ADA Tejas Mark-II/Medium Weight Fighter

[Abdus Salem killed]

No.

LCA TEJAS MK1 & MK1A: News and Discussion

Really one thing missing our engine. I dont thnk govt is serious about that. I think they're serious about it. Just that they're not ready to spend the money that it's going to take. There's also ejection seats missing. Don't know how feasible it is to develop our own.

defenceforumindia.com

 

[Abdus Salem killed]

No.

LCA TEJAS MK1 & MK1A: News and Discussion

Nope MK2 was supposed to be the actual Tejas that IAF wanted and they are getting the best version of it. This was the one that was supposed to get more orders than any other Tejas variant and it should get if they actually want to hit the 42 sqdn requirement. You are too paranoid but let's...

defenceforumindia.com

ADA Tejas Mark-II/Medium Weight Fighter

Both.. Retards are having wet-dreams about keeping 114 MRFA, 200 AMCA Mk1 & 250+ AMCA Mk2. AMCA is not IAF's wet dream. As AMCA comes closer to reality, IAF will do the same thing as Tejas. Then they'll float a new tender for 200 NGMRFA and eventually buy su-57.

defenceforumindia.com

 

[Abdus Salem killed]

When have I ever said that?

LCA TEJAS MK1 & MK1A: News and Discussion

MWF will have far lower cost of operation and it will get India on the export market Rafael are required by but MWF is a necessity Lets See After seeing Whopping 6.2 billion $ I don't think MWF Will cost less than 15 billion $ in 2027 Inflation cost I Won't Put such amount of money until HAL...

defenceforumindia.com

 

[flanker99]

LCA TEJAS MK1 & MK1A: News and Discussion

MWF will have far lower cost of operation and it will get India on the export market Rafael are required by but MWF is a necessity Lets See After seeing Whopping 6.2 billion $ I don't think MWF Will cost less than 15 billion $ in 2027 Inflation cost I Won't Put such amount of money until HAL...

defenceforumindia.com

are vai how do do u find such old twts?

 

[Abdus Salem killed]

are vai how do do u find such old twts?

I have a very good memory

 

[Narasimh]

Video unavailable now

They made it private now.. did not want some things in the public eye i suppose

 

[Abdus Salem killed]

@abingdonboy ? Not a liar

 

[abingdonboy]

LCA TEJAS MK1 & MK1A: News and Discussion

Really one thing missing our engine. I dont thnk govt is serious about that. I think they're serious about it. Just that they're not ready to spend the money that it's going to take. There's also ejection seats missing. Don't know how feasible it is to develop our own.

defenceforumindia.com

What’s your point? I stand by what I said- the IAF has little interest in LCA MK.2 as long as their MRFA dreams are entertained.

if anything my comments from late 2021 were validated in the recent controversy on the matter that forced the IAF to express their intent for LCA MK.2 (albeit it at 50% less strength than they had proposed 4 years ago)

 

[abingdonboy]

@abingdonboy ? Not a liar

What did I lie about? You have a good memory but apparently can’t understand the context of my comments?

 

[NutCracker]

are vai how do do u find such old twts?

He searches for exact combo of "keywords" that he might remeber.

 

[Abdus Salem killed]

He searches for exact combo of "keywords" that he might remeber.

That to but you have to remember the comments that talked about those things in the first place

 

[MirageBlue]

What’s your point? I stand by what I said- the IAF has little interest in LCA MK.2 as long as their MRFA dreams are entertained.

if anything my comments from late 2021 were validated in the recent controversy on the matter that forced the IAF to express their intent for LCA MK.2 (albeit it at 50% less strength than they had proposed 4 years ago)

I think it's clear that they have committed to 6 squadrons (108 units) of the Tejas Mk2 apart from the 6 squadrons (114 units) of MRFA. The earlier worry was that the IAF would've not wanted to commit to the Tejas Mk2 due to their fear that the GoI will make them take the Mk2 as the MRFA itself. As far as the IAF sees it, the MRFA offers them a mature option that is technologically very advanced.

The agencies responsible for its development and testing will need to deliver, which I'm fairly confident they will. The MoD and GoI will need to do their bit for supporting the program with funding and acting as a genuine bridge between the IAF and ADA/HAL since there will be some hiccups for sure.

I just hope that there is a lot better Program Management this time around. The IAF is embedded in the PMT and right from the start, so they've had a very good say on what is needed with the Tejas Mk2. That will translate into a more streamlined and efficient program in my view.

Just keep in mind that there are 83 Tejas Mk1As on order that need to be produced and delivered as well, till 2029. There's a lot riding on HAL and Indian industries that are part of these programs. Between them, the IAF has 10 squadrons of Tejas Mk1A and Mk2s to be inducted in the next 10-12 years. It is not a small number.

 

[abingdonboy]

I think it's clear that they have committed to 6 squadrons (108 units) of the Tejas Mk2 apart from the 6 squadrons (114 units) of MRFA. The earlier worry was that the IAF would've not wanted to commit to the Tejas Mk2 due to their fear that the GoI will make them take the Mk2 as the MRFA itself. As far as the IAF sees it, the MRFA offers them a mature option that is technologically very advanced.

The agencies responsible for its development and testing will need to deliver, which I'm fairly confident they will. The MoD and GoI will need to do their bit for supporting the program with funding and acting as a genuine bridge between the IAF and ADA/HAL since there will be some hiccups for sure.

I just hope that there is a lot better Program Management this time around. The IAF is embedded in the PMT and right from the start, so they've had a very good say on what is needed with the Tejas Mk2. That will translate into a more streamlined and efficient program in my view.

Just keep in mind that there are 83 Tejas Mk1As on order that need to be produced and delivered as well, till 2029. There's a lot riding on HAL and Indian industries that are part of these programs. Between them, the IAF has 10 squadrons of Tejas Mk1A and Mk2s to be inducted in the next 10-12 years. It is not a small number.

