ADA Tejas Mark-II/Medium Weight Fighter

[VIP]

MRFA is flying. Is Mk2 flying already?

Did IAF let mk1 fly properly? It took a parikkar to bitch slap these import shills and put it down their throats. Mk1 would have been easily available im 2012 already. The MRFA IAF wants is also not present in current standard, they can wait and buy old standard but want Tejas be in mk2 standard out of the box. Just wait when mk2 prototype comes out, if Modi govt doesn't remain in power these leechers would strike the whole project.

 

[IndianHawk]

MRFA is flying. Is Mk2 flying already?

MRFA is still in tender process. We speculate rafale will win again but we can never be sure !! We are also not sure if this time tender will be awarded it may extend like countless times before.
Mk2 could be flying in a year if funds are there.

 

[radion]

Did IAF let mk1 fly properly? It took a parikkar to bitch slap these import shills and put it down their throats. Mk1 would have been easily available im 2012 already. The MRFA IAF wants is also not present in current standard, they can wait and buy old standard but want Tejas be in mk2 standard out of the box. Just wait when mk2 prototype comes out, if Modi govt doesn't remain in power these leechers would strike the whole project.

tejas was grounded in 2012

The grounding of Tejas, which was kept secret, took place because of the new pilot’s helmets. Since these protruded above the ejection seats, the helmets could have prevented a smooth ejection by smashing into the fighter’s canopy before it was blown off. Since that constituted a serious safety issue for pilots, flight-testing was halted since August.

For the Tejas’ flight-test programme, which is already behind schedule, this three month delay has been a blow. The Initial Operation Clearance (IOC), which was scheduled for end-2010, and which the Indian Air Force (IAF) accorded only provisionally in January 2011, is now expected only around mid-2013.

After three months on ground, combat aircraft Tejas resumes test flight

The Tejas Light Combat Aircraft (LCA), which has remained grounded for more than three months, finally resumed flight-testing last week. Seven flights of the Tejas have taken place since then without mishap.

web.archive.org

6 years after first flight in 2001, lca got the ability to fire a missile.

The Light Combat Aircraft ‘TEJAS’ program achieved the most significant milestone yet when it successfully test fired the Close Combat Missile R-73 today at the air to air range off Goa coast. The historic event marks the beginning of weaponisation, which is the focus of the current initial operational clearance (IOC) phase of the program.

Tejas fires its first missile | Frontier India Defence & Strategic News Service

The Light Combat Aircraft ‘TEJAS’ program achieved the most significant milestone yet when it successfully test fired the Close Combat Missile R-73 today

web.archive.org

iaf still gave them ioc 1 in 2011 and 1 year later those issues about canopy came out; ioc 2(proper one) being given in 2013

The January 10 event will be called as Declaration of IOC, though the IAF top brass wanted to call it as IOC-1. Technically the English on the certificate will read something like this -- Certification for the Release to Services with assured safety and specified performance for IOC. “We haven’t closed the Request for Actions (RFAs) yet and there are some minor issues to be thrashed out. These are not safety critical or flight critical. Whatever concessions ADA-HAL have asked, are given,” says a military source.
As reported in these columns earlier, the Test pilots from ASTE will get to fly Tejas in March\April by which time LSP-7 and LSP-8 would have joined the flight-line. “Even while we roll out the first platform from the SP block (from the initial 20), the IAF pilots would have got the taste of Tejas. Their independent observations are crucial and we are ready for swift actions. As of now, activities relating to certification are over,” says another source.

Happy New Year: Takeoff 2011 with Tejas' fireworks! Countdown for IOC begins & ADA says 'all set for Jan 10'

Indian defence and aerosapce blog.

tarmak007.blogspot.com

iaf ordered mk1 ioc in 2006 expecting it to be over by 2011......2011&2013 was when it attained IOC lol
2019 was when it attained foc.

For production of Light Combat Aircraft (LCA) Tejas, Hindustan Aeronautics Limited (HAL) has got orders from Indian Air Force (IAF) for 40 aircrafts {20 Initial Operational Clearance (IOC) standard and 20 Final Operational Clearance (FOC) standard}. 20 IOC contract was signed on 31st March 2006 to be completed by December 2011 and 20 FOC contract was signed on 23rd December 2010 to be completed by 2016. IOC for LCA Tejas was received in December, 2013.

