INSAS Rifle, LMG & Carbine

[Suryavanshi]

I wish we could go fully Indigenous in aircraft manufacturing, well at least with Tejas mk 2 we have a reply for Pak jf 17.

 

[Chinmoy]

4 Kg weight for loaded or without magazine?

 

[bole]

@Chinmoy, I believe without mag.

 

[Chinmoy]

And the SLR magazine, Its going to be heavy ..

How about reducing the Magazine from 20 rnds to 15 rnds? This would result in considerable weight as well as length reduction. As of now, the magazine too seems to be bit longer for battlefield purpose.

 

[itsme]

How about reducing the Magazine from 20 rnds to 15 rnds? This would result in considerable weight as well as length reduction. As of now, the magazine too seems to be bit longer for battlefield purpose.

15 is too low. They should just get rid of SLR mag and make a new mag out of high-grade polymer or fiber. Also, the butt needs to be changed to something more ergonomic and 21st century like not some 80s design. These ppl in OFB need to update themselves. I personally also think the barrel is too long.

 

[Chinmoy]

15 is too low. They should just get rid of SLR mag and make a new mag out of high-grade polymer or fiber. Also, the butt needs to be changed to something more ergonomic and 21st century like not some 80s design. These ppl in OFB need to update themselves. I personally also think the barrel is too long.

Yeah, 15 is bit low in number, but what you would loose in numbers could be made up with hit impact. Change in doctrine occurred as single 5.56rnd is unable to stop tango dead in track. But it could be achieved with a single well placed 7.62, but again 20 or 30 rnds magazines depends entirely on GSQR.

High grade polymer or fiber is something which we would see eventually during the development phase. As far as butt is considered, I think its a clever design to keep the weight on minimal side with full metal design. Now metal is what had been sought by IA instead of polymer. So I think its ok.

There are many things which we have to consider while designing a barrel. Length of barrel does effect the range of bullet as we all know. But along with it the rifling too and the number of twist does effect the range. How much twist you have to provide the round before it exist the barrel is something which does decide on range along with barrel length. You might have noticed that DMR firing 7.62 NATO round does have a longer barrel in comparison to AR. Now it is a known fact that longer barrel does assist in range by allowing the gases to act longer. But along with the gas its the amount of twist which plays a role here. So a shorter barrel would bring down the accuracy at the required 500 mtr range. As per the report, it exceed the expectation regarding range. So obviously barrel length played a important role here.

 

[Kunal Biswas]

@Chimoy already cleared a lot of things, I will few more to it ..

========

Once in service, The barrel never require a change at least for 1B1, 15rnds is too low as not every round is fired accurately, I think its a IA demand for metal magazine which i think its wrong as the polymer magazine is quite improved since 2010, Its quite feasible to issue polymer magazines ..

Regarding barrel, By look of it the rifle is shorter than SLR ( stupid long rifle ) which is great relief ..

What is the life of a assault rifle barrel?

And how is it measured during these tests?

How about reducing the Magazine from 20 rnds to 15 rnds? This would result in considerable weight as well as length reduction. As of now, the magazine too seems to be bit longer for battlefield purpose.

15 is too low. They should just get rid of SLR mag and make a new mag out of high-grade polymer or fiber. Also, the butt needs to be changed to something more ergonomic and 21st century like not some 80s design. These ppl in OFB need to update themselves. I personally also think the barrel is too long.

Yeah, 15 is bit low in number, but what you would loose in numbers could be made up with hit impact. Change in doctrine occurred as single 5.56rnd is unable to stop tango dead in track. But it could be achieved with a single well placed 7.62, but again 20 or 30 rnds magazines depends entirely on GSQR.

High grade polymer or fiber is something which we would see eventually during the development phase. As far as butt is considered, I think its a clever design to keep the weight on minimal side with full metal design. Now metal is what had been sought by IA instead of polymer. So I think its ok.

There are many things which we have to consider while designing a barrel. Length of barrel does effect the range of bullet as we all know. But along with it the rifling too and the number of twist does effect the range. How much twist you have to provide the round before it exist the barrel is something which does decide on range along with barrel length. You might have noticed that DMR firing 7.62 NATO round does have a longer barrel in comparison to AR. Now it is a known fact that longer barrel does assist in range by allowing the gases to act longer. But along with the gas its the amount of twist which plays a role here. So a shorter barrel would bring down the accuracy at the required 500 mtr range. As per the report, it exceed the expectation regarding range. So obviously barrel length played a important role here.

 

[debspark90]

And the SLR magazine, Its going to be heavy ..

@Kunal Biswas
The OFB still did a commendable job here given the time they had in their hand. We all thought they would simply use the SLR and mod it.
But to everyone's surprise they used the INSAS Mk1C platform and did the milling and forging of the barrel and bolt assemblies incl the lower from scratch..
The mag can be replaced by a new one on a later stage though.

The Pakistani POF tried to pimp the G3 into a modern looking rifle and not making the inside feom scratch, but still eventually was rejected..

 

[Butter Chicken]

Encounter starts in Baramulla.2 jihadis holed up


UPDATE: Both Jihadis get 72 each


Picture of one of the jihadis-Basit

 

[Kunal Biswas]

Honestly, I was very excited with MK1C in 5.56mm as its easy and fun to use and i consider it better ..

