Arjun Main Battle Tank (MBT)

[Kunal Biswas]

But this is just US policy of arms exports, US is only superpower on this planet, they don't want anyone to have their best technology.no source says that T-90S have downgraded armor compared to T-90 and T-90A.

For that you have to think abt political environment We are under a cold war, Any leaked Info is valuable for enemy.

Russian play the same game i told you abt how T-72M is different from T-72A, Also do note until soviet fall their is not much info their for T-72 variants, Our decision to replace tot Russian module gives a hint..

 

[Damian]

Damian, the guys working on Armour are commonly PHDs in Physics and Chemistry or both, It is evident the full knowledge from such article is impossible, Its gives you the Idea, and if you know you dont question..

To Understand one have to work hard to that level, Getting a PHD is not observations, Have some respect..

I have respect to designers but still we don't know what ammunition was tested against Kanchan armor ("all ammunition" means nothing).

And as I said, it is better to question anything than belive in anything.

I'm not asking for detailed information on Kanchan protection level, I only asking about what ammunition was used to tests it, what were designation names of that ammunition, from where this ammunition was obtained etc. etc. etc.

It is really so hard to say what ammunition was tested?

For that you have to think abt political environment We are under a cold war, Any leaked Info is valuable for enemy.

Ok but I'm not asking about things covered by OPSEC.

Russian play the same game i told you abt how T-72M is different from T-72A,

Depends about what T-72M we are talking about, tanks for WarPac or non WarPac countries, T-72M for WarPac countries was more or less T-72A.

Also do note until soviet fall their is not much info their for T-72 variants, Our decision to replace tot Russian module gives a hint..

1) Yes, there were not many informations about more modern T-72's, and of course, decision of Indian goverment gives a hint that it is mostly licence issue, not definetly protection level issue.

 

[Damian]

@Damian you retard, go read you dumbo.

Wow, You are so adult, so smart, so... full of high culture!

How the hell are we supposed to take you seriously when you know nothing and tell us what is the WEAKness of the tank is!

I know nothing? And these photos I posted few pages ago are what? Maybe learn to read other people posts with understanding kid.

An internet troll like you would know more than Phds by just looking at it.LMAO!!

? Can someone translate this to some human language?

We have done enough of this defence about Arjun in Paki and other military forums for years to know what we are talking about.

And I read about MBT history of development and design also many years, this changes something?

It seems that You have some complex, I posted photographs with Arjun MBT weak zones and still instead of counterarguments from You I'am called troll, insulted etc. etc.

I only remind You that not I called You first idiot but You started.

So grow up or fuck off, I'am tired of talking with retards like You.

 

[Kunal Biswas]

I have respect to designers but still we don't know what ammunition was tested against Kanchan armor ("all ammunition" means nothing). I'm not asking for detailed information on Kanchan protection level, I only asking about what ammunition was used to tests it, what were designation names of that ammunition, from where this ammunition was obtained etc. etc. etc.It is really so hard to say what ammunition was tested? Ok but I'm not asking about things covered by OPSEC.

Depends about what T-72M we are talking about, tanks for WarPac or non WarPac countries, T-72M for WarPac countries was more or less T-72A.decision of Indian goverment gives a hint that it is mostly licence issue, not definetly protection level issue.

Do you know a project undergoing such as assault rifle how secrecy is their, People are not allowed to saw they worked for OFB outside India, And you want to know abt the round hit Arjun within 50m at 90 degree frontal Armour, It was Israeli Origin later all kind of Ammo In T-72M1 both Russian and Israeli origin were used on the tank and none penetrated..

The date was january 2000 at proof and experimental establishment arjun test
The Kanchan Armor - Frontier India - News, Analysis, Opinion

The source is Impossible to find in India but can be find if one knows what type of T-72 ammo exported to other countries..

For IMI: 125 mm APFSDS-T CARTRIDGE CL 3579 (MK2)
For Russian: 3vBM-17 was a must by 2000 in Indian T-72m1..


