Small arms and Light Weapons

[NoobWannaLearn]

Can we scrap this deal now?

 

[Love Charger]

Can we scrap this deal now?

Tweet not available tell what itvwas about

 

[NoobWannaLearn]

Tweet not available tell what itvwas about

Oh just noticed it was about ak203 deal getting more push back according to et maybe he deleted it cause it was fake news or something

 

[BlackViking]

Can we scrap this deal now?

jitna RR karna hai karlo lekin fauj ka dil aa gaya hai (Soldiers, officers alike) AK 203 par.
Aayega to wo hi.

 

[NoobWannaLearn]

jitna RR karna hai karlo lekin fauj ka dil aa gaya hai (Soldiers, officers alike) AK 203 par.
Aayega to wo hi.

Lagta to ye hi he

 

[Lonewarrior]

Can we scrap this deal now?

No
Don't forget we now have this huge responsibility of arming all those new vatniks

 

[Spadex]

Is it appropriate for this thread ?

Made by DRDO ARDE for surveillance and targeting Pakistani posts/ bunker.

 

[Spadex]

 

[Lonewarrior]

Lame in front of

Spoiler: this masterpiece

 

[MisraZ]

French ar10 type dmr VCD 10

Lebel

lebel.eu

 

[MisraZ]

Lebel ar15 type rifle VD15

 

[Automatic Kalashnikov]

French ar10 type dmr VCD 10

Lebel

lebel.eu

View attachment 176234

View attachment 176235

Is this in use with french forces? Iirc, they will be making scar H their standard DMR

 

[MisraZ]

Is this in use with french forces? Iirc, they will be making scar H their standard DMR

AFAIK it was intended for civilian market but some are used by French Law enforcement agencies.

 

[Johny_Baba]

DFI EXCLUSIVE FROM JOHNY_BABA, YOU WON'T GET THIS INFO FROM ANYWHERE!

So, do you guys know that there existed a very special "export" variant of INSAS ?!
i mean everybody knows we exported INSAS to Oman, Nepal, Swaziland etc but from all the very limited pics i've seen of these exported INSAs, they all seemed like typical 1B//1B1 pattern ones that we're also using here in our armed forces and so,

BUT BUT WAIT, as i said, there DID exist a special export variant of INSAS, yes,

aannndd it looked like...

...

...

somewhat like,

this,
View attachment 155574
...you guys must be thinking like, eh ?
but notice the handguards here, goes full length upto the gas block, and seems pinned down to front iron sight post (very Excalibur like), oh and notice front iron sight post, it's fully hooded one like that's there on chinese Type-56 and no top handguard cover above gas tube...

...hhmm but this matchbox sized pic...what to even conclude from it ?

...well i happen to have another...graphic of it ?
View attachment 155575
...so apart from things mentioned above, notice four white ;dots; around the fire selector, denoting four separate fire mods on it that must have been Safe-Semi-3 round burst and Full Auto...

furthermore, this is what the author had to say about it from where i got it,
View attachment 155576

Source = Jane's Infantry Weapons, 2000 edition,
Author = Terence "Terry" J. Gander

Now, some of my own comments - hypothesis etc,
first of all it would be really silly to even say anything from such matchbox sized pics and some lame kwality graphic and so, but being into guns things and so i could try to think some things,
> I believe this variant didn't have gas cut-off switch on it plus was not meant to launch rifle grenades from it (besides rifle grenades and things were already becoming outdated sort of things due to emergence of underbarrel grenade launchers and such things), alebit they still used same 'long pattern' muzzle device on it with probably gas rings as well so if someone had tried it back then he could've launched rifle grenades off that variant i believe, albeit with also cycling the weapon due to lack of gas cut-off
> long handguards hhmm, probably also of slimmer profile, this seems overall better idea than current INSAS pattern handguards to be honest, also the shape of handguards make me think if it was designed based on L1A1 SLR's handguards in mind or what...i mean just look at it
View attachment 155578
similar long profile, affixed with gas block at front (here screwed upon instead of using cross-pin) and has long circular-rectangular cutouts as probably air vents, on INSAS Export variant those cutouts are kinda front ahead and are 4 on each sides plus the remaining part has straight line patterned grip-design in remaining parts hhmm
> front iron sight block is of hooded one type with hole in centre for adjustments, very reminiscent to chinese Type 56's iron sight block, something like this
View attachment 155579
> rest as i mentioned before, seems like having Safe-Semi-3 round burst-Full Auto thus 4 positions on fire selectors as evident from that graphic around fire selector part


