INSAS Rifle, LMG & Carbine

[pmaitra]

Let's keep this thread about INSAS.

Some posts have been moved here: http://defenceforumindia.com/forum/land-forces/3796-assault-rifle-136.html#post792976

 

[Kunal Biswas]

Amogh was not rejected by Army, MSMC was preferred due to its size , Which is very little ..

Amogh is service within Indian Navy and Paramilitary , This was mentioned in this thread with the link you quoted..

Amogh together with the MSMC should be the ideal 5.56 mm weapons for policing and law enforcement. The Amogh perhaps would fare better it if had a collapsible stock instead of a folding one. Both look sexy and though Amogh was rjected by Army, there is no reason why Policiing units cannot use it for domestic security.

=========================

In hands of trained men there is no difference, Logistics was always an issue ..

All firearms are meant to be in 5.56mm ..

INSAS LMG dont have a quick barrel change option unlike old bren
But army still love its Bren LMG because of its round ,so why did't the OFB made a 7.62mm NATO insas LMG

========================

Wrong, Rifles are designated by there length of the barrel and cartage size, Insas has 18inch barrel ..

INSAS is not a semi-automatic Rifle..

I think rifle needs to be fully automatic to be called an Assault rifle like AK47 .. .

===============================

You missed most important part ..

"Around the Corner, Within a Window" Fighting with Minimum Exposure/Maximum Lethality, Mobility and Survivability
IMI's unique Air Burst Ammunition is designed for assault rifles such as the IDF's Tavor, as well as other assault rifles, including M4, SA80, FAMAS and others, which can serve as part of integrated soldier systems.

The IMI Air Burst Ammunition can be used in rifle grenades, a 40mm grenade for M203/AG-36 and other grenade launchers, as well as in non-lethal and intelligence applications. In the rifle grenade and 40 mm grenade versions, Air Burst Ammunition meets operational demands for optimum lethality, mobility and survivability, along with improved orientation capabilities - the factors that are critical in dynamic urban warfare scenarios. It supports specific objectives: to allow firing with both eyes open, in day and night scenarios, with lightweight, easy to operate rifles

User-Friendly and Easy to Operate The IMI armament is easy to fire. A soldier selects the mode of action - air burst, time delay, point detonation - based on the type of target, measures the range, feeds the data into the armament, aims precisely at the target and shoots.
High Momentum Firing for Increased Range

In an integrated soldier weapon system, much of the intelligence is gathered by a sight assembly which is added to the weapon to replace existing sights. A controller on the clip allows the user to operate the system, without having to interrupt the weapon's operation. A communications unit handles the interface between the sight and the armament, allowing operational data to be broadcast. The recoil absorption mechanism is designed in order to support high-momentum firing to increase maximum range.

The Over-The-Hill Intelligence Grenade meets the demands of the digital battlefield. It supports information-gathering of "over-the-hill" scenarios taking place in NLOS (Non Line of Sight) areas, providing real-time intelligence without the need to endanger human life or engage UAVs. This version is based on the original Air Burst Ammunition configuration, replacing a lethal payload with a digital camera and wireless communications. The soldier's fire is controlled by the sight, which focuses on suspicious areas. The camera begins to photograph immediately after firing. Images are manually received by a hand-held computer. The soldier views real-time intelligence and can fast forward or reverse the film. Firing data provide target coordinates of the target on view

^^ IMI MPRS mounted on INSAS ..

new grip ,naked gun.....

========================

Care to read the thread, You will have your answer ..

Is here any updates on the MSMC Sub machine gun?

And arent INSAS being replaced? I heard even Ak-47 is better than INSAS?

 

[rohit b3]

Care to read the thread, You will have your answer ..

The thread is huge, im reading it in parts. Actually i was in Kashmir a few months back and got a oppurtunity to talk to our soldiers. Learnt a lot about them. On asking them would they prefer an INSAS or Ak-47, all(3 of them actually) had the same reply. Ak-47 anyday. ONe of them even explained that Ak-47 has more range and more "power".

 

[Kunal Biswas]

In counter terrorism operations, AK is preferred coz it serve the purpose of spray and pray, INSAS is preferred over AK coz of Range and precision ..

It used to be that AK round is more powerful, But now Indian Army is fielding heavier and more lethal 5.56mm rounds since some years now ..

==================

Which soldiers you talked to ? Are they from Army or Paramilitary / Police ?
.

ONe of them even explained that Ak-47 has more range and more "power".

 

[rohit b3]

In counter terrorism operations, AK is preferred coz it serve the purpose of spray and pray, INSAS is preferred over AK coz of Range and precision ..

It used to be that AK round is more powerful, But now Indian Army is fielding heavier and more lethal 5.56mm rounds since some years now ..

==================

Which soldiers you talked to ? Are they from Army or Paramilitary / Police ?
.

Theres a rope way called Gandola. I asked two guys there, at the top. I dunno exactly from which regiment/department they belonged.

Apart from that, my longest conversation lasting almost 2 hours was with a guy at Chandawadi. He belonged to the Signal and Communication department. He was serving in the Army for 6 Years. He told me several things which sounded quite de moralising


Apart from that, there was another guy walking around and joinin our convo occasionally, from the same camp. He had been serving for 20 years and proudly told me about his service in Somalia and Siachen.

