LCA TEJAS MK1 & MK1A: News and Discussion

onlinpunit

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People criticizing HAL can answer why were HAL employees not vaccinated as FLW?
If that would have been done a lot less HAL employees would have got affected and lot less would have died.
There wouldn't have been 2/3 weeks of closure.

Indian military was vaccinated early. So should have been the agencies who supply and support them.

Not just you have to look after the teeth but have to look after the tail too.
Ask HAL Management !
 

Spitfire9

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Criticizing HAL is foolish. HAL is doing excellent work despite the Wuhan pandemic. They delivered Tejas IOC within the timeline...
My apologies, but that is not the case.

"Two contracts were signed between IAF & Hindustan Aeronautics Limited (HAL) for procurement of (i) 20 Initial Operational Clearance (IOC) standard aircraft on 31st March 2006 to be completed by December 2011". (Source: Indian Ministry of Defence; issued July 30, 2018)

Delivery of 20 aircraft was supposed to take 5 years. It actually took 13 years to deliver 16 fighters.

Criticizing HAL is foolish. HAL is doing excellent work despite the Wuhan pandemic. They delivered Tejas IOC within the timeline and the same will happen with Tejas FOC
My apologies, but that is not the case.

"(ii) 20 Final Operational Clearance (FOC) standard aircraft on 23rd December 2010 to be completed by 2016.". (Source: Indian Ministry of Defence; issued July 30, 2018)

Delivery was supposed to take 5 years. 10 years later it is scheduled for completion 2023, actually taking 13 years.

Nothing wrong with HAL's performance?
 

onlinpunit

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As if HAL management was the agency deciding the definition of FLW. If they were they would have...but alas they aren't the one deciding.

So your smart retort isn't smart at all.
So who should be held responsible For including their employees as FLW ?
 

ladder

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So who should be held responsible For including their employees as FLW ?
Those who didn't feel the need of it. Wasn't it clear?

Answer is 'we'. We includes all, G.o.I, Armed forces and our collective wisdom that couldn't comprehend that closure of HAL due to high case load will hamper delivery schedule.

Or it was a foregone conclusion for those who were deciding that slippage of a quarter or two or four from HAL doesn't matter in the grand scheme of things for them.
 
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vishnugupt

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Ok.HAL is a state of the art world class company..
They can sell their game changer products in world market and get serious money..
Why rely on ungrateful IAF ?
I am not saying HAL is a world-class company. I am saying it is sufficient as per their order book.
 

Flying Dagger

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My apologies, but that is not the case.

"Two contracts were signed between IAF & Hindustan Aeronautics Limited (HAL) for procurement of (i) 20 Initial Operational Clearance (IOC) standard aircraft on 31st March 2006 to be completed by December 2011". (Source: Indian Ministry of Defence; issued July 30, 2018)

Delivery of 20 aircraft was supposed to take 5 years. It actually took 13 years to deliver 16 fighters.



My apologies, but that is not the case.

"(ii) 20 Final Operational Clearance (FOC) standard aircraft on 23rd December 2010 to be completed by 2016.". (Source: Indian Ministry of Defence; issued July 30, 2018)

Delivery was supposed to take 5 years. 10 years later it is scheduled for completion 2023, actually taking 13 years.

Nothing wrong with HAL's performance?
When did they got IOC and FOC for Tejas please mention that too.
 

vishnugupt

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My apologies, but that is not the case.

"Two contracts were signed between IAF & Hindustan Aeronautics Limited (HAL) for procurement of (i) 20 Initial Operational Clearance (IOC) standard aircraft on 31st March 2006 to be completed by December 2011". (Source: Indian Ministry of Defence; issued July 30, 2018)

Delivery of 20 aircraft was supposed to take 5 years. It actually took 13 years to deliver 16 fighters.



My apologies, but that is not the case.

"(ii) 20 Final Operational Clearance (FOC) standard aircraft on 23rd December 2010 to be completed by 2016.". (Source: Indian Ministry of Defence; issued July 30, 2018)

Delivery was supposed to take 5 years. 10 years later it is scheduled for completion 2023, actually taking 13 years.

Nothing wrong with HAL's performance?
Absolutely nothing wrong with HAL because ADA was developing Tejas, not HAL. How can HAL deliver you IOC or FOC Tejas even before it was achieved?

IOC delivery was slow before FOC was delayed. ADA and HAL worked with synergy which is a good point.

But after achieving FOC, IAF should have ordered 20 extra FoC tejas.
 

onlinpunit

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Absolutely nothing wrong with HAL because ADA was developing Tejas, not HAL. How can HAL deliver you IOC or FOC Tejas even before it was achieved?

IOC delivery was slow before FOC was delayed. ADA and HAL worked with synergy which is a good point.

But after achieving FOC, IAF should have ordered 20 extra FoC tejas.
Between ADA and HAL they have pretty much s****d the LCA program.
 

sorcerer

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Delayed by Covid, HAL jet deliveries to start from July

The Chairman-cum-Managing Director of the HAL, R Madhavan, in a telephonic chat with The Tribune, said over the past three months, a delay in production had been witnessed as many of the suppliers weren’t able to deliver raw material on time. “But things are normalising now,” he said, hopeful of ensuring timely deliveries from July in case there was no third wave.
..
...