Sooo...What happened to this variant ? Did anybody adopted it ? Oman ? Swaziland ? Nepal ?
My best hypothesis regd it is,
This "INSAS Export variant" later became "INSAS Assault Rifle"...
DO NOTE that what i am saying here is NOT 1B1 but "Assault Rifle", i mean on older days of OFB there was a mention of certain "5.56mm Assault Rifle" variant of the INSAS with Semi-3 round burst and Full auto modes , for more info refer to '5.56mm Assault Rifle (Fixed Butt).pdf' in attachments,
as for INSAS they, OFB, always mentioned it as "RIFLE 5.56mm INSAS (Fixed Butt)" (or Folable Butt in that config) on their catalog on their website...

but that raises question how did this "5.56mm Assault Rifle" variant of INSAS looked now ? there exist some good enough pics of that one and here they are,
View attachment 155581
View attachment 155583
(not sure with this next pic though but judging from fire selector shape that's different from regular 1B ones i believe this one is also "5.56mm Assault Rifle" variant)
View attachment 155582

So coming back to INSAS Export variant,
my hypothesis, as i said,
This "INSAS Export variant" later became "INSAS Assault Rifle" variant...
and later "INSAS Assault Rifle" variant became bases for INSAS Excalibur and so,
so It could've happened this way, i believe,
View attachment 155584

=======================================================================

This is all the info i have gained so far regd to INSAS Export variant and some of my own thoughts-hypothesis etc,
now i need some help,
as i mentioned above the pic of INSAS Export variant was taken by certain "Terence 'Terry' John Gander",
i tried to look around and found out...
He's from the United Kingdom, worked as a Defense Journalist for years, was also affiliated with Royal Military Academy of Sandhurst, mostly wrote defense related stuff for IHS Jane's for many years, now mostly retired and lives at this address,

9 Le Bourgage
Alderney
Channel Islands
GY9 3TL

so, my personal request to anybody from the UK here, please please try to be in contact with Mr. Terry Gander and inquire about this particular export variant of the INSAS, if possible please also try to source a complete pic from him
I tried my best to contact him, i mailed to Royal Military Academy but they never responded back,
I also tried to ask my <sensei> on teligram who's into actual defense dealings and stuff, all he informed to me was that, well, Terry is now 83+ years old (probably trying to say he's retired now and too old to even bother with such petty things etc)...
but i do still want to know, he's the only person i know of who could provide some solid info about this all, and if he kicks the bucket before revealing it all, it'll be buried with him forever...
so please please please anybody from the UK here do try to reach this fella and ask around for info as well as pics he took back in 2000, my very humble request to you

So in May of this year, i posted this post for first time and since then i was thinking about making my own mspaint-basic photoshop level illustration of this said Export variant of INSAS, but goddamn life happened - i started it and left midway and kinda forget about it
but then stumbled upon it and decided this time to finish it at all cost before DefExpo22 and here it is!

DFI EXCLUSIVE FROM JOHNY_BABA! ILLUSTRATION OF EXPORT VARIANT OF INSAS CIRCA EARLY 2000s

(note that markings are also imaginary, as only these two tiny pics exist about this said variant and i had to rely on available flock of INSAS pics to consider how it could've happened, E stands for Export of course)

 

[Love Charger]

So in May of this year, i posted this post for first time and since then i was thinking about making my own mspaint-basic photoshop level illustration of this said Export variant of INSAS, but goddamn life happened - i started it and left midway and kinda forget about it
but then stumbled upon it and decided this time to finish it at all cost before DefExpo22 and here it is!

