MMRCA 2.0: News & Discussions

IndianHawk

Senior Member
Joined
Sep 24, 2016
Messages
9,058
Likes
37,675
Country flag
Why china is not taking back taiwan? Answer is why saudi, uae is not fighting Israel. The USA factor. And dont ask me not to bring USA.Its a reality.
Doklam, they have roads there.
This is last on china here as it's getting off topic. Israel destroyed all Arab airforce in just 6days.
USA is not treaty bound to defend Taiwan as of now. What is china waiting for ?? Also they can build all the road till where they were before. We also have road all over chumbi valledy and tawang. Fact is they were in no position to fight. Take it to some china tread if you wish further discussion.
 

Hydra3

Tihar Jail
Banned
Joined
Mar 10, 2020
Messages
368
Likes
173
Country flag
Fuck off Paki ******! We know your false flag narrative post the Balakot thread!
First of all i am not a pakistani, secondly no afro american is exist pakistan & your know how on anthropology is very poor, go and get educated. Thirdly you are a fucking racists.
Go and fuck your dick or every dick you meat in street.
 

Hydra3

Tihar Jail
Banned
Joined
Mar 10, 2020
Messages
368
Likes
173
Country flag
Fuck off Paki ******! We know your false flag narrative post the Balakot thread!
I want to add one more thing, i never had any different opinion on balakot strike what i differed on the the 27th incident, the incident we lost our face infront of the international community.
 

varun9509

Regular Member
Joined
Aug 12, 2017
Messages
555
Likes
2,001
Country flag
I want to add one more thing, i never had any different opinion on balakot strike what i differed on the the 27th incident, the incident we lost our face infront of the international community.
Paint your face black however you like. No one gives a crap about you.

I will salute each and every Air Warriror who fought that day, and displayed valour like no one.

BHARAT MATA KI JAI!!!!!
 

IndianHawk

Senior Member
Joined
Sep 24, 2016
Messages
9,058
Likes
37,675
Country flag
I want to add one more thing, i never had any different opinion on balakot strike what i differed on the the 27th incident, the incident we lost our face infront of the international community.
A mig21 shot down an f16 . We gained tremendous respect. That's why porky jets didn't dare fly when we took away Kashmiri autonomy. They knew there f16 are useless.
 

Fulcrum29

New Member
Joined
Mar 31, 2020
Messages
3
Likes
4
Country flag
J-9 - look at the air intake



Lavi


J-10


Seems Lavi and J10 have more similarities.
To be honest, looking similar on the outside doesn't mean much, externally, the StG-44 and AK-47 look very similar, but field strip them and you'll see something radically different!
Still, I guess that the J-10 has taken some inspiration from the Lavi, but not only; after all, it was a time during which the US had increasingly good relations with China (there was even a program called "Peace Pearl", if I'm not mistaken, in which the USA would help modernising the Chinese air force, but it was abandoned due to Tiananmen), and the PLA was lookng into ways to modernise its J-7s and 8s as well.
So, I'm fairly sure the J-10 has DNA from all of these planes.
 

Chain smoker

Regular Member
Joined
Mar 25, 2020
Messages
106
Likes
408
Country flag
To be honest, looking similar on the outside doesn't mean much, externally, the StG-44 and AK-47 look very similar, but field strip them and you'll see something radically different!
Still, I guess that the J-10 has taken some inspiration from the Lavi, but not only; after all, it was a time during which the US had increasingly good relations with China (there was even a program called "Peace Pearl", if I'm not mistaken, in which the USA would help modernising the Chinese air force, but it was abandoned due to Tiananmen), and the PLA was lookng into ways to modernise its J-7s and 8s as well.
So, I'm fairly sure the J-10 has DNA from all of these planes.
China also copied black hawk helicopter which they got before massacre.
 

Ajax01

Regular Member
Joined
Feb 29, 2020
Messages
360
Likes
1,183
Country flag
To be honest, looking similar on the outside doesn't mean much, externally, the StG-44 and AK-47 look very similar, but field strip them and you'll see something radically different!
Still, I guess that the J-10 has taken some inspiration from the Lavi, but not only; after all, it was a time during which the US had increasingly good relations with China (there was even a program called "Peace Pearl", if I'm not mistaken, in which the USA would help modernising the Chinese air force, but it was abandoned due to Tiananmen), and the PLA was lookng into ways to modernise its J-7s and 8s as well.
So, I'm fairly sure the J-10 has DNA from all of these planes.
Exterior design has direct bearing on a fighter kinematic and aerodynamic performance unlike a gun where internal mechanism is important. Interior of an aircraft has the sensory package , flight control electronics and the likes . In this case they are almost carbon copies.
 

