INSAS Rifle, LMG & Carbine

[ManhattanProject]

Same ?

You mean both are Ak derivative ?

no the ofb one is a short stroke gas piston system, more like a sig 550 series rifle.

 

[Vishalreddy3]

. 303 Lee Enfield rifle sniper of Prakasham district police (pics already posted in Indian Police Thread)

You can check its review and accuracy in this video!

 

[Tuco]

About guns @Levina has posted a good informative interview.

 

[Johny_Baba]

Seriously you guys are bitching so much over a 3gp quality pic of this new OFB Carbine

If that pic is the problem then have a look on these before building opinions...

 

[Johny_Baba]

no the ofb one is a short stroke gas piston system, more like a sig 550 series rifle.

nope it's long stroke as usual,and even SIG 550 series is long stroke gas piston type.

 

[Vishalreddy3]

Kevin pietersen with forest rangers of kaziranga national park armed with SLRs.
What's eye catching is that they wear maroon berets

 

[vampyrbladez]

Seriously you guys are bitching so much over a 3gp quality pic of this new OFB Carbine

If that pic is the problem then have a look on these before building opinions...

OFB clearly has no idea about weapon ergonomics.

Same spot welded sights, disjointed picatinny rail, non ergonomic stock, no picatinny rail for foregrip or grenade launcher/flashlight, no muzzle device options, weird pistol grip, questionable QC

I hope the private sector gets this tender.

 

[Suryavanshi]

I hope the private sector gets this tender

There are none competing for it

 

[Unknowncommando 2]

 

[vampyrbladez]

There are none competing for it

We have MKU with Caracal (CAR 816) , MKU with Thales (FN 90) , IWI with Punj Lloyd (Tavor and Galil) and two dark horses (Astr Defence and SSS Defence)

For comparison :

Astr Defence

SSS Defence

OFB

 

[Suryavanshi]

We have MKU with Caracal (CAR 816) , MKU with Thales (FN 90) , IWI with Punj Lloyd (Tavor and Galil) and two dark horses (Astr Defence and SSS Defence)

For comparison :

Astr Defence

SSS Defence

OFB

Sss defence has alredy been debunked.
ASTR defence we don't know anything about them.
OFB is well OFB

 

[vampyrbladez]

Sss defence has alredy been debunked.
ASTR defence we don't know anything about them.
OFB is well OFB

Debunked? Those guys are doing trials for their sniper rifle with Indian Army and have a JV with LMT which makes some of the best AR 15/10 rifles in the world!

If OFB gets the contract, you will see another INSAS style replacement 10 years down the line. Better to reduce damage now than later.

Stupid MOD Babus with their political games and whisper network .

 

[Vishalreddy3]

We have MKU with Caracal (CAR 816) , MKU with Thales (FN 90) , IWI with Punj Lloyd (Tavor and Galil) and two dark horses (Astr Defence and SSS Defence)

For comparison :

Astr Defence

SSS Defence

OFB

Completely forgot about Thales partnership with Larsen and Toubro. FN90 is an amazing weapon, which is an standard issued one for Australian army!!

 

[Flying Dagger]

Debunked? Those guys are doing trials for their sniper rifle with Indian Army and have a JV with LMT which makes some of the best AR 15/10 rifles in the world!

If OFB gets the contract, you will see another INSAS style replacement 10 years down the line. Better to reduce damage now than later.

Stupid MOD Babus with their political games and whisper network .

I very much doubt OFB have any chance the best they got was TAR - for AK at double the price.

For Carbine MKU Caracal and IWI Carmel/ARAD are main competition.

Sig also have good chance as they may throw a derivative of same 716 DI rifle at low price.

 

[Vishalreddy3]

I very much doubt OFB have any chance the best they got was TAR - for AK at double the price.

For Carbine MKU Caracal and IWI Carmel/ARAD are main competition.

Sig also have good chance as they may throw a derivative of same 716 DI rifle at low price.

TAR had also been rejected during trials by IA.
In my opinion, when push comes to shove the only company we can trust with Technology/Technology Transfer/Price/Quality Control is IWI-Punj Loyd
Just look at the lineup, they are offering!! Arad, Carmel, Gallil Ace

 

[Johny_Baba]

OFB clearly has no idea about weapon ergonomics.

Same spot welded sights, disjointed picatinny rail, non ergonomic stock, no picatinny rail for foregrip or grenade launcher/flashlight, no muzzle device options, weird pistol grip, questionable QC

I hope the private sector gets this tender.