This information was given by Raksha Rajya Mantri Dr. Subhash Bhamre in a written reply to Shri Harivansh in Rajya Sabha today.

Production of Tejas Aircraft

I am surprised in majority of these discussion ADA and drdo get a clean chit.Is it because they developed it?
ADA,DRDO, HAL,GOI and iaf are not at sync with each other at all.Proof of it can be seen with contradiction in timelines with every project.Another 2 examples are mwf and drdo.

I will agree that iaf is partly dumb.They gave the order of a product without said product being ready.

 

[flanker99]

tejas was grounded in 2012

After three months on ground, combat aircraft Tejas resumes test flight

The Tejas Light Combat Aircraft (LCA), which has remained grounded for more than three months, finally resumed flight-testing last week. Seven flights of the Tejas have taken place since then without mishap.

web.archive.org

6 years after first flight in 2001, lca got the ability to fire a missile.

Tejas fires its first missile | Frontier India Defence & Strategic News Service

The Light Combat Aircraft ‘TEJAS’ program achieved the most significant milestone yet when it successfully test fired the Close Combat Missile R-73 today

web.archive.org

iaf still gave them ioc 1 in 2011 and 1 year later those issues about canopy came out; ioc 2(proper one) being given in 2013

Happy New Year: Takeoff 2011 with Tejas' fireworks! Countdown for IOC begins & ADA says 'all set for Jan 10'

Indian defence and aerosapce blog.

tarmak007.blogspot.com

iaf ordered mk1 ioc in 2006 expecting it to be over by 2011......2011&2013 was when it attained IOC lol
2019 was when it attained foc.

Production of Tejas Aircraft

I am surprised in majority of these discussion ADA and drdo get a clean chit.Is it because they developed it?
ADA,DRDO, HAL,GOI and iaf are not at sync with each other at all.Proof of it can be seen with contradiction in timelines with every project.Another 2 examples are mwf and drdo.

I will agree that iaf is partly dumb.They gave the order of a product without said product being ready.

Thats not dumb almost all the countries do that...but iaf did treat tejas as a burden at first and was not involved much and clearly knew little about industries capability which led to overpromising and under delivering.
Mwf design is ready but funds are not allocated yet for more prototype ball is in babus,mod and politicians hands now

 

[radion]

Thats not dumb almost all the countries do that...but iaf did treat tejas as a burden at first and was not involved much and clearly knew little about industries capability which led to overpromising and under delivering.
Mwf design is ready but funds are not allocated yet for more prototype ball is in babus,mod and politicians hands now

Thats not dumb almost all the countries do that...but iaf did treat tejas as a burden at first and was not involved much and clearly knew little about industries capability which led to overpromising and under delivering.
Mwf design is ready but funds are not allocated yet for more prototype ball is in babus,mod and politicians hands now

iaf still gave them ioc and the order despite shortcomings. I guess they expected mwf but got lca instead.

 

[flanker99]

iaf still gave them ioc and the order despite shortcomings. I guess they expected mwf but got lca instead.

What are u talking about?..lca was is and will be lca there's no doubt about that.some unfulfilled req+more are to be met my mk1a MWF is different category beast

 

[radion]

What are u talking about?..lca was is and will be lca there's no doubt about that.some unfulfilled req+more are to be met my mk1a MWF is different category beast

The fact that they expected mwf from lca but still took the delivery 3 yrs after ioc.

 

[HariPrasad-1]

Meanwhile kf-21 took first flight :

Far inferior to Tejas.

 

[HariPrasad-1]

IAF’s obsession with MMRCA/Rafale is 2+ decades old. They haven’t adjusted their approach despite much changing in the meantime. It’s not 2001 anymore and LCA still a pipe dream.

