ADA Tejas (LCA) News and Discussions

Which role suits LCA 'Tejas' more than others from following options?

  • Interceptor-Defend Skies from Intruders.

    Votes: 342 51.3%
  • Airsuperiority-Complete control of the skies.

    Votes: 17 2.5%
  • Strike-Attack deep into enemy zone.

    Votes: 24 3.6%
  • Multirole-Perform multiple roles.

    Votes: 284 42.6%

  • Total voters
    667
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Godless-Kafir

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It also says this also.....
It also says according to sources so thats not even a legitimate source, If a bulb burst and 10 people got injured behind a protective screen then thats some big bulb. Looks like the tank exploded and thats the only thing that could have caused such a large explosion, shattering windows and injuring people. I think they are covering up the truth.
 

gogbot

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http://www.bharat-rakshak.com/NEWS/newsrf.php?newsid=14087



The LCAs fuel tank exploded in a lightning test and that is not of any concern to IOC?!!! That is too much of bending over backwards, just to see this inducted. If the fuel tank explosion does not concern IOC i dont know what does. I think they r just going to push it in service.
Why are you omitting important details , read carefully

According to sources, the explosion occurred around 5.15 pm at the Lightning Test Facility of CABS, where the controlled test ignition (pre-testing activity carried out prior to actual test) was conducted.
The first report on the entire incident cited that this had nothing to do with the actual test.
 

icecoolben

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It also says according to sources so thats not even a legitimate source, If a bulb burst and 10 people got injured behind a protective screen then thats some big bulb. Looks like the tank exploded and thats the only thing that could have caused such a large explosion, shattering windows and injuring people. I think they are covering up the truth.
Why r u so desperate to dis-credit Tejas programme?

The development may have beened seeded in 1983, but the conditions were not completely favourable for Indian programmes, we were very much confident of soviet protecton. The requirements of Engine itself was frmed only in 1985, so kaveri began in earnest in 1987. Only in 1991, after the demise of USSR, the problems of spares crept up and value of self reliance realised. In 1993,ADA did get the project funding, only for technology demonstrators, probably the same time IAF specified ASQR. Sorry, u had to take interest in Tejas in 1999, when initial flight was schedulled but put off at the time of sanctions, but that was essentially a collateral damage that needed to be bourne due to strategic necessity of pokran tests. Even after the tech demos flew, only in 2003, was the funding for prototypes granted. So, for a beginner ADA has reasonably done a commendable job in 17 years, if you can count out three years gap due to pokran tests. this time-line doesn't deviate too much from Gripen programme from 1982-1996 for 14 years.

I'd rather u read for yourself.

On our own wings



Tejas, India's first fighter aircraft, is combat ready. Here is the story of how it beat sceptics and sanctions

By Ramu Patil

Please do not allow the first flight of the Light Combat Aircraft to take place. The aircraft has not been developed with adequate rigour, and safety aspects have not been fully looked into. It would be a catastrophe if you allow it to fly.

This was the gist of a cable which landed on then defence minister George Fernandes's table in 2001. It came from a major US military aircraft manufacturer on January 3, a day before the maiden flight of the indigenously designed and developed Tejas.
Even in India, many people were sceptical about the success of the fighter project, which started way back in 1983. In the subsequent 27 years, countless work-hours and ?14,000 crore were spent on developing it. Justifiably, people wondered why India should invest so much on developing it when fighter aircraft were available off the shelf in the international market.

Fernandes, with supreme confidence in Team LCA, ignored the cable. The following morning the homegrown fighter, flown by Wing Commander Rajiv Kothiyal, soared into the clear Bangalore sky. "He [Fernandes] told us about the letter from the US only after the first flight was over," recalls Air Marshal (retired) Philip Rajkumar, head of the LCA flight test operations at that time and author of The Tejas Story: The Light Combat Aircraft Project.

But doubting Thomases sniggered. They said Tejas "flew somehow" and the real test for it would be to fly frequently and be part of the Indian Air Force. And exactly a decade after that historic first flight, the aircraft is now combat ready. The scientists at the Aeronautical Development Agency (ADA), the nodal agency for developing the fighter, and the test crew at the National Flight Test Centre (NFTC) are confident. "Missiles, practice bombs and drop tanks have all been integrated and tested successfully. It is a very potent weapon now,'' says P.S. Subramanyam, project director (combat aircraft) and director, ADA.

According to K. Tamilmani, chief executive, Centre for Military Airworthiness and Certification (CEMILAC), the LCA is ready for Initial Operational Clearance (IOC).
CEMILAC, which is part of the Defence Research Development Organisation, is the certifying agency for all military aircraft and airborne systems in India. It goes only by the demonstrated performance of the aircraft and systems to certify it. All major envelope requirements for the IOC have been completed and safety aspects proved, says Tamilmani. "Some small things that still need to be completed would be done soon," he says.

A few parameters like firing missiles through radar targeting will be done before getting the IOC and handing over the aircraft to the IAF, which has ordered 40 LCAs. Bangalore-based state-owned aircraft maker Hindustan Aeronautics Limited (HAL) will start rolling out Tejas in the next few months.
Flying with the IAF would be a major milestone for this multi-mission tactical fighter capable of air combat, offensive air support and other combat missions. At the flight test stage, on an average, each aircraft does eight sorties per month, but in the operational squadrons, they will be flown almost every day. "It is a fully combat-ready aircraft that encompasses all features that the IAF wants,'' says Group Captain Suneet Krishna of the NFTC, who has been test flying the LCA and has been associated with the project for 10 years (see box). The NFTC pilots, from the IAF and the Navy, have so far completed 1,500 sorties, testing a number of parameters or test points.

"Tejas is so agile and so good that it sometimes surprises you," says NFTC Project Director Air Commodore Rohit Verma. The veteran pilot, who has flown the Russian MiGs and French Mirages, is in love with Tejas.
Like pilots, flight test engineers, too, played an important role. Sitting at the hi-tech Telemetry Centre at the end of the HAL airport's runway, they monitor the test flights. In fact, the test director always has a better situational awareness of the aircraft than its pilot. All through the flight, the director is in touch with the pilot, while a specialist monitors the crucial parameters in the aircraft.