Now, That heavier round will surly make anyone`s day from good to bad, I remember what is like to use SLR ..

 

[Hari Sud]

I'll be blunt iam disgusted to see the Rifle !! The makers and designers are may be sitting on some different planet away from the modular designing ideas. If this is what they present for as an upgrade then, May The Almighty be With the Army. Zoom onto the pic of DG Infantry see the cover above the gas tube The rail which has been placed over will not even survive a day of hard combat involving crouching, rolling and falls it will either come out or will simply change the zeroed sights accuracy which will be fatal during any combat situation.

They can't even copy the bloody Russian stuff accurately.

The forehand grip will be a pain in the ass for troops during extended ops,as it has not been finished properly every time a round will be fired it will hurt your fingers.

Lord have mercy i am really sick of seeing such weapons and Gentlemen let me tell you one more thing,Such assault rifles keep getting tested throughout the year at various ranges and this is not a new Agni Pariksha which has started. IMHO we shouild go for a joint venture with IWI and start make in India.
And the Magzine

Do you belong to import only lobby group?

 

[itsme]

Do you belong to import only lobby group?

Do you honestly think this looks like an upgrade? As hammerhead suggested an JV with IWI will produce a great AR. And more over PL is gonna manufacture Tavors here.

 

[sbm]

Honestly, I was very excited with MK1C in 5.56mm as its easy and fun to use and i consider it better ..

Now, That heavier round will surly make anyone`s day from good to bad, I remember what is like to use SLR ..

Kunal, speaking with some guys at CLAWS, they were puzzled by the infantry's request. They could understand 7.62 x 39 but not this. That said, if it works, I'll be happy. Now I have to wonder what will become the section level LMG?

 

[ezsasa]

NDTV News scroll banner is saying Excalibur is junked by IA.

Is this news old or new?

 

[Akshay Fenix]

Some army chap on other forum too said this rifle will never be selected by IA as its too heavy and optimum weight "he" would prefer is 3 - 3.5 kgs. Current weight of the rifle will be an overkill for soldiers posted in high altitude regions like siachen, a region where you would think twice for carrying even an extra bullet.

Also it failed the tests conducted by Nagaland police.

 

[Mangal]

So we should assume AAR/MCIWS as good as dead?

 

[Vayuputra]

Heavy calibre means heavy barrel, so ultimately weight would be more compared to 5.56 based rifle. Don't understand their logic

 

[Kunal Biswas]

The rifle showed during the expo shows its wear and tear as it is a prototype went into trails, Its quality is gud enough and abrand new Russian AK 101 was put besides it for comparison, The photo which the Gen is holding is not clear, Its gud enough for knowing its a MK1C in 7.62x51mm ..

====

@hammer head also posted a lot about 1B1, You should read the thread ..

====

1B1 is design as per GSQR prepared by Army back in 90s, The MK1C in 7.62x51mm is based on the same design, It saves poor grunt from new training and cleaning procedure from start, It boost confidence as its something he is familiar with, This is not about some Nigerian Army or SF unit but +2 million strong army ..

Read the thread, get to know about problems 1B1 faced, Anything alien will go through the same problems ..

I'll be blunt iam disgusted to see the Rifle !! The makers and designers are may be sitting on some different planet away from the modular designing ideas. If this is what they present for as an upgrade then, May The Almighty be With the Army. Zoom onto the pic of DG Infantry see the cover above the gas tube The rail which has been placed over will not even survive a day of hard combat involving crouching, rolling and falls it will either come out or will simply change the zeroed sights accuracy which will be fatal during any combat situation.

They can't even copy the bloody Russian stuff accurately.

The forehand grip will be a pain in the ass for troops during extended ops,as it has not been finished properly every time a round will be fired it will hurt your fingers.

Lord have mercy i am really sick of seeing such weapons and Gentlemen let me tell you one more thing,Such assault rifles keep getting tested throughout the year at various ranges and this is not a new Agni Pariksha which has started. IMHO we shouild go for a joint venture with IWI and start make in India.
And the Magzine

Do you belong to import only lobby group?

Do you honestly think this looks like an upgrade? As hammerhead suggested an JV with IWI will produce a great AR. And more over PL is gonna manufacture Tavors here.

 

[cobra commando]

One report says:

"Desi shoot-to-kill rifle meets 99.9% requirements 1st trial."

another one says, army rejects made in India rifle:

http://www.ndtv.com/india-news/for-...rifles-made-in-india-rejected-by-army-1715267

wat teh phuk is going on, hain ??

 

[ezsasa]

One report says:

"Desi shoot-to-kill rifle meets 99.9% requirements 1st trial."

another one says, army rejects made in India rifle:

http://www.ndtv.com/india-news/for-...rifles-made-in-india-rejected-by-army-1715267

wat teh phuk is going on, hain ??

Ok.... the NDTV report is written by Vishnu som. The guy was pretty upset on live TV When 126 rafale deal was cancelled.

We'd rather wait for some time before some more sources to confirm the same.

Right now it is Govt lobby vs foreign lobby news articles coming out.