Agni V Missile

[nitesh]

What's the point in speculations now, the conclusion is. It is an ICBM, re entry spped in 7km/s. This is ICBM

Let our diplomacy run around with 5k KM tag in true Indian tradition of showin modesty.

 

[pmaitra]

What's the point in speculations now, the conclusion is. It is an ICBM, re entry spped in 7km/s. This is ICBM

Let our diplomacy run around with 5k KM tag in true Indian tradition of showin modesty.

Niteshji, calling it an ICBM is speculation.

Not taking credits away from the scientists. They have done a fantastic job, but let's keep jingoism under control. We have not tested an ICBM, and we don't even know whether this can go beyond 5500 km. Speed is impressive, but still, it is not an ICBM.

We need something like the Satan - and I wish we make one soon.

 

[nitesh]

Niteshji, calling it an ICBM is speculation.

Not taking credits away from the scientists. They have done a fantastic job, but let's keep jingoism under control. We have not tested an ICBM, and we don't even know whether this can go beyond 5500 km. Speed is impressive, but still, it is not an ICBM.

We need something like the Satan - and I wish we make one soon.

SIr, the comment was not directed towards you, just see the last pages when I got overboard posting articles and come to your own conclusions. Yes till now test range is touted as 5k km+ now. Now 5k km+ can be any where.

 

[Vishwarupa]

Agni V launch: US refrains from criticizing the test, praises India's non-proliferation record

Agni V launch: US refrains from criticizing the test, praises India’s non-proliferation record - The Times of India

WASHINGTON: Refraining from criticizing India for its Agni V intercontinental ballistic missile test, and instead praising New Delhi for its ''solid nonproliferation record,'' the Obama administration on Wednesday called on ''all nuclear-capable states to exercise restraint regarding nuclear capabilities.''

Administration officials repeated the same formulations on Thursday following the successful test, rejecting repeated attempts by some journalists to extract some criticism for what they perceived as India's transgression. ''We urged all nuclear-capable states to exercise restraint regarding their nuclear and missile capabilities,'' State Department spokesman Mark Toner said, referring to his statement a day earlier, and repeated that India is ''playing a significant role internationally on the issue (of non-proliferation).''

On Wednesday, the US State Department essayed a mild and guarded reaction when asked if Washington has discussed with India the test, which came just days after North Korea was pilloried for a similar effort. Drawing a clear distinction between India and other countries, State Department spokesman Mark Toner said the United States has a ''very strong strategic and security partnership with India, so we obviously have routine discussions about a wide range of topics, including their defense requirements,'' although he was ''not aware that we've specifically raised this issue with them.''

Pressed by a journalist on whether Washington had any specific concerns on the test as a destabilizing factor in the region, Toner reiterated that ''we always caution all nuclear-capable states to exercise restraint,'' rather than singling out India.

On Thursday, reporters broached the subject again, going as far as to implying that perhaps the administration had not really weighed in on the subject. ''I'll let my comments stand...I think I've said what I've wanted to say,'' Toner said stonily, suggesting that the whole issue had been considered at length in the administration before the muted reaction that appeared to recognize India' security compulsions in the region arising from missile technology exchanges between China, Pakistan and North Korea.

The remarks and the broader reaction in Washington were a far cry from the Clinton-era response in the 1990s when India's missile tests were routinely criticized and its nuclear tests in 1998 brought in its wake international opprobrium and sanctions. Significantly, Toner not only invoked the ''very strong strategic and security partnership with India'' but also endorsed its non-proliferation record in fending off questions that were implicitly critical.

Some of the media appeared to recognize and acknowledge the nuances of the new developments. ''India missile test has few critics, unlike NKorea,'' read the headline to a widely-distributed AP story, which said the test caused barely a ripple -- even in China -- just days after North Korea was globally vilified for a failed rocket launch. Many headlines emphasized that India had tested a nuclear-capable that could reach China.

 

[pmaitra]

SIr, the comment was not directed towards you, just see the last pages when I got overboard posting articles and come to your own conclusions. Yes till now test range is touted as 5k km+ now. Now 5k km+ can be any where.

Ah, I see.

