Sukhoi Su 30MKI

[jackprince]

Don't know if it was posted before. If posted, @mods please delete. @pmaitra @sob


An excellent docu... good work by Maroof Raza

 

[mahesh]

off topic

what if nose landing gear problem occurs in in our SU 30mki, Tejas, can there be any ideas for this problem in this scenario, coz except our Harrier, i guess the all birds are simple as dead, just for a small simple malfunction

 

[myana]

off topic

what if nose landing gear problem occurs in in our SU 30mki, Tejas, can there be any ideas for this problem in this scenario, coz except our Harrier, i guess the all birds are simple as dead, just for a small simple malfunction

Not sure for fighter planes but all the passenger planes' have a fail safe for landing gears to fall down into its place by its own weight just by gravity.

 

[indiandefencefan]

Russia, India In Dicussion For Modernizing Su-30MKI Fighter Jets

Russia and India are in discussion on modernization of Su-30MKI fighter jet, deputy head of the Federal Service for Military-Technical Cooperation Konstantin Biryulin told Russia's TASS news agency on Monday.

The modernisation package includes onboard communication and data transfer systems, as well as radar equipment of Su-30MKI fighter jets.

Biryulin, who heads the Russian delegation to the show, said at the opening of Le Bourget Paris Air Show 2015 that "talks are underway with Indian partners on conducting a comprehensive modernisation of Su-30MKI jets which were first supplied (to India) around 20 years ago."

Russia's participation in Le Bourget Paris Air Show 2015 scheduled for June 15-21 has decreased insignificantly despite the uneasy political situation, Biryulin told TASS last week.

"We still consider Paris Air Show to be a promising exhibition platform for maintaining and developing dialogue with our partners from Europe and other regions in the world," he added.

"In the process of preparing for the show we did not face any counteraction or restrictions on forming our exhibition. Though this year the emphasis was made on showcasing our capabilities in designing civil aviation for understandable reasons, the Russian exhibition will also be informative in terms of presenting modern combat aviation," the delegation head added.

http://www.defenseworld.net/news/13...odernizing_Su_30MKI_Fighter_Jets#.VX7qwFWqqko

 

[bennedose]

I was fortunate to have seen and videoed this superlative Su-30 MKI performance by Viktor Pugachev in Aero India 1998. That was the most breathtaking display I have seen, and the man kept the whole display below a low cloud cover. There was no YouTube in 1998 and by the time I got a YouTube account a decade later this video was "lost" in my archives. I found it today ..enjoy It has Pugachev's signature "Cobra" manoeuvre

 

[bennedose]

off topic

what if nose landing gear problem occurs in in our SU 30mki, Tejas, can there be any ideas for this problem in this scenario, coz except our Harrier, i guess the all birds are simple as dead, just for a small simple malfunction

Read this - it was written by my late cousin Wing Co (retd) Suresh
http://www.bharat-rakshak.com/IAF/history/1970s/1301-kukke-suresh-jaguar.html
Unfortunately the photos are missing. Will try and locate

 

[pmaitra]

Read this - it was written by my late cousin Wing Co (retd) Suresh
http://www.bharat-rakshak.com/IAF/history/1970s/1301-kukke-suresh-jaguar.html
Unfortunately the photos are missing. Will try and locate

Wow. This was a very interesting read. Now, I see that BAe started the blame game without actually getting their French manufacturer/supplier to fix their manufacturing defects. This reminds of Rolls-Royce unilaterally reducing the service period for the BAe Hawk after the engine's quill shaft failed.

We need to resist the urge to pin the blame on HAL the moment some aircraft crashes. The article proves the fact that a HAL Engineer knew how to save the plane. The article proves how BAe was unwilling to accept the flaw in their design, which was uncovered by NAL. Last, but not th eleast, this article shows how HAL actually came up with a fix to the problem. This tells me HAL engineers are a lot more skilled than we are willing to give them credit for, and we should not take the word of these foreign vendors for granted.

