Russia to the rescue of IAF, offers 21 MiG-29s to boost strength

Neil

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Russians will upgrade the legacy aircraft to the standard that India wants, say IAF sources. India currently has three squadrons of MiG-29.

New Delhi: Faced with a depleting strength, the Indian Air Force (IAF) is in talks with Russia to buy 21 MiG-29 fighter aircraft that are lying with Moscow since the late 1980s.

Top IAF sources told ThePrint that the Russians will upgrade the aircraft to the standard that India wants.

“The price offered by the Russians is good. Even though it was built at the same time when we bought the earlier MiG-29 squadrons, they have never flown,” a source said.

India currently has three squadrons of MiG-29 — a twin-engine single-seat air superiority fighter aircraft. One squadron comprises 18 aircraft.

These aircraft are currently being upgraded in-house by the IAF.

“The Russians will upgrade the 21 aircraft to the standard of the upgraded ones here. We are in talks to see how and at what price the deal can be done,” a source said.

Sources said this also rules out any additional orders for Su-30 MKI to the Hindustan Aeronautics Ltd (HAL) except for the nine aircraft that the IAF might order to replace the ones that crashed.

A high-level IAF team was in Russia last month to check on the fighter aircraft and it has submitted a favourable report to the Air Headquarters.

India was the first international customer of Russia for its MiG-29s.

Upgraded aircraft
The MiG-29 aircraft is currently going through structural as well as overall avionics upgrade, besides getting a new weapons package.

With the new air-to-air refuelling feature, an upgraded MiG-29 can cover larger distances compared to the previous legacy aircraft, something the IAF is keen on, keeping in mind the possibility of a two-front war scenario.

The upgraded MiG-29s have all the latest features, including a glass cockpit with digital screens.

The upgraded aircraft can also do air-to-ground, air-to-air and even anti-shipping operations, with the removal of several restrictions of the legacy aircraft.

Of IAF’s three MiG-29 squadrons in operation, two are at the Adampur Air Force Station while the other one is based in Jamnagar.

https://theprint.in/defence/russia-to-the-rescue-of-iaf-offers-21-mig-29s-to-boost-strength/191328/
 

HariPrasad-1

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Russians will upgrade the legacy aircraft to the standard that India wants, say IAF sources. India currently has three squadrons of MiG-29.

New Delhi: Faced with a depleting strength, the Indian Air Force (IAF) is in talks with Russia to buy 21 MiG-29 fighter aircraft that are lying with Moscow since the late 1980s.

Top IAF sources told ThePrint that the Russians will upgrade the aircraft to the standard that India wants.

“The price offered by the Russians is good. Even though it was built at the same time when we bought the earlier MiG-29 squadrons, they have never flown,” a source said.

India currently has three squadrons of MiG-29 — a twin-engine single-seat air superiority fighter aircraft. One squadron comprises 18 aircraft.

These aircraft are currently being upgraded in-house by the IAF.

“The Russians will upgrade the 21 aircraft to the standard of the upgraded ones here. We are in talks to see how and at what price the deal can be done,” a source said.

Sources said this also rules out any additional orders for Su-30 MKI to the Hindustan Aeronautics Ltd (HAL) except for the nine aircraft that the IAF might order to replace the ones that crashed.

A high-level IAF team was in Russia last month to check on the fighter aircraft and it has submitted a favourable report to the Air Headquarters.

India was the first international customer of Russia for its MiG-29s.

Upgraded aircraft
The MiG-29 aircraft is currently going through structural as well as overall avionics upgrade, besides getting a new weapons package.

With the new air-to-air refuelling feature, an upgraded MiG-29 can cover larger distances compared to the previous legacy aircraft, something the IAF is keen on, keeping in mind the possibility of a two-front war scenario.

The upgraded MiG-29s have all the latest features, including a glass cockpit with digital screens.

The upgraded aircraft can also do air-to-ground, air-to-air and even anti-shipping operations, with the removal of several restrictions of the legacy aircraft.

Of IAF’s three MiG-29 squadrons in operation, two are at the Adampur Air Force Station while the other one is based in Jamnagar.

https://theprint.in/defence/russia-to-the-rescue-of-iaf-offers-21-mig-29s-to-boost-strength/191328/
Since India has sorted out maintenance issues and state of art EW is developed for plane, AESA is now available so as integration of European missile and asrta, this plane can really pack a big punch.
 

uoftotaku

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Should do more of this as urgency will increase. Bulgaria, Poland and Serbia all have MiG-29 air frames for sale. We can raise another 2-3 Sqds worth in a short time
 

Aaj ka hero

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Should do more of this as urgency will increase. Bulgaria, Poland and Serbia all have MiG-29 air frames for sale. We can raise another 2-3 Sqds worth in a short time
May be of not the desired quality as above here it is mentioned that IAF team was in russia and was happy with the planes.
Also MIG-29 upg if I am not wrong is only available in russia and india.
 

uoftotaku

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May be of not the desired quality as above here it is mentioned that IAF team was in russia and was happy with the planes.
Also MIG-29 upg if I am not wrong is only available in russia and india.
UPG is basically what the Russians have done under SM programme for their own planes. Ours are different as we have included some indigenous and Israeli equipment rather than 100% Russian.

