Main Battle Tanks and Armour Technology

If Tanks have to evolve, which path they should follow?

  • Light Vehicles-Best for mobility

    Votes: 25 7.3%
  • Heavy Armour-Can take heavy punishment.

    Votes: 57 16.7%
  • Modular Design-Allowing dynamic adaptions.

    Votes: 198 58.1%
  • Universal Platform-Best for logistics.

    Votes: 61 17.9%

  • Total voters
    341

ppgj

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Sunday, January 3, 2010

Т-90М. New Specs.

The new pictures and main specs of T-90M (ob.188M) were appeared on a Russian site. This tank was first time demonstrated for Putin in Dec.10 at N-Tagil. It has got:

- New bigger turret without weakened frontal areas and with the all-aspect ERA covering.
- ERA 'Relict'
- Additional roof protection against atop attacking munition.
- New additional autoloader, placed on the aft part of the turret and able using the new longer sub-caliber rods.
- Aft ammo storage.
- Panoramic 3-channel IR commander site with improved anti-split/rounds protection.
- 7.62 mm automatic turret instead of 12.7mm.
- Totally new 2A82 125 mm MG (2A46M5 - optional).
- FCS with the net-centric module.
- New radio.
- New navigation system.
- New anti-split kevlar layer instead of the standard Russian anti-neutron layer.
- new anti-fire system.

In work:

- Mono-block power unit on 1200 hp V-99 engine.
- Steering wheel control.

T-90M - is intended for the export purpose mainly. For domestic use there was confirmed 'Burlak' program with heavy Tomsk OKBTM's input.







Defunct Humanity: ?-90?. New Specs.
 

jakojako777

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T-90ME was demonstrated first time




The export version of modernized T-90M tank was demonstrated for Russian PM Putin today in 'UVZ plant (N-Tagil). The tank has a new, bigger turrets,
- 'Relict' ERA on the turret (but not on the hull),
- a new panoramic commander sight with 360 degree vision,
- new commander hatch with better accessability
- different placement of the air conditioner
- new tracks
- stronger rolls and some improvement in the chassis
- possibly 1200 hp engine

VIDEO
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GvcsQZ7ttcI
Defunct Humanity: T-90ME was demonstrated first time
 

jakojako777

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Happy New Year - with a new tank!


Public presentation of this machine, I confess, we expected more for the July exhibition of arms in Nizhny Tagil, but apparently not destiny ... It took place under the upcoming, new, 2010. December 8, 2009 tank facility 188M "was presented to Vladimir Putin before the meeting on the development of Russia's tank, which was held in" tank capital "of Russia - the city of Nizhny Tagil. Highlighting the visit of President of the Government, journalistic brethren, many of the "splitting" of the commander's version of the serial MBT T-90A is equipped with program-technical complex integrated into the automated control system for tactical-level, but the "Ehmke" standing on the demonstration site GDVTS next to the T-90AK, and which representing a real, genuine, show a sensation - not a word!



Object 188M "is created as a proactive development of the Ural KB transport engineering, as opposed to the ROC" Boatmen under way at Omsk KB. Named the ROC is an example of illustrating the chaos that has formed in the industry, and the squandering of public funds. ROC "Boatmen provides for a unified military department to upgrade the first T-90 tanks and T-72. At the same time, JSC UKBTM - the developer of these machines - is constantly engaged in work on improving the design of MBT T-90 and the modernization of T-72. It would seem that it should deal with this work, an ROC no ... "Boatmen was transferred to Omsk KBTM is a very good technology bureau, but has a weak capacity for new and more promising design. Moreover, KBTM does not and did not have a T-90 tanks irrelevant. And such an organization entrusted with such a difficult job! As a result of advancing the work was successfully eaten, "inventions" are protected by patents, but the actual "Burlaka" as there was, and no. According to some KBTM can not adapt their CD to the "cart" T-90 and had to seek technical assistance to UKBTM. In addition, the mass of the developed design is such that it can not withstand even a strong chassis, what is there at Tagil T-90. The excess of any allowable load is so great that the most devastating impact on the resource. Of course, a negative result - it's the same result, but let me, then why GABTU suit tender for the development and delivery of simulators for this is the failed "Boatmen? Why not allocate funds UKBTM for the completion of the "Object 188M" - yet another staged improvement of T-90?

