Know Your 'Rafale'

[BON PLAN]

Rafale-M Jets That Indian Navy Is Buying From France Likely To Cost 5.5 Billion Euros: Report
The 26 Dassault Rafale-M fighter jets that the Indian Navy will acquire from France are estimated to cost around €5.5 billion, according to Economic Times.
Just yesterday (10 July), the Defence Procurement Board, headed by the Defence secretary, cleared a proposal to purchase 26 Rafale-M aircraft and three additional scorpene-class submarines for the Indian Navy.

Rafale-M Jets That Indian Navy Is Buying From France Likely To Cost 5.5 Billion Euros: Report

The 26 Dassault Rafale-M fighter jets that the Indian Navy will acquire from France are estimated to cost around €5

swarajyamag.com

As each time, what is the logistic package (from nothing to a full support for X years as for IAF)? what are the weapons purchased? a base accomodation? How are the offsets?

 

[spacemarine2023]

As each time, what is the logistic package (from nothing to a full support for X years as for IAF)? what are the weapons purchased? a base accomodation? How are the offsets?

yes the likely price will accommodate weapons, maintenance and training costs.. but French are not reliable regarding offset clauses they r yet to honour offset in Rafale purchase for IAF.
The difference between Americans and French is once you have legal docs regarding offset Americans always follow.. but between two unreliable weapon sources French r preferred coz apparently it seems french doesn’t have any anti India policy ingrained in their deep state..

 

[Wisemarko]

Rafale-M Jets That Indian Navy Is Buying From France Likely To Cost 5.5 Billion Euros: Report
The 26 Dassault Rafale-M fighter jets that the Indian Navy will acquire from France are estimated to cost around €5.5 billion, according to Economic Times.
Just yesterday (10 July), the Defence Procurement Board, headed by the Defence secretary, cleared a proposal to purchase 26 Rafale-M aircraft and three additional scorpene-class submarines for the Indian Navy.

Rafale-M Jets That Indian Navy Is Buying From France Likely To Cost 5.5 Billion Euros: Report

The 26 Dassault Rafale-M fighter jets that the Indian Navy will acquire from France are estimated to cost around €5

swarajyamag.com

Chinese aircraft carrier has Chinese equipment and Chinese aircraft. Building more helps Chinese economy.

Indian aircraft carrier has high import content (engines, gears, radars etc) and imported fighters at exorbitant cost. Building more only empties your pockets. This rat race ain’t worth it.

 

[shade]

Meanwhile looks like Gobi won't actually buy the 26 Rafale-Ms and 3 Scorpene subs at this rate.

The Wire: The Wire News India, Latest News,News from India, Politics, External Affairs, Science, Economics, Gender and Culture

thewire.in

 

[BON PLAN]

yes the likely price will accommodate weapons, maintenance and training costs.. but French are not reliable regarding offset clauses they r yet to honour offset in Rafale purchase for IAF.
The difference between Americans and French is once you have legal docs regarding offset Americans always follow.. but between two unreliable weapon sources French r preferred coz apparently it seems french doesn’t have any anti India policy ingrained in their deep state..

We are late, indeed, but it xas difficult to found companies with the requested level of quality.
Only a problem of time.

See what the US gave as offests..... doors for B737....

 

[BON PLAN]

yes the likely price will accommodate weapons, maintenance and training costs.. but French are not reliable regarding offset clauses they r yet to honour offset in Rafale purchase for IAF.
The difference between Americans and French is once you have legal docs regarding offset Americans always follow.. but between two unreliable weapon sources French r preferred coz apparently it seems french doesn’t have any anti India policy ingrained in their deep state..

When were we not reliable? during Kargil we were the sole with israel to give you help.
Where were the americans ?

 

[shade]

When were we not reliable? during Kargil we were the sole with israel to give you help.
Where were the americans ?

He's agreeing with you mon ami.
His point is basically "Frenchies may not honor offsets but atleast they don't have a knife ready to stab us in the back ike the Americans".

There's no point in buying say F-18s if they come with a clause of "You need our permission to attack abc country" or "You cannot attack xyz country".
TASL meanwhile may get some offsets deal to build F-18 wings and wheels or some sh*t but that's nothing compared to some freedumb and democrackery happening when you need foreign vendor support the most

 

[blackleaf]

Chinese aircraft carrier has Chinese equipment and Chinese aircraft. Building more helps Chinese economy.