Thanks.

Yes, as I said, theoretically, India is able to build ICBMs, but we have neither built nor tested one yet.

Also, DRDO website and even the scientists have said it is a 5000+ km range missile, but, as you said, it could be anywhere. What we know for sure is we have a 5000 km range missile.

Also, when they say it can hit Eastern Europe, I guess they are talking about the western edge of Kazakhstan (and the vicinity), as Eastern Europe. Any ICBM worth its salt needs to have more than that IMHO.

 

[nitesh]

Ah, I see.

Thanks.

Yes, as I said, theoretically, India is able to build ICBMs, but we have neither built nor tested one yet.

Also, DRDO website and even the scientists have said it is a 5000+ km range missile, but, as you said, it could be anywhere. What we know for sure is we have a 5000 km range missile.

Also, when they say it can hit Eastern Europe, I guess they are talking about the western edge of Kazakhstan (and the vicinity), as Eastern Europe. Any ICBM worth its salt needs to have more than that IMHO.

Here the interpretation part come in play, your interpretation says it is not an ICBM, although the terminal velocity is in ICBM category, you know that India is carefully balancing the diplomacy by harping on the 5k km, here is one more pointer

Broadsword: Perfect launch for the 5000-km range Agni-5 missile

Within minutes, the Agni-5 was in space, streaking southwards for 2,000 kilometres until it crossed the equator. Then it hurtled along for another 3000-kilometers, re-entering the atmosphere over the Tropic of Capricorn and splashing down between the southern tip of Africa and Australia. From launch to splash-down, just 20 minutes had elapsed.

It re entered at 5k KM, how much far it has traveled up to speculation

 

[Yusuf]

What's the point in speculations now, the conclusion is. It is an ICBM, re entry spped in 7km/s. This is ICBM

Let our diplomacy run around with 5k KM tag in true Indian tradition of showin modesty.

for the convenience of our members 7km/s = 25,000 km/hr


UGM-133 Trident II - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
LGM-30 Minuteman III ICBM - United States Nuclear Forces

the trajectory used was at a lower level. 600kms. Even the Russian Bulava SLBM using a lower trajectory.

The missile has three stages; the first and second stages use solid fuel propellant, while the third stage liquid fuel, to allow high maneuverability during warhead separation. The missile can be launched from an inclined position, allowing a submarine to fire them while moving. It has a low flight trajectory, and due to this could be classified as a quasi-ballistic missile

RSM-56 Bulava - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Entirely possible that India is working on the ICBM at a lower trajectory. Decreases reaction time for the enemy and is also more maneuverable. at 25,000 km hr, using the right trajectory to fire the missile and release of MIRV, the momentum itself will add a bit of range to it.

 

[pmaitra]

Here the interpretation part come in play, your interpretation says it is not an ICBM, although the terminal velocity is in ICBM category, you know that India is carefully balancing the diplomacy by harping on the 5k km, here is one more pointer

Broadsword: Perfect launch for the 5000-km range Agni-5 missile

Sorry, but I just cannot link speed with ICBM. Why does this speed keep cropping up when discussing whether Agni-5 is ICBM?

It re entered at 5k KM, how much far it has traveled up to speculation

As I said, if India can launch satellites, it can also make ICBM. The points I am making are:

• Agni-5 is not an ICBM.
• India can make an ICBM, but that is theoretical, because India hasn't built or tested one yet.
• Agni-5's speed does not make it an ICBM.
• Also, Mach 25 is quite a reasonable speed in outer space.

 

[pmaitra]

We need to invite MZKT/MAZ to India to build an appropriate TEL for an ICBM. ICBMs are going to be huge, and without TEL, silo based launchers just don't exude much confidence.

 

[Yusuf]

We need to invite MZKT/MAZ to India to build an appropriate TEL for an ICBM. ICBMs are going to be huge, and without TEL, silo based launchers just don't exude much confidence.

The missile is ready to be cannister launched. We have TEL in place.

 

[pmaitra]

The missile is ready to be cannister launched. We have TEL in place.

I was talking about the ICBM. That will be much larger than Agni-5. Also, we need a rigid body TEL, not a tractor-trailer type articulated TEL.

