Modernisation of Indian Army Infantry

[COLDHEARTED AVIATOR]

Umm no... the deal comes with SIG built optics as a package. Along with Magpull made furniture for the stock, the foregrip, the pistol grip and some others. Will try to get some details

looking forward to some link.

it would be dumb decsiond to not order accessories.

 

[Vande1947]

Accessories will have to be ordered separately. This deal doesn’t even include sights, rifles will
Be delivered in basic stripped down version, maybe in 10
Years they’ll get some additional items for frontline units.

Expecting these clowns in IA procurement and MOD to deliver world class ready for operations equipment is delusional.

Are our negotiators that dumb or that corrupt? In either case, there must be some oversight before such a deal is signed off.At least, I hope so

 

[abingdonboy]

Umm no... the deal comes with SIG built optics as a package. Along with Magpull made furniture for the stock, the foregrip, the pistol grip and some others. Will try to get some details

That is not my understanding.

There was an entirely separate RFI that the IA issued for third party optics and accessories.

 

[abingdonboy]

Are our negotiators that dumb or that corrupt? In either case, there must be some oversight before such a deal is signed off.At least, I hope so

Please probably a bit of both.


Why else does the IA keep running abroad for every nut and bolt? They literally import their shoes!

I’m sure a lot of “fun” was had when selection team
Went around the world to US, UAE, Australia etc for this tender. Seriously aren’t interested in travelling to a corner of India are they?

What else explains why the world’s 3rd largest military KEEPS breaking up every SINGLE deal? Need 12 -18 SSK? That will mean they got
For 2 6 unit deals decades apart with a cost escalation in the billions. Same
For fighters, same for tanks, same for rifles, look at this deal, total requirement is in the 100,000s and we are supposed to
Cheer for maybe 10% requirement being filled?

More deals, more opportunity for all expenses paid trips, wining and dining and sadly, kickbacks.

No other explanation for this sh!t.


No other professional military operates like this. They have a single requirement that is met by a single solution. In India 2-3 different solutions for a single requirement. Economies of scale, what is that?

And then military has the b@lls to start blaming PSUs for all their problems.

 

[binayak95]

Please probably a bit of both.


Why else does the IA keep running abroad for every nut and bolt? They literally import their shoes!

I’m sure a lot of “fun” was had when selection team
Went around the world to US, UAE, Australia etc for this tender. Seriously aren’t interested in travelling to a corner of India are they?

What else explains why the world’s 3rd largest military KEEPS breaking up every SINGLE deal? Need 12 -18 SSK? That will mean they got
For 2 6 unit deals decades apart with a cost escalation in the billions. Same
For fighters, same for tanks, same for rifles, look at this deal, total requirement is in the 100,000s and we are supposed to
Cheer for maybe 10% requirement being filled?

More deals, more opportunity for all expenses paid trips, wining and dining and sadly, kickbacks.

No other explanation for this sh!t.


No other professional military operates like this. They have a single requirement that is met by a single solution. In India 2-3 different solutions for a single requirement. Economies of scale, what is that?

And then military has the b@lls to start blaming PSUs for all their problems.

YAWWNNN !!! Have heard this drivel so many gods damn times that I am tired of it.

Were military acquisitions in the past decades corrupt? FUCK YES. Look at the T90 deal !

But then also look at our fucking awesome Political leadership who shoved down Soviet deals down our throats because it suited their purposes - (T72, MiG21, MiG 23, MiG 29, BMPs, Su30) and also go to HEIGHTS to appease the voter base of DPSU unions.

Has the situation improved - a bit - barely. Pvt companies who want to make guns (IWI-Punj and MKU-Caracal) are ACTIVELY lobbied against by Babus and DPSU unions and furthermore, the rules are stacked against them.

DPSUs make SHIT. Literally SHIT. Ever worn an OFB made sweater, a Drill shoe, a jungle boot? Ever fired an orange furnitured INSAS from Kanpur, watch in horror as it blows up in your hands? I HAVE.

