Know Your 'Rafale'

[Bhartiya Sainik]

View attachment 149568

CARTOON ??? TYPICAL CHILDISH RESPONSE.
NOBODY'S FORCING YOU TO TALK HERE. FEEL FREE TO GET OUT OF INDIAN FORUM

 

[Bhartiya Sainik]

The tile conformal array are now very slim. Some 40 mm is in the pipe.
There are space available in the 2 bulbs were the canards are installes for exemple.
All the Rafale frames from F3R are modified so as to be compliant with F4.2 and beyond. Side arrays are in the road map of F4.3 or F5...

Ok, good for future upgrades then. But top, bottom & rear sectors are still left out.

These containers may be jettisonable in case of... and more aero shapped that on this picture.
It is only usefull in the very first days of a war, the time to destroy the opponent radars and SAM.

No i mean they cannot be jettisioned bcoz of their stealthy material can't fall into enemy's hands.
In very 1st days of war also during SEAD/DEAD there could/would be some losses of 4th gen jets like we are seeing in Ukraine now. We can't assume that all the SAMs would fail.
When the jet itself is not 5th gen + the missiles are not stealthy then a stealthy container won't help.
S/MRBMs & CrMs with various types of payload can also be used to destroy any fixed targets.

 

[BON PLAN]

Buying a 4th Gen fighter like Rafale with same price is a bad deal. Period. Go find a deal where Rafale actually won against f-35 View attachment 149566

In UAE.
80 to 0

It is a nice slap.

 

[Picard]

Rafale does have a self protection and escort jamming suite called SPECTRA- that can protect the aircraft. One can argue which self protection suite is better in 4th Gen fighters (AN/ALQ-254, AN/ALQ-214, SAAB ICMS) but again, they remain self protection suites.
Now I do get tired of repeating the capability of over 1600 TRM notched behemoth APG-81 of F-35 or 1500 TRM APG-79 of F-18 with over 10x more peak power, wide band jammers, 1 degree locational accuracy and long range supersonic anti-radiation missiles to finish the job when none of these are present on a $150 million Rafale! Heck Rafale didn't even have an HMD till India paid billion dollars to French for it.

OK, I intended to "peace out" as you said, but this is just a misrepresentation of what I was saying.

You are dismissing Rafale for not having a certain capability... when Rafale was designed specifically to operate without it. I have already explained that Rafale doesn't need to have anything more than self-protection suite, because it was never designed to provide escort for other aircraft: Rafale does everything ("omnirole"), and thus Rafales only need to protect themselves.

Also, 1 degree directional accuracy is literally what SPECTRA has. And it also has wide band jammers. So your "none of these are present on Rafale" is quite incorrect. In fact, much of that "150 million USD" sum was eaten up by SPECTRA development.

 

[Fonck83]

Buying a 4th Gen fighter like Rafale with same price is a bad deal. Period. Go find a deal where Rafale actually won against f-35 View attachment 149566

Tell us about why
Finland have an extra 9,4 billion US dollar agreeement for 64 F-35 ?
Canada have a very bad 15,8 billion US dollar for 88 F-35 ?

 

[Aniruddha Mulay]

Buying a 4th Gen fighter like Rafale with same price is a bad deal. Period. Go find a deal where Rafale actually won against f-35 View attachment 149566

Says who, a country which is selling 36 F-15IQ fighter jets to Indonesia for a price of $14 billion.

 

[SARTHAK]

Buying a 4th Gen fighter like Rafale with same price is a bad deal. Period. Go find a deal where Rafale actually won against f-35 View attachment 149566

you clearly don't understand the diplomacy that goes around these purchases, equipment from different nations have strings attached to diplomacy, coercive measures and lobbying is common ,indian purchases from usa are generally a balancing act to nullify purchases from russia and france is a comparatively more neutral so it is more compatible likewise many countries do this

 

[Wisemarko]

Canada have a very bad 15,8 billion US dollar for 88 F-35 ?

Canada hasn't even started negotiations for the deal and you already know how much they paid? Also Canadians are development partners for F-35 and they will pay themselves for lot of things. The entire deal will be very different (and complex) than G2G deals. For instance Canadians want to develop ecosystem for future export of components and technology as well.

 

[Wisemarko]

you clearly don't understand the diplomacy that goes around these purchases, equipment from different nations have strings attached to diplomacy, coercive measures and lobbying is common ,indian purchases from usa are generally a balancing act to nullify purchases from russia and france is a comparatively more neutral so it is more compatible likewise many countries do this

What diplomacy was involved in paying $2 billion for upgrading Mirage-2000 without AESA or Meteor? What balancing act took place when you paid $600,000 each for AASM because Rafale doesn't have JDAM integration (which is a scam because it is not difficult integration. But french want their clients to buy expensive add ons and weapons).

Don't mix bad deals and diplomacy

 

[Wisemarko]

In UAE.
80 to 0

It is a nice slap.

UAE hahaha: here is from UAE- slap on Macron

To clarify: UAE absolutely wants F-35 and wouldn't even buy Rafale. They have been offended by our dumb Biden administration and rightfully angry about it. There are some concerns about Chinese base in UAE but that's more of an excuse to reneg on the F-35 deal cleared by Trump.

 

[Love Charger]

What diplomacy was involved in paying $2 billion for upgrading Mirage-2000 without AESA or Meteor? What balancing act took place when you paid $600,000 each for AASM because Rafale doesn't have JDAM integration (which is a scam because it is not difficult integration. But french want their clients to buy expensive add ons and weapons).