The issue is that in 2018 the then CAS said 201 LCA MK.2 was the plan, this has been falling ever since, a couple years later 170 was mentioned and now the are ~120 (6 SQNs), and we all know this is because IAF is putting all their force into getting 114 MRFA.

mk.2 has been and is being sacrificed for the MRFA fantasies of IAF that to this day have not got beyond AON, best best best case scenario all 114 are in service come 2038-40 at this point. A stupid plan poorly implemented is peak Indian military. All other large airforces (that have access to reliable engines)have domestically made single engine fighters as their backbone. IAF is living off of brochure specs and not thinking like a future ready force

 

[MirageBlue]

The issue is that in 2018 the then CAS said 201 LCA MK.2 was the plan, this has been falling ever since, a couple years later 170 was mentioned and now the are ~120 (6 SQNs), and we all know this is because IAF is putting all their force into getting 114 MRFA.

mk.2 has been and is being sacrificed for the MRFA fantasies of IAF that to this day have not got beyond AON, best best best case scenario all 114 are in service come 2038-40 at this point. A stupid plan poorly implemented is peak Indian military. All other large airforces (that have access to reliable engines)have domestically made single engine fighters as their backbone. IAF is living off of brochure specs and not thinking like a future ready force

201 Tejas Mk2 was simply not feasible. At 24 per year, you'd be talking about Tejas Mk2 deliveries almost till 2036-37! Higher rate than that and it's almost not possible for the IAF to absorb so many per year.

108 is not a small number and it is likely to go up IF ADA and HAL meet the timelines that they commit to. GoI has to do it's bit with funds being released without any delays. Contract negotiations shouldn't be as long winded as they were for Mk1A. That's also IAF, HAL and MoD's responsibility.

You're being extremely pessimistic, whereas if you look at the IAF's procurement plan as shown in the screen grab from this page, the MRFA is the last import. AMCA is also high on their priority given the J-20 entering service in increasing numbers and the possibility of a J-35 variant entering PAF service in the next 5-6 years.

Tejas Mk2 is perfect for Mirage-2000, MiG-29 and Jaguar replacements which adds up to well over 160-170 units..is why the numbers are likely to go up IF ADA, HAL and other agencies can adhere to the timelines so production is not spilling over majorly into the 2030s.

If the GoI keeps kicking MRFA down the road or if this MRFA continues to be a rabbit hole, then expect the IAF to look at the Tejas Mk2 as the filler.

 

[johnj]

I think its production ready by 2030's this is logical if we see the estimated timeline:
Nov/Dec 21 : CDR completed after which manufacturing started
late 2022 - early 2023 : roll out of first prototype
late 2023 - early 2024 : First flight
2024-2030 - flight testing period of 6 years (F22- 6yrs, F35- 8-9 yrs, Rafale - 8-9yrs)
2030's - production ready

I hope they can run an accelerated testing timeline but 2030 is not bad, but our fleet number will be really affected

without td or prototype.

 

[johnj]

I don't disagree. But 36 + 114 + 108 = 258
So it looks like the IAF as a plan for the obsolescence of the aircraft you mentioned .
Mk1a look like they will replace the remaining mig 21s .
Only hope for more mk2s is a reduction in the mrfa or exports.

42 sqn. in total. LCA mk2 eventually become the backbone/workhorse of IAF in future - around 150 to 250 or more considering mrfa cancellation or reduced nos.

 

[johnj]

Yep. The IAF always wanted the 126 rafales which GOI failed to make a deal on .
These are all my speculations based on interviews of the IAF chief.

nope. IAF wanted around 180 eu jets. 126 plus additional order in future. Now seeing lca capability, mmrca nos were reduced - 114 under make in india. {100 jets minimum for make in india] IAF keep talking about mmrca/mrca until mk2 achieve foc, ie 2031/32.

 

[karn]

42 sqn. in total. LCA mk2 eventually become the backbone/workhorse of IAF in future - around 150 to 250 or more considering mrfa cancellation or reduced nos.

Didn't the IAF chief lay down a plan for 30 somthing squadrons for by the mid 2030s ? In the timeframe for that the 42 squadrons .. won't the AMCA be the workhorse ?

 

[johnj]

The issue is that in 2018 the then CAS said 201 LCA MK.2 was the plan, this has been falling ever since, a couple years later 170 was mentioned and now the are ~120 (6 SQNs), and we all know this is because IAF is putting all their force into getting 114 MRFA.

mk.2 has been and is being sacrificed for the MRFA fantasies of IAF that to this day have not got beyond AON, best best best case scenario all 114 are in service come 2038-40 at this point. A stupid plan poorly implemented is peak Indian military. All other large airforces (that have access to reliable engines)have domestically made single engine fighters as their backbone. IAF is living off of brochure specs and not thinking like a future ready force

IAF asking for 150 plus mmrca from 2000.
IAF considering buying 12 sqn of lca. mk1 - 2 sqn. then rest 10 sqn 180- mk2, but mk1a take the place of 4 sqn, now 6 sqn, unfortunately iaf forced to buys around 15 or more sqn of lca.

 

[karn]

nope. IAF wanted around 180 eu jets. 126 plus additional order in future. Now seeing lca capability, mmrca nos were reduced - 114 under make in india. {100 jets minimum for make in india] IAF keep talking about mmrca/mrca until mk2 achieve foc, ie 2031/32.

The IAF got 36 rafales they want 114 more . That's 150 right there . So a 30 reduction from their eventual end goal .
Let's see .. all indications seem like a new competition for MRFA is not possible .. if mmrca was anything to go by AMCA might be ready by the time price negotiations end