P.S.: By ICBM, I mean one with around 8000 km range, not a 5500 km range.

 

[Yusuf]

I was talking about the ICBM. That will be much larger than Agni-5. Also, we need a rigid body TEL, not a tractor-trailer type articulated TEL.

P.S.: By ICBM, I mean one with around 8000 km range, not a 5500 km range.

No any ICBM is NOT going to be larger than this. That is what i have been saying. The size of the missile is what is required for an SLBM. This bird itself is an ICBM whether you believe it or not. Check the specs of Trident or Minuteman.

 

[pmaitra]

No any ICBM is NOT going to be larger than this. That is what i have been saying. The size of the missile is what is required for an SLBM. This bird itself is an ICBM whether you believe it or not. Check the specs of Trident or Minuteman.

Agni-5 is not an ICBM. There is nothing to believe or disbelieve. Wishful thinking won't turn Agni-5 into ICBM.

Just a reality check:

• Topol-M is 22.7 m long.
• Agni-5 is 17.5 m long.

So, yes, in all likelihood an ICBM is going to be longer than Agni-5.

 

[Yusuf]

Agni-5 is not an ICBM. There is nothing to believe or disbelieve. Wishful thinking won't turn Agni-5 into ICBM.

Its not wishful thinking..

Ok tell me, does india have a 250kt TNW?

 

[pmaitra]

^^

Just added some info in my earlier post.

You can keep repeating it any number of times, but it won't make Agni-5 an ICBM, and no, I am not talking about a 5500 km range missile.

 

[Blackwater]

Agni-5 is not an ICBM. There is nothing to believe or disbelieve. Wishful thinking won't turn Agni-5 into ICBM.

Doest not matter Agni 5 is ICBM or anti tank missile.

it has shaken both pak and china.

paki media says

India stands no chance in arms race: China

India on Thursday test-fired the Agni-V missile that can hit targets more than 5,000 km away.


India may have missiles that can reach most parts of China but stands "no chance in an overall arms race" with the country, a Chinese daily said Thursday, when India test-fired its 5,000km range nuclear capable missile, and added that New Delhi would gain nothing by stirring "further hostility".

The article, "India being swept up by missile delusion", that appeared in the op-ed section of the state-run Global Times said India apparently is hoping to enter the global intercontinental missile club, despite intercontinental missiles normally having a range of over 8,000km.

India on Thursday test-fired the Agni-V missile that can accurately hit targets more than 5,000 km away. With this launch, India entered an exclusive club of nations that have this capability.

The daily noted that India has moved rapidly in developing missile technology.

"It successfully launched the Agni IV with a range of 3,500km last year. Indian public opinion has long seen China as its reference point for military development," it said.

Criticising India, it said the country "is still poor and lags behind in infrastructure construction, but its society is highly supportive of developing nuclear power and the West chooses to overlook India s disregard of nuclear and missile control treaties".

"The West remains silent on the fact that India s military spending increased by 17 percent in 2012 and the country has again become the largest weapons importer in the world," it said.

It stressed that India "should not overestimate its strength".

"Even if it has missiles that could reach most parts of China, that does not mean it will gain anything from being arrogant during disputes with China. India should be clear that China s nuclear power is stronger and more reliable. For the foreseeable future, India would stand no chance in an overall arms race with China," it warned.

It went on to say that "India should also not overstate the value of its Western allies and the profits it could gain from participating in a containment of China. If it equates long range strategic missiles with deterrence of China, and stirs up further hostility, it could be sorely mistaken".

The daily advised that China and India should develop as friendly a relationship as possible. "Even if this cannot be achieved, the two should at least tolerate each other and learn to coexist."

It quickly added that it would be "unwise for China and India to seek a balance of power by developing missiles".

"The geopolitics of Asia will become more dependent on the nature of Sino-Indian relations. The peace and stability of the region are crucial to both countries. China and India should both take responsibility for maintaining this peace and stability and be wary of external intervention," the article said.

"China understands the Indian desire to catch up with China. China, as the most appropriate strategic target for India, is willing to take India as a peaceful competitor."