T-90MNovaya Tagil'skaya machine - "Object 188M" - is different, first of all, a completely new design of the tower, the protection of which is practically devoid of reducing vulnerability zones and is vserakursnoy. Significantly better protected not only frontal but also lateral and feed. Most relevant to the protection - improved protection of the roof. The machine is essentially an improved MSA. His feature - the inclusion of the three-channel thermal commander's panoramic sight. In developing the MSA used operating time, obtained during the highly successful R & D "Frame-99" and "Slingshot-1. Attention should be given smaller dimensions sights and very serious protection from fire small-caliber guns, bullets and shell fragments of large caliber. This is especially noticeable on the background presented in March 2009 the outgoing Ukrainian tank "MBT-M. In general, visibility at 188M highlighted.

Also created good conditions for work crew - ergonomics Tagil machines obviously going well! The machine is equipped with a new gun with improved ballistic characteristics. It can be installed as that has already become the standard for mass-Russian machine gun 2A46M5, and a completely new tool - 2A82. In addition to the new autoloader calculated on the BPS high aspect ratio, in the turret has a container for an additional BC. In our view this is not the right decision, but in the best shape corresponds to the latest international standards Armored fashion. Do not remain without attention and support weapons. LSD replaced by remote-controlled autonomous machine gun. At 188M installed a new secure communications system, navigation system, provides for integration into ASUV.

Currently, pilot production UKBTM made only a tower. Production is constrained by inadequate funding body. To show the Prime Minister, the tower, as befits a combat module was installed without problems on the first-encountered chassis - which explains its presence on the body of the DMZ "Contact-V» instead of the projected "relics". In addition, the Corps "Object 188M also provides enhanced protection VLD by installing a new package combined reservations. Been strengthened hull roof - especially in the driver's hatch. In addition to the introduction of modern fire-fighting system of the tank reduced the probability of fire due to refusal of fires antineutron nadboya lining and replacement of fire-resistant ballistic material such as "Kevlar".

To improve the performance of UKBTM together with the Chelyabinsk enterprises CTZ and Electromashina "is working to develop and implement monoblock power plant based on the V-shaped 1000-strong turbo-diesel V-92S2 or it formed are versions in 99 power 1200l.s. and traffic control system with steering wheel. Successful demonstration of Russia's new military leadership of the state machinery and the Ministry of Defense certainly give new impetus to the fundamental retooling of our Army to a new technique, which in turn contributes to enhancing the export potential of Russia's machinery and the increasing interest in Russia's tanks from foreign customers.

Ñ Íîâûì ãîäîì – ñ íîâûì òàíêîì!



.
 

AJSINGH

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T-90M "Bhishma": modified T-90M in Indian service.It differs in 'Kaktus' embedded explosive reactive armour (ERA) package on its frontal hull and turret-top (the T-90S has 'Kontakt-5' ERA), is fitted with an enhanced environmental control system supplied by Israel's Kinetics Ltd for providing cooled air to the fighting compartment, has additional internal volume for housing the cryogenic cooling systems for new-generation thermal imagers like the THALES-built Catherine-FC thermal imager (operating in the 8-12 micron bandwidth
 

bhramos

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how much is T-90M capable or equal to that of Arjun MBT?
as some T-90S lost with Arjun in competitive trails!!!
 

ppgj

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@AJS,

this is one of the unsubstantiated fancy article the author has written - among many. the blog article is dated jan 28. 2009. can you give one official source that says india is procuring T-90M's whenever they are ready??

first of all there is still a lot of validation required for the prototypes that are/may be existing in Russia. the new auto loader they are planning is for the longer rods which means either a whole new turret or a major redesign meaning hell of a lot of money and time!!! can you tell me when this T-90M is going to be operational??

as it is, T-90S costs more than Arjun (have given links in the past)!! will the IA invest more in an obsolete tank which even russian forces are refusing!!!(link given in another thread).

also indian TOT is for T-90S (link given in the past).

it makes lot of sense to debate on what is realistic situation than one based on a imaginary fancy article!!
 

p2prada

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@AJS,

this is one of the unsubstantiated fancy article the author has written - among many. the blog article is dated jan 28. 2009. can you give one official source that says india is procuring T-90M's whenever they are ready??

first of all there is still a lot of validation required for the prototypes that are/may be existing in Russia. the new auto loader they are planning is for the longer rods which means either a whole new turret or a major redesign meaning hell of a lot of money and time!!! can you tell me when this T-90M is going to be operational??

as it is, T-90S costs more than Arjun (have given links in the past)!! will the IA invest more in an obsolete tank which even russian forces are refusing!!!(link given in another thread).

also indian TOT is for T-90S (link given in the past).

it makes lot of sense to debate on what is realistic situation than one based on a imaginary fancy article!!
The biggest difference between the 2 tanks is the ERA, that's all.
ERA can be fitted later on. We are not going for the Shtora anyway. So, that does not come into the discussion.
 

ppgj

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The biggest difference between the 2 tanks is the ERA, that's all.
no sir. not according to igor. it will have a new turret and a new additional auto loader. i quote -

Sunday, January 3, 2010



Т-90М. New Specs.