Srinivas_K

Senior Member
Joined
Jun 17, 2009
Messages
7,442
Likes
13,025
Country flag
To be honest, looking similar on the outside doesn't mean much, externally, the StG-44 and AK-47 look very similar, but field strip them and you'll see something radically different!
Still, I guess that the J-10 has taken some inspiration from the Lavi, but not only; after all, it was a time during which the US had increasingly good relations with China (there was even a program called "Peace Pearl", if I'm not mistaken, in which the USA would help modernising the Chinese air force, but it was abandoned due to Tiananmen), and the PLA was lookng into ways to modernise its J-7s and 8s as well.
So, I'm fairly sure the J-10 has DNA from all of these planes.
You forgot to mention that Chinese approached Israel and copied their design in your post and try to white wash the chinese doings.

https://nationalinterest.org/blog/buzz/chinas-f-16-meet-j-10-fighter-possibly-thanks-israel-48727

China goods mostly means copy and pirate . Off late they are coming up some products of their own, but by the time the J10 was in developing stage they are pirating, copying and stealing designs all around the world including Russian ones.
 

vampyrbladez

Senior Member
Joined
Jun 21, 2018
Messages
10,282
Likes
26,666
Country flag
I want to add one more thing, i never had any different opinion on balakot strike what i differed on the the 27th incident, the incident we lost our face infront of the international community.
Paki ******s like you scream in pain as you stab us in the back! I'd bet money you're either an Islamist or Commie here for 'turning' this forum! Fat chance ******!
 

vampyrbladez

Senior Member
Joined
Jun 21, 2018
Messages
10,282
Likes
26,666
Country flag
To be honest, looking similar on the outside doesn't mean much, externally, the StG-44 and AK-47 look very similar, but field strip them and you'll see something radically different!
Still, I guess that the J-10 has taken some inspiration from the Lavi, but not only; after all, it was a time during which the US had increasingly good relations with China (there was even a program called "Peace Pearl", if I'm not mistaken, in which the USA would help modernising the Chinese air force, but it was abandoned due to Tiananmen), and the PLA was lookng into ways to modernise its J-7s and 8s as well.
So, I'm fairly sure the J-10 has DNA from all of these planes.


I'll just leave this here.

Also....

STAY ON TOPIC!
 

MIDKNIGHT FENERIR-00

VICTORIOUM AUT MORS
Senior Member
Joined
Oct 27, 2019
Messages
3,107
Likes
10,293
A mig21 shot down an f16 . We gained tremendous respect. That's why porky jets didn't dare fly when we took away Kashmiri autonomy. They knew there f16 are useless.
They didn’t fly because we have Nukes and We will Rape them in a All out War and GayRan Khan even accepted that.
 

MIDKNIGHT FENERIR-00

VICTORIOUM AUT MORS
Senior Member
Joined
Oct 27, 2019
Messages
3,107
Likes
10,293
Paki ******s like you scream in pain as you stab us in the back! I'd bet money you're either an Islamist or Commie here for 'turning' this forum! Fat chance ******!
Calm Down bro! We need to chill with N word and Shift towards Monkey or Bitch. Porkis Aren’t Africans they are Pedo Worshiping Sand Monkeys. Even if you Say N word call them Sand ******s.
 

MIDKNIGHT FENERIR-00

VICTORIOUM AUT MORS
Senior Member
Joined
Oct 27, 2019
Messages
3,107
Likes
10,293
How Egypt Ruined the MiG-23 and Compromised Soviet Aerial Warfare Capabilities: President Anwar Sadat's Cold War Betrayal

March-29th-2020


MiG-23 Flogger Swept Wing Fighters and Egyptian President Anwar Sadat

Following the overthrow of its Western aligned monarchy in 1952 Egypt emerged as a leading client for Soviet armaments, acquiring 80 MiG-15 fighters and 30 IL-28 bombers in an initial batch of purchases made in 1955 alongside equipment for the country's ground forces such as T-34 and IS-3 tanks and a range of artillery and armoured transports. This single purchase accounted for 85 percent of all weaponry shipped to the Middle East in the five year period from 1951-1956, and when supplemented with Soviet training it quickly turned the country into a leading military power unrivalled among African or Arab states. Egypt would subsequently receive new generations of combat jets, which for its Air Force included newer MiG-17, MiG-19 and MiG-21 fighters, Su-17 strike fighters and Tu-16 medium bombers - providing it with one of the most capable air wings in the world.


