way



2022/11/22PRINTEMAIL

According to data released by the World Intellectual Property Organization (WIPO) on November 21, 3.4 million patents were filed worldwide in 2021, up 3.6 percent from the previous year. The number of applications has increased for two consecutive years and hit a record high for the past three years since 2018. Applications from China, which accounted for nearly 50 percent of the total, played a driving role.


By country, China topped the list with 1.58 million applications. The United States ranked second with 590,000 cases and Japan third with 280,000 cases. Germany ranked seventh with 58,000, down one place from the previous year. In terms of regional share, Asia accounts for 67.6 percent, which is the overwhelming majority.

Applications from China rose 5.5 per cent year on year, while those from South Korea rose 2.5 per cent, pushing up overall growth. Japan, on the other hand, saw a 1.7 per cent year-on-year decline in applications. The US (down 1.2%) and Germany (down 3.9%) were also lower than the previous year.

Wipo Director-General Daren Tang commented that "despite the economic and social fragmentation caused by the global pandemic, people in all countries continue to be committed to technological innovation and creativity".


On the other hand, it also shows concerns about the impact of a deteriorating economy and rising geopolitical tensions on technological development.


The analysis of each company and sector was not disclosed, but it is believed that Asian high-tech companies are actively applying. In WIPO's ranking of international patent applications released in February this year, Huawei technology ranked first for five consecutive years. Korea s Samsung Electronics ranked third.

The number of global patent applications fell in 2019 for the first time in nine years, due to the decline in China. In 2020, there was only a small increase from the previous year.

 

[SexyChineseLady]

Global patent applications hit a new high, with China leading the way



2022/11/22PRINTEMAIL

...

By country, China topped the list with 1.58 million applications. The United States ranked second with 590,000 cases and Japan third with 280,000 cases. Germany ranked seventh with 58,000, down one place from the previous year. In terms of regional share, Asia accounts for 67.6 percent, which is the overwhelming majority.

China is leading a wave from East Asia. The coming era will be an innovation-led economy using local IP instead of buying from West.

 

[ym888]

China is leading a wave from East Asia. The coming era will be an innovation-led economy using local IP instead of buying from West.

The West still owns most of the technology patents, you can't get around that.

East Asia has done well.