The new pictures and main specs of T-90M (ob.188M) were appeared on a Russian site. This tank was first time demonstrated for Putin in Dec.10 at N-Tagil. It has got:

- New bigger turret without weakened frontal areas and with the all-aspect ERA covering.
- ERA 'Relict'
- Additional roof protection against atop attacking munition.
- New additional autoloader, placed on the aft part of the turret and able using the new longer sub-caliber rods.
- Aft ammo storage.
- Panoramic 3-channel IR commander site with improved anti-split/rounds protection.
- 7.62 mm automatic turret instead of 12.7mm.
- Totally new 2A82 125 mm MG (2A46M5 - optional).
- FCS with the net-centric module.
- New radio.
- New navigation system.
- New anti-split kevlar layer instead of the standard Russian anti-neutron layer.
- new anti-fire system.

In work:

- Mono-block power unit on 1200 hp V-99 engine.
- Steering wheel control.

T-90M - is intended for the export purpose mainly. For domestic use there was confirmed 'Burlak' program with heavy Tomsk OKBTM's input.
http://igorrgroup.blogspot.com/2010/01/90-new-specs.html

another link from the above link -

http://translate.google.com/transla...04.narod.ru/xlopotov_8/t90m.htm&sl=auto&tl=en

ERA can be fitted later on.
yes if it were only ERA but it is not!!!

We are not going for the Shtora anyway. So, that does not come into the discussion.
agree.
 

p2prada

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Igor's blog is primarily his own views, like Trishul or some others. Nevertheless, a new autoloader is not unrealistic and is not difficult to install either. Let's see if his report is true. If T-95 is a myth then the T-90M will be the future for the Russians.
 

Kunal Biswas

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ppgj

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Igor's blog is primarily his own views, like Trishul or some others.
agree but sir, Igor is rooted in reality and writes non fancy articles. he is considered a credible source unlike Prasun who has been accused of plagiarism and whose articles are not allowed on certain forums. many of his fancy articles have been thrashed by many.

also if you read Igor's link he quotes a different site which i linked in the previous post.

besides the Trishul blog entry was dated jan 2009 and i have never seen a single source claiming T-90M's for IA. neither the IA/GOI have shown any interest (with bad past experience with even T-90S TOT) nor T-90M is operational.

it is not just ERA. a new whole turret and an additional autoloader means extensive validation trials. considering some unconfirmed reports and forum talk - russia is going to import "armour plates" from Rhinemetal!!

considering their situation ,i am afraid, i don't see T-90M any way near to being operational.

Nevertheless, a new autoloader is not unrealistic and is not difficult to install either.
it may not be unrealistc or difficult but if the specs are to be beleived, it will involve lot of money and time which i am sure IA will not exercise considering the delays and cost overruns - they have been accusing the drdo of - on Arjun.

Let's see if his report is true. If T-95 is a myth then the T-90M will be the future for the Russians.
may be but looking at this report does not look that way -

http://rpg7.org/eng/ground_troops_a...o-purchase-the-outdated-armored-vehicles.html

Good indeed but i wished for 'Kaktus' not 'Relict' though it will provide better protection than K5..
Gun and Ammo are almost same so does the Armour module, still a gud tank..
sir, you may be right but the point is T-90M in IA is moot because TOT is for T-90S!!
 

Kunal Biswas

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it may not be unrealistc or difficult but if the specs are to be beleived, it will involve lot of money and time which i am sure IA will not exercise considering the delays and cost overruns - they have been accusing the drdo of - on Arjun.

sir, you may be right but the point is T-90M in IA is moot because TOT is for T-90S!!
Arjun is the first priority coz it beats T-90S in most respect but its expensive..
In IA T-90S is the best suited tank to repalce T-72, the price of T-90s makes its ideal replacement.
Now Army want T-90S/M its up-to Army..
 

ppgj

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Arjun is the first priority coz it beats T-90S in most respect but its expensive..
agree. but not expensive than T-90!! infact less sir.

