AMCA - Advanced Medium Combat Aircraft (HAL)

[mehrotraprince]

People might have seen many models of AMCA but this is the picture published in Report of the Director NAL 2011-2012

 

[Twinblade]

People might have seen many models of AMCA but this is the picture published in Report of the Director NAL 2011-2012

One of the many configurations that was under study at that time. The one at AI13 is what they will proceed with.

 

[mehrotraprince]

One of the many configurations that was under study at that time. The one at AI13 is what they will proceed with.

Any picture or wind tunnel scale model available to public? If yes, then please post it.

 

[Ganesh2691]

From AI 2013

 

[arnabmit]

^^ This design does not have serpentine intakes for hiding the engine blades

 

[Ganesh2691]

 

[p2prada]

^^ This design does not have serpentine intakes for hiding the engine blades

Serpentine intakes are an utter waste of space.

YF-22 did not have it, PAKFA does not have it.

There are much better ways to reduce inlet emissions than restrict airflow with serpentine intakes. S-ducts are better off in subsonic aircraft which are required to be cheaper.

 

[arnabmit]

Serpentine intakes are an utter waste of space.

YF-22 did not have it, PAKFA does not have it.

There are much better ways to reduce inlet emissions than restrict airflow with serpentine intakes. S-ducts are better off in subsonic aircraft which are required to be cheaper.

Please elaborate on the much better ways to reduce inlet emissions.

 

[p2prada]

Please elaborate on the much better ways to reduce inlet emissions.

RAM coatings, radar blockers, composite and ceramic blades etc.

This is a radar blocker on the Super Hornet.

 

[p2prada]

Another one.

 

[p2prada]

Small mistake in my previous post.

I said YF-22 did not have serpentine intakes, my bad, it's YF-23.

 

[arnabmit]

Small mistake in my previous post.

I said YF-22 did not have serpentine intakes, my bad, it's YF-23.

Yeah, for a moment I was like

 

[arnabmit]

RAM coatings, radar blockers, composite and ceramic blades etc.

This is a radar blocker on the Super Hornet.

RAM, composite and ceramic blades are OK. Though I have no idea about India's RAM capabilities

But aren't radar blockers much more inefficient than serpentine intake? I gather that Serpentine intakes work pretty well if the curve is gradual over at least 3-4m, but create a choke if there is sharp curve in a higher gradient.

 

[p2prada]

RAM, composite and ceramic blades are OK. Though I have no idea about India's RAM capabilities

But aren't radar blockers much more inefficient than serpentine intake? I gather that Serpentine intakes work pretty well if the curve is gradual over at least 3-4m, but create a choke if there is sharp curve in a higher gradient.

It is a design feature. If you go for serpentine intakes then you cannot go beyond mach 2 because the inlets won't be able to handle the shock. And they take up more space inside the fuselage. But on the other hand, it is cheaper to design than a variable intake and reduces costs. You can also save a bit more by avoiding radar blockers and expensive RAM coatings.

You end up getting a heavier aircraft, that's fatter and more draggy, carries less fuel and less space for weapons. Basically, a 1100 Km ROA aircraft that cannot carry anything bigger than a 500 Kg bomb, like the Raptor.

PAKFA is expected to fly at mach 2.6, so they couldn't go for a S-duct. But they can compensate for RCS by using radar blockers, RAM coatings and new gen blades that are less susceptible to generating reflections. The inlets are outside and well spaced, that means more internal volume in the fuselage, hence more space for weapons, avionics and fuel.

You end up getting an aircraft that can provide a 1500-2000 Km ROA and carrying heavier bombs and cruise missiles, like the PAKFA.

 

[p2prada]

YF-23

X-32

 

[p2prada]

I gather that Serpentine intakes work pretty well if the curve is gradual over at least 3-4m, but create a choke if there is sharp curve in a higher gradient.

I don't know about this aspect. But we need to wait and see how the Russian treat their aircraft's inlet. Maybe we will never know.

 

[arnabmit]

@p2prada

Also, could you suggest a reason for not choosing the stealthier "V-Tail" design like in the YF-23? AMCA initially had a tail-less thrust-vectored design like the Boeing program, which was later scrapped. "V-Tail" was also considered initially for X-32. Also, the biggest challenge of the "V-Tail" seems to be rewriting the entire FBW rules. But since AMCA is reportedly supposed to have FBL instead of FBW, then it should not have been an issue IMO.

 

[p2prada]

@p2prada

Also, could you suggest a reason for not choosing the stealthier "V-Tail" design like in the YF-23? AMCA initially had a tail-less thrust-vectored design like the Boeing program, which was later scrapped. "V-Tail" was also considered initially for X-32. Also, the biggest challenge of the "V-Tail" seems to be rewriting the entire FBW rules. But since AMCA is reportedly supposed to have FBL instead of FBW, then it should not have been an issue IMO.

No, I don't know why this wasn't chosen.

Anyway FBL and FBW shouldn't make a difference when it comes to software.

 

[Twinblade]

^^ This design does not have serpentine intakes for hiding the engine blades

WTH are you talking about, of course it does have serpentine air intakes. No configuration of AMCA was without serpentine intakes.

 

[arnabmit]

WTH are you talking about, of course it does have serpentine air intakes. No configuration of AMCA was without serpentine intakes.

The light green strips? never saw this pic, my bad.

But isn't the curve gradient too sharp? Wouldn't it create chokes on the airflow specially at supersonic speeds? All designs I have seen of serpentine intakes on the net have a much more gradual curve stretched out over the length of the craft.