China Economy: News & Discussion

[Varzone]

Not disappearing fast enough for a lot of people I think

Nearly 1 In Every 2 Mercedes-Benz Sold In Q2 2022 Went To China | Carscoops

China is by far the largest market for Mercedes-Benz with over 206,000 sales in Q3

www.carscoops.com

China remains one of the brand’s most important markets. Mercedes sold 206,800 vehicles in the country in the July to September period, easily outselling Europe where 152,700 vehicles were delivered and North America where 83,200 units were sold. Indeed, deliveries in China were almost three times the 72,400 vehicles sold in the United States during Q3.

are you going to reply to my every post with auto sales? This video was particularly about Shanghai and how the repeated COVID lockdown has destroyed businesses.

 

[SexyChineseLady]

are you going to reply to my every post with auto sales? This video was particularly about Shanghai and how the repeated COVID lockdown has destroyed businesses.

A drop in sales of foreign auto brands would be a leading indicator of a disappearing middle class. It is not happening yet.

The Chinese brands are growing even faster while Mercedes sell more in China than Europe or North America -- that would indicate an expanding (not a contracting) middle class able to absorb more cars which besides a home is the biggest purchase of a household:

Chinese Auto Brands Are Surpassing Global Firms Like BMW, Mercedes and Audi - Pandaily

According to data released by the China Passenger Car Association, the cumulative retail share of Chinese car brands in the first three quarters of this year was 47.0%, up 7.5% year-on-year. International luxury brands and joint ventures are now showing downward trends in China.

pandaily.com

 

[RoaringTigerHiddenDragon]

A drop in sales of foreign auto brands would be a leading indicator of a disappearing middle class. It is not happening yet.

The Chinese brands are growing even faster while Mercedes sell more in China than Europe or North America -- that would indicate an expanding (not a contracting) middle class able to absorb more cars which besides a home is the biggest purchase of a household:

Chinese Auto Brands Are Surpassing Global Firms Like BMW, Mercedes and Audi - Pandaily

According to data released by the China Passenger Car Association, the cumulative retail share of Chinese car brands in the first three quarters of this year was 47.0%, up 7.5% year-on-year. International luxury brands and joint ventures are now showing downward trends in China.

pandaily.com

Not really. A large portion of Chinese car sales are fleet sales - like for taxis, police, government uses etc. And the EV adoption is happening because the CCP is heavily subsidizing just to play yet another low quality, volume game.

Sales are surging, but profits remain a distant dream for most Chinese EV makers

China’s electrified-vehicle market took root in 2010 after Beijing rolled out a generous subsidy program. Sales of EVs and plug-in hybrids have expanded at a breathtaking pace ever since. Yet, except for BYD, profits are nowhere in sight for many domestic companies venturing into the EV sector...

www.autonews.com

Wow…even the Chinese say that the car market is weak. Did the CCP approve of this statement?

China auto sales growth slows in Sept as signs of softening demand emerge

Sales of electric vehicles (EV) in China rose at their slowest pace in five months as demand faltered in a sputtering economy despite government incentives to revive the auto market, though industry officials forecast a stronger end to the year.

www.reuters.com

Like the real estate bubble burst, the bank lending bubble for cars will collapse next due to overall debt tightening.

Here are a few collapses:




The negative spiral of real estate collapse is now collapsing several sectors:


Looks like Shanghai is toast as well:



Ch8ja is going through even more pain than I thought. All hail Xictator for his far reaching zero-Covid policy thanks to the vaccine aka salt so;Union not working. It was a pitiful attempt to arm twist Moderna to share vaccine tech. Did not happen. So lockdown again. Lol.

 

[RoaringTigerHiddenDragon]

Or maybe the BMW and Mercedes sales are from each party Secretary owning a 100 luxury cars?How many party Secretary thugs has the CCP unleashed on the poor Chinese peasants who don’t even have money to buy medicines?

 

[RoaringTigerHiddenDragon]

By the way, has Xi returned the looted moneys back to the peasants or he is going to buy 2000 BMWs to shore up “auto sales”?

