Modernisation of Indian Army Infantry

[Automatic Kalashnikov]

What happened to the carbine deal?

 

[NotASussyBoi]

What happened to the carbine deal?

stuck in limbo

 

[shuvo@y2k10]

The 5.56 mm carbine deal is stuck in limbo. Don't expect any progress in near future.

The AK-203 deal is already signed, and factory is set-up in Amethi. However, the production is yet to begin. Though there is very little chance of any progress till the dust over Ukraine war settles down, but still this has better prospects than thje 5.56 carbine. Thus, the carbine role in Infantry squad, will most likely be taken up by AK-203, while 7.62*51 mm rifle will be the mainstray.

As far as Sig-716 deal is concerned there are too many conflicting reports. One is saying deal is cancelled, another one is saying it is on. Now one knows for sure.

I would say that there exists a good window of oppurtunity for SSS to pitch in their P-72 or AR based rifles in 7.62*51mm, as a Sig-716 alternative.

LMG role will be taken up by Negev (16k brought recently), to be complemented by 40K numbers (whose deal will most likely be of ARDE LMG to be manufacture by a pvt sector company).

 

[AUSTERLITZ]

Carbine can be AK-203 or P-72 recon carbine or Galil ace 7.62 x39 carbine.As long as AK-203 and carbine has same ammo.

 

[shuvo@y2k10]

The future of JVPC and Asmi also looks bleaks. JVPC has cleared army trials. However, their seems to no interst whatsoever in inducting it in numbers. Only few purchases from state police and CAPFs.

 

[AUSTERLITZ]

The future of JVPC and Asmi also looks bleaks. JVPC has cleared army trials. However, their seems to no interst whatsoever in inducting it in numbers. Only few purchases from state police and CAPFs.

JVPC would be very good for NSG,CQB police and vehicle crews/arty.

 

[fooLIam]

What happened theaterization plans of Indian armed forecs. No recent news?
Is it supposed to be this slow?

 

[Fire and groove]

You will inevitably close in on the enemy. Therefore it doesn't hurt to have some AKs or a similar weapon in the section.

Additionally you need UBGLs which Sig 716i or any other free floating rifle so far has yet to deploy.

True, but if you're closing the distance you've probably won the engagement and are trying to secure the objective from a superior tactical position anyway. In the end, you can't have everything with your weapons. In any other instance where mountains weren't a major equation a standard issue battle-rifle would be stupid, but here it makes sense.
The grenadier issue can be resolved through issuing seperate GL platforms. It's better to have a seperate launcher anyway, UBGLs add weight to the weapon, require handguard space for a leaf sight and make patrols a hassle. With a seperate GL, a grenadier can shoot without fatiguing himself too badly and still have a launcher handy.

 

[vampyrbladez]

True, but if you're closing the distance you've probably won the engagement and are trying to secure the objective from a superior tactical position anyway. In the end, you can't have everything with your weapons. In any other instance where mountains weren't a major equation a standard issue battle-rifle would be stupid, but here it makes sense.
The grenadier issue can be resolved through issuing seperate GL platforms. It's better to have a seperate launcher anyway, UBGLs add weight to the weapon, require handguard space for a leaf sight and make patrols a hassle. With a seperate GL, a grenadier can shoot without fatiguing himself too badly and still have a launcher handy.

The Indian Army uses the Milkor MGL but that just adds more weight to the individual soldier and is quite cumbersome.

When deploying a squad in the form of fire teams to flank and destroy an enemy hardpoint you need mobility.

Having a rifle attached UBGL allows for less perceived recoil and an actual weapon to shoot back with at the enemy instead of having to switch to your primary.

Since engagement distance for such an assault will be 50-100 m, you can use the AK's own rifle iron sights to mark out targets.

 

[AUSTERLITZ]

Interesting thing is army is issuing bipods to a number of SIGs - a quasi SAW?
Lets say 2 bipod mounted SIGs plus a Negev LMG per squad in mountains.(as per data only plains battalions have 2 LMG) that could mean fire section with one Negev supporting assault section divided into 2 fireteams each with their bipod mounted sig.

 

[JConline]

Interesting thing is army is issuing bipods to a number of SIGs - a quasi SAW?
Lets say 2 bipod mounted SIGs plus a Negev LMG per squad in mountains.(as per data only plains battalions have 2 LMG) that could mean fire section with one Negev supporting assault section divided into 2 fireteams each with their bipod mounted sig.

Not a quasi SAW but probably a DMR role for the SIGs.

 

[AUSTERLITZ]

Not a quasi SAW but probably a DMR role for the SIGs.

DMR may not require Bipod,but firing SIG in automatic short bursts would require bipod for sure.

 

[Aditya Ballal]

You will inevitably close in on the enemy. Therefore it doesn't hurt to have some AKs or a similar weapon in the section.

Additionally you need UBGLs which Sig 716i or any other free floating rifle so far has yet to deploy.

The issue for UBGLs on the SIG 716 is do the regulars have any UBGL that attaches via Picatinny rails.

 

[vampyrbladez]

Interesting thing is army is issuing bipods to a number of SIGs - a quasi SAW?
Lets say 2 bipod mounted SIGs plus a Negev LMG per squad in mountains.(as per data only plains battalions have 2 LMG) that could mean fire section with one Negev supporting assault section divided into 2 fireteams each with their bipod mounted sig.

Bipods are only used for DMR. Using Sig 716i as a SAW is a good way to burn out the barrel.

 

[vampyrbladez]

The issue for UBGLs on the SIG 716 is do the regulars have any UBGL that attaches via Picatinny rails.

No. The shearing effect on the picatinny rail adaptor over time on the MLOK will cause canting on the barrel shroud over time.

 

[ezsasa]

Finally.. EoI for manpack SDR for infantry .. it's a start..
anyone tracking SDR developments, how much deviation is there from products already available within the country?

https://indianarmy.nic.in/writereaddata/RFI/837/Sigs5EoI240522.pdf

 

[Fire and groove]

Finally.. EoI for manpack SDR for infantry .. it's a start..
anyone tracking SDR developments, how much deviation is there from products already available within the country?

View attachment 157686

https://indianarmy.nic.in/writereaddata/RFI/837/Sigs5EoI240522.pdf

300 seems pretty low.

 

[rkhanna]

300 seems pretty low.

Prototype development and testing. Will take years before we see them in the field

 

[Kumaoni]

Not sure where this is supposed to go. But the Indian Army was actually outgunned by the LTTE in Sri Lanka.

 

[Kumaoni]

Yet they still managed to capture the Jaffna City from a veteran insurgent group, arguably the most battle hardened in the world, in just two weeks. The Indian army had never fought Urban Guerillas before, and the LTTE had just bloodied the Sri Lankan Army from these very positions.

To put into context, it took the USA, British, and Iraqmore than a month to capture Fallujah in 2004, against an arguably less hardened insurgent force with a technological advantage in firepower.

Not bashing the Americans here, Fallujah 2004 was a brilliantly executed operation and the Marines fought absolutely brilliantly, achieving an amazinf kill ratio, but that’s just to prove into perspective how underrated the Indian Army can really be.

Contrary to hearsay, both official and unofficial, the IPKF performed valiantly in its tasks.

Source: The IPKF in Sri Lanka, 1987-1990 report by an American Major.