The quality of the donor frame is not so important as the programme as a 100% strip down and structural rebuild. Essentially the air frame is Zero Lifed to extend the flight hours. There are also deep modifications on the original air frame to add new avionics bays and fuel tanks. Any MiG-29 other than the original batch of A models (as they were structurally different) an serve as donor for upgrade.
 

Aaj ka hero

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UPG is basically what the Russians have done under SM programme for their own planes. Ours are different as we have included some indigenous and Israeli equipment rather than 100% Russian.

The quality of the donor frame is not so important as the programme as a 100% strip down and structural rebuild. Essentially the air frame is Zero Lifed to extend the flight hours. There are also deep modifications on the original air frame to add new avionics bays and fuel tanks. Any MiG-29 other than the original batch of A models (as they were structurally different) an serve as donor for upgrade.
I am saying about structure you see mig-29 upg or sm for them is completely new aircraft and only russia and india have those planes so it will be faster if we buy or talk with them.
 

Neil

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IAF wants to accept Russian offer of 21 surplus MiG-29 fighters

These 21 fighters were built in the 1980s by Russian firm, RAC MiG, for the Russian Air Force, which eventually could not muster up the money to pay for them

The under-strength Indian Air Force (IAF), already making do by extending the life of its MiG-29, Mirage 2000, and Jaguar fleet, is now evaluating an unexpected windfall from Moscow — for a brand new squadron of upgraded MiG-29 multi-role fighters.

These 21 fighters were built in the 1980s by Russian firm, RAC MiG, for the Russian Air Force, which eventually could not muster up the money to pay for them.

For three decades, these aircraft have lain unused; their wings stored separate from their bodies. Now, the IAF has been invited to buy them at the price they were built — which is below $25 million (Rs 175 crore). That is cheaper even than the Tejas Mark 1 fighter.

A high-level IAF team has returned from Russia, where we found the MiG-29s to be in excellent condition. They could make an excellent addition to our fleet and we are submitting a positive report,” said a senior air marshal who is directly involved in air force acquisitions.

The IAF inducted the MiG-29 in the late-1980s after the United States supplied the Pakistan Air Force the F-16 Falcon fighter. Since then, the IAF has operated three MiG-29 squadrons: called “First Supersonics”, “Black Archers” and “Tridents”. Two of these squadrons are based in Adampur, Punjab and the third in Jamnagar, Gujarat.


The IAF’s existing 69 MiG-29s are currently undergoing a $900 million mid-life upgrade to the MiG-29UPG standard. While the old MiG-29s were mainly twin-engine, air-superiority fighters, optimised for air-to-air combat with enemy fighters. The far more capable MiG-29UPG is a “multi-role fighter” that is also equipped and armed to strike ground targets.


In addition, with the addition of large capacity fuel tanks and mid-air refuelling capability, the IAF regards its MiG-29UPGs as long-range, multi-role fighters.

“These are without question the most capable MiG-29s flying anywhere in the world,” said the IAF air marshal.

Russia has confirmed that it will upgrade the 21 MiG-29s now being offered to the same standard as IAF’s other three MiG-29UPG squadrons. That would add another $15 million or so to each fighter’s price.

In addition to the IAF’s fleet of MiG-29UPGs, the Indian Navy operates the MiG-29K/KUB variant off the aircraft carrier, INS Vikramaditya. This variant will also fly from the INS Vikrant, when it is delivered in 2020-21.

https://www.business-standard.com/a...1-surplus-mig-29-fighters-119021300018_1.html
 

rone

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If only. USD 25m a pop and USD 15m for upgrade. USD 40 for each ''new'' aircraft or Rs 285 cr

Expensive, but Will be built from old unconstructed airframes at MiG's Lukhovitsy facility

I did't getto It in 15mil upg packge It's include new radar avoincs engine etc, in 25 Mil only mig 29 skelito..?
 

Armand2REP

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If only. USD 25m a pop and USD 15m for upgrade. USD 40 for each ''new'' aircraft or Rs 285 cr

Expensive, but Will be built from old unconstructed airframes at MiG's Lukhovitsy facility

So it is another one of those offers to complete Cold War scrap piles that have been rusting for 30 years.
 

Enquirer

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Does anyone know for sure if Mig29-UPG has fly-by-wire?

Mig-29-UPG is broadly based on Mig-29SMT, which I do not think by itself is has fly-by-wire; even though SMT version attempts to provide an upgrade package to the older Mig-29s to get them close to the ground-up-new Mig29-M variant!
 

mayfair

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The question is how much are they charging for these old frames? Then add the upgrade costs to them.

Wouldn't it be better to go for brand new frames or ever Mig 35, if the price difference is not that much?

The idiocies of the Indian babudom never fail to amuse and infuriate.
 