 

[Varzone]

By the way, has Xi returned the looted moneys back to the peasants or he is going to buy 2000 BMWs to shore up “auto sales”?

Must be nice to be a CCP Official, life set.

 

[Hari Sud]

Not really. A large portion of Chinese car sales are fleet sales - like for taxis, police, government uses etc. And the EV adoption is happening because the CCP is heavily subsidizing just to play yet another low quality, volume game.

Sales are surging, but profits remain a distant dream for most Chinese EV makers

China’s electrified-vehicle market took root in 2010 after Beijing rolled out a generous subsidy program. Sales of EVs and plug-in hybrids have expanded at a breathtaking pace ever since. Yet, except for BYD, profits are nowhere in sight for many domestic companies venturing into the EV sector...

www.autonews.com

Wow…even the Chinese say that the car market is weak. Did the CCP approve of this statement?

China auto sales growth slows in Sept as signs of softening demand emerge

Sales of electric vehicles (EV) in China rose at their slowest pace in five months as demand faltered in a sputtering economy despite government incentives to revive the auto market, though industry officials forecast a stronger end to the year.

www.reuters.com

Like the real estate bubble burst, the bank lending bubble for cars will collapse next due to overall debt tightening.

Here are a few collapses:




The negative spiral of real estate collapse is now collapsing several sectors:


Looks like Shanghai is toast as well:



Ch8ja is going through even more pain than I thought. All hail Xictator for his far reaching zero-Covid policy thanks to the vaccine aka salt so;Union not working. It was a pitiful attempt to arm twist Moderna to share vaccine tech. Did not happen. So lockdown again. Lol.

‘Hastily built EV cars in China built on copied or reverse engineered technology are the greatest fire hazard there. Average 20 cars daily are on fire because the technology is not fully understood by the Chinese manufacturers.

 

[Varzone]

Can someone pls guide me to the China politics thread? I have to post something interesting

 

[NutCracker]

Must be nice to be a CCP Official, life set.

You can even have concubines and have more than one children (before policy abolition).
Those babies can not exist on paper so no govt scheme benefits.

If the kid is unlucky and got dumped by his CCP member-dad, then he will have only option to become LITTLE PINK, opt work from home basement and defend CCP on online forums

 

[Bharatiya]

It seems that China went a bit too aggressive a little too early. CCP could've remained assertive without appearing as a threat; the so-called Peaceful rise of China.

While the trade war was already going on, I think Covid was what really pushed it through a threshold and created the current market scape. The wolf warrior diplomacy only made it worse.

Current day China's gdp is around 70% of US'. (Yen has fallen, so we might see reduction, but these are the current numbers.)

If they waited until they developed (borrowed) a few more critical techs and crossed the US' gdp, then China would've been in a more favorable position. Because te US is still quite ahead and its empire holds many critical technologies and industries.

I think the chinese would argue that US was already intent of fighting and they're better off being aggressive than meek since they accumulated enough power. It's somewhat valid, but still. Anyway, Time will be the final verdict.

 

[ym888]

It seems that China went a bit too aggressive a little too early. CCP could've remained assertive without appearing as a threat; the so-called Peaceful rise of China.

While the trade war was already going on, I think Covid was what really pushed it through a threshold and created the current market scape. The wolf warrior diplomacy only made it worse.

Current day China's gdp is around 70% of US'. (Yen has fallen, so we might see reduction, but these are the current numbers.)

If they waited until they developed (borrowed) a few more critical techs and crossed the US' gdp, then China would've been in a more favorable position. Because te US is still quite ahead and its empire holds many critical technologies and industries.

I think the chinese would argue that US was already intent of fighting and they're better off being aggressive than meek since they accumulated enough power. It's somewhat valid, but still. Anyway, Time will be the final verdict.

China has not been in a war for 40 years and is the only one of the P5.

If this is not peaceful rise, then what is? Bombing Baghdad? Occupation of Afghanistan?

China's biggest sin is to grow too fast.

The Chinese have to apologize for that.