Don't mix bad deals and diplomacy

We Indians are bad negotiators
Since its a defense forum, i can discuss few wars after india got independence from Britain in 47.
In 1948, Pakistan attacked kashmir region , they reached till its capital Sri Nagar
The king of kashmir asked indias help, we sent in indian army freshly experienced from ww2 and battle hardened throughly
We pushed the pakis back and back till winters of 1949 , then our first prime minister ran to United nations and internationalised kashmir issue even though the generals were confident to push Pakistanis completely out of kashmir and winning too ,
In 1971, we could have taken some northern areas of today's Bangladesh, we didn't.
Hence now we are their mercy to connect to our north eastern states ,
Its runs deep in indian government , they are never good negotiators even when in a advantageous position.

 

[Wisemarko]

We Indians are bad negotiators
Since its a defense forum, i can discuss few wars after india got independence from Britain in 47.
In 1948, Pakistan attacked kashmir region , they reached till its capital Sri Nagar
The king of kashmir asked indias help, we sent in indian army freshly experienced from ww2 and battle hardened throughly
We pushed the pakis back and back till winters of 1949 , then our first prime minister ran to United nations and internationalised kashmir issue even though the generals were confident to push Pakistanis completely out of kashmir and winning too ,
In 1971, we could have taken some northern areas of today's Bangladesh, we didn't.
Hence now we are their mercy to connect to our north eastern states ,
Its runs deep in indian government , they are never good negotiators even when in a advantageous position.

Every nation has its aching points. Overall india is in good hands now and hopefully good times will prevail.

 

[Love Charger]

Every nation has its aching points. Overall india is in good hands now and hopefully good times will prevail.

I know , American military hardware is best in the world generally.
Indian government dosent purchase any big American equipments like fighter planes because we perceive Americans are little unreliable, ( a cold war experience ) and us equipment is costly
I dont want to be rude but america uses military equipment sale to further its geopolitical goals.
And America won't help India in making nuke submarines or other strategic equipments too.

 

[Love Charger]

The average Indian dosent hate usa though.

 

[Covfefe]

We Indians are bad negotiators
Since its a defense forum, i can discuss few wars after india got independence from Britain in 47.
In 1948, Pakistan attacked kashmir region , they reached till its capital Sri Nagar
The king of kashmir asked indias help, we sent in indian army freshly experienced from ww2 and battle hardened throughly
We pushed the pakis back and back till winters of 1949 , then our first prime minister ran to United nations and internationalised kashmir issue even though the generals were confident to push Pakistanis completely out of kashmir and winning too ,
In 1971, we could have taken some northern areas of today's Bangladesh, we didn't.
Hence now we are their mercy to connect to our north eastern states ,
Its runs deep in indian government , they are never good negotiators even when in a advantageous position.

Nope, Indians are the most miser buyers in procurement but with the French it's not an option. We know for what it is, and they too know it. America is a very risky supplier especially for non Anglo Saxon countries - you never know which random aunty sitting in an obscure county will present a bill of "Hooomun rights" or whatever the prevalent propaganda item for the day (environment, labour laws, democracy, women rights, lgbtqia, or just about anything) and they'll start messing with your supplies. French know this anxiety very well, and spares and post deal sales are for captive customers - there's isn't much of a negotiating leverage with the buyer. Also, their scale isn't that of American manufacturing so costs are going to be higher. (That said I still think the whole Mirage upgrade program was a big scam)

 

[Wisemarko]

Americans are little unreliable,

We are dumb in so many ways. Smart nations know that and bear with us or trick us. But when comes to weapons once supplied, no problems.

 

[Love Charger]

We are dumb in so many ways. Smart nations know that and bear with us or trick us

Americans are anything but dumb. Hehe

 

[Bhartiya Sainik]

We Indians are bad negotiators
Since its a defense forum, i can discuss few wars after india got independence from Britain in 47.
In 1948, Pakistan attacked kashmir region , they reached till its capital Sri Nagar
The king of kashmir asked indias help, we sent in indian army freshly experienced from ww2 and battle hardened throughly
We pushed the pakis back and back till winters of 1949 , then our first prime minister ran to United nations and internationalised kashmir issue even though the generals were confident to push Pakistanis completely out of kashmir and winning too ,
In 1971, we could have taken some northern areas of today's Bangladesh, we didn't.
Hence now we are their mercy to connect to our north eastern states ,
Its runs deep in indian government , they are never good negotiators even when in a advantageous position.

Correction - these bad negotiators in past were mostly monarchs, colonial puppets with no patriotism.
BTW let me remind every citizen that the word India also Greek-Latin, i'm really ashamed of using it on papers.

 

[Wisemarko]

Correction - these bad negotiators in past were mostly monarchs, colonial puppets with no patriotism.
BTW let me remind every citizen that the word India also Greek-Latin, i'm really ashamed of using it on papers.

Isn't the word "Hindu" Persian?

 

[Bhartiya Sainik]

Americans are anything but dumb. Hehe

They are very management oriented since beginning till date, by hook or crook. After WW they gathered captured foreign scientists to make foundation of their war industry. Today also as USD is dominating global economy, people from various nations are running after it, even seeking green-card & US citizenship rather than building their country, such is the power of money.
Any country refusing to take their advice & trade in abundance with them automatically becomes a threat by default.