Says retired wing commander P.K. Raveendran, group director (flight testing), NFTC: "Each test flight requires a lot of preparation and analysis. Soon after the flight there will be a 'hot debrief', the first impression of the flight by the pilot and test engineers. That will be followed by 'data debrief', where each aspect is discussed in detail so that corrective action can be taken in time." He has been associated with the project from 1995 and is heading the team of "back room boys and girls" assisting the project.

"Young boys and girls worked late in the night and would report to work again by 7 a.m. That also included a woman, who had a kid to take care of at home," says former ADA director Dr Kota Harinarayana. "When I asked her, she said: 'Sir, my mother-in-law has told me she will take care of the baby so that I can focus on the national project.'"
"Like any true patriot, I feel happy to be part of this project," says Devadatta Maharana, who integrated the complex Airborne Separation Video System that captures the trajectory of bombs and drop tanks dropped from the aircraft. The special cameras mounted on Tejas capture 1,000 frames per second. Though it sounds simple, analysing separation of missiles, bombs or drop tank is crucial as any slight deviation in separation, at a very high speed, can prove disastrous for the aircraft.
-atleat feel happy for these guys

State-of-the-art technologies like fly-by-wire, digital flight control and all composite structures have made Tejas technologically superior to many IAF fighters. "The LCA is far superior to the upgraded MiG 21s. It will be as good as any fourth generation fighter,'' says Rajkumar, who has 5,200 flying hours on 75 different aircraft. It was Rajkumar who set up the NFTC in 1994.
Says Verma, "The LCA is a good bedrock for any future projects. The platform-neutral technology can be used for other platforms. After IOC, final operations clearance (FOC) would be a bit of challenge for us as we would be going in for a high angle of attack, more sensors, more weapons and big envelope. We will do FOC by the end of 2012."

Experts say Tejas is best suited for short duration missions, while heavier aircraft like the Sukhois can fly longer missions. But Sukhoi costs around ?240 crore($ 48 mil), and an upgraded Jaguar around ?300 crore($ 60 mil). Su-30MKI is one of the most capable flying machines in the IAF. However, the IAF cannot afford to have only those as they are very expensive and the operational costs are too heavy. The LCA, which is relatively less expensive—it costs around ?150($ 30 mil ) crore and, with the upgrades, can go up to ?200 crore—will fit into the light class of fighters. The IAF is acquiring 126 medium multi-role aircraft for $11 billion to strengthen its medium class fleet.

So far, a total of ?25,000 crore has been invested on the LCA project. "Of that, around ?14,000 was for development and rest of the money for making 40 aircraft," says Subramanyam. "If we look at 200 aircraft [for the IAF and the Navy], we will be getting business worth ?50,000 crore.''

Though the project is now on the right flight path, the going was tough a few years ago. "When we started, 999 out of 1,000 people did not believe us," says Kota, known as the Father of the LCA. Long before the LCA project was even born, he had done his Ph.D thesis on the 'Design of an air superior fighter for India', at IIT Bombay. It was to honour Kota's contribution to the project that his initials 'KH' were inscribed on the aircraft that made the maiden flight.

Kota and his team were very cautious in their approach. "We were willing to accept criticism on account of delays rather than putting the project in danger," says Kota. "We conducted many tests, more than what are normally done. The aircraft was ready to fly in 1999, but we took one full year to test and re-test before deciding to fly it in 2001." An unassuming person, Kota is now working on the Regional Transport Aircraft (RTA) project.

Bridging the technology gap, too, was a huge challenge. HAL, the only aircraft-maker in the country, had not done much after its Marut programme in the early 60s, and India was two decades behind developments in aviation. In aviation, they say, one needs to keep running to stay where you are. And India was not even walking!
Next was the difference of opinion between the IAF and DRDO. "The IAF was looking for an aircraft which would be on the frontline in 15 years or so," says Rajkumar, "while the aeronautical community felt that the technological gap had to be bridged by developing technologies like fly-by-wire, composite structures, and digital avionics. The IAF knew that it would take a long time to do this.''

After sitting on the fence all through the 80s, the IAF started supporting the project in the 90s. The project got a meaningful funding of ?2,188 crore in 1993. Then came the US sanctions after Pokhran nuclear tests in 1998. Many thought it to be the end of the fighter project as the US firms GE and Lockheed Martin, which were helping with engines and avionics, respectively, pulled out overnight. Says Shyam Chetty, head of flight mechanics and control division: "When sanctions were imposed, we were in the US working with Lockheed Martin. They immediately asked us to leave the country and did not even allow us to enter their campus to collect our equipment and papers. It took many years to get them back. Meanwhile, we had to start from scratch to develop flight control law (FCL), which was a very important part of the project. That was a big challenge.''

To tackle the crisis, then DRDO head A.P.J. Abdul Kalam formed national teams to develop the crucial technologies within India. "We took it as a challenge and worked day and night," says Kota. "We developed all the required systems before the sanctions were lifted."

The teams conquered complex technologies like composite materials, digital fly-by-wire system and glass cockpit and established various testing facilities. Says National Aerospace Laboratory Director A.R. Upadhyay: "In my 18 years of association with the LCA project, I have become a better aerospace professional. Technologies like FCL and carbon fibre composites developed at NAL are helping many programmes including our Saras, a 14-seater aircraft, and also the RTA project."

A.K. Sood, RTA project adviser and former chief designer at HAL, has the same opinion. "The technology and expertise we developed for the LCA were used for conducting full aircraft vibration tests on Sukhoi and for vibration tests on external stores on Mirage 2000. That reduced our dependency on the foreign aircraft makers," he says.
But the ambition to develop a complex jet engine and equally difficult Multi-Mode Radar (MMR) led to delays. Even now, Tejas flies with a US-made engine and an Israeli radar.
Says Rajkumar: "It was an absurd managerial decision to give the task of developing a jet engine to GTRE [Gas Turbine Research Establishment] and radar development to HAL Hyderabad. They never had any experience of doing such complex work. The only organisation that could have developed the radar was LRDE [Electronics and Radar Development Establishment] and the HAL Engine Division in Bangalore, which had the experience of developing engines. Today, with the benefit of hindsight, we can say the decisions were wrong, though we cannot blame anyone."

