ADA Tejas Mark-II/Medium Weight Fighter

Twinblade

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am not shy. There are many in tejas thread who calls radar as pesa.
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And you chose to believe those retards.

the link says its almost similar to stealth
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In what way ? Stealth is many things. LPI radars, low emissions, low RCS, passive triangulation etc.

here is link about carbon composite giving natural stealth - Stealth and Tejas | idrw.org
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As explained earlier composites are also radar transparent, something you are unable to comprehend. While composite skin does not reflect radar waves, the insides of the aircraft do. That is why F-22 and F-35 is made of RAM and achieve low RCS despite using less composites than Tejas because of shaping and material. The mere percentage of composites is no indicator of the 'stealthiness' of the platform.

so again tejas have lesser RCS than gripen.
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Maybe it does, maybe it doesn't. Anyone without the necessary background that claims so is a certified idiot.

and give me link about how gripen better than tejas
Sure. Here's some brief info about the extent to which sensor/information/data fusion has been implemented in Gripen.



The IOC-2 brochure of Tejas makes a brief mention of Data Fusion:-
http://www.tejas.gov.in/IOC-Brochure.pdf
Advanced Glass Cockpit with High Performance Graphics to Support Situational Awareness, Decision Support and Data Fusion
However, from the poster from Aero India, the above features on Tejas will make debut on Mk2 version.


The data fusion which exists currently in Indian systems is restricted to RWR where the unified data from all ESM sensors is merged and displayed as one image.
 
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pmaitra

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here is link - Livefist: Four MMRCA Contenders Fail Leh Trials!
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rafale is selected by IAF and EFT not selected cause cost negotiation so the rest four have most percentage of failure at leh
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@ersakthivel have posted this many times that MMRCA contender's performance are not disclosed...... May be they vulnerable than their specs
I see. It is not clear in what way they failed.

Four of the contenders that underwent cold-weather evaluation trials at Leh didn't meet performance requirements. OK, major understatement. Four of the contenders bit dust in Leh. Read that again: four aircraft. That's huge. It's still unclear which part of the Leh test the four aircraft types failed at, though it is quite clear that it was either the switch off/on after landing, or the take-off with meaningful combat load at that altitude.
 
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power_monger

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Abhi - Stealth is affected by followign factors as per Wiki.
Factors affecting Stealth of Aircraft

Size
As a rule, the larger an object, the stronger its Radar reflection and thus the greater its RCS. Also, Radar of one band may not even detect certain size objects. For example. 10 cm (S-band Radar) can detect rain drops but not clouds whose droplets are too small.

Material
Materials such as metal are strongly radar reflective and tend to produce strong signals. Wood and cloth (such as portions of planes and balloons used to be commonly made) or plastic and fibreglass are less reflective or indeed transparent to Radar making them suitable for radomes. Even a very thin layer of metal can make an object strongly radar reflective. Chaff is often made from metallised plastic or glass (in a similar manner to metallised foils on food stuffs) with microscopically thin layers of metal.

Also, some devices are designed to be Radar active, such as Radar antennas and this will increase RCS.

Radar absorbent paint
The SR-71 Blackbird and other planes were painted with a special "iron ball paint". This consisted of small metallic-coated balls. Radar energy is converted to heat rather than being reflected.

Shape, directivity and orientation
The surfaces of the F-117A are designed to be flat and very angled. This has the effect that Radar will be incident at a large angle (to the normal ray) that will then bounce off at a similarly high reflected angle; it is forward-scattered. The edges are sharp to prevent there being rounded surfaces. Rounded surfaces will often have some portion of the surface normal to the Radar source. As any ray incident along the normal will reflect back along the normal this will make for a strong reflected signal.

From the side, a fighter plane will present a much larger area than the same plane when viewed from the front. All other factors being equal, the plane will have a stronger signal from the side than from the front so the orientation between the Radar station and the target is important.

Smooth surfaces
The relief of a surface could contain indentations that act as corner reflectors which would increase RCS from many orientations. This could arise from open bomb-bays, engine intakes, ordnance pylons, joints between constructed sections, etc. Also, it can be impractical to coat these surfaces with radar-absorbent materials.


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This article does not mention anything about heat and infrared signatures.Arent these also a factor in RCS?
 