DFI EXCLUSIVE FROM JOHNY_BABA! ILLUSTRATION OF EXPORT VARIANT OF INSAS CIRCA EARLY 2000s

View attachment 176251
(note that markings are also imaginary, as only these two tiny pics exist about this said variant and i had to rely on available flock of INSAS pics to consider how it could've happened, E stands for Export of course)

I remember this, some brit journo talked about this initially

 

[Lonewarrior]

So in May of this year, i posted this post for first time and since then i was thinking about making my own mspaint-basic photoshop level illustration of this said Export variant of INSAS, but goddamn life happened - i started it and left midway and kinda forget about it
but then stumbled upon it and decided this time to finish it at all cost before DefExpo22 and here it is!

DFI EXCLUSIVE FROM JOHNY_BABA! ILLUSTRATION OF EXPORT VARIANT OF INSAS CIRCA EARLY 2000s

View attachment 176251
(note that markings are also imaginary, as only these two tiny pics exist about this said variant and i had to rely on available flock of INSAS pics to consider how it could've happened, E stands for Export of course)

And I used to think I'm the one who's most वेल्ले here

 

[Johny_Baba]

And I used to think I'm the one who's most वेल्ले here

 

[Johny_Baba]

So in May of this year, i posted this post for first time and since then i was thinking about making my own mspaint-basic photoshop level illustration of this said Export variant of INSAS, but goddamn life happened - i started it and left midway and kinda forget about it
but then stumbled upon it and decided this time to finish it at all cost before DefExpo22 and here it is!

DFI EXCLUSIVE FROM JOHNY_BABA! ILLUSTRATION OF EXPORT VARIANT OF INSAS CIRCA EARLY 2000s

View attachment 176251
(note that markings are also imaginary, as only these two tiny pics exist about this said variant and i had to rely on available flock of INSAS pics to consider how it could've happened, E stands for Export of course)

DFI EXCLUSIVE FROM JOHNY_BABA! A DESI AK THAT MOSTLY WENT UNNOTICED!

It is known to us DFIans that when it comes to desi AKs, things are quite muddy, as there are claims that we made certain AK-7 that was similar to early Bulgarian AKs we got here (Arsenal AR); then there was certain MRF-91 that allegedly made Mikhail Kalashnikov himself seethe about reeee muh kaapiroightz and so when he visited and saw it at certain defense expo
then entire INSAS line itself is an AK derivative family itself, from basic Rifle (1B, 1B1, Assault, Excalibur, Amogh, MSMC/JVPC etc) and lately we made Trichy Assault Rifle = copy of later era Bulgarian AKs from Arsenal Inc. mainly M1F41; and Ghaatak which well...i think is an offshot of INSAS in 7.62x39mm calibre (yes yes with buttstock inspired from East German MPi-KM-72 variant of AK and an aperture sight in place of notch sight of AK and handguards with picatiny rails yada yada...)

but wait,
is Ghaatak really a recent thing ?
i mean, carefully watch this pic that was posted on the forum itself BUT MOSTLY WENT UNNOTICED BY ALL MEMBERS (EXCEPT ME )

hhmm...
and if it still went unnoticed to you then refer this pic of ^above AK^ vs Ghaatak Rifle

so yeah i do believe there existed a certain ;predecessor of Ghaatak; that was manufactured by some OFB and used in small numbers by defense forces; another Desi AK here
likewise it was based on INSAS because points mentioned above in pic;

now after confirming existence of this ;predecessor; i have certain hypothesis regarding this
>1. This was actually so famed MRF-91 (probably ;later; variant of MRF-91)
So MRF-91, as i mentioned above,a desi AK that made Kalashnikov himself seethe, was made in small numbers around early 90s when armed forces decided to induct lots of AKs; and probably this one in the pic was one of them, and likewise due to lack of much pics it is hard to confirm this except this small moment where Sandeep Unnithan himself showed it in one of his vdos on tour to OFB's ;Rifle Room; in Ishapore

however there still are some noticeable differences between this said ;predecessor; and MRF-91 as evident from the video, like receiver on MRF-91 is more AK like (BUT with riveted bolt carrier rails, notice the clearly visible rivets where rails are usually affixed inside; this asks for another hypothesis ;did MRF-91 preceded INSAS itself hhmm?; ) but otherwise it does seem related somehow with this one
so for now i'm considering it this way:
MRF-91 (1st variant; in OFB Rifle Room) => INSAS => 'Ghaatak Predecessor' in the pic = ;Later Version of MRF-91 or some fork//derivative; => Ghaatak itself

