INS Vikramaditya (Adm Gorshkov) aircraft carrier

[youngindian]

Soviet Carrier Turns Into India's White Elephant

Published: 1 Aug 2009 10:25

NEW DELHI - When Russia gave India a retired Soviet aircraft carrier five years ago, New Delhi was delighted - little realizing the vessel would turn into a costly white elephant.

Russia, India's longtime weapons supplier, said in 2004 it would give the country the 44,570-ton "Admiral Gorshkov" as a gift, provided Delhi paid a Russian shipyard $974 million to refurbish the carrier.Since then, the price has skyrocketed for fixing up the 27-year-old ship, which was decommissioned after the collapse of the Soviet Union.

In 2007, Russia demanded $850 million more, citing cost escalations.

Then, six months ago, Russia startled India with another demand - this time for 2.9 billion dollars.

It also pushed back the ship's delivery by four years to 2012 - a year after India must mothball its last remaining aircraft carrier, the British-origin INS Viraat.

Now India's national auditor has waded into the row, saying the navy could have paid less for a new carrier.

"At best, the Indian navy would be acquiring, belatedly, a second-hand ship with a limited lifespan by paying significantly more than what it would have paid for a new ship," it said in its military spending report.

The Russian price hikes have sparked outrage, forcing India's Defence Minister A.K. Antony to assure parliament this week that fresh negotiations were once again under way.

"At present, the price escalation is in the negotiation stage and nothing has been finalised," Antony said, but he conceded India was paying "a substantially huge price" for the Admiral's refit.

New Delhi has already paid hundreds of millions of dollars in advance to Russia's state-run Sevmash shipyard.

"It's no doubt giving India a severe headache but we're stuck with it because if we pull out now, we don't get back a penny," said retired Gen. V. N. Sharma, a former chief of India's million-plus army.

India must also dig deeper into its pocket for tens of millions of dollars extra to equip the docked Admiral Gorshkov with Sukhoi-30 warjets and Russian missiles, officials say.

Russia's state-run defence export agency Rosoboronexport, which is handling the deal, has rejected suggestions that it is short-changing India.

"Every step in the process of the refit of the aircraft carrier is monitored by the Indian navy's technical team and they have never raised objections," spokesman Vyacheslav Davidenko was quoted as saying by the Press Trust of India.

The shipyard refitting the vessel has insisted that the cost escalations are due to Indian demands for features not included in the original contract.

Minister Antony says New Delhi, which is trying to build an aircraft carrier of its own, was forced to turn to Russia as no other country would give India a tactical vessel of such a size.

Russia, which accounts for 70 percent of India's military hardware, has up to $9 billion worth of defense orders from New Delhi in the pipeline.

General Sharma said he believes the Russians "grossly miscalculated when writing up this contract in 2004".

But retired Rear Adm. Raja Menon, who was associated with the project, said he believes Russia is seeking to get as much out of India as it can.

He said Moscow is in the habit of arm-twisting its traditional weapons buyers.

"Russia's track record is very poor in this regard and this time the nation has to take a call on this," he said.

"In other contracts too they had escalated costs and thought they could get away with it again," Menon said.

Soviet Carrier Turns Into India's White Elephant - Defense News

 

[RPK]

Govt to renegotiate Gorshkov deal with Russia

New Delhi: Facing flak over the controversial Gorshkov aircraft carrier deal, the government on Tuesday indicated that it will renegotiate the terms with Russia.

Minister of State Defence Pallam Raju said that India will once again hold talks on the terms of agreement including the price with Russia but maintained that India may have to go through the deal since it urgently needs aircraft carriers.

"India is going to sit down with Russia to re-negotiate Gorshkov deal. Cost of the carrier has shot up but since the Navy needs the 3 carriers we have to go through with the deal," Raju was quoted as saying by a news channel.

Recently, stung by CAG criticism for escalating cost of second-hand aircraft carrier Admiral Gorshkov bought from Russia, the government had assured the Rajya Sabha that it would agree to a fresh price for the warship only after going through the audit report.


India had bought the 45,000-tonne Gorshkov from Russia in January 2004 at a total cost of USD 974 million, which included its refit and repair.

As the repair and refit of Gorshkov began in the Sevmash Shipyard, Russians made an additional demand for USD 1.2 billion towards the escalating cost of the work.

After revising the repair costs three times since 2007, Russia made a final demand for additional USD 2.9 billion in February this year.