 

[bennedose]

Read this - it was written by my late cousin Wing Co (retd) Suresh
http://www.bharat-rakshak.com/IAF/history/1970s/1301-kukke-suresh-jaguar.html
Unfortunately the photos are missing. Will try and locate

Here are the images related to this story

 

[Yumdoot]

It was the same with Canberra and Gnats too. There too our pilots were basically used as cannon fodder for incomplete planes, incomplete flight envelops and incomplete understanding of the aerodynamics.

From the same site http://www.bharat-rakshak.com/IAF/History/1950s/1181-Canberra-Crash.html

 

[akshay m]

Flankers and Typhoons are testing each other now

Indradhanush 2015 is going on

Su 30MKI at RAF Coningsby for Ex.Indradhanush 2015

 

[akshay m]

Ex-Indradhanush 2015

 

[akshay m]

the bolded line about the use of yaw by the flankers is interesting



Exercise Indradhanush: Flankers And Typhoons Battle In British Skies

The British Royal Air Force (RAF) and Indian Air Force (IAF) have hailed the success of a major exercise which saw the deployment of four Sukhoi Su-30MKI ‘Flankers’ to the U.K. to fly with and fight against the RAF’s Eurofighter Typhoon.

Exercise Indradhanush IV (Hindi: Rainbow) concluded on July 30 following intensive flying operations with RAF Typhoon squadrons from RAF Coningsby, Lincolnshire. Ten IAF crews including 15 pilots and five weapon systems operators flew twice daily missions, often flying all four Su-30s on air-to-air training missions flying beyond visual range (BVR) and within visual range (WVR) engagements with the Typhoon.

This is the fourth iteration of the exercise, with the British and Indians taking it in turns to visit each other's shores.

The last time the Indians deployed to the U.K. was in 2007.

The Su-30s came from 2 Sqn – the Winged Arrows – based at Tezpur near India’s frontier with China.

The Flanker pilots were also able to use their thrust-vectoring control (TVC) “super-maneuverability” capability activated by flipping a switch in the cockpit. One pilot told Aviation Week that they had used the yaw capability of the TVC to remain inside the tight turn radius of the Typhoon in order to keep the Typhoon in missile launch parameters.

It was not possible to assess which aircraft, if any, had the upper hand in air combat, pilots and commanders remained tight lipped on the results of any dogfighting.

RAF Wg. Cmdr. Chris Moon, commanding officer of 3 (Fighter) Sqn which led the exercise said that participants had adopted a “crawl, walk, run approach” with Indian crews familiarizing themselves with U.K. airspace regulations before taking on the Typhoons in 1vs1, 2vs1 and increasingly complex engagements. The last exercise mission saw all four Flankers working with six Typhoons to escort and support two C-130J Hercules on a paradropping mission. They were opposed by 8-10 red-air Typhoons.

The exercise also saw the use of an Indian C-17 and an Il-78 tanker aircraft. The Il-78 operated alongside an RAF A330 Voyager tanker over the North Sea. While the Su-30s could have refueled from the Voyager, they were not cleared to, as a result fighters refueled from their national assets.

At least two RAF pilots got to fly in the back seat of the Su-30 during exchange sorties on July 30.

All Indian aircraft left the U.K. on July 31

 

[akshay m]

From the previous post(http://defenceforumindia.com/forum/threads/sukhoi-su-30mki.43829/page-33#post-1062527) and this one , it seems that the flanker one this years round of dogfights

-----------------
Indian air force pilots (IAF) flying their Su-30MKI Flankers provided stiff opposition for a UK Royal Air Force (RAF) Eurofighter Typhoon squadron during air combat maneuvering exercises just ended in the UK. Senior officers from both the IAF and the RAF were unwilling to discuss details, but AIN understands from informed sources with knowledge of the exercise that, in close combat, the thrust vector control (TVC) on the heavier Flankers more than compensated for the greater thrust-to-weight ratio of the Typhoon. The IAF is likely to buy another 30or 40 Su-30MKIs from the licensed Indian production line, boosting its fleet to close to300, especially after last week’s formal withdrawal by Delhi of the RFP for a Medium Multi-Role Combat Aircraft (MMRCA).