>2. This was some desi INSAS based AK that preceded Ghatak
as i explained in the pic above, seems most reliable hypothesis as of now

>3.There was no ;predecessor; this is just Ghaatak with some AK stuff on it
hhmm plausible but then our guys in defense forces going this far to modify an actual newer service rifle like Ghaatak this much with getting older era AK iron sights back and putting AK handguards (with those rectangular engraving)-pistol grip etc back minus buttstock ? for what purposes ? do they even allow this much tinkering with service weapons in armed forces ?

 

[Aditya Ballal]

DFI EXCLUSIVE FROM JOHNY_BABA! A DESI AK THAT MOSTLY WENT UNNOTICED!

It is known to us DFIans that when it comes to desi AKs, things are quite muddy, as there are claims that we made certain AK-7 that was similar to early Bulgarian AKs we got here (Arsenal AR); then there was certain MRF-91 that allegedly made Mikhail Kalashnikov himself seethe about reeee muh kaapiroightz and so when he visited and saw it at certain defense expo
then entire INSAS line itself is an AK derivative family itself, from basic Rifle (1B, 1B1, Assault, Excalibur, Amogh, MSMC/JVPC etc) and lately we made Trichy Assault Rifle = copy of later era Bulgarian AKs from Arsenal Inc. mainly M1F41; and Ghaatak which well...i think is an offshot of INSAS in 7.62x39mm calibre (yes yes with buttstock inspired from East German MPi-KM-72 variant of AK and an aperture sight in place of notch sight of AK and handguards with picatiny rails yada yada...)

but wait,
is Ghaatak really a recent thing ?
i mean, carefully watch this pic that was posted on the forum itself BUT MOSTLY WENT UNNOTICED BY ALL MEMBERS (EXCEPT ME )

hhmm...
and if it still went unnoticed to you then refer this pic of ^above AK^ vs Ghaatak Rifle

so yeah i do believe there existed a certain ;predecessor of Ghaatak; that was manufactured by some OFB and used in small numbers by defense forces; another Desi AK here
likewise it was based on INSAS because points mentioned above in pic;

now after confirming existence of this ;predecessor; i have certain hypothesis regarding this
>1. This was actually so famed MRF-91 (probably ;later; variant of MRF-91)
So MRF-91, as i mentioned above,a desi AK that made Kalashnikov himself seethe, was made in small numbers around early 90s when armed forces decided to induct lots of AKs; and probably this one in the pic was one of them, and likewise due to lack of much pics it is hard to confirm this except this small moment where Sandeep Unnithan himself showed it in one of his vdos on tour to OFB's ;Rifle Room; in Ishapore

however there still are some noticeable differences between this said ;predecessor; and MRF-91 as evident from the video, like receiver on MRF-91 is more AK like (BUT with riveted bolt carrier rails, notice the clearly visible rivets where rails are usually affixed inside; this asks for another hypothesis ;did MRF-91 preceded INSAS itself hhmm?; ) but otherwise it does seem related somehow with this one
so for now i'm considering it this way:
MRF-91 (1st variant; in OFB Rifle Room) => INSAS => 'Ghaatak Predecessor' in the pic = ;Later Version of MRF-91 or some fork//derivative; => Ghaatak itself

>2. This was some desi INSAS based AK that preceded Ghatak
as i explained in the pic above, seems most reliable hypothesis as of now

>3.There was no ;predecessor; this is just Ghaatak with some AK stuff on it
hhmm plausible but then our guys in defense forces going this far to modify an actual newer service rifle like Ghaatak this much with getting older era AK iron sights back and putting AK handguards (with those rectangular engraving)-pistol grip etc back minus buttstock ? for what purposes ? do they even allow this much tinkering with service weapons in armed forces ?

Someone needs to post this great observation on social media.

 

[Aditya Ballal]

JVPC is becoming more common with the ICG. Atleast one seaborne force was competent enough to urgently replace the WW2 era Sterling’s.