Not more but less, M is meant for degraded, TOT issue was with Gun not Armour, It change for 2 reason one is cost other is quality, Its no doubt that we have the tot and we understood which is better..

 

[Damian]

And you want to know abt the round hit Arjun within 50m at 90 degree frontal Armour, It was Israeli Origin later all kind of Ammo In T-72M1 both Russian and Israeli origin were used on the tank and none penetrated..

The date was january 2000 at proof and experimental establishment arjun test
The Kanchan Armor - Frontier India - News, Analysis, Opinion

The source is Impossible to find in India but can be find if one knows what type of T-72 ammo exported to other countries..

For IMI: 125 mm APFSDS-T CARTRIDGE CL 3579 (MK2)
For Russian: 3vBM-17 was a must by 2000 in Indian T-72m1..

So Kanchan was not tested against most modern ammunition.

 

[Shaitan]

Indeed, pitty that there are no photos of Kanchan armor availabale as Burlington armor photos, BDD armor and Reflecting plates in T-72B turret.

 

[Kunal Biswas]

So Kanchan was not tested against most modern ammunition.

The known date is 2000, Their are continues test on betterment of tank Armour, test dont stops, Newer rounds supplied with T-90S too used as per than Kanchan was again modified, Production Models of Arjun mk1 can withstand Newer rounds ( Delivered during 2002 ) with T-90S, Again in future if IA go for NATO rounds we than tests would be done again at facility call proof and experimental establishment..

 

[A.V.]

OFFICIALLY GK and KALKI stay away form this thread , i find any posts from you guys here will delete it , since you people cant debate facts and resort to personal attacks , let the rest sane members here debate it

 

[Damian]

http://desmond.imageshack.us/Himg819/scaled.php?server=819&filename=kachanarmour.png&res=medium

This actually not shows internal structure of Kanchan armor, I have pics of Burlington, BDD and T-72B armor, I also have pics of British prototype armor similiar to Burlington.

The known date is 2000, Their are continues test on betterment of tank Armour, test dont stops, Newer rounds supplied with T-90S too used as per than Kanchan was again modified, Production Models of Arjun mk1 can withstand Newer rounds ( Delivered during 2002 ) with T-90S, Again in future if IA go for NATO rounds we than tests would be done again at facility call proof and experimental establishment..

What ammunition was supplied for T-90S? What NATO ammunition will be used and from what gun it will be fired, India don't have any gun capabale to use NATO ammunition.

 

[Kunal Biswas]

What ammunition was supplied for T-90S? What NATO ammunition will be used and from what gun it will be fired, India don't have any gun capabale to use NATO ammunition.

Probably Lekalo..

If IA chose Smooth-bore, their is a new gun in development for Arjun, Said to be thicker..

 

[Damian]

(BDD armor for T-54/55 and T-62 tanks)

(Burlington armor)




(T-72B Reflecting Plates)

(UK prototype armor made from Depleted Uranium alloy and polycarbonate)

These are photos of different composite armors.

Probably Lekalo..

Hmm interesting.

If IA chose Smooth-bore, their is a new gun in development for Arjun, Said to be thicker..

It is not so easy, to fire different ammunition types qualification trails are needed.

For example in US they got M68 and M68A1 105mm rifled guns, the first one was installed in M60 series, latter one in M1 and M1IP, but only the latter one could fire M900 APFSDS ammunition due to higher pressure that was generated by M900 propelant charge.

So before any tests on armor, there will be need to make qualification tests with new gun and ammunition.

Not to mention if any country will decide to sold they newest APFSDS ammunition, for example US will never agree to sold M829 series, they even developed fo export KEW series of APFSDS ammunition.

Germany maybe will solde DM53 or DM63, and still DM53 use very powerfull propelant charge, Germans had problems with such ammunition, if I remeber correctly they can fire this ammunition only from L55 RH-120 gun, not from L44 version.