The CAG report for 2008 laid in Parliament last week had slammed the Defence Ministry for buying the old warship at the price of a new aircraft carrier

 

[RPK]

India could agree on extra $1.2 bln for Admiral Gorshkov - paper | Top Russian news and analysis online | 'RIA Novosti' newswire

MOSCOW, August 6 (RIA Novosti) - Russia is hoping to reach an agreement with India in August on an additional $1.2 billion to finalize the overhaul of the Admiral Gorshkov aircraft carrier for the Indian Navy, a Russian newspaper said on Thursday.

The next round of talks to determine the final funding amount for the carrier's repair and modernization is due to take place in India within the next few days.

According to Nezavisimaya Gazeta newspaper, India has no alternative but to allocate the required $1.2 bln, despite recent objections from the government's accounting office, because the Indian Navy desperately needs to replace its INS Viraat, which, although currently operational, is now 50 years old.

Under the original $1.5 billion 2004 contract between Russia's state-run arms exporter Rosoboronexport and the Indian Navy, which includes delivery of MiG-29K Fulcrum carrier-based fighters, the work on the aircraft carrier was to have been completed in 2008.

However, Russia later claimed it had underestimated the scale and the cost of the modernization, and asked for an additional $1.2 billion, which New Delhi said was "exorbitant."

After long-running delays and disputes, India offered in February 2008 to raise the refit costs for the aircraft carrier, docked at the Sevmash shipyard in northern Russia for the past 12 years, by up to $600 million.

Russia said it was not satisfied with the proposed amount and the issue of the additional funding remains unresolved.

The Times of India newspaper said earlier that the deal had been criticized by India's Comptroller and Auditor General (CAG) that called the ship "junk" in a July report.

"It can be seen that the Indian Navy was acquiring a second-hand refitted aircraft carrier that had half the life span of and was 60 percent more expensive that a new one," said the report.

However, Indian defense minister's aide Pallam Raji has recently said the Indian authorities are ready to consider Russia's proposal to raise the price of the deal by $1.2 bln.

Konstantin Makiyenko, deputy director of the Center for Strategic Analysis, a Moscow based think tank, has said that the Indian government will most likely agree on the new deal considering that China has launched an ambitious aircraft carrier construction program.

He reiterated that India's only aircraft carrier - INS Viraat - will be decommissioned in the next few years, while construction of its own aircraft carrier would take much longer than the remaining overhaul of the Russian warship.

"Basically, India does not have an alternative but to agree [on the deal]," he said.

Russia has pledged to finish the Admiral Gorshkov's overhaul as soon as possible and deliver it to India in 2012 if the additional $1.2 bln funding is provided by New Delhi.

After modernization, the carrier will join the Indian Navy as INS Vikramaditya, and is expected to be seaworthy for 30 years.

Admiral Gorshkov is a modified Kiev class aircraft carrier, originally named Baku.

The ship was laid down in 1978 at the Nikolayev South shipyard in Ukraine, launched in 1982, and commissioned with the Soviet Navy in 1987.

It was renamed after the collapse of the Soviet Union in 1991.

In 1994, following a boiler room explosion, the Admiral Gorshkov sat in dock for a year for repairs. After a brief return to service in 1995, she was finally withdrawn from service in 1996 and put up for sale.

The ship's displacement is 45,000 tons. It has maximum speed of 32 knots and an endurance of 13,500 nautical miles (25,000 km) at a cruising speed of 18 knots.

 

[youngindian]

India could agree on extra $1.2 bln for Admiral Gorshkov - paper

06/08/2009

MOSCOW, August 6 (RIA Novosti) - Russia is hoping to reach an agreement with India in August on an additional $1.2 billion to finalize the overhaul of the Admiral Gorshkov aircraft carrier for the Indian Navy, a Russian newspaper said on Thursday.

The next round of talks to determine the final funding amount for the carrier's repair and modernization is due to take place in India within the next few days.

According to Nezavisimaya Gazeta newspaper, India has no alternative but to allocate the required $1.2 bln, despite recent objections from the government's accounting office, because the Indian Navy desperately needs to replace its INS Viraat, which, although currently operational, is now 50 years old.

Under the original $1.5 billion 2004 contract between Russia's state-run arms exporter Rosoboronexport and the Indian Navy, which includes delivery of MiG-29K Fulcrum carrier-based fighters, the work on the aircraft carrier was to have been completed in 2008.

However, Russia later claimed it had underestimated the scale and the cost of the modernization, and asked for an additional $1.2 billion, which New Delhi said was "exorbitant."