To be fair Chinese carrier is a Chinese copy of a Soviet Carrier with Chinese copies of Soviet equipment and Chinese copies of Soviet aircraft.
I guess the ability of the Chinese to reverse engineer is impressive. However it is infuriating that they have been allowed to do so for so long without any consequences.
Why did the Russians and the French and the other European and Western countries continue selling military equipment to China in the 80s, 90s and 2000s when they knew that they had no respect for international IP rights?

Indian aircraft carrier has high import content (engines, gears, radars etc) and imported fighters at exorbitant cost. Building more only empties your pockets. This rat race ain’t worth it.

Hopefully we can change that. India is better off now than in the 2000s when the Vikrant was designed.

With maritime engines we will be stuck with foreign ones for the foreseeable future unless we go the nuclear route. Maybe the GE deal signed can be extended to the LM2500 so we can at least get some value added in India.

Local alternatives for the rest aren't too far off. Indian industry should be able to build most of the gears/other fitting for the new carrier.
For radars a version of the Long-Range Multi Function Radar currently deployed in the INS Anvesh will be used on future Indian Navy vessel including any new carrier.

For fighters the TEDBF program is there and will hopefully be ready in time for the new carrier. There is a lot of uncertainty but I don't think building a naval fighter is beyond us even if it is delayed.

 

[BON PLAN]

 

[pankaj nema]

Dassault Aviation’s Rafale joint venture with Anil Ambani likely to be dissolved

NEW DELHI: The Indo-French joint venture (JV) between Dassault Aviation and Anil Ambani-owned Reliance Aerostructure Ltd is likely to be dissolved as the French

www.newindianexpress.com

 

[BON PLAN]

Dassault Aviation’s Rafale joint venture with Anil Ambani likely to be dissolved

NEW DELHI: The Indo-French joint venture (JV) between Dassault Aviation and Anil Ambani-owned Reliance Aerostructure Ltd is likely to be dissolved as the French

www.newindianexpress.com

I really don't know if it is a good news or not.

 

[pankaj nema]

I really don't know if it is a good news or not.

Of Course ,it is a Very Good News

Now all that France has to do is to Sign an Agreement on 110 KN engine for AMCA MK 2 AND Then We can Sign the 114 MRFA Agreement ie Dassault will make Rafales in India

 

[spacemarine2023]

Of Course ,it is a Very Good News

Now all that France has to do is to Sign an Agreement on 110 KN engine for AMCA MK 2 AND Then We can Sign the 114 MRFA Agreement ie Dassault will make Rafales in India

pretty bad idea 114 Rafales for an engine offset .

 

[shade]

I really don't know if it is a good news or not.

It's good news because he's bankrupt and will prevent further crying by our irrelevant opposition party.

Congress raises the Rafale issue ahead of PM Modi's France visit

Congress party raises the issue of Rafale deal ahead of PM Modi's France visit. French judicial authority asks for Indian assistance in corruption investigation. Congress alleges reduction in tax demand for Reliance Flag Atlantic France.

www.livemint.com

 

[shade]

Official PIB press release about DAC Approving 26 Rafale-M + 3 Scorpenes to be build by MDL

https://pib.gov.in/PressReleasePage.aspx?PRID=1939178

==================================================================================
DAC approves proposals for procurement of 26 Rafale Marine aircraft from France to boost Indian Navy’s operational capabilities


Also clears acquisition of three additional Scorpene submarines under Buy (Indian) category
Posted On: 13 JUL 2023 2:58PM by PIB Delhi

A meeting of the Defence Acquisition Council (DAC), held under the chairmanship of Raksha Mantri Shri Rajnath Singh, approved three proposals on July 13, 2023. The DAC granted Acceptance of Necessity (AoN) for procurement of 26 Rafale Marine aircraft along with associated ancillary equipment, weapons, simulator, spares, documentation, crew training and logistic support for the Indian Navy from the French Government based on Inter-Governmental Agreement (IGA). The price and other terms of purchase will be negotiated with the French Government after taking into account all relevant aspects, including comparative procurement price of similar aircraft by other countries. Further, integration of Indian designed equipment and establishment of Maintenance, Repair & Operations (MRO) Hub for various systems will be incorporated into the contract documents after due negotiations.

The DAC also granted the AoN for procurement of three additional Scorpene submarines under Buy (Indian) category which will be constructed by Mazagon Dock Shipbuilders Limited (MDL). The procurement of additional submarines, with higher indigenous content, will not only help in maintaining required force level and operational readiness of the Indian Navy, but also create significant employment opportunities in the domestic sector. It will also help the MDL in further enhancing its capability and expertise in submarine construction.

