Is Air force capable of Two Front War?

[Oracle]

I think all of us are missing one point- what stops India from attacking Pakistan? their nukes, right? now logically, dont you think the same deterrent will apply to China. Would China risk Indian nukes falling on Chinese cities in the event Idia is on the brink of losing a war with China? I knowthat Chinese Nuke arsenal far outnumbers ours, but then, nukes are not only about numbers. Plus India's recent missile developments along with strike packages like the MKI with mid air refuelling, brings a lot of chinese cities under our nuke range.

So therefore, I dont think a wo front war or an all out war with China is likely. What is more likely is those mad Pakis launching a misadventure, but china is highly unlikely to step in......did they do so in Kargil?

Just my two paise!

If Pakistan has to toss a nuke, it would mean Pakistan has already lost the war. Nukes are for deterrence, not for war fighting. Pakistan has no hope of surviving a nuclear retaliation, and even they know that.

 

[ace009]

PLAAF

2011:

J10:200-220
su27,su30,J11A/B/BS: 250-300
JH7/7A:120-150
J8 series:>200
J7 series:>600

by 2015
+
modified CF1:unknown
J10B:>100
J11B/BS:>100
JH7B:unknown
J15(modified su33):<50
J16:unknown
J20,J19:<10
Y20:<10
Y9:unknown
H-6K:unknown

by 2020
+
steath bomber
stealth UCAV
exported/carrier-based J-XX

for more information about PLAAF,you can visit here

Chinese Military Aviation

Some of these numbers look too high - for example J-20 in 2015 - for an aircraft with first flight in 2010 even one squadron by 2015 seems like optimistic.
what is J-19?
What is Y-20?
What is Y-9 or H-6K?

Anyway, a head to head comparison of IAF and PLAAF will look like ...

2015 -
IAF PLAAF
Su-30MKI ~200 su27,su30,J11A/B/BS: ~300-350
Mig 29 ~60 (upgraded ~30) J10A/B: ~250-300
Mirage 2000 ~50 (upgraded ~20) JH7/A/B: ~150-200
MMRCA ~20 J15/16: ~50
Mig-21Bis ~140 J7: 200
Mig 27 ~100 J8: ~600
Jaguar ~100 Others: ~100
LCA Mk1 ~40

 

[aimarraul]

Some of these numbers look too high - for example J-20 in 2015 - for an aircraft with first flight in 2010 even one squadron by 2015 seems like optimistic.
what is J-19?
What is Y-20?
What is Y-9 or H-6K?

China's first large transporter may fly in 2012 - People's Daily Online

Y-20,Y-9


H-6K

One of the H-6K (K/JH6K?) cruise missile carrier prototypes was undergoing a test flight at CFTE. This new variant first flew on January 5, 2007 at XAC. Two prototypes have been produced (861 & 862). Its major improvement is to replace two fuel-thirsty WP-8/AM-3 turojet engines with Russian D-30 series turbofan engines (D-30KP-2? TO thrust 12,000kg, the same engine used by Il-76MDs in service with PLAAF), resulting in a greater range (30% more?) and a higher cruise speed. Around 55 D-30KP-2 engines were imported from Russia between 2009-2011. It is believed that D-30KP-2 is being reverse-engineered as WS-18 by the Chengdu Engine Corporation. Other improvements include a redesigned solid nose housing a large ground search radar, a chin mounted FLIR/TV turret for night/poor weather missions, nose MAWS sensors, a SATCOM antenna on the top of rear fuselage, a datalink antenna on the bottom of rear fuselage, solid tail cone housing electronics with the tail gunner compartment removed, 6 underwing missile pylons and use of composite materials to reduce weight. Its cockpit has been completely redesigned featuring 6 color MFDs. The aircraft now has 3-member crew located in the forward cabin (two pilots+WSO), each eqipped with a new ejection seat to improve pilot survivalbility. The crew can also get into/out of the cabin quickly through a side door. The internal bomb bay appears retained and no IFR probe has been found. A total of 6 large long-range cruise missles may be carried, which might be the air-launched version of CJ-10 (CJ-10K?) curise missile (range 2,500km, similar to Russian Kh-55). Some images suggested it may also carry a mix of different types of missles, including the smaller KD-63 ASM. H-6K is capable of flying strategic missions with these long-range curise missiles (armed with nuclear warheads). It also has the potential to be converted into ASW aircraft or tanker in the future. The latest images (May 2011) indicated that the first batch of H-6Ks are entering the service with PLAAF (S/N 11x9x?).





J19

It was first rumored in August 2010 that SAC is developing a 3.5 generation heavy multi-role fighter bomber (J-16?) based on J-11BS. The aircraft can be viewed as an upgraded version of Su-30MKK based on its mission and capability, which is comparable to American F-15E. First flight was rumored to be between 2011-2012. J-16 has tandem seats with a WSO sitting in the backseat. It features an enhanced fire-control system (AESA?) with additional AG modes. Besides PL-8 and PL-12 AAMs, it could also carry the same precision guided weapons being carried by JH-7A, such as KD-88 ASM and LS-500J LGB. Compared to JH-7A, J-16 is expected to have a more powerful radar (AESA?), a greater weapon load (8t) and a longer range (4,000km). A further improved variant (J-17?) with stealth enhancements such as comformal weapon bay, stealth optimized engine intakes and canted vertical tailfins are also rumored to be under development at SAC. A recent rumor (April 2011) claimed that SAC is developing a 4th generation heavy multi-role stealth fighter with a conventional design including large LERX and Caret inlets simliar to American F-22 (J-19?). First flight was rumored to be between 2011-2012. However not all of these stealth fighter projects will eventually enter the service since PLAAF simply cannot afford all of them.