After long-running delays and disputes, India offered in February 2008 to raise the refit costs for the aircraft carrier, docked at the Sevmash shipyard in northern Russia for the past 12 years, by up to $600 million.

Russia said it was not satisfied with the proposed amount and the issue of the additional funding remains unresolved.

The Times of India newspaper said earlier that the deal had been criticized by India's Comptroller and Auditor General (CAG) that called the ship "junk" in a July report.

"It can be seen that the Indian Navy was acquiring a second-hand refitted aircraft carrier that had half the life span of and was 60 percent more expensive that a new one," said the report.

However, Indian defense minister's aide Pallam Raji has recently said the Indian authorities are ready to consider Russia's proposal to raise the price of the deal by $1.2 bln.

Konstantin Makiyenko, deputy director of the Center for Strategic Analysis, a Moscow based think tank, has said that the Indian government will most likely agree on the new deal considering that China has launched an ambitious aircraft carrier construction program.

He reiterated that India's only aircraft carrier - INS Viraat - will be decommissioned in the next few years, while construction of its own aircraft carrier would take much longer than the remaining overhaul of the Russian warship.

"Basically, India does not have an alternative but to agree [on the deal]," he said.

Russia has pledged to finish the Admiral Gorshkov's overhaul as soon as possible and deliver it to India in 2012 if the additional $1.2 bln funding is provided by New Delhi.

After modernization, the carrier will join the Indian Navy as INS Vikramaditya, and is expected to be seaworthy for 30 years.

Admiral Gorshkov is a modified Kiev class aircraft carrier, originally named Baku.

The ship was laid down in 1978 at the Nikolayev South shipyard in Ukraine, launched in 1982, and commissioned with the Soviet Navy in 1987.

It was renamed after the collapse of the Soviet Union in 1991.

In 1994, following a boiler room explosion, the Admiral Gorshkov sat in dock for a year for repairs. After a brief return to service in 1995, she was finally withdrawn from service in 1996 and put up for sale.

The ship's displacement is 45,000 tons. It has maximum speed of 32 knots and an endurance of 13,500 nautical miles (25,000 km) at a cruising speed of 18 knots.

India could agree on extra $1.2 bln for Admiral Gorshkov - paper | Top Russian news and analysis online | 'RIA Novosti' newswire

 

[RPK]

Vikramaditya is a 'she'

Vikramaditya, the king of Ujjain, is famed for his wisdom, valour and magnanimity, is one of the most popular legendary Indian kings. But in the modern history, the popular Vikramaditya is referred as 'she'! In an interview with the Hindu newspaper on Wednesday, August 12, 2009, the Chief of the Naval Staff Admiral Sureesh Mehta says: "I hope she'll last 30 years and more", referring to the wonderful capabilities of INS Vikramaditya, (ex- Admiral Gorshkov) aircraft carrier, which the Navy say will be ready by 2012.

Although the Indian Navy has no elaborate representation of women in it - Women were inducted into the Indian navy for the first time in 1992 - its most priced possessions, the vessels are always referred as 'she'.

In fact, it is a worldwide tradition. Ironically, the country, which refers its supreme commander of the armed forces - the president - as 'Rashtrapati or husband of the nation, despite being a woman, also follows the same. Besides, it also follows the tradition that the launching of the vessels should be by woman. On 27 July, when India launched its first indigenous nuclear powered submarine INS Arihant for sea trials - termed as a historic milestone in the country's defense preparedness -, it was done by Gursharan Kaur, wife of Prime Minister Manmohan Singh. Kaur broke a coconut and performed a puja after which she unveiled a plaque naming the 112-metre-long submarine. "I name it INS Arihant. All the best to the submarine," she said.

It has always been customary to refer the ships as 'she'. Apparently, early seafarers spoke of their ships in the feminine gender for the close dependence they had on their ships for life and sustenance. Some say that a feminine name is chosen with the idea of safety and protection, and that the sea will protect the vessel on its journeys just as a mother watches over her children. Naming a sea vessel is traditionally done by a woman. (Kaur had announced INS Arihant's name as her husband, the prime minister looked on). Sailors consider launching a ship very much like the baptism of a child. Religious ceremony also relates to a concern to invoke the gods that rule the weather. While in India, the launching ceremony is done with a breaking of a coconut (an Indian tradition to mark an auspicious beginning), in some countries, like in Canada, the event is usually marked by the traditional breaking of a champagne bottle on the ship's bow. French ship launchings and christenings in the 18th and early 19th centuries were accompanied by unique rites similar to that of marriage and baptismal ceremonies. In Japan, the launchings incorporate silver axes to bring good luck to the keel.