This was made as an potential replacement for dem 9mm Sterling "Carbines" ( irl SMGs) so if armed forces procure it then definitely it's an helluwa upgrade anyway,and it was designed by ARDE not OFB,
and you're forgetting the most important upgrade in terms of design part that's INSAS finally getting a sectional-receiver (similar to SG540//SG550 series), that too in a milled receiver so we can expect some good reliability here,
as for,
> Spot Welded sights
what's the issue when they are mounted on steady platform with newly designed sectional receiver unlike previous ones based on INSAS where they were mounted on hinged top cover ? even JVPC has got similar welded sights on its top sectional receiver,
and remember we don't have optics as standard issue thing here so operator need to have a basic iron sights set to aim with, I don't see any problem here.
> Disjointed Picatiny Rail
Again this is meant for CQB role, and whatever is given here on top is enough for combining a holographic sight and small Trijcon style (hinged) scope for short to mid-range engadments, i don't find much issue here either.

> non ergonomic stock, no picatinny rail for foregrip or grenade launcher/flashlight
Same stock is there on Amogh,INSAS Excalibur's Mk.1 iteration etc, so are grip on Amogh,Ghaatak etc
and if it works for them it'd work here as well

As for pica rails on 3/6/9 just look carefully on handguards re

There aren't intergrated rails on 3/6/9 positions but they indeed have provided mounts for it to screw rail sections etc as per requirement, guess something better than nothing.
As for grenade launcher we don't know if it could take standard ARDE 40mm UBGL under it after removal of that handguard or not, let's see but yeah maybe they could've done something about it.

>no muzzle device options
Again that's a threaded flash hider on it, directly taken from FNC pattern one and if they need they can remove it and put any other muzzle device on it having same thread pitch,
so such things aren't offered doesn't mean it cannot be done here.

>questionable QC
Yeah maybe this is a point where i have no disagreements with you,
but in terms of design i don't find much issues raised by you keeping the background of intended role (as replacement of Sterling SMG) and design of the firearm in mind.

 

[Johny_Baba]

Those guys are doing trials for their sniper rifle with Indian Army and have a JV with LMT which makes some of the best AR 15/10 rifles in the world!

Their JV with LMT has already been thrown into garbage as LMT is an amreeki company and they were forced to call it off due to ITAR ( International Traffic in Arms Regulations ).

 

[Flying Dagger]

TAR is not sought due to AK 203 it is otherwise a good piece but the price is insane as we were getting the original at half the price from Bulgaria.

And it's Adani now with IWI. Punj Lloyd sold off their share.

But in terms of bargain over TOT and license Caracal was willing to offer more they even offered us their carbine as well as rifle at lower price in comparison to Galil which a member mentioned was priced at 1600 dollars a piece. In that case Caracal all the way at 1100 dollars.

MKU is a very reliable defense supplier of IA so that provides them edge.

I do prefer if we can build a series of rifle around Carmel/Arad and with AK-203 in production we will be able to develop a good small arms industry.

TAR had also been rejected during trials by IA.
In my opinion, when push comes to shove the only company we can trust with Technology/Technology Transfer/Price/Quality Control is IWI-Punj Loyd
Just look at the lineup, they are offering!! Arad, Carmel, Gallil Ace

 

[Vishalreddy3]

TAR is not sought due to AK 203 it is otherwise a good piece but the price is insane as we were getting the original at half the price from Bulgaria.

And it's Adani now with IWI. Punj Lloyd sold off their share.

But in terms of bargain over TOT and license Caracal was willing to offer more they even offered us their carbine as well as rifle at lower price in comparison to Galil which a member mentioned was priced at 1600 dollars a piece. In that case Caracal all the way at 1100 dollars.

MKU is a very reliable defense supplier of IA so that provides them edge.

I do prefer if we can build a series of rifle around Carmel/Arad and with AK-203 in production we will be able to develop a good small arms industry.

I feel we have to as greedy as possible!!
Acquire all the technology through TOT from various companies. If caracal agrees for ToT, then aquire them, since its only for 93,000 units which is not even 25-30% of carbine requirements of the IA. The rest can be compensated with others
Within 10 years, we've got to be self sufficient in small arms manufacturing

 

[Suryavanshi]

I feel we have to as greedy as possible!!
Acquire all the technology through TOT from various companies. If caracal agrees for ToT, then aquire them, since its only for 93,000 units which is not even 25-30% of carbine requirements of the IA. The rest can be compensated with others
Within 10 years, we've got to be self sufficient in small arms manufacturing

Absorbed by who?
OFB had a lot of TOT but couldn't do much with it. Absorption of TOT is also important.