For Exercise Indradhanush IV, the IAF deployed four Su-30MKIs from No 2 Squadron based at Tezpur to RAF Coningsby, assisted by mid-air refueling from an IAF Ilyushin Il-78 tanker. Logistics support was provided by an IAF C-17 and a C-130J, and these transports also carried a special forces unit that exercised with its RAF counterpart, including paradrops. Three previous exercises in the series included two visits by RAF Typhoons to India and an Su-30MKI deployment to the UK in 2007. However, that exercise was constrained by Indian security rules that precluded the use of the Flanker’s N011M passive electronically-scanned array (PESA) radar. There were no such restrictions this time, although the rules that were agreed by both air forces for the exercise included a common maximum range for beyond-visual range (BVR) engagements. The Flanker and the Typhoon both carry a long-range infrared search and track (IRST) sensor that can supplement or replace BVR detection of opposing aircraft by their respective radars.

Scenarios for the two-week exercise gradually increased in complexity, ending with an 18-aircraft mission in which the four Flankers joined six Typhoons in a ‘Blue’ Force that was tasked to escort two C-130Js (one Indian, on British) into a drop zone, opposed by six jets of a ‘Red’ Force comprising RAF Hawks and more Typhoons. Although air-to-air engagement was the main focus of the exercise, the Flanker and Typhoon pilots also honed their air-to-ground skills. Typhoons performed simulated drops of Paveway II and IV laser-guided bombs. Although the Flankers can carry a much greater range of ordnance, they simulated only ‘generic’ weapons-dropping while in the UK.

The status and timetable is not entirely clear for India's plans to upgrade the Su-30MKI fleet with an AESA radar; new displays including the Thales Topsight HMDS; and new weapons including the Indian Astra BVRAAM and the Indo-Russian Brahmos cruise missile. The ending of the MMRCA requirement could theoretically free up funds for the upgrade, and the additional licensed production, although some observers believe that more resources could be applied to the Fifth Generation Fighter Aircraft (FGFA) project with Russia, instead. Meanwhile, Dassault Aviation seems confident of a firm contract from India for 36 French-built Rafale fighters within a couple of months, in lieu of the MMRCA deal. Eric Trappier, CEO, told journalists at the company’s half-yearly-results press conference last week that the company was now committing to an increased Rafale production rate starting in 2018.

 

[akshay m]

so super maneuverablity is still useful in close air combat, as is TVC
unlike what many say



Indian Flankers Test British Typhoons on Exercise

Indian air force pilots (IAF) flying their Su-30MKI Flankers provided stiff opposition for a UK Royal Air Force (RAF) Eurofighter Typhoon squadron during air combat maneuvering exercises just ended in the UK. Senior officers from both the IAF and the RAF were unwilling to discuss details, but AIN understands from informed sources with knowledge of the exercise that, in close combat, the thrust vector control (TVC) on the heavier Flankers more than compensated for the greater thrust-to-weight ratio of the Typhoon. The IAF is likely to buy another 30or 40 Su-30MKIs from the licensed Indian production line, boosting its fleet to close to300, especially after last week’s formal withdrawal by Delhi of the RFP for a Medium Multi-Role Combat Aircraft (MMRCA).

For Exercise Indradhanush IV, the IAF deployed four Su-30MKIs from No 2 Squadron based at Tezpur to RAFConingsby, assisted by mid-air refueling from an IAF Ilyushin Il-78 tanker. Logistics support was provided by anIAF C-17 and a C-130J, and these transports also carried a special forces unit that exercised with its RAFcounterpart, including paradrops. Three previous exercises in the series included two visits by RAF Typhoons to India and an Su-30MKI deployment to the UK in 2007. However, that exercise was constrained by Indian security rules that precluded the use of the Flanker’s N011M passive electronically-scanned array (PESA) radar. There were no such restrictions this time, although the rules that were agreed by both air forces for the exercise included a common maximum range for beyond-visual range (BVR) engagements. The Flanker and the Typhoon both carry a long-range infrared search and track (IRST) sensor that can supplement or replace BVR detection of opposing aircraft by their respective radars.