So there are many problems to solve.

 

[Kunal Biswas]

It is not so easy, to fire different ammunition types qualification trails are needed.

For example in US they got M68 and M68A1 105mm rifled guns, the first one was installed in M60 series, latter one in M1 and M1IP, but only the latter one could fire M900 APFSDS ammunition due to higher pressure that was generated by M900 propelant charge.

So before any tests on armor, there will be need to make qualification tests with new gun and ammunition.

Not to mention if any country will decide to sold they newest APFSDS ammunition, for example US will never agree to sold M829 series, they even developed fo export KEW series of APFSDS ammunition.

Germany maybe will solde DM53 or DM63, and still DM53 use very powerfull propelant charge, Germans had problems with such ammunition, if I remeber correctly they can fire this ammunition only from L55 RH-120 gun, not from L44 version.

So there are many problems to solve.

The above is within Gov facilities we will know after Tank is operational..

Anyways, We never wanted Nuke i guess other wise we would have made one with help of IMI..

IA will go for DM-63 as its one of the best and remain one of the best in future to come..

Tell me what is the Barrel pressure ( Range in MPA ) L55 can endure ?

 

[Godless-Kafir]

I think we need to buy more stuff from "Western" nations like Poland to solve this huge armor deficit on the arjun! I wont be surprised if IA did that!

 

[Godless-Kafir]

Probably Lekalo..

If IA chose Smooth-bore, their is a new gun in development for Arjun, Said to be thicker..

I thought they are only redesigning the bore and not the entire gun?

 

[p2prada]

I don't think we ever received the Lekalo. The 3BM44M seems to have hit some rough weather in manufacturing or our negotiations with Russia. Eitherway it is disappointing.

Even our previous requirement I had posted earlier only mentioned the Israeli Mk1 and Russian 3BM42.

 

[Damian]

Tell me what is the Barrel pressure ( Range in MPA ) L55 can endure ?

Dunno, need to ask some people.

Here is for RH-M-120/L44 and M256/L44 firing M829A1 APFSDS.

• Peak Chamber Pressure: 96,000 psi @ 120°F. 82,650 psi @ 70°F.
• Nominal Velocity: 5,150 ft/sec (1,569 m/s)

IA will go for DM-63 as its one of the best and remain one of the best in future to come..

Yeah, DM63 is a good choice, it generates less pressure inside breach and barrel so gun service life is longer than using DM53, and still DM63 have high penetration levels.

 

[Damian]

Knife ERA cassettes, reactive element (Shaped charge) and sliced KE penetrator after Knife reaction.

In my opinion Knife ERA have many interesting capabilities, and should be investigated by all countries interested in ERA development.

 

[Kunal Biswas]

Knife ERA cassettes, reactive element (Shaped charge) and sliced KE penetrator after Knife reaction.

In my opinion Knife ERA have many interesting capabilities, and should be investigated by all countries interested in ERA development.

@Damian,

Post this here:
http://defenceforumindia.com/indian-army/208-indias-born-again-t-90m-mbt-90.html

Post anything related to Arjun in this thread..

Btw, why not to make a thread on tank know how ? we will make it a sticky..

 

[Damian]

@Damian,

Post this here:
India's 'Born Again' T-90M MBT

Post anything related to Arjun in this thread..

Knife ERA can be mounted on any tank, like any other ERA type, so it can be also mounted on Arjun.

IRCC there were some rumors that Poland is interested in Knife ERA for UCP Anders, as well as in Zaslon APS.

Btw, why not to make a thread on tank know how ? we will make it a sticky..

Agree. You can make such topic.

 

[Shaitan]

(BDD armor for T-54/55 and T-62 tanks)

(Burlington armor)




(T-72B Reflecting Plates)

(UK prototype armor made from Depleted Uranium alloy and polycarbonate)

Thanks for the examples yaar.

I dont know much about these things.