HAL - the evidence was given yesterday itself and a few weeks before when a brand SPANKING new Su30MKI crashed before delivery.

Arjun itself is plagued with issues of spares and their availability. Inspite of being a fine tank.

And then you have the gall of blaming the services for not trusting DPSU made products.

Gods know how many hundreds of men have died because of faulty landmines (400 casualties due to this in Op Parakram), badly made 'nades, MISERABLY manufactured assault rifles, poorly sealed arty shells. Has any fucking employee ever been held accountable? NO!

Speak to any service personnel and he'll repeat this story. From ANY service.

And I haven't even gone into the horror story of what happened to the IPKF.

 

[mohitbhagat]

Has IA given any chance to these local
Efforts? OFB 7.62 met 99% of their criteria.

From day one (1990s) the IA has moaned and b!tched about INSAS. They made ZERO effort to work with industry and when solutions have come they have put them through absurd testing regimes.


Why has CRPF accepted JVPC, Excalibur etc and IA still happy with 1920s era 9mm carbines?

In the search for the best army will reject anything and everything indian entites offer up to them. Even if it’s not 100% perfection I’m sure JVPC or AMOGH will be better than the 9mm carbine they are still having to use.

Actually IA was always clear minded when it came to carbines. They wanted to replace it with something in 5.56 nato. They might have changed from multi cal to 7.62 nato to an Ak platform for assault rifle but never changed for carbine.
OFB & DRDO should have kept the Micws project going on with further and further refinenment. MCIWS was a promising platform and you just can't perfect a weapon in short period of time. If they would have continued with that project we might have had MCIWS for our carbine purposes and if not for Frontline troops or the odd 94k car816 we would have atleast got 3.6 lakhs of MCIWS carbine for our military. And who knows our entire military would have been inducting a single platform for 5.56 nato, 7.62×39 and even 7.62 nato requirements

 

[mohitbhagat]

YAWWNNN !!! Have heard this drivel so many gods damn times that I am tired of it.

Were military acquisitions in the past decades corrupt? FUCK YES. Look at the T90 deal !

But then also look at our fucking awesome Political leadership who shoved down Soviet deals down our throats because it suited their purposes - (T72, MiG21, MiG 23, MiG 29, BMPs, Su30) and also go to HEIGHTS to appease the voter base of DPSU unions.

Has the situation improved - a bit - barely. Pvt companies who want to make guns (IWI-Punj and MKU-Caracal) are ACTIVELY lobbied against by Babus and DPSU unions and furthermore, the rules are stacked against them.

DPSUs make SHIT. Literally SHIT. Ever worn an OFB made sweater, a Drill shoe, a jungle boot? Ever fired an orange furnitured INSAS from Kanpur, watch in horror as it blows up in your hands? I HAVE.

HAL - the evidence was given yesterday itself and a few weeks before when a brand SPANKING new Su30MKI crashed before delivery.

Arjun itself is plagued with issues of spares and their availability. Inspite of being a fine tank.

And then you have the gall of blaming the services for not trusting DPSU made products.

Gods know how many hundreds of men have died because of faulty landmines (400 casualties due to this in Op Parakram), badly made 'nades, MISERABLY manufactured assault rifles, poorly sealed arty shells. Has any fucking employee ever been held accountable? NO!

Speak to any service personnel and he'll repeat this story. From ANY service.

And I haven't even gone into the horror story of what happened to the IPKF.

The thing with we Indians is that we want everything best for our personal uses from clothes to cosmetics and from cars to mobile phones. When it comes to the public they get what they find the best whether its foreign maal or not but when it comes to the armed forces they want the military to adopt any shit our public sector makes.

 

[mohitbhagat]

That is not my understanding.

There was an entirely separate RFI that the IA issued for third party optics and accessories.