Scenarios for the two-week exercise gradually increased in complexity, ending with an 18-aircraft mission in which the four Flankers joined six Typhoons in a ‘Blue’ Force that was tasked to escort two C-130Js (one Indian, on British) into a drop zone, opposed by six jets of a ‘Red’ Force comprising RAF Hawks and more Typhoons. Although air-to-air engagement was the main focus of the exercise, the Flanker and Typhoon pilots also honed their air-to-ground skills. Typhoons performed simulated drops of Paveway II and IV laser-guided bombs. Although the Flankers can carry a much greater range of ordnance, they simulated only ‘generic’ weapons-dropping while in the UK.

The status and timetable is not entirely clear for India's plans to upgrade the Su-30MKI fleet with an AESA radar; new displays including the Thales Topsight HMDS; and new weapons including the Indian Astra BVRAAM and theIndo-Russian Brahmos cruise missile. The ending of the MMRCA requirement could theoretically free up funds for the upgrade, and the additional licensed production, although some observers believe that more resources could be applied to the Fifth Generation Fighter Aircraft (FGFA) project with Russia, instead. Meanwhile, Dassault Aviation seems confident of a firm contract from India for 36 French-built Rafale fighters within a couple of months, in lieu of the MMRCA deal. Eric Trappier, CEO, told journalists at the company’s half-yearly-results press conference last week that the company was now committing to an increased Rafale production rate starting in 2018.


and this from another article

The Flanker pilots were also able to use their thrust-vectoring control (TVC) “super-maneuverability” capability activated by flipping a switch in the cockpit. One pilot told Aviation Week that they had used the yaw capability of the TVC to remain inside the tight turn radius of the Typhoon in order to keep the Typhoon in missile launch parameters.
http://aviationweek.com/blog/exercise-indradhanush-flankers-and-typhoons-battle-british-skies

 

[Yumdoot]

Ability to point using TVC coupled with the ability to shoot with Helmet Mounted Sights has done a lot to iron out the difficulties with bigger planes.

If on top of that you get a separate WSO then that would make things that much more relaxed for the guys on the hot seats.

Sometimes I wish we had also installed a couple of R-60 aimed straight out the rear hemisphere cued with an aft mounted reverse facing IRST. After that only a man with a death wish would have dared come near these MKIs.

 

[Mangesh]

I have seen Russian pilots doing extreme manoeuvres with sukhoi 30.But I ve never seen any Indian pilot coming even close to that.They just do some regular stunts.Is it that Indian pilots are not matching the standards of Russian or American pilots?

 

[ezsasa]

I have seen Russian pilots doing extreme manoeuvres with sukhoi 30.But I ve never seen any Indian pilot coming even close to that.They just do some regular stunts.Is it that Indian pilots are not matching the standards of Russian or American pilots?

i am of the opinion that most extreme of the stunts are usually done by Sukhoi Test pilots or Airshow pilots, not regular Air force pilots. Do post some videos where Tail number of Su30 corresponds to Russian airforce. i am open to changing my opinion based on evidence.

We should also remember that our Su30 pilots train for a two front war, considered one of the most stressful peacetime training in the world. You don't want to loose an aircraft doing gimmicks, We already have enough idiots who try to blame IAF at every opportunity possible.

As far as american pilots, they haven't had a real aircraft-aircraft combat situation since First gulf war i think!!!!!