Egyptian Chief of Staff Saad Al Shazly

Egypt was able to afford this massive arsenal due largely to Soviet aid, regarding which the chief of staff of the Egyptian armed forces Saad Al Shazly noted in his memoirs:

"The Soviets have been as generous to the Arabs in price as they have been in quantity. Soviet weapons are cheap anyway: about half the price of their nearest Western equivalents. In addition, the Soviets offer munificent repayment terms, especially to countries in real need. Commonly, the Soviets will write off half the purchase price and give a loan for the remainder at perhaps two percent interest a year, with a grace period of three to seven years and repayment over a further 15 years."

Much of this debt would be forgiven, meaning weapons were provided almost free of charge. Despite this generous aid, which provided a very considerable material advantage both quantitatively and qualitatively, Egyptian forces notably failed repeatedly to effectively engage neighbouring Israel in multiple conflicts in the 20 years after 1955 - an issue which only worsened after Soviet military advisors were expelled from the country in 1972.


Soviet-built Tu-16 Bombers in the Egyptian Air Force

Despite signs of the beginnings of an anti-Soviet policy from Egypt's new President Anwar Sadat, who assumed power in 1970 after the death of his strongly Soviet aligned predecessor Gamal Abdel Nasser, the USSR continued to provide Egypt with state of the art armaments both to prepare for the Yom Kippur War in October 1973 and afterwards to further bolster its defences. While Egypt's material advantage in the field was overwhelming during the war, poor tactics due to political interventions by the president in military planning ultimately led to an Egyptian defeat. Seeking new combat jets which could better contest air superiority against Israeli F-4E Phantoms, Egypt was provided with the Soviet MiG-23 Flogger - a new third generation swept wing design which could outperform the F-4. The fighter integrated a new generation of sensors and air to air missiles, and Egypt was the second country after Syria to receive the jets. The first unit was operational before the end of 1974.



Ultimately the MiG-23 represented part of the last major arms delivery to Egypt from the Soviet Union, with the country's new president adopting a strongly westphalian position, pivoting to the Western Bloc and downgrading diplomatic and defence ties with Moscow. While Egypt was expected to have been a leading client for new MiG-23 variants then under development, and for new more capable jets which would soon afterwards be offered for export such as the MiG-25 and MiG-29, its defection to the Western Bloc would leave remaining Soviet partners in the region such as Libya and Syria in a far weaker position. The Anwar Sadat government would further go on to undermine Soviet and allied interests by providing the MiG-23 to the United States.


Syrian Air Force MiG-23

Chief of Staff Saad Al Shazly, who was subsequently removed from his position and exiled by the Sadat government, stated in his memoirs regarding Egypt's role in compromising Soviet weapons technologies including the MiG-23 and the new 2K12 KuB air defence system:

"The Soviet Union supplies its weapons subject only to two conditions: that they not be used against Soviet interests, and that their secrets be preserved. For reasons already given, the Soviet Union considers that the struggle against Israel is in its interests. And the insistence upon security reflects the fact that the Soviet Union supplies to the Arabs virtually the same weapons that it relies upon for its own security and that of its allies in Europe. In that regard, we may expect the Soviets to be in the future a good deal more demanding in their security requirements after the betrayal by Sadat. When he broke with the Soviets in 1974, Sadat put all the sophisticated Soviet weaponry Egypt’s armed forces possessed at the disposal of America.

The damage this did to the Arab cause was incalculable; its effects will be felt for years. When reports began to surface in the late 1970s that Sadat had even delivered four MiG-23 fighter aircraft to the United States, they were indignantly denied in Egypt. On 26 April 1984, the death of U.S. Air Force General Robert Bond while piloting a MiG-23 confirmed the secret that even Sadat had been ashamed to confess. But of course the result of his betrayal has been, and for years to come will be, not American but Arab deaths. The success of the Israeli Air Force in destroying 18 Syrian battalions of the Soviet made SAM-6 [2K12 Kub – the most advanced air defence system deployed in the Yom Kippur War] anti-aircraft missiles in Lebanon in June 1982, a victory which opened the door to Israel’s slaughter in Lebanon, was possible only because American experts had passed to Israel the results of their long study of those missiles, courtesy of Sadat, and their perfection of electronic counter-measures to defeat them."