On the production of a batch of 20 Tejas jets called the ‘Final Operational Clearance’ version, Madhavan said, “We have to produce 10 more of these, which will be done this fiscal.”


Separately, four jets are ready and IAF pilots will soon be coming to Bengaluru to fly these away from the Tejas facility. He said the production of trainers, part of 83 jets ordered for the Tejas Mark1-A version, would commence next year (2022-23 fiscal).
 

vishnugupt

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Between ADA and HAL they have pretty much s****d the LCA program.
Kid, Relax don't show Leftist type arrogance.. "so what if I don't know"
I want to repeat, Tejas is an engineering marvel for India, it's not only a jet but a full aerospace industry and expertise for which most of the nations are the envy. This is ADA which will make it possible for me and you to see a 5th generation fighter jet by 2030 which others cant even imagine.
Maybe your ideals are LM, Boeing, or BAE but I hold very high regard for ADA, A ideal agency that made Tejas a reality despite of odds one can't even imagine today. Tejas might be delayed for few years but this delay is acceptable when you are building something from scratch.
 

Bleh

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Kid, Relax don't show Leftist type arrogance.. "so what if I don't know"
I want to repeat, Tejas is an engineering marvel for India, it's not only a jet but a full aerospace industry and expertise for which most of the nations are the envy. This is ADA which will make it possible for me and you to see a 5th generation fighter jet by 2030 which others cant even imagine.
Maybe your ideals are LM, Boeing, or BAE but I hold very high regard for ADA, A ideal agency that made Tejas a reality despite of odds one can't even imagine today. Tejas might be delayed for few years but this delay is acceptable when you are building something from scratch.
You're taking the guy too seriously.. He just comes here to vent non-stop. Never seen his posts before?

Relax.
 

Flying Dagger

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Tejas program was fcuked by many organisations that include ADA GTRE and HAL to an extent too. But HAL in this case can't be held completely responsible but doesn't mean they have done excellent job in past.

They have delayed the trainer projects , blocked the sale by promising moon to gov minister while delivering nothing which resulted in poor training program and a few deaths too. Jaguar or Sukhoi delivery schedule were delayed for years too.

Their quality process have been come into question multiple times with HAL Dhruva , Mirage upgrade/crash poor spare parts procurement to save cost and many more issues .

We have done this multiple times so better we look into future now and how we can improve it..

Dassault bringing their production standard in India is one thing we could have learn from... Or still can with next batch of rafales.

We have been improving on Heli department incrementally .

But truth in India it will take a dedicated and tough RM to make these PSUs OFBs improve.
 

Spitfire9

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Kid, Relax don't show Leftist type arrogance.. "so what if I don't know"
I want to repeat, Tejas is an engineering marvel for India, it's not only a jet but a full aerospace industry and expertise for which most of the nations are the envy. This is ADA which will make it possible for me and you to see a 5th generation fighter jet by 2030 which others cant even imagine.
Maybe your ideals are LM, Boeing, or BAE but I hold very high regard for ADA, A ideal agency that made Tejas a reality despite of odds one can't even imagine today. Tejas might be delayed for few years but this delay is acceptable when you are building something from scratch.
Tejas is an immense technical achievement starting from a low base and delays cannot be avoided in such a project. I do not, however, think that glossing over avoidable delays is at all constructive.
 

Whitecollar

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Tejas is an immense technical achievement starting from a low base and delays cannot be avoided in such a project. I do not, however, think that glossing over avoidable delays is at all constructive.
If people at HAL are not feeling like rushing the productions, maybe HAL should offer us DFI fanbois a job at Tejas assembly!
 

Whitecollar

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Suppose if HAL delivers 40 Tejas in 2 years with massive investment and workforce then they will have to sit idle for the next 2 year and have to pay salary with her own pocket. this would be a good example of bankruptcy. The whole defence ecosystem is largely dependent on how the Armed forces run it. Private player will also run away if Armed forces keep on giving piecemeal/ inadequate orders.
That is true but where we are concerned about are regular delays that are faced by HAL and everytime Mr Madhavan brings up some excuse. If you cannot deliver before time due to future order uncertainity, atleast try to minimize the delays to as few as possible. Same covid situation was there for L&T but they did deliver 100 K-9 Vajras, didn't they??
 

onlinpunit

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Kid, Relax don't show Leftist type arrogance.. "so what if I don't know"
I want to repeat, Tejas is an engineering marvel for India, it's not only a jet but a full aerospace industry and expertise for which most of the nations are the envy. This is ADA which will make it possible for me and you to see a 5th generation fighter jet by 2030 which others cant even imagine.
Maybe your ideals are LM, Boeing, or BAE but I hold very high regard for ADA, A ideal agency that made Tejas a reality despite of odds one can't even imagine today. Tejas might be delayed for few years but this delay is acceptable when you are building something from scratch.
I have nothing against the jet. It's a decent plane..
But the whole project management is so.fckd up.
 

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