 

[Yumdoot]

IAF pilots do all the gimmicks. Most of these air show routines are crystalized and purified forms of real life maneuvers. Seen a Su do a Pugachev's Cobra over populated township at probably 500 meters. Back in 2005/2006. Actually with post stall maneuvering you are less taxed then with the older types of stable planes pushing the envelop. Ask the numerous people who lost their lives in Gnats and Mig21s [Added later - Oh! sorry cannot ask them now ]. Most of these were put down to pilot error. Pilot error does not mean the pilot was a dumbo. Rather it implies that the goddamned aircraft and its pilot met their match in real life flying. Real life is stranger then fiction and all engineering is a fiction. The worse off are the Navy pilots unless your navy is a cold waters navy.

In post stall maneuvering your plane is just a brick controlled only by the flight control systems acting in the rocket/missile principle (only at a much more slow speeds). Most of the hard work to manage these stunts has already been carried out, tested and certified in multiple countries, even before the IAF guys get their hands on it. That is how the Russians were able to call out the cowboy attitude to the maneuvers that some IAF pilots are tracked and known to be indulging in. There was this Munje guy. Then there is a spawn of an Ex-IAF guy. This later guys is famous among ground staff for reporting problems with his Sukhoi that no other pilot would report.

I would personally regard an RSS-Sukhoi as an easier aircraft to fly compared to a stable Mig 21 or even the earlier Gnats. The flying challenge was with the earlier planes. Today the challenge is to be a good tactician (not a mere pilot) using all the sensors, weapons, flight envelop available. Earlier all you had was a gun and a lot of unpredictable weather and virtually no communication. Fly with your wits. Today you just go through the rough weather. Today the challenge is to not kill your own in all the sensor and capabilities overload. Remember what the Training-Mode-Only-Radar did to these Sukhois in Red Flag where they kept killing their own. Imagine losing your WSO or some primary sensor, in mid fight.

If you are doing circus in the air then 50% likelihood that your opponent has already achieved a mission kill on you and equally probably your life is in danger too. Best to work in ways that this gets avoided in the first place.

 

[tharun]

How many Su-30MKI are manufactured per year by HAL?
How much percentage of of plane is made in India?

 

[Yumdoot]

About 16 Su30MKIs are made per year. At least they have the installed capacity to make that many.

By Components:

February 27, 2014
http://www.business-standard.com/ar...litary-industrial-complex-114022701266_1.html
HAL started its phased manufacturing programme for the 30MkI in 2004-05. Over 2004-05 to 2012-13, HAL manufactured 174 aircraft. By 2012-13, the air frame was 100 per cent indigenous while the more complex engine was 70 per cent indigenous. This included some 1,500 highly sophisticated and complex castings and forgings - to the great surprise of Russian engineers. Today, the aircraft's overall indigenous content is around 75 per cent. A detailed plan is underway to take that to 85 per cent in 2015-16.

By Values:

24 October 2014
http://ajaishukla.blogspot.in/2014/10/first-sukhoi-30-overhauled-at-nashik.html
Says the chief of HAL’s Nashik facility, S Subrahmanyan: “More 51 per cent of the Su-30MKI by value is currently made in India, a little more than the 49 per cent agreed with Russia in the contract signed in 2000 to build 140 fighters in India.

Of the 43,000 components that go into a Su-30MKI, 31,500 components --- or 73 per cent --- are now being built in India.

Further indigenisation is blocked since the Indo-Russian contract mandates that all raw materials that goes into the Su-30MKI --- including 5,800 titanium blocks and forgings, aluminium and steel plates, etc --- must be sourced from Russia. The contract also stipulates that another 7,146 items like nuts, bolts, screws and rivets must be sourced from Russia.

HAL has also partially indigenised the Su-30MKI’s giant AL-31FP engines, which are built in Koraput, Odisha. 53 per cent of the engine by cost has been indigenised, with the remaining 47 per cent consisting of high-tech composites and special alloys --- proprietary secrets that Russia will not part with. Even so, HAL builds 87.7 per cent of the engine’s components in India.

Fairly high percentage is made in India now. Something that we will never get with western stuff.