North Korean MiG-23 Fighters

The consequences of Egypt's passing on MiG-23 fighters to the United States, a state of the art fighter which had barely begun to enter service, went well beyond the Middle East. The fighters were deployed by a range of operators, from Cuban air units in Latin America and Angola to North Korean and Vietnamese air units in East Asia as well as the Warsaw Pact nations and the Soviet Union itself. The defences of all these parties among others were seriously undermined by the actions of the new Egyptian leadership. The MiG-23 was a potentially formidable design, with its powerful Khatchaturov R-35-300 engine putting out the same amount of thrust as the F110 powering American F-15 and F-16 fighters which gave the lighter Flogger an extremely high thrust/weight ratio. Although suffering from overcomplexity and high maintenance requirements, and on earlier variants from limited situational awareness at close ranges, the fighter had the potential to perform much better as the design was further upgraded had the program not faced a serious compromise so early on. The MiG-23 remains in service in large numbers today in Russian reserve units, and enhanced variants are deployed by a number of former Soviet defence clients such as Syria, North Korea and Ethiopia.

MiG-23 Flogger Swept Wing Fighters

 

vampyrbladez

Senior Member
Joined
Jun 21, 2018
Messages
10,282
Likes
26,666
Country flag
Calm Down bro! We need to chill with N word and Shift towards Monkey or Bitch. Porkis Aren’t Africans they are Pedo Worshiping Sand Monkeys. Even if you Say N word call them Sand ******s.
No we don't. You need to call out ******S for their Niggardly ways!
 

WolfPack86

Senior Member
Joined
Oct 20, 2015
Messages
10,558
Likes
16,993
Country flag
Is F-21 Fighter Jet For India A Rebranded Version Of American F-16 Aircrafts?
Last year, the US offered India its F-21 fighter jets which New Delhi did not buy presumably because it resembled the F-16 jets and were seen as a mere rebranded version of the iconic fighter aircrafts.

However, according to Defence Editor David Axe of National Interest, the F-21 merely resembles the old F-16 but rather is a new aircraft with new cockpit display, a larger airframe spine to accommodate additional electronics and a new infrared sensor and refuelling probe that is compatible with India’s Russian made aerial tankers.

However, the rebranding of F-16 to F-21 fighter jets has raised some poignant questions, one of them being at what point do upgrades turn an old fighter jet into a new one?


As EurAsian Times had reported earlier, India wants to replace its old 1960s Russian made MiG-21s and MiG-27s. The MiG-21s are particularly prone to accidents with India reporting around 490 crashes killing 200 pilots out of the 874 MiG-21s it first brought into service in 1963.

The Indian Air Force, as reported by the EurAsian Times, has been looking to acquire new fighter jet to fly alongside French Rafales, Russian MiG-29s and SU-30s and India’s indigenously built Tejas aircraft which Lockheed Martin described as the world’s largest fighter aircraft ecosystem.

The F-21 shares many of its significant aspects with F-16V which Lockheed has sold previously to Bahrain, Greece, Slovakia, South Korea and Taiwan.

Yet, the F-21 or F-16V is different from F-16A that first flew in 1978. As compared to the F-16A, F-21 or F-16V has better radar and sensors and carry long-range missiles. But then why did the USA not call the F-16V something different?

The reason behind not changing the fighter’s name seems to be connected with cost efficacy to make the new programme sound less risky. In fact, the three new F-35 variants namely F-35 A, F-35B and F-35C shared very few design elements outside of their cockpits.

All the three variants have just 20-25% commonality according to Lt Gen Christopher Bodgan. The American tendency to give old names to new aircrafts created a false impression that the fighter aircrafts were just the same old jets with new names.

Another example includes the advanced F-15 variant of Boeing which the company has offered to US Air Force as F-15X and a new F/A-18E/F model that has nothing in common with its earlier predecessor F/A-18A/B.

If the Indian Air Force opts to buy the F-21 jets it would undoubtedly be able to claim to be the first operator of a brand new aircraft even if to the layman the fighter jet appears to be just another old aircraft.

Vivek Lall, Vice-President of Strategy and Business Development of Lockheed Martin had earlier said that if India decides to buy the F-21 jets then the company will not sell them to anyone else and will set up a state-of-the-art F-21 manufacturing facility with Tata Group and create an ecosystem for the overall growth of India’s defence manufacturing.