Enquirer

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The question is how much are they charging for these old frames? Then add the upgrade costs to them.

Wouldn't it be better to go for brand new frames or ever Mig 35, if the price difference is not that much?

The idiocies of the Indian babudom never fail to amuse and infuriate.
It's unclear what the physical offer is. These mothballed airframes were meant for Algeria, which had ordered the SMT version....which would mean that the engine should already be the new R33-3, and radar should already be the new Zhuk-ME radar.

The UPG upgrade package (which normally costed $15 to upgrade older aircraft) should now be confined to just the IFR & custom avionics - probably $5-$7 million

Net-net the total price might be around $30-$37 million a piece

The idea of buying the mothballed airframes 'at cost price' is ridiculous. These are sitting there for decades tying up space and manpower - they might have soon been discarded! The airframes should have been bargained for 50% the cost price.

It's IAF rescuing Russia, not the other way round!
 

Akshay Fenix

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Buying more SU-30 MKI would be a better deal then buying these junks at cost price.

"A high-level IAF team was in Russia lastmonth to check on the fighter aircraft and it has submitted a favourable report to the Air Headquarters"

Seems IAF is in favor of this deal, stocked up on wine and some cash from russian buddies.

And when one of these crashes, they'll just blame HAL for it. easy target.
 

IndiaRising

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Buying more SU-30 MKI would be a better deal then buying these junks at cost price.

"A high-level IAF team was in Russia lastmonth to check on the fighter aircraft and it has submitted a favourable report to the Air Headquarters"

Seems IAF is in favor of this deal, stocked up on wine and some cash from russian buddies.

And when one of these crashes, they'll just blame HAL for it. easy target.
Bhai IAF has to work within the budget they are allotted. I’m sure they want the best planes for the Air Force but where is the money? The defense budget doesn’t allow IAF to make extravagant deals unless the political class believe it’s worth it.
 

Aaj ka hero

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So it is another one of those offers to complete Cold War scrap piles that have been rusting for 30 years.
Common with the money right now we have this I think is OK deal if IAF is happy atleast I am glad HAL was not there.
 

Akshay_Fenix

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Bhai IAF has to work within the budget they are allotted. I’m sure they want the best planes for the Air Force but where is the money? The defense budget doesn’t allow IAF to make extravagant deals unless the political class believe it’s worth it.
Excuses!!!

IAF favoured Boeing for new helicopters, revised parameters 5 times : CAG

The Comptroller and Auditor General (CAG) has come down heavily on the Indian Air Force (IAF) for “aligning” its tender requirement for heavy lift choppers to suit the Boeing-manufactured Chinook, which the force finally bought in 2015.

The CAG, however, maintained that there were inadequate field evaluation trials for both the Chinook CH-47, manufactured in the US and its competitor, the Russian Mi-26.

In a paragraph titled “ASQRs (Air Staff Qualitative Requirements) aligned to Chinook”, the audit has noted that though the existing Mi-26 helicopters were to be replaced with new heavy-lift helicopters (HLH), “the parameters formulated for procurement were much lower”.



The max payload capacity was reduced to 11,000 kgs as against the 20,000 kgs of Mi 26 helicopters. Seating capacity was also reduced to 45 troops as against the 82 troops of Mi-26 helicopters,” the CAG report says.

“The max underslung load was reduced to 10,000 kgs as against the underslung load capacity of 20,000 kgs of Mi-26 helicopter.”

The CAG report notes that the “revised ASQR parameters matched those of the Chinook helicopter”, adding that the Ministry of Defence (MoD) did not contest the fact that the ASQRs were aligned to Chinook helicopter.

The report further notes that during the FET (Field Evaluation Trials), the Chinook helicopter did not meet eight critical ASQR parameters while the Mi-26 did not meet five ASQR parameters.


ASQR revised five times ::

The CAG report states that the ASQR parameters were revised five times between 2006 and 2009. Thus the ASQRs were being drafted in consultation with the vendors “or in other words were being modified according to what was offered by them rather than the user need”.

The primary objective of these helicopters was to provide heavy lift support to the Army for its combat operation.

The CAG noted that there was a large difference between the payload capacity of Mi-26 helicopter and CH-47.

The Mi-26 helicopter is capable of carrying 20 tonnes in a single drop mission as against the payload of 11 tonnes by the CH-47 helicopter. Seating capacity of Mi-26 helicopter is 82 with fully equipped troops whereas the seating capacity of CH-47 Chinook is only 45.

Thus, for transporting weapons, equipment and men to support combat operation, the CH-47 would have to make double the trips as compared to the Mi-26 helicopter.

https://theprint.in/defence/iaf-fav...opters-revised-parameters-5-times-cag/192200/


All the parameter got changed, just so the IAF could get fancy toys.

When it comes to tejas/ in-house products they keep on adding more and more parameters keeping the indegeneous product in the development stage for eternity but everything is good and dandy when it comes to foreign maal.

And when you don't fulfill their demands, they do press conferences; crying to the media about how the government is mean and doesn't care about squadron short fall. :crying:
 

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