RFI always gets cancelled and so on. Either way the rfi was for 16k telescopic scopes for 7.62 nato rifles. But the thing is Sig is one manufacturer who offers a complete weapons solution. And they make one hell of a accessories. All top quality stuffs. So it would be wise to get these from the sig itself, it increases the chances of heavy discounts and fast procurement

 

[WolfPack86]

DAC approves acquisition of 5000 Milan 2T ATGMs for #IndianArmy It has tandem HEAT warhead capable to defeat 880 mm RHAe . 2T version developed to defeat ERA enforced tanks. IMO , from

and

tanks only VT-4 and Type-99 B (not deployed against

) can stand against it.

 

[Gessler]

Some more pics of Kalashnikov AK-203 (or equivalent tech) proposed for IA:

Folding + Collapsible stock is now standard kit:

--

• Better build quality (hope OFB won't fuck it up)
• Long 12'o clock rail integrated into dust cover

(No need for stupid riser modules and shoddy tack-ons of sights like BEL does)

• Flip-up pivoted dust cover.

(Familiar to use for AK operators, also helps retain sight zero much better than old AK covers)

• Quad-railed handguard

(12'o clock for using day+night sight combos, 3 & 9 for flashlights, laser, 6'o clock for grips)

• Ergonomic Pistol grip
• Improved Fire selector lever
• Folding + Collapsible Lightweight Stock
• Improved Flash hider
• Redesigned 90-degree gas port
• Original AK sight picture for when using irons is retained, thanks to lack of full-length rail

(Potentially useful for users of AK who are very accustomed to the current AKM/Eastern
European copies)

A quantum leap over our existing AKs. The things we would have only gotten had we paid for an aftermarket (and pretty expensive) upgrade kit are now standard features on the weapon.

 

[Prashant12]

PM Narendra Modi might soon inaugurate Russian AK-47/203 rifle manufacturing factory in Uttar Pradesh

New Delhi: Make in India is taking off. Prime Minister Narendra Modi is likely to inaugurate a new factory in Korwa, near Amethi, in Uttar Pradesh, on February 28 for the manufacture of Russian designed AK-47/203 rifles in India.

The plant will initially manufacture 7.47 lakh rifles for the Armed forces and then, for the Central police forces. Eventually, perhaps 2 million (or 20 lakh) rifles will be manufactured here.

The Defence Ministry’s proposal is already before the Cabinet Committee on Security (CCS) headed by the Prime Minister and is likely to be cleared very shortly. A joint venture involving the Indian authorities and Kalashnikov, the manufacturers of the world’s most popular assault rifle, is likely in about a week.

For a considerable while now, the Centre has spoken of Make in India. This factory will provide enough assault rifles to cater to the demand of the Armed forces. The Army, particularly the infantry, has been asking for new weapons and a decision to buy state-of-the-art rifles from Sig Sauer and then, carbines, have already been taken. But only a limited number will be bought from Sig Sauer, the deal being valued at Rs 647 crore.

For the entire army, now of over 1 million men, the Kalashnikov will be the standard weapon. The Russian government has also been very supportive of the project. So far, the Kalashnikovs used by the armed forces have been imported. Now, beginning with perhaps the first 50 rifles, that could be “dedicated” to the nation, the Indian Army and then, the other security forces will be using rifles, designed in Russia, but certainly, made in India.

https://www.timesnownews.com/india/...manufacturing-factory-in-uttar-pradesh/362042

 

[Pandeyji]

Just hope they don't kill of indigenous firearms R&D in the processrison:

 

[Prashant12]

Army commences induction of new sniper rifles along LoC


Udhampur (J&K), Feb 7 (PTI) The Indian Army has started the induction of new sniper rifles along the Line of Control in Jammu and Kashmir, a top army officer said.

Under the General Officer Commander-in-Chief of Northern Command's special financial power, the Army floated tenders for procurement of 5,719 sniper rifles from global vendors in January.