The LCA Mark I that is now ready for IOC will fly with GE 404 IN20 engines while Mark II, the first flight of which is likely to be in December 2014, will fly with the more powerful GE 414 engines. Mark II will have a retractable fuel system and will improve on all deficiencies noticed in the former.

Lack of adequately trained workforce was also a problem. Says Rajkumar: "When the IJT [Intermediate Jet Trainer] project was taken up by HAL, the manpower got split. That had an adverse effect on the progress of the LCA project.''
But a transparent working system helped the project. Everyone in the ADA, IAF and airworthiness teams knew what the challenges were. "The system was so transparent that I used to joke that the LCA project was like a cabaret artiste without a G-string. It was totally transparent. There was nothing hidden,'' says Kota, with a hearty laugh.

Looking back at the long development period, Wing Comander Ajey Lele of Institute of Defence Studies and Analyses (IDSA), New Delhi, says: "It was possible to complete the project a little earlier, but one must understand that developing aircraft is not a simple job. The criticism was very harsh, as if we were manufacturing something like a mobile phone.''

Fighter development projects take a lot of time. The development of European fighters took 25 years and the F22 Raptor of the US was a Cold War era project. "If it took over two decades for the US to develop the F22, India, too, will take time,'' Lele says.
The process of developing a fighter helped private industry as well. Says Ashok Saxena, MD, Navvavia Technologies Private Limited: "Small and medium enterprises played a major role in the production of test equipment and components. Those companies are now getting business from many foreign firms looking for good quality, low-cost outsourcing for their own programmes." Saxena was managing director of HAL Bangalore Complex and was closely associated with the LCA project.

HAL will find it a challenge to meet production requirements. It will have to produce around 200 LCAs for the IAF and the Navy in the coming years. As of now, it is capable of making only eight aircraft a year and is planning to increase the capacity to 12. Which means, it requires nearly 18 years to make 200 fighters. Neither the IAF nor the Navy can wait that long.

http://week.manoramaonline.com/cgi-bin/MMOnline.dll/portal/ep/theWeekContent.do?BV_ID=@@@&contentType=EDITORIAL&sectionName=TheWeek%20COVER%20STORY&programId=1073755753&contentId=8548495
Tejas is a pilot's aircraft


COCKPIT VIEW

Group Captain Suneet Krishna, a veteran who has flown MiG 27s and Mirages, has been associated with the LCA project since 2000, a year before the first aircraft took to skies. He has seen Tejas taking shape, growing from a mere flying machine to combat-ready fighter. He has flown Tejas extensively and loves it. "The good thing about Tejas is that it's a pilots' aircraft. It has been designed by the pilots and for the pilots," he says.

According to Krishna, Tejas has improved a lot over the years. "In 2001, when we made the first flight, there were a lot of doubts among people and the scientific community. Even the IAF was a little sceptical. But over the years, we have flown 1,500 sorties. The aircraft has been doing well and we have achieved most of the targets we had set for ourselves. It has improved a lot," he says.

On how it compares with the MiGs, Krishna says Tejas is a well balanced aircraft, capable of fulfilling the roles for which it has been designed and developed. "It has state-of-the-art technology and we can keep improving on it as Tejas is going to be there for many years," says Krishna. "We can keep adding or modifying it as per our requirements. The good thing is that the technology is in our hands and we do not have to depend on anyone else."

Does anything need to be improved? "Whatever was needed has been improved as of now," says Krishna. "First, we demonstrated and proved the technology and then, the first 200 flights proved our capability to develop advanced flight control systems and integrate modern avionics and other technologies. We have now developed an aircraft as per the IAF requirement, and it is almost ready for induction. It is a complete combat-ready aircraft. It can go into a combat and demonstrate its capabilities."

http://week.manoramaonline.com/cgi-bin/MMOnline.dll/portal/ep/theWeekContent.do?BV_ID=@@@&contentType=EDITORIAL&sectionName=TheWeek%20COVER%20STORY&programId=1073755753&contentId=8548496
For once even the Indian opposition hasn't demanded JPC on this,

Though I believe, every Prime minister starting from Rajiv Gandi to the present defence minister A K Antony supported the project to the hilt, a bias on part of the malayalee editor can't be ignored

Antony tilted the balance in favour of the LCA



He wears a Henry Sandoz, a self-winding wrist-watch purchased when he got a Rs:750 scholarship in school in the early 60s, and he loves to drive his 25-year-old Fiat. P.S. Subramanyam, project director (combat aircraft) and director of Aeronautical Development Agency, has never felt the need to change the watch and the car that are close to his heart. But on the work front, he is heading projects that are evolving to keep pace with the global technological advancements. He spoke to THE WEEK about the LCA project. Excerpts:

After a long delay, the LCA is ready. How does it feel?
Everyone talks about the delays. It is not correct to say that the programme started in 1983, when the government first thought of working on a combat aircraft. They decided to put Rs:560 crore seed money for preparing the project definition, but there was no clarity. Even the air staff requirement (ASR) [standards for the engine] came only in 1985. In 1987-88, the project definition was prepared and the proposal to make prototypes was submitted. The government said they cannot take a risk with that kind of money and they split the programme into two parts; technology demonstration (TD) programme and proto-vehicle development project. In 1993, they gave Rs:2,199 crore for the TD. So, the actual programme started only in 1993. - Project started
In fact, clarity came only in 2004-05. In 2001, we flew the first aircraft and in 2004, we did the TD for the government, after which they released ?3,320 crore. The first proto vehicle (PV1) came out in December 2005. The IAF got confidence in the programme and gave the standard of preparation of fighter aircraft. So, the fillip came in 2005. From then on, the programme has been progressing rapidly, especially after Defence Minister A.K. Antony tilted the balance in favour of the LCA by publicly stating that the government would support the project, irrespective of any developments.

