Sukhoi Su 30MKI

Steven Rogers

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How is this possible? Su30 is still being manufactured. It started being made in 2004 and even if it has 35 year life span, the first Su30 will last till 2040 and subsequent ones will last till 2055. How can AMCA replace it?

India will use 4 planes mix - MWF, AMCA, Rafale and Su30,all of them made in India. One can say Rafale is redundant amongst these as it offers nothing special compared to AMCA or MWF. But Su30 offers special features like carrying ultra heavy payload like Brahmos missile and travelling for 3000km without refueling which is not replaceable by any other plane India possesses or intends to possess in future.
su30mki flies massively and will need massive overhaul of the earlier frames...AMCA will be inducted by 2035 and will likely replace it...
 

Vijyes

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su30mki flies massively and will need massive overhaul of the earlier frames...AMCA will be inducted by 2035 and will likely replace it...
Nothing flies massively. Su30s are not overused. They are used according to schedule and the 35 year life is based on this schedule. Mig21 which were flying for over 40 years and still flying shows how long an airframe can last

AMCA can't carry heavy weapons like Beahmos, doesn't have the massive range of Su30. AMCA is for induction by 2027-8, may be delayed to 2030. Su30 will not retire till 2040. So, it makes no sense for AMCA to replace Su30.
 

Steven Rogers

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Nothing flies massively. Su30s are not overused. They are used according to schedule and the 35 year life is based on this schedule. Mig21 which were flying for over 40 years and still flying shows how long an airframe can last

AMCA can't carry heavy weapons like Beahmos, doesn't have the massive range of Su30. AMCA is for induction by 2027-8, may be delayed to 2030. Su30 will not retire till 2040. So, it makes no sense for AMCA to replace Su30.
As per CAG they are overused than specified.
Mig21 flies because their replacement didnt came, so far Su30s replaced migs to counter numbers however the retirement of those types were sought in 90s , iaf still uses it because they didnt got the replacement in nos of the same.
Tejas LCA will carry Brahmos NG, Amca will carry stand off weapons and brahmos NG.AMCA can carry 3 tons of payload internal and 5-6 tons internal ,total payload exceeds what a su30 can carry.
A Su30 cant fly as much as a stealth aircraft with weapons and fuel internal. So far IAF officials claim that Rafale flies farther and longer than the Su30.
 

Vijyes

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As per CAG they are overused than specified.
Mig21 flies because their replacement didnt came, so far Su30s replaced migs to counter numbers however the retirement of those types were sought in 90s , iaf still uses it because they didnt got the replacement in nos of the same.
Tejas LCA will carry Brahmos NG, Amca will carry stand off weapons and brahmos NG.AMCA can carry 3 tons of payload internal and 5-6 tons internal ,total payload exceeds what a su30 can carry.
A Su30 cant fly as much as a stealth aircraft with weapons and fuel internal. So far IAF officials claim that Rafale flies farther and longer than the Su30.
It is a lie that Mig21 was sought to be replaced in 1990s. It was only fake news spread by USA aligned newspapers as India was then desperately needing IMF assistance and USA was using it to spread propaganda. One has to note that Su30 have spent several times more in storage of HAL due to spare parts shortage and hence the extra time flown is compensated here. Su30, too will fly for 35 years by that standard.

AMCA can't carry 3 ton internal payload. Even F35 with much bigger size can't carry 3 ton internally. AMCA may be expected to carry 1 ton of payload internally, mostly comprising of BVRAAM & WVRAAM.

Rafale can't fly further than Su30. Su30 has twice the quantity of internal fuel as Rafale but 1.5times the weight of Rafale. Rafale may carry external tanks to get more fuel but that will cause heavy drag and lower other payload. Su30 with internal fuel alone can travel as much as Rafale with 2 external tanks weighing 1ton each.
 

arya

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You're the only one who thinks that a mechanical airframe will outlast an electronic component :)

Name one instance when an fighter aircraft's radar had to be replaced by a new radar of the same type because the old one 'wore out' !!! Fighter aircraft engines get replaced...new engine of the same type....but radars if any are replaced ONLY for an upgrade.

The radars for Pechora etc (that see 100x operational hours per month than an aircraft) has been operational for nearly 50 years now!!!!!

Irrespective of when the upgrade starts and how long it will take to accomplish it, it makes no sense to buy new planes in old config! Why can't the new planes being built come in the new config??? Instead of the old radar they'll need to drop in a new one, instead of the old engine they need to drop in a new one!
Your are saying right but they will not accept it , question is simple when new engine , new radar ,etc avaible for SU30 MKI why buying based on old & spend money further on them
 

arya

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my question is suppose tonight Chinese planes J20 , J31, su35, su30 mkk will enter in our airspace then how will our airspace will counter them because we didnot upgraded our SU30 we didnot bought new 5th gen planes .


What was our airforce & babus was doing when chine bought SU35 , when they made j20 & soon J31 what the hell our so called defence think tanks were doing .