SAC first time admit that they are developing a next generation fighter which will start trial production by 2015

?????


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——沈阳飞机设计研究所创建50周年纪实报道之七

　中国航空报 2011年7月16日 星期六

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从跟踪创新到自主创新——

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[aimarraul]

instead of thinking of how to win a two front war all the time india should try her best to make peace with pakistan ,it will be totally nightmare for any country if such a scenario becomes a reality

 

[badguy2000]

two side war?

India even can not win a one-side war against CHina.

 

[LETHALFORCE]

two side war?

India even can not win a one-side war against CHina.

And China can't win against Taiwan

 

[ace009]

two side war?

India even can not win a one-side war against CHina.

You sure China will win against India - no doubts whatsoever?

 

[Dovah]

India even can not win a one-side war against CHina.

Whatever happened to the peaceful rise of China.

 

[Dovah]

instead of thinking of how to win a two front war all the time india should try her best to make peace with Pakistan

Exactly, after all every Pakistani wants to co-exist peacefully with a terrorist sponsor like India who perpetrated several attacks on their soil, for example the 2008 Mumbai attack.....oh wait

 

[plugwater]

I thought that between production slow down at HAL and super 30 upgradation, we would NOT have 230 Su-30 MKI by 2015.

I saw a news article that HAL produce close to 30 MKIs every year. So we will finish 230 ACs by 2015.

 

[Zebra]

I saw a news article that HAL produce close to 30 MKIs every year. So we will finish 230 ACs by 2015.

May be , 2017 - before they start FGFA they will make all MKI , if I am not wrong .
Any way my point is IAF needs more a/cs which can counter F 16 ( west front ) . ASAP . So that all other heavy a/cs can be on east front .

 

[Zebra]

two side war?

India even can not win a one-side war against CHina.

That is true , but for sure at the heavy cost .

 

[ace009]

Dude - in case of an India China war, anything short of a IRBM barrage from China, there is NO WAY the Chinese can expect an outright victory against India. And I wonder what the US response would be if China hits India with 300 IRBMs!

 

[Oracle]

instead of thinking of how to win a two front war all the time india should try her best to make peace with pakistan ,it will be totally nightmare for any country if such a scenario becomes a reality

This has been India's intention all these years and even now. However it has given India more terrorist attacks.

You have to understand it is not the Civilian Government that is in power in Pakistan, it is the PA & ISI. And the moment they drop the hate India mentality, the PA & ISI lose the edge in Pakistan. PA & ISI survive on the fake hatred they have generated and indoctrinated in the minds of the Pakistanis, against India and Indians.

 

[Yusuf]

I saw a news article that HAL produce close to 30 MKIs every year. So we will finish 230 ACs by 2015.

They are struggling to make 12 a year. AF us demanding it ups it to about 18 which they can't with the present infra.

 

[binayak95]

Dude - in case of an India China war, anything short of a IRBM barrage from China, there is NO WAY the Chinese can expect an outright victory against India. And I wonder what the US response would be if China hits India with 300 IRBMs!

I think the USA will probably return the favour and give China a barrage. But India's strategic missiles are good enough to do some damage to the Chinese military. we are hypothesizing that this two front war will happen post 2017, right. That's good news because by that time, our Anti missile defense systems such as the PAD & the AAD will have been deployed.

 

[Param]

I think the USA will probably return the favour and give China a barrage. But India's strategic missiles are good enough to do some damage to the Chinese military. we are hypothesizing that this two front war will happen post 2017, right. That's good news because by that time, our Anti missile defense systems such as the PAD & the AAD will have been deployed.

Why would they(US) do that? We are not in a military alliance with them. One should not expect too much.And how would our 30 or so strategic missiles do damage to the Chinese military? They are meant for detterrence and wasting those for conventional strikes would be suicide.

If China launches a barrage of 300 IRBMs there is not much we can do about it.

 

[Yusuf]

I think the USA will probably return the favour and give China a barrage. But India's strategic missiles are good enough to do some damage to the Chinese military. we are hypothesizing that this two front war will happen post 2017, right. That's good news because by that time, our Anti missile defense systems such as the PAD & the AAD will have been deployed.

And for what joy will the US send a barrage of missiles into China for India? Why will they risk their cities for India? Last I checked, we are not part of NATO.

 

[binayak95]

And for what joy will the US send a barrage of missiles into China for India? Why will they risk their cities for India? Last I checked, we are not part of NATO.

Because its in the interest of US. a war between India and China is the only chance that US will have to take on China and emerge victorious. Besides American cities are safe. They have got multi tiered missile defense systems from the coast of Japan through Pacific naval bases such as Guam and Midway to the Pacific coast of US itself and these systems have been in place since the days of the Cold War.

And India is a "strategic ally" of US and Russia

 

[Yusuf]

Because its in the interest of US. a war between India and China is the only chance that US will have to take on China and emerge victorious. Besides American cities are safe. They have got multi tiered missile defense systems from the coast of Japan through Pacific naval bases such as Guam and Midway to the Pacific coast of US itself and these systems have been in place since the days of the Cold War.

And India is a "strategic ally" of US and Russia

You have no clue about how the US thinks.