The daily said China and India are sensitive toward each other, "but objectively speaking, China does not spend much time guarding against India, while India focuses a lot of attention on China".

"China hopes India will remain calm, as this would be beneficial to both giants."


Dunya News: World:-India stands no chance in arms race: China...

 

[Blackwater]

Agni-5 is not an ICBM. There is nothing to believe or disbelieve. Wishful thinking won't turn Agni-5 into ICBM.

Doest not matter Agni 5 is ICBM or anti tank missile.

it has shaken both pak and china.

paki media says

India stands no chance in arms race: China

India on Thursday test-fired the Agni-V missile that can hit targets more than 5,000 km away.


India may have missiles that can reach most parts of China but stands "no chance in an overall arms race" with the country, a Chinese daily said Thursday, when India test-fired its 5,000km range nuclear capable missile, and added that New Delhi would gain nothing by stirring "further hostility".

The article, "India being swept up by missile delusion", that appeared in the op-ed section of the state-run Global Times said India apparently is hoping to enter the global intercontinental missile club, despite intercontinental missiles normally having a range of over 8,000km.

India on Thursday test-fired the Agni-V missile that can accurately hit targets more than 5,000 km away. With this launch, India entered an exclusive club of nations that have this capability.

The daily noted that India has moved rapidly in developing missile technology.

"It successfully launched the Agni IV with a range of 3,500km last year. Indian public opinion has long seen China as its reference point for military development," it said.

Criticising India, it said the country "is still poor and lags behind in infrastructure construction, but its society is highly supportive of developing nuclear power and the West chooses to overlook India s disregard of nuclear and missile control treaties".

"The West remains silent on the fact that India s military spending increased by 17 percent in 2012 and the country has again become the largest weapons importer in the world," it said.

It stressed that India "should not overestimate its strength".

"Even if it has missiles that could reach most parts of China, that does not mean it will gain anything from being arrogant during disputes with China. India should be clear that China s nuclear power is stronger and more reliable. For the foreseeable future, India would stand no chance in an overall arms race with China," it warned.

It went on to say that "India should also not overstate the value of its Western allies and the profits it could gain from participating in a containment of China. If it equates long range strategic missiles with deterrence of China, and stirs up further hostility, it could be sorely mistaken".

The daily advised that China and India should develop as friendly a relationship as possible. "Even if this cannot be achieved, the two should at least tolerate each other and learn to coexist."

It quickly added that it would be "unwise for China and India to seek a balance of power by developing missiles".

"The geopolitics of Asia will become more dependent on the nature of Sino-Indian relations. The peace and stability of the region are crucial to both countries. China and India should both take responsibility for maintaining this peace and stability and be wary of external intervention," the article said.

"China understands the Indian desire to catch up with China. China, as the most appropriate strategic target for India, is willing to take India as a peaceful competitor."

The daily said China and India are sensitive toward each other, "but objectively speaking, China does not spend much time guarding against India, while India focuses a lot of attention on China".

"China hopes India will remain calm, as this would be beneficial to both giants."


Dunya News: World:-India stands no chance in arms race: China...

 

[pmaitra]

Doest not matter Agni 5 is ICBM or anti tank missile.

it has shaken both pak and china.

Honestly, I don't really care about Pakistan. We already had them covered. This one was needed for PRC.

 

[nitesh]

Sorry, but I just cannot link speed with ICBM. Why does this speed keep cropping up when discussing whether Agni-5 is ICBM?

What is the confusion? the re entry speed is an indicator that it is and ICBM. Dunno why you are confused

As I said, if India can launch satellites, it can also make ICBM. The points I am making are:

• Agni-5 is not an ICBM.
• India can make an ICBM, but that is theoretical, because India hasn't built or tested one yet.
• Agni-5's speed does not make it an ICBM.
• Also, Mach 25 is quite a reasonable speed in outer space.

Well officially yes, Mach 25+ was the re entry speed as mentioned in different reports, that is normally for ICBM's.

 

[Vishwarupa]

Agni-V can reach targets 8000 km away: Chinese experts

Agni-V can reach targets 8,000 km away: Chinese experts - Hindustan Times