 

[Bharatiya]

China has not been in a war for 40 years and is the only one of the P5.

If this is not peaceful rise, then what is? Bombing Baghdad? Occupation of Afghanistan?

China's biggest sin is to grow too fast.

The Chinese have to apologize for that.

You really shouldn't be saying that to an Indian of all people. We're your neighbors and know what you do, overtly or covertly. Sponsoring and helping a terrorist state, funding the naxals in NE, Doklam, Galvan. I can go on.

Btw, don't "What about US" or "That's not a real war" us. That sh*t doesn't fly here. We consider what China did as hostile activity and aren't delusional. Like S. Jaishankar said, the relationship is not normal and it's not business as usual.


Back to the original question, the timing China went aggressive and started pissing off nations like there's no tomorrow. Do you support that timing? Why? What are the merits? Or do you not support it?

 

[SexyChineseLady]

China began pissing off Western nations once its GDP threatens to eclipse the US and Huawei took over the lead on 5G

Japan suffered the same attacks from the US when its economy and scientific base threatened to lead the world:

Scientists divided over US blocking key chipmaking equipment sale to China | TRT World

www.trtworld.com

Japanese scientist Hiroo Kinoshita, who performed the first EUV experiment in the mid-1980s, says Beijing has an equal right to pursue modern technology.

“Of course, I could not understand that decision. Science has no border,” he says when asked about the US blocking ASML sales to China.

The US-China economic showdown stems from the race to dominate the 5G market where Chinese firm Huawei has taken the lead, he tells TRT World.

Kinoshita has had firsthand experience of what happens when a political standoff comes in the way of technological development.

“When Japan became the leader in semiconductors, especially in the memory chip segment, Japan-US semiconductor friction broke out.

“NTT Laboratories (the Japanese version of Bell Labs) where I was working, had to stop semiconductor development. After that, Japanese semiconductor development declined,” he says.

“Therefore, I believe that scientific and technological competition should be free (of political roadblocks).”

 

[SexyChineseLady]

The global chips industry is going into a recession with over supply, plummeting demand and crashing prices. And this is before next year's inevitable recession and the full impact of losing access to China which is now 75% of the global market.

But in China because of the US bans, the chips industry is in growth mode because China needs to access to chips made locally!

In few years, you will see a new semiconductor supply chain based solely in China that can potentially double the global output and drive many current firms out of business with more chips flooding the global market plus loss of access to the largest market in China.

The sudden reversal of the global chip shortage

Quickly shrinking demand for certain products is causing cancelled orders and unsold stockpiles. Read more at straitstimes.com.

www.straitstimes.com

Weak chip outlook
TSMC, the world’s largest contract chipmaker, faces reduced orders from four of its largest customers, reflecting slowing global demand. JPMorgan Chase said in a report in early September that AMD, Nvidia, Qualcomm and MediaTek slashed chip orders with TSMC.

While reporting a record quarterly profit surge for the July-to-September quarter last week, TSMC warned of a likely decline for the entire semiconductor industry in 2023 and cut its capital spending forecast by 10 per cent in 2022.

Other semiconductor companies are also facing tough conditions. AMD lowered its revenue forecast for the third quarter, citing significant weakening in the PC market. Intel, Nvidia and Micron Technology all issued subdued outlooks.

In the first half of 2022, macroeconomic headwinds and a number of “black swan” factors combined to cause consumer electronics demand to plummet, with smartphones and PCs bearing the brunt. Micron predicted that global PC shipments will decline by 10 per cent to 20 per cent in 2022, while the global smartphone market will decline by less than 10 per cent.

To reduce inventories, some chipmakers have begun slashing prices.

...
China’s resilience

China, however, presents a different picture. As the United States tightens sanctions on the country’s semiconductor sector, domestic chipmakers are accelerating efforts to develop alternatives.

The latest round of restrictions mainly targets advanced chips, which are generally characterised as having process nodes smaller than 28 nanometers. In semiconductor design, smaller process node sizes denote more-advanced technology.