Is it ready for Initial Operational Clearance?
As of now, we have all equipment onboard, all sensors are functioning, all weapons integrated, carried and released. We have come to the IOC level. We are awaiting an endorsement from the defence minister.

Does the aircraft meet all the ASRs?
I will not say it will meet all the ASRs in which case we would not have brought in the alternative engine. There will be some deficiencies related to engine performance. The IAF is aware of all these aspects.

After the IOC, the next challenge would be the Final Operations Clearance?
Yes, FOC is the next major thing. But we do not see any problem in that. Beyond Visual Range missiles, some other weapons have to be integrated. That will be done by 2012.

What about the LCA Navy project?
The aircraft carrier that the Navy is building in Kochi and the other carrier, Vikramaditya, are looking for a light combat aircraft. No one else in the world is making this class of 10-tonne aircraft for a carrier with ramp take-off. We have taken the commitment very seriously and are putting all our best efforts to ensure its first flight in first quarter of 2011.
For conducting the carrier compatibility trials, we are building a mock-up of the aircraft carrier at a shore-based test facility in Goa. By the next quarter or so the take-off region will be ready.

How did the project help the industry?
When we started the programme, our technologies were second generation, which were almost three decades old. Today, the world says we are four-plus generation. It is not only the aircraft, but all technologies, design, analysis, simulation, ground testing, flight testing and assembling have been upgraded. The money has gone into developing an eco-system that helps private industries.

How did you handle the criticism about the programme?
Our leaders totally insured us from all criticism. While they took care of all those aspects, they gave us day-to-day challenges. We never got exposed to the media and never took it seriously.

What after the LCA project?
The IAF is saying 'Let us make a fifth generation aircraft, the Advanced Medium Combat Aircraft'. The seed money has been given, and the IAF is working very closely with us to evolve the specifications so that the programme can start. Also, the Unmanned Aerial Combat Aircraft programme is coming up and money has already been given. That is a little more advanced than the AMCA because of its stealth characteristics.
http://week.manoramaonline.com/cgi-bin/MMOnline.dll/portal/ep/theWeekContent.do?BV_ID=@@@&contentType=EDITORIAL&sectionName=TheWeek%20COVER%20STORY&programId=1073755753&contentId=8548497
If u have anyone to blame, blame the USSR for supporting us in the cold war with state of the art aircraft. The bureacracy that thrives within MOD and the production agency HAL for not employing adequate man power. God knows if HAL has know-how of advanced manufacturing for LCA Tejas whose airframe especially is a quantum leap from Su-30.

One thing I've noted, u tend to hide behind an anonymous tag. I dare u reveal your country. there are several others promoting interests of their own countries, what makes u shy. I don't suppose u r from the forbidden kingdom, though u say Godless.
 
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Tshering22

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Guys no matter how much some of our critics discredit Tejas to some extent, I must say that we developed a really versatile platform that can be kept on modifying for long time and hence each improvement makes it more and more capable; something similar to Gripen series. The MK2 would be roughly the "NG" version of Tejas.

One thing that draws my attention though is that how come ADA has not released any videos of Tejas doing some good rolls, split Ss and loops? Or a video in which Tejas is shown crossing sound barrier with the sonic boom 'cloud' visible around it? That would have been an effective propaganda tool to silence some of the discouraging types. One has to admit Tejas has some serious record: not a single crash during all its test phases.

Not even the US and Russia have such a clean slate record. I do pray that it never happens whether any of our jet in testing or even in full use. That would really show the world our technical expertise.
 

ppgj

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good reports. thanks Icecoolben.

time and again it was pointed there were no delays and the project only started in 1993 but many memers here keep insisting that it was delayed and if i remember right one member said it was 40 years late!!!

the following quote from the PSS (from the horse's mouth) nails that -

Everyone talks about the delays. It is not correct to say that the programme started in 1983, when the government first thought of working on a combat aircraft. They decided to put Rs:560 crore seed money for preparing the project definition, but there was no clarity. Even the air staff requirement (ASR) [standards for the engine] came only in 1985. In 1987-88, the project definition was prepared and the proposal to make prototypes was submitted. The government said they cannot take a risk with that kind of money and they split the programme into two parts; technology demonstration (TD) programme and proto-vehicle development project. In 1993, they gave Rs:2,199 crore for the TD. So, the actual programme started only in 1993.
http://week.manoramaonline.com/cgi-...gramId=1073755753&BV_ID=@@@&contentId=8548497

that says it all. there is difference between a feasibility report, definition stage and actual approval for the project itself.

1993 was the year it was given go ahead with funds allocated and 8 years it took to fly!!! no mean achievement considering it was something fresh india was attempting (HAL 24 MARUT if had been implemented would have served as a great data point for the designers!!! alas..). 17 years to IOC. compare this time to any developer anywhere in the world including established players, it won't be any different. all the infrastructure had to be created from ground up. NFTC, ASTE, CEMILAC all came up because of LCA besides on wind tunnel testing centre, composites mastery, various avionics including EW suites were focussed/produced specifically for this project. if india can boast of the infrastructure for designing and productionising an aircraft in the future, the credit goes to LCA and it's designers.

another point LCA opposers insist on is the cost balloning.

what they miss is it it is pea nuts compared to any developer worldwide. actually a fraction. all this has gone into not only developing an aircraft but creating all the new infra - a great fututre investment.

besides what LCA has given the country is not 1 aircraft but 3!! an airforce variant, a naval variant and a trainer - an important point people have missed.

another point missed is - how much the project has already given back on investment. let's take a look.

1. composites are being used in SU 30MKI, NAL SARAS and will be used in RTA 70, AMCA.

2. CSIO developed HUD already on in the LCA will see installation in other aircrafts. IJT Sitara will be the first followed by others -

The HUD for the HJT, a follow-up project of the Tejas HUD, is more compact and lighter, with some more features incorporated into it. The CSIO is now contemplating development of the HUD systems for SU-30 MKI, Jaguar and MiG series aircraft.
http://www.tribuneindia.com/2006/20060719/cth1.htm



http://www.lca-tejas.org/avionics.html

3. Tarang RWR, Tempest EW were developed which have been modified/upgraded and find themselves in most indian aircrafts including SU 30MKI, MIG 27, JAGUAR etc..