In IA T-90S is the best suited tank to repalce T-72, the price of T-90s makes its ideal replacement.
Now Army want T-90S/M its up-to Army..
no sir T-90S costs more than Arjun -

The T-90 currently serving with the Indian Army after all upgrades costs Rs17 crore, as against an Rs16 crore price tag for the Arjun. Larger orders for the Arjun will further bring down per unit costs.
http://www.domain-b.com/defence/land/indian_army/20100517_arjun_main_battle_tanks_oneView.html

Ajai shukla alluded to this in his Business-Standard article too.
 

ppgj

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Can u elaborate abt the following upgrades to Indian T-90S
..
sir this was extensively debated on Arjun thread.

the fact that T-90 costs less is a myth as explained by Ajai shukla (a tank man himself) here -

No reasons were given for that delay. Nor did the Ministry of Defence (MoD) reveal the T-90's ballooning cost, now a whopping Rs 17.5 crore. On November 30, 2006, the MoD told the Lok Sabha that the T-90 tank cost Rs 12 crore apiece. Parliament does not yet know about the 50 per cent rise in cost.
he talks about how the cost was brought down by not including what a modern tank is supposed to include to get a price advantage over Arjun!!

http://ajaishukla.blogspot.com/2010/02/t-90-tank-piercing-armys-armour-of.html

do read and hope that will answer your upgrade query.
 
Last edited:

san

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Is any other country is interested in this modified tank other than IA. Algeria has bought couple of hundrd T90 but did not heard anything for new purchase. Why IA is so fancy about T series tank. Poland and Egypt, both has preffed to use western tanks after using several decades of T series. Poland has its own locally produced modified upgraded T series tank but still it preffered to use Leo in Afganistan. We have our own Leo aka Arjun but still IA preffered imported T series.
 

Kunal Biswas

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Is any other country is interested in this modified tank other than IA. Algeria has bought couple of hundrd T90 but did not heard anything for new purchase. Why IA is so fancy about T series tank. Poland and Egypt, both has preffed to use western tanks after using several decades of T series. Poland has its own locally produced modified upgraded T series tank but still it preffered to use Leo in Afganistan. We have our own Leo aka Arjun but still IA preffered imported T series.
IA is interested coz T-90S is cheaper to replace all 1700+ t-72 from Indian Army, Arjun is not AKA leo, both are different tanks in terms of Armour, mobility and the gun,As our economy is growing strong we will have Arjun as MBT of India, Presently Arjun is the most powerful tank in IA Inventory and recent show of Arjun vs T-90, Army is in favor of Arjun..
 

p2prada

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agree but sir, Igor is rooted in reality and writes non fancy articles. he is considered a credible source unlike Prasun who has been accused of plagiarism and whose articles are not allowed on certain forums. many of his fancy articles have been thrashed by many.
You don't have to call me sir mate.

Also, Igors views may be good at times, but they are not the official view from the Russian or Indian officials. What he has defined as T-90M may not be the same as what we are talking about.

The Russians actually make a lot of different prototypes and everybody gets confused in the end, with help from the media. The export model is T-90S. We are improving on that model with the Kaktus ERA. Some one from the media calls it T-90M. The T-90M you are talking about actually does not exist. So, the media may have decided to name this version of T-90S as the T-90M.

it is not just ERA. a new whole turret and an additional autoloader means extensive validation trials. considering some unconfirmed reports and forum talk - russia is going to import "armour plates" from Rhinemetal!!
That may be a future upgrade to the T-90. Lets not jump to conclusions to what it is designated as.
The first 300+ tanks are T-90S with Kontart, the next 1300 are with kaktus 5. That's about it. Nothing else will be changed except maybe the APS.
 

p2prada

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agree. but not expensive than T-90!! infact less sir.
The Arjun price tag of Rs 16 Crore is a 2005 figure, not the latest 2010 figure and it was unit costs. The T-90 price tag was for an operational tank in 2008 and was the program cost.

The Arjun price tag was for a tank with just chassis, engine and tracks, also FCS. It did not take into consideration cost of ammo, spares and cost of communication equipment and some other electronics like Night Vision. The T-90 price tag is for everything, ammo, electronics, training, spares and other lifecycle costs.

Remember that the T-90 we are inducting is a completely finished model except APS. The Arjun was not finished at the time of signing the second and third contract.
 

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