 

[Kunal Biswas]

Its interesting for civilians to interact with Soldiers, It is concerning if some solider speaking of demoralizing things to civilian..

I wonder how the units is, Signal is not infantry and 6 years for this young chap is too less to comment such ..

He belonged to the Signal and Communication department. He was serving in the Army for 6 Years. He told me several things which sounded quite de moralising.

 

[sydsnyper]

Re: INSAS Rifle, LMG & Carbine

@Kunal sir - Are there any updates to the Trichy Assault Rifle. Ever since I saw the exhibition pic of the SLR like foregrip (the pic where a guy shows the rifle to a girl in some defence expo in TN), it has captured my interest and curiosity.

I loved the look of the rifle. Would you have any new/first hand pics of it?

 

[sayareakd]

Re: INSAS Rifle, LMG & Carbine

@Kunal sir - Are there any updates to the Trichy Assault Rifle. Ever since I saw the exhibition pic of the SLR like foregrip (the pic where a guy shows the rifle to a girl in some defence expo in TN), it has captured my interest and curiosity.

I loved the look of the rifle. Would you have any new/first hand pics of it?

 

[sydsnyper]

Re: INSAS Rifle, LMG & Carbine

These are exactly the pics I was talking about..... any news on how they are faring in their user trials...

 

[angeldude13]

The thread is huge, im reading it in parts. Actually i was in Kashmir a few months back and got a oppurtunity to talk to our soldiers. Learnt a lot about them. On asking them would they prefer an INSAS or Ak-47, all(3 of them actually) had the same reply. Ak-47 anyday. ONe of them even explained that Ak-47 has more range and more "power".

You are lucky.
I got scolded by a old fauji when i asked him few questions about INSAS.
He said it was none of my business.
I am really scared to talk to any jawan about rifles now

 

[Rohan Nautiyal]

Its interesting for civilians to interact with Soldiers, It is concerning if some solider speaking of demoralizing things to civilian..

I wonder how the units is, Signal is not infantry and 6 years for this young chap is too less to comment such ..

Kunal Sir, shouldn't we use drum mag for INSAS LMG???? Only 35 rounds per mag isn't enough......

 

[Kunal Biswas]

Read this thread, Lots of interesting discussion here abt Trichy Assault Rifle ..

 

[Kunal Biswas]

Talked about this sometime back..

@Kunal Biswas can we use drum magazine in INSAS rifle?

I also think if we use poisonous bullets in INSAS rifle? One shot one kill?

Oh, sorry move it to INSAS rifle and LMG thread.

@Kunal Biswas Why do we not use drum mags for INSAS LMG? I have a drum mag design of 100 rounds that is half the size of a 100 round C-Mag which takes 30 sec to load up.

this carry 150 and double drum for better balance

INSAS is very strictly as per GSQR, So you see everything on INSAS as per GSQR, In IA LMG was always meant for Magazine where as need for GPMG only came after Kargil War, Where 30rnd mag was found insufficient for continues suppressive fire..

May be if someone make a new GSQR keeping suppressive fire in mind may think of it..

X-15 50 round drum magazine

Its shorter in length compare to a 30rnd Mag of AR-15 / INSAS LMG,


=========================
=========================

Size of the Magazine and Weight are primary concern, A solution balanced between these two factor may be a good choice..

Kunal Sir, shouldn't we use drum mag for INSAS LMG???? Only 35 rounds per mag isn't enough......

 

[rugved]

Talked about this sometime back..

On the outset, MAC is the best firearms channel I have seen on YouTube. :cool2:

 

[hitesh]

Kunal Sir, shouldn't we use drum mag for INSAS LMG???? Only 35 rounds per mag isn't enough......

INSAS LMG has 30 round mag even the full capacity is never used due to mag spring issue ...

 

[Kunal Biswas]

Loading a mag to full capacity will degrade the spring quickly, The same goes for any other firearm ..

INSAS LMG has 30 round mag even the full capacity is never used due to mag spring issue ...

 

[W.G.Ewald]

Large drums don't make any sense to me. Using a box feeding a belt must be easier, like US Army M 249 SAW.

 

[sayareakd]

IHMO the idea is that soldiers dont waste ammo, with belt feed of double drum they will tend to put more bullets on target then what is needed.

Therefore IA used 30 Bullet mag for the LMG. In long war it will be decisive factor.

 

[Kunal Biswas]

From CT Encounters ..

 

[Saumyasupraik]

M-16 is also available in fully-automatic.

They used them in Vietnam, IIRC. @W.G.Ewald, please confirm.




Ok, a battlefield rifle and an assault rifle are essentially guns that fire spinning projectiles, but a sub-machine-gun might or might not fire spinning bullets, depending on whether it is a rifle or a smooth-bore.

Yes, a sub-machine-gun will be ideal for a shorter range and the length of the bullet will be smaller, even if the diameter is bigger.

Secondly, I do not know the difference between a battlefield rifle and an assault rifle. Can you clarify that a bit?

I think he means battlerifle and not battlefield rifle. Battle rifle are select fire rifles which fire full size cartridges like the 7.5x55mm Swiss and 7.62mm NATO, rifles in this category are the FAL, M14, G3, AR-10, SIG 510 etc.