In 2022 LCA MK.2 is a 17.5T MMRCA in its own right. Apparently IAF objected to the MWF (medium weight fighter) nomenclature after ADA created a larger airframe from what was originally planned so instead of doggedly pursuing 100+ Rafale IAF ought to be reimagining their plans based on the changed environment that now exists domestically and in the region.

who else is buying 100+ jets off the shelf other than the oil rich Arabs with no industry to speak of? Koreans, Turks and even Indonesians are thinking about next gen projects of their own. Even Pakis have JF-17 as their backbone and default solution.

So IAF’s world view is that Indian industry are on par with Egyptians, Malaysians etc who are seeking licence assembly of 4th gen jets- ironically HAL is in talks to setup LCA assembly in both (not that I expect this to fructify )

LCA MK.2 can do >90% of the mission profiles of Rafale for maybe 60-70% of the cost. The only real thing Rafale will have on MK.2 come 2030s is payload/range and a slight edge in EW. So yes buy a couple more SQNs of Rafale for DPSA role but 114 more? 6 SQNs of MRFA can easily pay for 10++ LCA MK.2 SQNs. A force whose fleet strength is in freefall isn’t thinking about this?

Most of the things are true except EW. Spectra is far superior. It Jams the Radar of F16, Su35, Jf17 etc and can jam most of the radars.

 

[MonaLazy]

Far inferior to Tejas.

Please elaborate. It has the better engine for a start & two of them. T/W & payload should be way better in the KF-21 than Tejas Mk1? Stealth shaping should help it's cause too.

 

[HariPrasad-1]

Please elaborate. It has the better engine for a start & two of them. T/W & payload should be way better in the KF-21 than Tejas Mk1? Stealth shaping should help it's cause too.

I am sorry.My mistake. I misread it as South korean FA50.

 

[VIP]

tejas was grounded in 2012

After three months on ground, combat aircraft Tejas resumes test flight

The Tejas Light Combat Aircraft (LCA), which has remained grounded for more than three months, finally resumed flight-testing last week. Seven flights of the Tejas have taken place since then without mishap.

web.archive.org

6 years after first flight in 2001, lca got the ability to fire a missile.

Tejas fires its first missile | Frontier India Defence & Strategic News Service

The Light Combat Aircraft ‘TEJAS’ program achieved the most significant milestone yet when it successfully test fired the Close Combat Missile R-73 today

web.archive.org

iaf still gave them ioc 1 in 2011 and 1 year later those issues about canopy came out; ioc 2(proper one) being given in 2013

Happy New Year: Takeoff 2011 with Tejas' fireworks! Countdown for IOC begins & ADA says 'all set for Jan 10'

Indian defence and aerosapce blog.

tarmak007.blogspot.com

iaf ordered mk1 ioc in 2006 expecting it to be over by 2011......2011&2013 was when it attained IOC lol
2019 was when it attained foc.

Production of Tejas Aircraft

I am surprised in majority of these discussion ADA and drdo get a clean chit.Is it because they developed it?
ADA,DRDO, HAL,GOI and iaf are not at sync with each other at all.Proof of it can be seen with contradiction in timelines with every project.Another 2 examples are mwf and drdo.

I will agree that iaf is partly dumb.They gave the order of a product without said product being ready.

IAF still gave them IOC?? What were they suppose to do exactly when LCA got the abilities they actually required at the 1st place? Even Arjun also got such certifications. The point is, despite knowing that LCA is developing like they wanted they rejected it calling it inferior and asked for capabilities "suddenly" which they never ever told ADA to develop and didn't provide active consultation for the same. They were on the verge of canceling the whole project but parikkar stepped in and HAL proposed Mk1A which he shoved in their throats. If it were rafle in f3 standard, they would have taken it.

This doesn't mean ADA's work was full proof, they do have a lot shortcomings, just look at the workplace and testing facilities they got, just look like some panchayat level office.

 

[karn]

IAF still gave them IOC?? What were they suppose to do exactly when LCA got the abilities they actually required at the 1st place? Even Arjun also got such certifications. The point is, despite knowing that LCA is developing like they wanted they rejected it calling it inferior and asked for capabilities "suddenly" which they never ever told ADA to develop and didn't provide active consultation for the same. They were on the verge of canceling the whole project but parikkar stepped in and HAL proposed Mk1A which he shoved in their throats. If it were rafle in f3 standard, they would have taken it.