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abhi_the _gr8_maratha

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that's what I was saying. Tejas is smaller than gripen, tejas uses carbon composite which reflects less radar signature than metal. Gripen uses more metal than tejas.
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tejas have radar absorbent paint (
hoping that gripen c/d have it.) and surface of tejas is smooth cause it consist 90% composite so it have smooth surface.
mr. Gupta has said that is is almost similar to stealth.
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and I am not comparing one on one with gripen but on budget. We can buy 5 tejas for 2 gripen and tejas will have AESA and gripen will have a pesa.
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and aren't we comparing cold condition specs of gripen to hot and humid condition specs of tejas? Why the performance of MMRCA not disclosed?
 
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Kunal Biswas

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Crystal blade being produce in India, It was provided on MK1 thread ..

@ersakthivel post are quite informative, Lets not get personal with anyone ..

As far as the forum's yell-see-yay eggsbert is concerned he has the ignominy of claiming that the 0.5 meter plug that is supposed to go on mk2 version has already been incorporated in the mk1 version, Tejas has a lower frontal RCS to PAK-FA, DRFM can block AESA radars and that no single crystal blade has been made in India. His refusal to see logic in face of proofs and in general rudeness has lead to this:-


His posts need to be taken with more salt than in the dead sea.
 
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Twinblade

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tejas will have AESA and gripen will have a pesa.
First you claimed Tejas has PESA now you claim Gripen will have PESA. Gripen's prototype AESA, Raven ES-05 is already flying on the Gripen NG prototype for the last five years. Not only is it an AESA, but it is a swashplate mounted AESA, the complexity of which cannot be understated. All the data buses and cooling fluids have to pass through a rotating joint, but it also gives extremely high field of view and off boresight capabilities.

PICTURE: Saab's Gripen Demo makes first flight with AESA radar - 11/5/2009 - Flight Global
 

abhi_the _gr8_maratha

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For god's sake kid, google before you type anything. First you claimed Tejas has PESA now you claim Gripen will have PESA. Gripen's prototype AESA, Raven ES-05 is already flying on the Gripen NG prototype for the last five years. Not only is it an AESA, but it is a swashplate mounted AESA, the complexity of which cannot be understated. All the data buses and cooling fluids have to pass through a rotating joint, but it also gives extremely high field of view and off boresight capabilities.

PICTURE: Saab's Gripen Demo makes first flight with AESA radar - 11/5/2009 - Flight Global

we are comparing gripen c/d with tejas mk1. And tejas mk2 with NG and I was talking about mk1 will be later fitted with aesa.
 

Twinblade

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we are comparing gripen c/d with tejas mk1. And tejas mk2 with NG and I was talking about mk1 will be later fitted with aesa.
No Tejas nor Gripen will carry PESA. Tejas's AESA will come in the future, Gripen's AESA is flying today and would be retrofitted on older models with orders already placed.

On Dec. 18, Sweden signed a deal with Saab, the country's aerospace and defense giant, to modify 60 Gripen C fighters to the E standard, with a consequent contract with Selex for 60 AESA radars. The second flyable version is due to be delivered soon.
First Typhoon Flight With AESA Could Open Door to Exports | Defense News | defensenews.com
 

power_monger

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In other words you know squat about anything. No Tejas nor Gripen will carry PESA. Tejas's AESA will come in the future, Gripen's AESA is flying today and would be retrofitted on older models with orders already placed.


First Typhoon Flight With AESA Could Open Door to Exports | Defense News | defensenews.com
I do not deny that a operational grippen is undoubtedly better product as of now.But with Mark-2 feature and changes i believe that tejas will almost comparable to grippe (even considering that grippen will also considerably upgrade itself during the period) .
 

abhi_the _gr8_maratha

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lol. Your post is full of contrast. Your post says gripen c will be modified to e standard. Its gripen e and not gripen c
 

Pulkit

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Thanks abhi that article was really nice and covered / touched all the aspects we are talking about....

But wat the article in IDRW was pointing out cannot be ignored... If not SAAB then we will have to refer seek help from other firms...

We all really wish that the foreign help will not be a requirement in future..
but what are the chances of that happening and once again we will have a great product which will not be given credit ti deserves........

I never questioned the technical ability I have always questioned the intentions behind it....

 
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abhi_the _gr8_maratha

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we are taking foreign help from israel for radar, engine is american and there is much more...... So atleast keep the design indigenous
 

Kunal Biswas

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We rejected Gripen design long back, Keep in mind that Tejas design is specific for Indian needs ....



AESA is design by our own institutes run by HAL and DRDO separately, SAAB cannot offer any significant technology boost to Tejas program, Anything they have can be obtained from open firms ..

we are taking foreign help from israel for radar, engine is american and there is much more...... So atleast keep the design indigenous
 

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