"We have been able to commence the induction of the new sniper rifles (along LoC with Pakistan) and some more are still in the pipeline", General Officer Commanding in Chief (GoC-in-C), Lt Gen Ranbir Singh told PTI in reply to a question.

He was asked when the Army will be inducting 5,719 sniper rifles from global vendors to replace Soviet-era Dragonov SVD as global tenders have already been floated.
The Army commander said some of these equipments have been received and some are likely to come in next some time.

Lt Gen Singh said that upgradation of weaponry is an ongoing exercise.
"Other equipments which enhances our counter terrorism capability is also being inducted. The capability building is in the pipeline", he said.

As per the reports, soldiers guarding the LoC are being armed with deadly new sniper rifles, including an anti-material rifle that can go through concrete and metal objects, such as vehicles.
The guns being given to the soldiers are the .338 Lapua Magnum Scorpio TGT by Beretta, and the .50 Calibre M95 by Barrett. These snipers will replace the ageing Russian Dragunov, the mainstay of Indian soldiers.

Army chief General Bipin Rawat had said last month that "the Northern Command of the Indian Army taking care of the borders with Pakistan and some parts of Line of Actual Control is soon going to be equipped with the new sniper rifles from this month."

The US-made Barrett M95 is an anti-material rifle which has a whopping range of 1,800 metres.
The other gun that will be available to the troops along the LoC is the Victrix Armaments .338 Lapua Magnum Scorpio TGT, owned by Italian firm Beretta.The Scorpio TGT uses the .338 Lapua Magnum (8.6×70mm or 8.58×70mm), a rimless, bottlenecked, centre-fire rifle cartridge, reports added. PTI AB CK

https://www.theweek.in/wire-updates/national/2019/02/07/des63-jk-snipers.html

 

[sthf]

Please probably a bit of both.


Why else does the IA keep running abroad for every nut and bolt? They literally import their shoes!

ANKLE BOOTS FOR RS 2,900: ORDNANCE FACTORIES FLEECE SOLDIERS

http://www.indiandefensenews.in/2017/03/ankle-boots-for-rs-2900-ordnance.html

Only 2 Out Of 8 'Made In India' High-Altitude Clothing Gear Meet Indian Army’s Standard

https://www.indiatimes.com/news/ind...-gear-meet-indian-army-s-standard-361602.html

==========================

Yep, no need to import.

Monoply - Monopolies are thus characterized by a lack of economic competition to produce the good or service, a lack of viable substitute goods, and the possibility of a high monopoly price well above the seller's marginal cost that leads to a high monopoly profit.[3] The verb monopolise or monopolize refers to the process by which a company gains the ability to raise prices or exclude competitors. In economics, a monopoly is a single seller. In law, a monopoly is a business entity that has significant market power, that is, the power to charge overly high prices.[4]

 

[Prashant12]

Defence Ministry: India signs contract for acquiring 72,000 Sig Sauer Assault Rifles for the Indian Army under fast-track procedures.

 

[Prashant12]

Centre clears making 7.47 lakh Kalashnikovs in India. Inter-governmental agreement on Feb 15. Joint venture agreement on Feb 19. Inauguration likely by PM Modi on Feb 28

 

[ezsasa]

Centre clears making 7.47 lakh Kalashnikovs in India. Inter-governmental agreement on Feb 15. Joint venture agreement on Feb 19. Inauguration likely by PM Modi on Feb 28

Does this mean CQB tender cancelled?

 

[Gessler]

Does this mean CQB tender cancelled?

What does one have to do with the other?

 

[ezsasa]

What does one have to do with the other?

I was expecting 5.5 Insas replacement, as per my earlier calculation...

Then again this could be inclusive of central and police forces.

 

[Aaj ka hero]

Only 2 Out Of 8 'Made In India' High-Altitude Clothing Gear Meet Indian Army’s Standard

Sirji you are saying like every foreign country every company is already qualified.
I can't understand what is the problem atleast two met standard.