Mig 29s too will have indian EW -

http://www.livemint.com/articles/2010/07/21214510/DAREBELtojointlybuildele.html?atype=tp

4. latest EW RWJ for self protection and jammer is already on Mig 27 per reports.

5. MMR with only the processor being israeli can also see being installed on other aircrafts though AESA will be the focus in future for the LRDE.



http://angle-of-attack.blogspot.com/2010/04/lca-radar-is-not-aesa.html

6. indian MFDs already in LCA and are being put in SU 30MKIs. would be replicated in others in future.



http://www.aviationweek.com/aw/gene...e=Indian-Made MFD System Cleared For Su-30MKI

7. mission computers are now standard on all aircrafts. IIRC even malaysian SU 30MKMs also feature indian Mission computers.

8. GTRE Kaveri though not successful to the extent will have marine versions while Kaveri itself has given the country it's first turbofan engine. this with help from Snechma will power AMCA hopefully.

9. ILSS and OBOG - life support and oxygen generator system.



Light Combat Aircraft (LCA) Tejas will be equipped with the ILSS from February 2011. It will provide 100 per cent oxygen to pilots in case of ejection from the fighter aircraft.

An important constituent of the ILSS is the onboard oxygen generation system (OBOGS),
The ILSS can be customised to suit MiG-29, Sukhoi-30 and Mirage-2000 for their long-duration flights, Dr. Padaki said.
http://www.hindu.com/2010/11/14/stories/2010111464731700.htm

it is worth recalling aircrafts used to carry oxygen cylinders. this is a worthy effort only few have mastered.



http://frontierindia.net/album/v/FIDSNS/defense/DRDO/Tejas/ILSS-OBOG-LCA-Tejas-+DRDO.jpg.html

10. though SIVA HADF pod and Tusker Pod were not directly related, got a boost with the LCA development.

some more details at -

http://www.lca-tejas.org/avionics.html

so the question is - is the LCA costly?? is LCA delayed?? is the investment productive?? is the infra created which will help future programmes is in vain??

food for that. people can judge for themselves.

i leave it at that. cheers.
 

Rahul Singh

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http://www.bharat-rakshak.com/NEWS/newsrf.php?newsid=14087



The LCAs fuel tank exploded in a lightning test and that is not of any concern to IOC?!!! That is too much of bending over backwards, just to see this inducted. If the fuel tank explosion does not concern IOC i dont know what does. I think they r just going to push it in service.
Is it what a LCA critic all about? Where it is written LCA drop tank exploded?

First source to break the news was TARMAK007 and there it is clearly mentioned that blast took place before testing and was intentional and controlled one but somehow it behaved abnormally.

Here's the official version from a senior CABS official:Before testing various parts of the aircraft, we do the fuel-air-mixture ignition test on the custom-built rig. Yesterday, while this pre-test-ignition was done, the window panes of the viewing area were shattered due to a minor explosion. It shouldn't have happened. It's an unusual experience. As a result, 10 of our colleagues got injured due to splinters. We are investigating the incident and a Board of Inquiry is being set-up now. The Tejas program is on track and this is a minor incident.

Author' note IMPORTANT: Please note that the incident occurred AHEAD of the fuel tank(s) test and NOT during the test.
 

Godless-Kafir

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Is it what a LCA critic all about? Where it is written LCA drop tank exploded?

First source to break the news was TARMAK007 and there it is clearly mentioned that blast took place before testing and was intentional and controlled one but somehow it behaved abnormally.

Here's the official version from a senior CABS official:Before testing various parts of the aircraft, we do the fuel-air-mixture ignition test on the custom-built rig. Yesterday, while this pre-test-ignition was done, the window panes of the viewing area were shattered due to a minor explosion. It shouldn't have happened. It's an unusual experience. As a result, 10 of our colleagues got injured due to splinters. We are investigating the incident and a Board of Inquiry is being set-up now. The Tejas program is on track and this is a minor incident.

Author' note IMPORTANT: Please note that the incident occurred AHEAD of the fuel tank(s) test and NOT during the test.
It does not say drop tank because its says fuel tank of LCA. Although it does not mention fuel tank exploded i thought it could have been a cover up considering a bulb burst can shatter protective glass shield. Either way if the fuel air mixture exploded i suppose their would be fire and incinerated the staff. Governments always do a cover up job, so It was only a paranoid observation since i am prone to watching deadlines slip for more than decade that i have followed the project, i was worried if they are burying the issue just to pass the test in fear of criticism and delay.
 
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icecoolben

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Guys no matter how much some of our critics discredit Tejas to some extent, I must say that we developed a really versatile platform that can be kept on modifying for long time and hence each improvement makes it more and more capable; something similar to Gripen series. The MK2 would be roughly the "NG" version of Tejas.

One thing that draws my attention though is that how come ADA has not released any videos of Tejas doing some good rolls, split Ss and loops? Or a video in which Tejas is shown crossing sound barrier with the sonic boom 'cloud' visible around it? That would have been an effective propaganda tool to silence some of the discouraging types. One has to admit Tejas has some serious record: not a single crash during all its test phases.

Not even the US and Russia have such a clean slate record. I do pray that it never happens whether any of our jet in testing or even in full use. That would really show the world our technical expertise.
ADA is funded for research only and thus cannot do the advertising. HAL is the profittering agency involved in production with some fiscal autonomy, But it has hardly any words to write about Tejas in its website, let alone make promos. Besides to market good promos, u need to hire professions from multimedia and maketting sector, while HAL is scouting for realtors to find locatins suited to manufacture 126 MMRCA jets.

U wanna think of "Tejas - International Roadmap" ???
 