After 27 we are buying new missile for IAF Why because we saw our preparation is not upto level
 

arya

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It is a lie that Mig21 was sought to be replaced in 1990s. It was only fake news spread by USA aligned newspapers as India was then desperately needing IMF assistance and USA was using it to spread propaganda. One has to note that Su30 have spent several times more in storage of HAL due to spare parts shortage and hence the extra time flown is compensated here. Su30, too will fly for 35 years by that standard.

AMCA can't carry 3 ton internal payload. Even F35 with much bigger size can't carry 3 ton internally. AMCA may be expected to carry 1 ton of payload internally, mostly comprising of BVRAAM & WVRAAM.

Rafale can't fly further than Su30. Su30 has twice the quantity of internal fuel as Rafale but 1.5times the weight of Rafale. Rafale may carry external tanks to get more fuel but that will cause heavy drag and lower other payload. Su30 with internal fuel alone can travel as much as Rafale with 2 external tanks weighing 1ton each.

Do you know how many pilots lost life because of outdated Migs , Do i need to tell you numbers
 

Steven Rogers

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It is a lie that Mig21 was sought to be replaced in 1990s. It was only fake news spread by USA aligned newspapers as India was then desperately needing IMF assistance and USA was using it to spread propaganda. One has to note that Su30 have spent several times more in storage of HAL due to spare parts shortage and hence the extra time flown is compensated here. Su30, too will fly for 35 years by that standard.

AMCA can't carry 3 ton internal payload. Even F35 with much bigger size can't carry 3 ton internally. AMCA may be expected to carry 1 ton of payload internally, mostly comprising of BVRAAM & WVRAAM.

Rafale can't fly further than Su30. Su30 has twice the quantity of internal fuel as Rafale but 1.5times the weight of Rafale. Rafale may carry external tanks to get more fuel but that will cause heavy drag and lower other payload. Su30 with internal fuel alone can travel as much as Rafale with 2 external tanks weighing 1ton each.
90s mig21 replacement wasnt fake ,the first migs inducted in 60s And the last in 80s,currently the ones who fly were last made in 80s, 90 replacement sought for the replacement of migs made in 60.
Earlier Sukhois inducted in early 2000snds,and they will be replaced by amca beyond 35s and this is stated by IAF officer.

F35 on paper is over 1.2mts smaller than AMCA in length,and half a meter less width than AMCA, the internal vol on paper is also less than amca. AMCA could carry a 3ton of payload internal is stated by the head of the programme,its internal weapon bay volume will be in bw f22 and f35's.

Rafale could fly farther than Su30 in any case,it could perform missions more efficiently than Su30 due to wide array of standoff weapons,Rafale range is way higher than su30 and it is proven due to its more efficient turbo fan engines, and relatively more fuel compared to su30mki(not by volume but by relative volume) .
 
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IndianHawk

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Or rather drop the plan to acquire the fleet of mix heavy mid light. Which i guess is already dropped. Last year during a seminar,Airforce official stated that AMCA will replace the earlier Su30mkis.
This heavy medium light thing is made up bullshit and makes no sense in multirole era .
Before su30 we had no heavy fighter.

Then again in Stealth era fighter sizes are again increasing due to requirement of huge volume of internal fuel and bigger weapons bay.

I don't believe India would stop at just one stealth program. Eventually all our airforce (600-800) fighter will have to move on to become
5th-6th gen. So another stealth bird will have to come and it makes sense for that bird to be bigger than AMCA so that it can offer different capabilities than AMCA. That is why I think su57mki might still have future in iaf.

I may be wrong ofcourse.

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IndianHawk

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my question is suppose tonight Chinese planes J20 , J31, su35, su30 mkk will enter in our airspace then how will our airspace will counter them because we didnot upgraded our SU30 we didnot bought new 5th gen planes .


What was our airforce & babus was doing when chine bought SU35 , when they made j20 & soon J31 what the hell our so called defence think tanks were doing .

After 27 we are buying new missile for IAF Why because we saw our preparation is not upto level
Neither of Chinese fighters have any western air to air missiles. No meteor no aim 120c or d !

That means they have no superiority over IAF in any dimension.

J20 flies with su30 engine while being way more heavier. Without stealth engine it is not anymore Stealthy than a rafale !

We bought rafale to deal with them specifically. Su35 and if someday j20 matures with a proper engine which seems too far away given Chinese are stuck at engine tech .

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IndianHawk

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It is a lie that Mig21 was sought to be replaced in 1990s. It was only fake news spread by USA aligned newspapers as India was then desperately needing IMF assistance and USA was using it to spread propaganda. One has to note that Su30 have spent several times more in storage of HAL due to spare parts shortage and hence the extra time flown is compensated here. Su30, too will fly for 35 years by that standard.

AMCA can't carry 3 ton internal payload. Even F35 with much bigger size can't carry 3 ton internally. AMCA may be expected to carry 1 ton of payload internally, mostly comprising of BVRAAM & WVRAAM.