This doesn't mean ADA's work was full proof, they do have a lot shortcomings, just look at the workplace and testing facilities they got, just look like some panchayat level office.

The capabilities asked for on the original Tejas never changed ..
Today the copium has moved to IAF never considered India's industrial potential while giving their requirements.
There is supposed to be only one IOC ..
Giving IOC 1 was a to save face for the development team .. or shoved down the IAFs throat as you like to put it ..

 

[sakalasiva]

I don't need to remind you that a big amount from budget allocated to forces is sent back at the end of the year. Navy actually invest and commit in a program, they take keen interest and provide active consultation unlike IAF and IA who change goal posts frequently.

Changing goal post thing is there I too accept. But you need to give credit to IAF for their past procurements where they have purchased the things best of it's category which they can offer. None of the purchases are useless. Also they improved them a lot after the purchase. So they know how to make things better. But their obsession with quality and slower than snail procurement policy of Govt is the problem. They choose a product and by the time Govt clears all approvals new gen aircrafts will be there in market and IAF do not want to settle for less. In my opinion this is the problem with IAF and frequent change in goal post also reason for this. You need to agree on the thing that fighter aircrafts are the only things which are upgrading at rapid phase and creating lot of imbalance between each generation in terms of it's capability and power with it. Like to tackle 5th gen fighter we require lot of 4th gen fighters.

 

[dumdumdum]

The capabilities asked for on the original Tejas never changed ..
Today the copium has moved to IAF never considered India's industrial potential while giving their requirements.
There is supposed to be only one IOC ..
Giving IOC 1 was a to save face for the development team .. or shoved down the IAFs throat as you like to put it ..

So all the claims made in this article are wrong? Was AESA radar part of the original capabilities asked?

 

[binayak95]

If I am not wrong all the Mig-29, most of the M-2000, and many of the Jaguar airframes will reach ~40 years life later this decade. I'm sceptical any of these will be able to fly well into the 2030's. So essentially we will have 21-22 sq of MKI+Tejas+Rafale in about a decades time and will need to induct 10 further new sq worth of fighters just to stay at low 30's squadron strength. Truely messed situation being further messed up by foot dragging on Tejas Mk-2 and AMCA development funding.

The MIG29s have been thoroughly upgraded, airframes refurbished, it'll be foolish to let go of the finest air superiority fighter we possess right now after the Rafale (yes MiG29UPG is better than the Su30MKI because of the D29 EW Suite). Keep it till half your Sukhoi fleet is upgraded atleast.

As far as Jaguars go, goddamn HAL is doing a fine job refurbishing (and in some cases rebuilding) entire airframes - the additional airframes from France are helping a lot & some of them might take to the skies too.

Same for Mirage 2000. I'd surprised if they go before 2035.

 

[binayak95]

I don't need to remind you that a big amount from budget allocated to forces is sent back at the end of the year. Navy actually invest and commit in a program, they take keen interest and provide active consultation unlike IAF and IA who change goal posts frequently.

Tbh, that used to be true pre 2015. Of late forces are spending more than the sanctioned amount. Lots and lots of key acquisitions in armaments, drones, is never announced. Look for all the Israel sold such and such product to an undisclosed south Asian nation for hints.

 

[binayak95]

Most of the things are true except EW. Spectra is far superior. It Jams the Radar of F16, Su35, Jf17 etc and can jam most of the radars.

S400 included. Its the third best goddamn SEAD bird after the EA18G/F15EX/F35 combo and the F35I - the last because Israeli voodoo.

 

[karn]

So all the claims made in this article are wrong? Was AESA radar part of the original capabilities asked?

I literally said original Tejas .

 

[Aniruddha Mulay]

S400 included. Its the third best goddamn SEAD bird after the EA18G/F15EX/F35 combo and the F35I - the last because Israeli voodoo.

Have we purchased any ARM with the Rafale?
Or do we plan to integrate our Rudram series with it?