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http://tarmak007.blogspot.com/
Happy New Year: Takeoff 2011 with Tejas' fireworks! Countdown for IOC begins & ADA says 'all set for Jan 10'

The January 10 event will be called as Declaration of IOC, though the IAF top brass wanted to call it as IOC-1. Technically the English on the certificate will read something like this -- Certification for the Release to Services with assured safety and specified performance for IOC. "We haven't closed the Request for Actions (RFAs) yet and there are some minor issues to be thrashed out. These are not safety critical or flight critical. Whatever concessions ADA-HAL have asked, are given," says a military source.
As reported in these columns earlier, the Test pilots from ASTE will get to fly Tejas in March\April by which time LSP-7 and LSP-8 would have joined the flight-line. "Even while we roll out the first platform from the SP block (from the initial 20), the IAF pilots would have got the taste of Tejas. Their independent observations are crucial and we are ready for swift actions. As of now, activities relating to certification are over," says another source.
 

SpArK

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Month Before IOC, MoD's Tejas Update In Parliament



One permanent fixture in all reports by the Indian Parliamentary Standing Committee on Defence is the Light Combat Aircraft (LCA Tejas) programme. And exactly month before the programme achieves initial operational clearance on January 10, the panel's latest report was released, containing the following updated account of the Tejas programme so far. Much of it is the same, but with the level of interest in the programme, especially now, there are several new bits scattered around this update. Here it is in full:

The programme of indigenous development of Light Combat Aircraft (LCA) had been initiated in August"Ÿ 1983 with the Government sanction of an interim development cost of Rs 560.00 Cr. This sanction was to initiate the programme and carry out Project Definition Phase (PDP). After completing the PDP, the report was submitted to Government and proposal to build 07 prototypes was made. The Government of India split the programme into Technical Development Phase and Operational Vehicle Development Phase. The Full Scale Engineering Development Programme Phase-I (LCA FSED Phase-I) was sanctioned in April"Ÿ1993 at a cost of Rs 2188 Cr (including the interim sanction of Rs 560 Cr given in 1983). The scope of FSED Phase-I was to demonstrate the technologies so that a decision could be taken to build operational proto-vehicles at a later stage. LCA FSED Phase-I was completed on 31 Mar 2004. While Phase-I programme was in progress, the Government decided to concurrently go ahead with the build of operational proto vehicles. The scope of FSED Phase-2 was to build three prototypes of operational aircrafts including a trainer and also to build the infrastructure required for producing 08 aircrafts per year and build eight Limited Series Production (LSP) aircrafts. Government sanctioned FSED Phase-II of the programme at a total cost of Rs 3301.78 Cr on 20 Nov"Ÿ2001. The Phase-II programme has been split into two phases namely, Initial Operational Clearance (IOC) and Final Operational Clearance (FOC). Standard of
preparation of operational aircraft was finalized in 2004 with changes in weapons, sensors and avionics to meet the IAF requirements and overcome obsolescence. (Original design was made in 1990s). This contributes to additional time and revised cost for Phase-II.

Governing body of ADA in its 41st meeting held on 22 Nov 2007 had detail review of the Programme and deliberated on achievements vis-à-vis objectives of LCA FSED Phase-II programme and recommended the extension of FSED Phase-II likely date of completion till 31 Dec 2012 (IOC by Dec 2010 & FOC by Dec 2012) with GE-F404-IN20 Engine and to develop & productionise the Mark 2 variant of Tejas aircraft and also recommended the constitution of Cost Revision Committee to assess additional requirement of funds. The need for extension of PDC for LCA FSED Phase-II was due to:

(a) Complexity of the system desgn and very high safety standards lead to extensive testing to ensure flight safety.

(b) Incorporating the configuration changes (for example R60 close Combat Missile (CCM) was replaced by R73E CCM which required design modifications) to keep the aircraft contemporary|

(c) Due to non-availability of indigenous "žKaveri Engine"Ÿ design changes were carried out to accommodate GE404 engine of USA.

(d) Change in the development strategy of Radar and associated changes on the aircraft.

(e) Major development activity of Avionics was undertaken in order to make aircraft contemporary, which took time but yielded results (for example, development of obsolescence free open architecture avionics system).

(f) US sanctions imposed in 1998 also led to delay in importing certain items and developing alternate equipment, since vendors identification and development to production cycle took time.

The need for revision of FSED Phase-II fund sanction was mainly due to:

(a) To neutralize the effect of inflation/delivery point cost against the sanctioned level at 2001 and the increase in manpower cost of HAL.

(b) To meet the programme management expenditure due to extended time line till Dec 2012

(c) Maintain and operate 10-15 aircraft for four years upto 2012

(d) To maintain & upgrade the design, development and test facilities upto 2012, in keeping with modern technology

(e) To complete the activities which were not costed in the original estimates.

Cost Revision Committee after careful consideration of the projections made and taking into account the increase in the cost of material, manpower, additional activities to complete the IOC & FOC, maintenance of facilities and expanded scope of the programme etc., recommended additional fund of Rs 2475.78 Cr for completing FSED Phase-II activities with PDC Dec 2012, Rs 2431.55 Cr for developing Tejas Mark 2 with alternate engine (LCA FSED Phase-III Programme) and Rs 395.65 Cr for Technology Development Programme (Total additional funds of Rs 5302.98 Cr). Recommendations of the Cost Revision Committee was accepted by Government and in November 2009, sanction was accorded for continuing Full Scale Engineering Development of LCA till Dec 2018 with an additional cost of Rs 5302.98 Cr.

LCA (Tejas) Programme is progressing satisfactorily as per schedule mutually agreed with IAF to meet their requirements. Flight Test phase on nine Tejas aircrafts to obtain IOC for Tejas, which is mandatory for induction of Tejas into IAF is in advanced stage. Establishment of Tejas production facilities for the production rate of eight aircrafts per annum is progressing concurrently with development activities. On 31 Mar 2006, IAF has executed the contract with HAL for production of 20 Tejas aircraft (series production) powered by GE-F404-IN20 engines in IOC configuration and production activities are in progress. Follow on order of another 20 aircraft is in an advanced stage of negotiation between IAF and Hindustan Aeronautics Limited (HAL).

The issue of Kaveri engine has been delinked temporarily from Tejas Production Programme and use of Kaveri engine on Tejas will be considered after successful completion of mandatory development tests on engine. Initial batch of Tejas production aircraft (Tejas Mk-1) will be integrated with GE-F404-IN20 engines and will be inducted into IAF progressively from Jan 2011 onwards. Development of Tejas Mk-2 with alternate imported foreign engine (LCA FSED Phase-III) to improve aircraft performance has been launched concurrently with LCA FSED Phase-II programme.