Lall said that looking from a distance, it may appear that the F-16 and F-21 are similar but actually are different. He said that F-21 had 12,000 hours of service life airframe as against F-16’s 8,000 hours and has completely different airframe, weapons capability, engine matrix and availability of engine options, according to News 18.

Earlier this year, Lockheed Martin inked an agreement with India’s Public Sector Undertaking Bharat Electronics Limited to explore opportunities in the F-21 fighter jet programme.
https://www.defencenews.in/article/...ded-Version-Of-American-F-16-Aircrafts-820073
 

Flying Dagger

Senior Member
Joined
Sep 26, 2019
Messages
3,583
Likes
9,444
Country flag
Is F-21 Fighter Jet For India A Rebranded Version Of American F-16 Aircrafts?
Last year, the US offered India its F-21 fighter jets which New Delhi did not buy presumably because it resembled the F-16 jets and were seen as a mere rebranded version of the iconic fighter aircrafts.

However, according to Defence Editor David Axe of National Interest, the F-21 merely resembles the old F-16 but rather is a new aircraft with new cockpit display, a larger airframe spine to accommodate additional electronics and a new infrared sensor and refuelling probe that is compatible with India’s Russian made aerial tankers.

However, the rebranding of F-16 to F-21 fighter jets has raised some poignant questions, one of them being at what point do upgrades turn an old fighter jet into a new one?


As EurAsian Times had reported earlier, India wants to replace its old 1960s Russian made MiG-21s and MiG-27s. The MiG-21s are particularly prone to accidents with India reporting around 490 crashes killing 200 pilots out of the 874 MiG-21s it first brought into service in 1963.

The Indian Air Force, as reported by the EurAsian Times, has been looking to acquire new fighter jet to fly alongside French Rafales, Russian MiG-29s and SU-30s and India’s indigenously built Tejas aircraft which Lockheed Martin described as the world’s largest fighter aircraft ecosystem.

The F-21 shares many of its significant aspects with F-16V which Lockheed has sold previously to Bahrain, Greece, Slovakia, South Korea and Taiwan.

Yet, the F-21 or F-16V is different from F-16A that first flew in 1978. As compared to the F-16A, F-21 or F-16V has better radar and sensors and carry long-range missiles. But then why did the USA not call the F-16V something different?

The reason behind not changing the fighter’s name seems to be connected with cost efficacy to make the new programme sound less risky. In fact, the three new F-35 variants namely F-35 A, F-35B and F-35C shared very few design elements outside of their cockpits.

All the three variants have just 20-25% commonality according to Lt Gen Christopher Bodgan. The American tendency to give old names to new aircrafts created a false impression that the fighter aircrafts were just the same old jets with new names.

Another example includes the advanced F-15 variant of Boeing which the company has offered to US Air Force as F-15X and a new F/A-18E/F model that has nothing in common with its earlier predecessor F/A-18A/B.

If the Indian Air Force opts to buy the F-21 jets it would undoubtedly be able to claim to be the first operator of a brand new aircraft even if to the layman the fighter jet appears to be just another old aircraft.

Vivek Lall, Vice-President of Strategy and Business Development of Lockheed Martin had earlier said that if India decides to buy the F-21 jets then the company will not sell them to anyone else and will set up a state-of-the-art F-21 manufacturing facility with Tata Group and create an ecosystem for the overall growth of India’s defence manufacturing.

Lall said that looking from a distance, it may appear that the F-16 and F-21 are similar but actually are different. He said that F-21 had 12,000 hours of service life airframe as against F-16’s 8,000 hours and has completely different airframe, weapons capability, engine matrix and availability of engine options, according to News 18.

Earlier this year, Lockheed Martin inked an agreement with India’s Public Sector Undertaking Bharat Electronics Limited to explore opportunities in the F-21 fighter jet programme.
https://www.defencenews.in/article/...ded-Version-Of-American-F-16-Aircrafts-820073
One area we must appreciate American jets is their service life , ease in maintenance, spare part supply compared to their russian European indian or chinese counterpart.
 

IndianHawk

Senior Member
Joined
Sep 24, 2016
Messages
9,058
Likes
37,675
Country flag
One area we must appreciate American jets is their service life , ease in maintenance, spare part supply compared to their russian European indian or chinese counterpart.
We will be all over American arms if they could give up on end user restrictions. They are untrustworthy as an ally and this will be their doom as a super power.
 

Global Defence

New threads

Articles

Top