In addition, the DAC approved the proposal to lay down guidelines for achieving the desired indigenous content in all categories of capital acquisition cases. It will help in achieving ‘Aatmanirbharta’ in critical manufacturing technologies and life-cycle sustenance of defence platforms/equipment through indigenous manufacturing.

=================================================================================

This is just approval, no contract has been signed yet

 

[Eagle Eye]

Some tit-pit: DAC approved 150 Atags artillery in Aug 2018. After Nothing moved beyond that.

In March 2023, DAC again approved 307 Atags.

Ps- DAC is just a start of procurement. Nothing more. Deal may happen/may not happen. CCS is the final.

 

[abingdonboy]

Some tit-pit: DAC approved 150 Atags artillery in Aug 2018. After Nothing moved beyond that.

In March 2023, DAC again approved 307 Atags.

Ps- DAC is just a start of procurement. Nothing more. Deal may happen/may not happen. CCS is the final.

100%, AONs are basically worthless. AON have been given to ATAGS, FICV,NMRH, NUH, P8 tranche 3 etc and we all know what has become of them

this is the very start of the process, contracts are a LONG way away, probably 2-4 years (if ever)

exact situation with the MQ9s and GE414 deal.

This govt has been promoting AONs as if they are contracts, before 2014 when was this nonsense ever hyped so much?

 

[shade]

this is the very start of the process, contracts are a LONG way away, probably 2-4 years (if ever)

exact situation with the MQ9s and GE414 deal.

This govt has been promoting AONs as if they are contracts, before 2014 when was this nonsense ever hyped so much?

"For 60 Years mitro"
"60 YEARS"
"The Congress party has neglected the needs of Indian defence"
"But me, I am leaving no stone unturned to equip our army with the best foreign and Atmanirbhar weapons"

The vibe of this guy is "LOOK MITRO I'M GETTING SHIT DONE AS COMPARED TO CHORGRESSIS ONLY EATING YOUR MONEY"

It's not wrong though but then he does heavy promotion for things that will materialize only years later.
After all public needs to be shown *something* that *shows* our guy is getting things done.
Not everyone is a 400 IQ defence enthusiast geek, or electronics geek, or infrastructure nerd etc.

 

[Azaad]

Official PIB press release about DAC Approving 26 Rafale-M + 3 Scorpenes to be build by MDL

https://pib.gov.in/PressReleasePage.aspx?PRID=1939178

==================================================================================
DAC approves proposals for procurement of 26 Rafale Marine aircraft from France to boost Indian Navy’s operational capabilities


Also clears acquisition of three additional Scorpene submarines under Buy (Indian) category
Posted On: 13 JUL 2023 2:58PM by PIB Delhi

A meeting of the Defence Acquisition Council (DAC), held under the chairmanship of Raksha Mantri Shri Rajnath Singh, approved three proposals on July 13, 2023. The DAC granted Acceptance of Necessity (AoN) for procurement of 26 Rafale Marine aircraft along with associated ancillary equipment, weapons, simulator, spares, documentation, crew training and logistic support for the Indian Navy from the French Government based on Inter-Governmental Agreement (IGA). The price and other terms of purchase will be negotiated with the French Government after taking into account all relevant aspects, including comparative procurement price of similar aircraft by other countries. Further, integration of Indian designed equipment and establishment of Maintenance, Repair & Operations (MRO) Hub for various systems will be incorporated into the contract documents after due negotiations.

The DAC also granted the AoN for procurement of three additional Scorpene submarines under Buy (Indian) category which will be constructed by Mazagon Dock Shipbuilders Limited (MDL). The procurement of additional submarines, with higher indigenous content, will not only help in maintaining required force level and operational readiness of the Indian Navy, but also create significant employment opportunities in the domestic sector. It will also help the MDL in further enhancing its capability and expertise in submarine construction.

In addition, the DAC approved the proposal to lay down guidelines for achieving the desired indigenous content in all categories of capital acquisition cases. It will help in achieving ‘Aatmanirbharta’ in critical manufacturing technologies and life-cycle sustenance of defence platforms/equipment through indigenous manufacturing.

=================================================================================

This is just approval, no contract has been signed yet

It'd follow the same steps taken as in the Rafale deal we signed in 2016. It came nearly a year after Modi's visit & signing of a similar MoU in 2015 IIRC. Nothing new here. SOP.

 

[pankaj nema]