In addition to the weekly reviews conducted at ADA and the Governing Body & Annual General Body Meetings, the Honourable Raksha Mantri has set up Special Review Committees with the Chief of Air Staff reviewing the programme once every quarter and Deputy Chief of Air Staff reviewing every month to ensure that the objectives of Tejas Programme are achieved without any further cost and time overrun.

http://livefist.blogspot.com/2011/01/month-before-ioc-mods-tejas-update-in.html?utm_source=twitterfeed&utm_medium=twitter
 

Rahul Singh

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[video]http://indiandefence.net/vshare2.7/view/88/tejas-test-fires-r73-over-goa-sea-during-2010-sea-trials/[/video]

Tejas fires R-73 over Goa during 2010 sea trials.

Special thanks to Tarmak007
 
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shuvo@y2k10

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http://www.bharat-rakshak.com/NEWS/newsrf.php?newsid=14087



The LCAs fuel tank exploded in a lightning test and that is not of any concern to IOC?!!! That is too much of bending over backwards, just to see this inducted. If the fuel tank explosion does not concern IOC i dont know what does. I think they r just going to push it in service.
nowhere it is mentioned that the fuel tank has exploded during the test.it could be blast from other instruments used in the experiment or other laboratory appliances
 

Rahul Singh

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It does not say drop tank because its says fuel tank of LCA. Although it does not mention fuel tank exploded i thought it could have been a cover up considering a bulb burst can shatter protective glass shield. Either way if the fuel air mixture exploded i suppose their would be fire and incinerated the staff. Governments always do a cover up job, so It was only a paranoid observation since i am prone to watching deadlines slip for more than decade that i have followed the project, i was worried if they are burying the issue just to pass the test in fear of criticism and delay.
Then please don't post guess work with that that kind of authority. Your sentence "The LCAs fuel tank exploded in a lightning test and that is not of any concern to IOC?!!! " especially the red section was pretending too much authority which in fact can best be rumor if not worse.
 

ppgj

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Rahul Singh 13 Hours Ago

HUD looks modified version of LCA's. Unlike LCA's HUD there is no sun cover which is a sign of improvement.
rahul,

i was looking for an image and i had that one at hand. the HUD has since undergone improvements.

Addition of advanced features like sun glare removal by use of multilayer coating on folding mirror, internally generated display to take care of display processor failure, FPGA based raster mode signal generation for a jitter free display, lower power consumption of less than 50 watts as compared to 145 watts in raster mode of operation etc has further fine tuned the technology. The user of HUD is Air Force for fighter (LCA) and trainer (HJT-36) applications
http://dsir.nic.in/a_report/english/2009-10E/III-A.pdf

there is a display too.
 

Rahul Singh

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PPGJ, LSP-4 HUD doesn't feature sun cover. May be they have not tested new models of HUD on LCA so far. Below is the pic of LCA LSP-4.

 

ppgj

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PPGJ, LSP-4 HUD doesn't feature sun cover. May be they have not tested new models of HUD on LCA so far. Below is the pic of LCA LSP-4.

rahul, the picture i posted is a old one. this must be the new one. if you read the article i posted, it speaks of multiple anti-glare coats which means you don't need the sun cover IMO.

however i have missed seeing this image of LSP 4. thanks.
 

Rahul Singh

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PPGJ, HJT-36's HUD looks little similar to LCA's minus sun cover but we should note that pic is from Farnborough 08 and earlier prototypes were using Sextant(Thales) HUD. Anyway following quote from CSIR annual report gives ample reason to believe that CSIO HUD is presently flying with HJT-36.

HUD is currently under use by Indian Air Force for fighter aircraft (LCA) and trainer aircraft (HJT-36) applications.

HUD variant for Hindustan Jet Trainer (HJT-36) met all essential Safety of Flight (SOF)
standards which cover various stringent tests like random vibration, sinusoidal vibration, mechanical shock, drop test, acceleration, low and high temperature operational & storage test, thermal shock, humidity, salt fog, high altitude & rapid decompression etc.
link
Image of LCA HUD during flight.

 

Rahul Singh

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$$$ From 'VAYU' Volume 3 2010. Bit old but worth reading. Not mentioning one pic of cutie pie(PV-5). Thanks 'VAYU'
-------------------------------------------------------------




Days after the Standing Committee on Defence was briefed at Parliament House in New Delhi on the 'Light Combat Aircraft Development Programme', with the government sanctioning an extension of the fighter's 'full-scale engineering development' (FSED) till 31 December 2018 (see box), a significant event took place at Bangalore. The 52-minute flight of the Tejas LCA limited series production 3 aircraft (LSP-3) on 23 April 2010 may have been nearly a year late than originally planned but marked a watershed in this protracted but steady programme. The Tejas LSP-3 (KH-2013) is the ninth test vehicle to join the flight line for development flight trials of the Light Combat Aircraft proceeding towards
achieving initial operational clearance (IOC) for induction in the IAF by end
2010. The virtual 'copy book' maiden test flight of LSP-3 was of immense
satisfaction to the designers, engineers and test team of the Aeronautical Development Agency (ADA) and its National Flight Test Centre (NFTC), apart from supporters in New Delhi.

This was the 1350th flight of the LCA (achieved collectively by TD-1, TD-2, PV-1, PV-2, PV-3, PV-5, LSP-1, LSP-2) but from LSP-3 onwards, in addition to
the main Digital Flight Control Computer (DFCC), there are four air data computers (ADC) for air data computations. As officially stated, "the quadruple ADCs, indigenously designed and developed by the Aeronautical Development Establishment (ADE) have taken care of the inevitable obsolescence of Air Data Transducers (ADT) which were imported and also off loaded some of the computations from DFCC in order to incorporate Autopilot functionality. These Air Data Computers are distributed asynchronous computers with respect to DFCC and hence taking care of all the failure modes of this computer was quite a challenge. Coupled with this was the additional challenge of realising this flight critical hardware by Bharat Electronics Limited (BEL) Bangalore in coordination with the design, manufacturing and certification agencies (CEMILAC and DGAQA)."