Power management integrated circuit (PMIC) chips, which manage battery power charging and sleep modes and scaling of voltages down or up on electronic devices, don’t rely on advanced process nodes.

The PMIC market has long been dominated by global players including Texas Instruments and Infineon Technologies. Now, capacity is slowly shifting towards Chinese manufacturers, Mr Gai said.

In the long term, global wafer capacity is in tight balance or regional oversupply, but China is in short supply as expanding capacity is one of the country’s core objectives, ICwise’s Mr Xie said.

China’s wafer foundry expansion momentum has not slowed. In August, Semiconductor Manufacturing International Corp (SMIC) co-chief executive Zhao Haijun said at the company’s second-quarter earnings conference that the domestic contract chip industry still has great prospects.

“We will not change our plans for long-term capacity expansion and development,” he said.

In addition to expanding its existing 12-inch and 8-inch wafer production lines, SMIC is also building three new 12-inch wafer projects in Beijing, Shenzhen and Shanghai. Once completed, the company’s total capacity will double.


...

 

[THESIS THORON]

interesting research

 

[rockdog]

interesting research

If you are neither Indian or Chinese, combine the report on India's Hunger Index ranking, you would gain doublle happiness. ^_^

 

[rockdog]

Some India Watcher from Chinese cyber, on the Sino-India trade:

China India trade broke through 100 billion US dollars in the first nine months. Although the export growth rate is strikingly different, the prospect of economic cooperation is unstoppable

1. The bilateral trade volume between China and India in the first three quarters was USD 103.63 billion, up 14.6%. China exported $89.66 billion to India, up 31%. India exported 13.97 billion dollars to China, down 36.4%. India has a deficit of US $75.69 billion, and will have a deficit of 100 billion for the whole year, becoming the second largest source of surplus in China.

2. In 2021, China's exports to India will increase by 46.2% to US $97.52 billion, which will continue in 2022. India's exports to China increased by 34.2% to US $28.14 billion, but will fall back to the level lower than that of 2020 in 2022. India's deficit in 2021 will be US $69.38 billion.

3. India's exports to China are not important, which shows that India unilaterally needs to import a large amount of Chinese goods. This kind of trade cooperation was once unacceptable to India, which launched a boycott. But fortunately, India's economic growth momentum is excellent, and its international development needs to surpass that of Britain and catch up with Germany, so it actually accepts Chinese goods. The Modi government has also accepted the plan of establishing a 2-4km "buffer zone" at the border, and the border conflict has rapidly cooled down. China and India have entered a period of great development of economic and trade cooperation. Both sides have a lot of common interests in the SCO and the BRICS.

4. With the support of Chinese goods and industrial chain, India's economy is expected to upgrade, connect with China's industrial chain and deepen ties. On this basis, it will only take a few years for India's economy to surpass Japan's. If it is realized, there will be a major adjustment in Asia's geopolitics. The independent power of developing countries will be enhanced, and China and India will make a strong voice on the international stage, replacing those who have been overtaken by Western groups and becoming the dominant force of the international community. When India's strength comes up, it will not be as polite as China. It is to challenge the western countries. It would be unreasonable not to give India a permanent member.

5. India has a large deficit with China. Now it has a deficit of 100 billion dollars, and in the future it will have a deficit of 200 billion dollars. This relationship is a tie up. With such great interests, it is necessary to do business peacefully. Although the relationship is not good, it's OK. One can earn money and the other can develop.

 

[FalconSlayers]

 

[InfinityWarrior Thanos]

If you are neither Indian or Chinese, combine the report on India's Hunger Index ranking, you would gain doublle happiness. ^_^

Add Taiwan being a Independent Country , achieve Eternal happiness.

 

[ym888]

MG's new Rs 10 lakh electric car Air EV revealed! Will take the EV fight to Tata Motors - Times of India

Electric Car News: We expect MG Motor India to make use of the Wuling Air EV's platform to introduce a new electric car in the Indian market to take on the most affordab

timesofindia.indiatimes.com

interesting



MG will launch this EV in India