Rafale can't fly further than Su30. Su30 has twice the quantity of internal fuel as Rafale but 1.5times the weight of Rafale. Rafale may carry external tanks to get more fuel but that will cause heavy drag and lower other payload. Su30 with internal fuel alone can travel as much as Rafale with 2 external tanks weighing 1ton each.
Even at lesser payload than su30 AMCA can still carry 2-3 bramhos NG. Missile will also improve with time that means more range at less weight and more compact size.

So a bramhos version of 2035 might have more range than today's full fledged bramhos while having just half the weight. This will negate need of a more heavy platform.

Anyway by 2035 we'll have hypersonic weapons in arsenal which will be able to strike thousands kilometres away from Indian mainland itself thus again minimizing the need for aircrafts borne cruise missile.

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Indx TechStyle

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It is a lie that Mig21 was sought to be replaced in 1990s. It was only fake news spread by USA aligned newspapers as India was then desperately needing IMF assistance and USA was using it to spread propaganda. One has to note that Su30 have spent several times more in storage of HAL due to spare parts shortage and hence the extra time flown is compensated here. Su30, too will fly for 35 years by that standard.
MiG-21 rumour sounds logical however. Much better options had emerged against plane which we had been using for 60s.
 

HariPrasad-1

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How is this possible? Su30 is still being manufactured. It started being made in 2004 and even if it has 35 year life span, the first Su30 will last till 2040 and subsequent ones will last till 2055. How can AMCA replace it?

India will use 4 planes mix - MWF, AMCA, Rafale and Su30,all of them made in India. One can say Rafale is redundant amongst these as it offers nothing special compared to AMCA or MWF. But Su30 offers special features like carrying ultra heavy payload like Brahmos missile and travelling for 3000km without refueling which is not replaceable by any other plane India possesses or intends to possess in future.
When will we require to fire Brahmos from Sukhoi 30 is not known but we are unable to use it in Kargil nor we could use it in air raid in balakot. Praising airplanes for some hypothetical scenario in which it will Excel and ignoring the current one which Delivers at the time of requirement is not something I would like. So far as raffle and mwf is concerned that you can carry Mini Brahmos accomplish 80% of the missions which Sukhoi can perform. In coming scenarios of electronic warfare and bvr combat, rafale or MWF will be more useful than mamoth Sukhoi who are very costly to operate.
 

Shekhar Singh

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my question is suppose tonight Chinese planes J20 , J31, su35, su30 mkk will enter in our airspace then how will our airspace will counter them because we didnot upgraded our SU30 we didnot bought new 5th gen planes .


What was our airforce & babus was doing when chine bought SU35 , when they made j20 & soon J31 what the hell our so called defence think tanks were doing .

After 27 we are buying new missile for IAF Why because we saw our preparation is not upto level
Try to read all the posts for atleast two years. Then you will be able to reply. You are too naive to reply.
 

arya

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Try to read all the posts for atleast two years. Then you will be able to reply. You are too naive to reply.

Check your & my joining date of joining on this forum .

Truth is far behind from your eyes.
 

Steven Rogers

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my question is suppose tonight Chinese planes J20 , J31, su35, su30 mkk will enter in our airspace then how will our airspace will counter them because we didnot upgraded our SU30 we didnot bought new 5th gen planes .


What was our airforce & babus was doing when chine bought SU35 , when they made j20 & soon J31 what the hell our so called defence think tanks were doing .

After 27 we are buying new missile for IAF Why because we saw our preparation is not upto level
J20,j31,su35,su30mkk dosnt have the ability to cross indian air space in any time soon,rest assured.
J20 hasnt been in combat service and it is facing troubles with engine and radar,j31 has even been developed, it is only flown by test pilots and wont be ready anytime soon,su35 is not deployed in tibet bit are patrolling scs, Su30mkk/j11/j10 doesnt have the capability to cross indian air space(but that doesnt mean indian aircrafts of today can cross and enter into chinese airspace),chinese equipments have been unproven so far, and last i know their anti stealth radar which is a copy of russian radar was busted in syria by israeli f35I.
 

arya

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That's why I am saying you a "naive". Its for your experience in military matters not the forum joining date. Lol.

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ਮੈਂ ਉਦੋਂ ਹੀ ਹਾਸਾ ਕਰ ਸਕਦਾ ਹਾਂ ਜਦੋਂ ਬੱਚਾ ਮੈਨੂੰ ਸਿਖਾਉਣ ਦੀ ਕੋਸ਼ਿਸ਼ ਕਰਦਾ ਹੈ ਕਿ ਕਾਰ ਨੂੰ ਕਿਵੇਂ ਡ੍ਰਾਇਵ ਕਰਨਾ ਹੈ
मैं हंस सकता हूं जब बच्चा मुझे सिखाने की कोशिश करता है कि मैं कार कैसे चला सकता हूं


I would appreciate if you counter me with some logic. my question was about new order of su30 mki while we should buy so called super sukhoi .
 

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