The most important aspect of LSP-3 is that this aircraft incorporates the required sensors and weapon systems required to achieve Initial Operational Clearance (IOC) standard. The key sensors integrated on LSP-3 include the Multimode Radar (MMR), Radar Warning Receiver (RWR), VHF Omni Range and Instrument Landing System (VOR/ILS) and Tactical Navigation System (TACAN). The primary sensor, and mission critical system of the Tejas is its Multimode Radar, jointly designed and developed by ADA, HAL, LRDE, ECIL with ELTA of Israel and is reportedly based on the EL/M-2032 which is an advanced pulse Doppler, multimode Fire Control Radar intended for multi-role fighter aircraft, with origins in the Lavi project.

This radar is designed to work in airto- air, air-to-ground and air-to-sea modes
and has high resolution ground mapping with many other features. The RWR is
designed and developed by DARE and BEL while the VOR/ILS and TACAN systems are designed and developed by SLRDC, HAL at Hyderabad. With these systems integrated and flown, the Tejas "is very close to final production standard aircraft as planned to be inducted into the Indian Air Force," according to ADA.

The LSP-3 maiden flight was made by Wg Cdr George Thomas (formerly CO No. 20 Squadron who had led the IAF team at 'Red Flag' in Nellis, USA and is now with the National Flight Test Centre at ADA). As per standard procedure the first flight was shepherded by a chase aircraft (Tejas Trainer PV-5) flown by Gp Capt RR Tyagi, the Chief Test Pilot and Wg Cdr (Retd) PK Raveendran SC, the Group Director (Flight Test). The test flight was conducted from the Telemetry station by the Test Director, Wg Cdr S Toffeen, under the supervision of Air Cmde Rohit Varma VM, the Project Director (Flight Test).

Tejas LCA Project Costs
The Committee during the course of examination of Demands for Grants of the previous year had noted that the LCA project was sanctioned in 1983 with the original cost of Rs. 560 crore. The first phase of the project was completed on 31 March 2004 with the cost of Rs 2188 crore. The sanctioned cost of the second phase was Rs 3301.87 crore and projected date of completion was 31 December 2008. The Ministry further informed that in November 2009, sanction was accorded for continuing full scale engineering development of the LCA till 31 December 2018 with an additional cost of Rs 5302.98 crore.

Report Card (as documented by MoD)
"Flight Test Phase on LCA Tejas initiated on 4 January 2001. Overall objectives of
Tejas FSED Phase I have been achieved in March 2004 with completion of 202 flight tests on Tejas (TD-1, TD-2 & PV-1) demonstrating critical technologies
identified during PDP. As on 15 March 2010, total of 1324 flight tests (776 hrs: 59 mins flight duration) have been completed utilising 8 Tejas aircraft.

Handling quality is adjudged as "very good" by 15 test pilots of IAF and Indian Navy. Maiden flight of the first two-seater (trainer) version Prototype Vehicle 5 (PV-5) took place on 26 November 2009. Presently,LCA Phase 2 activities leading to Initial Operational Clearance (IOC) are in progress. GE F404 IN20 engine and Martin Baker Mk.16G ejection seat installed and are functional on the Tejas. External stores (800 Itr & 1200 Itr drop tank) identified for IOC, integrated and
flight tested.

Air-to-ground weapons including practice bombs and 1000lb bombs integrated and dropped successfully. Air-to-air close combat missile (R-73E) released from Tejas. Sea level trials completed at Arrakonam and Goa. Hot weather trials (Phase 1) completed at Nagpur. Cold weather flight trials (Phase 1) carried out successfully at Leh. Night flying trials (Phase 1) completed. Crosswind take off and landing carried out successfully. Initial Operational Clearance (IOC) is scheduled to be completed by December 2010.

Searching for a new engine
With regard to the LCA powerplant, the Committee, during the course of examination of Demands for Grants of the previous years, had been informed
that the Tejas was running into 'serious problems' and the option was to either to import an engine (either the GE F414 or EJ 200) or persist with the GTRE Kaveri. The Committee was later informed that the final position to import a suitable engine in place of Kaveri engine had been taken, Requests for Proposal were floated and responses received. Technical evaluation of the offers received was 'under progress'.
 

ppgj

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PPGJ, HJT-36's HUD looks little similar to LCA's minus sun cover but we should note that pic is from Farnborough 08 and earlier prototypes were using Sextant(Thales) HUD. Anyway following quote from CSIR annual report gives ample reason to believe that CSIO HUD is presently flying with HJT-36.
the picture i posted as below was part of PV 2 as explained in the brief here -

HUD: The Head-up-Display of the LCA is a unit developed by the state-owned CSIO, Chandigarh. The HUD is claimed to be superior to similar systems in the international market. According to Mr. CV M L Narasimham, head of CSIO's Applied Optics division, compared to Israel's HUD, the CSIO equipment is noiseless, silent, and offers a better field of view. It is compact, reliable, non-reflective and designed for high-performance aircraft. It was first put on the PV-2 version of the LCA.


http://www.lca-tejas.org/avionics.html

this is correct if you check this -



http://www.bharat-rakshak.com/IAF/Images/2378-1/Indoor-LCA-Cockpit02.jpg

they are same. the second picture must be of PV 2.

from LSP series i guess it was changed to the ones that is in the picture you posted. two more similar ones -



http://img10.imageshack.us/img10/4498/img6765sm.jpg



http://kedar.smugmug.com/Miscellanous/Stuff/cockpitkedarkDSC1059/498514415_DfZ2Y-M.jpg

now compare that to IJT sitara HUD image. one more here (note this - report dated feb 2010, pretty recent) -



http://livefist.blogspot.com/2010/02/hjt-36-cockpit.html

so it is possible that the IJT sitara one must be the latest (without the sun cover meaning has the multiple coats of the sun glare to make up for it) which may go (?) on SP series production LCAs probably.
 
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