 

[RAM]

Russia's delay of stealth frigates mirror problems with Gorshkov deal


Yantar's so-called financial problem and exchange rate loss seems an attempt to wrest a higher price from the Indian government just as in the case of Admiral Gorshkov, as exchange rate fluctuations are always factored in international contracts between two countries or overseas companies, says Ravi Kunder

After having delayed the delivery of the Indian aircraft carrier INS Vikramaditya (formerly Admiral Gorshkov) by four years and doubled its price, Russia may delay the delivery of three stealth frigates to the Indian Navy as it says that it has lost RUR500 million due to exchange rate fluctuations. It is now seeking a $60-million loan to complete the construction of the frigates.

Yantar, based in the port city of Kaliningrad on the Baltic Sea also is negotiating a $60-million loan with the Russian national development bank Vnesheconombank (VEB), to complete the construction of three stealth frigates for the Indian Navy. (See: Russian shipyard building Indian frigates runs out of funds)
The state-owned Yantar shipbuilding factory's director general Igor Orlov said this week that when the contract was signed in 2006 to build three Project 1135.6 Krivak IV-class guided missile frigates for the Indian Navy, the exchange rate for the rouble was 28.2 roubles for a $1, but since then, it has fallen to 23.5 roubles resulting in the shipyard losing approximately RUR500 million. Today, however the exchange rate is 31 roubles for $1.
The $60-million loan is over and above the $100 million it had taken recently from the VEB to tide over financial constraints, Russian newswire RIA Novosti said quoting Yantar's director general Igor Orlov.
Yantar's claims of financial problems are somewhat hard to digest since in the first quarter of 2009, it posted a net profit RUR106.390 million (Rs161 million), up from the RUR119.322-million loss in the same period in 2008, according to the company's first quarter resultIn the first quarter of 2009, Yantar's turnover was RUR8.1 billion compared to RUR2.9 billion in the first quarter of 2008, and earnings increased almost 4.4 times to RUR33.996 million.
The company also revealed that its order books were full until 2012.
At a time when most companies have retrenched employees to cut costs during the global financial crisis, Yantar has actually hired more workers since the beginning of this year - in January ithired 100 people and added 62 in the first week of February, with plans to hire another 500.

On 5 August 2009, Orlov announced that the shipyard would be upgraded at a cost of $580 million and the upgrade project would be done in collaboration with Germany's IMG-group.
The Yantar shipbuilding factory is Russia's largest shipyard and since its inception in 1945, it has built 153 military ships and about 500 civillian ones .
The shipyard, escaped bankruptcy on two occasions, once in 2004 and again in 2006.
In 2006, based on the impending $1.6-billion order for the three Indian stealth frigates, Yantar was able to renegotiate its $1.5-million debt with Interregional Investment Bank and Vneshtorgbank, thus avoiding bankruptcy.

It well may be that this so-called financial problem and exchange rate loss, is an attempt to wrest a higher price for from the Indian government just as in the case of Admiral Gorshkov.
This is especially so since exchange rate fluctuations are always factored in in international contracts between two countries or overseas companies.
The Financial Express had reported on 12 December 2007, ''The defence establishment is getting worried at reports emanating from Russia about problems dogging its Rs5,514-crore (around $1.4-billion) project for construction of three more Talwar-class 'stealth' frigates at Yantar shipyard in Kaliningrad. There is a fear that Russia may demand more money for the construction of the three frigates, apart from pushing back their delivery dates.''
It added, ''Although Russia is yet to officially communicate any demand for more money in the frigates' project, Russian officials are publicly holding that it will take ''a minimum of $100 million more'' to construct the three Indian warships at Yantar shipyard.''
So far, Russia has not asked for more money, but saying that it has lost $500 million on the order due to currency fluctuations is a sure sign of what can be expected in the coming months.
Although St. Petersburg-based Severnaya Verf yard was in the race to build the stealth frigates for the Indian Navy, the order was bagged by Yantar shipyard. The order was a follow-up order to the three Krivak Class, Project 1135.6 stealth frigates delivered to India in 2004 built by the Baltisky shipyard. These frigates were delivered two years behind schedule.
In October, alarmed at the news of infrastructure and financial problems at Yantar, India deputed a team of observers headed by deputy chief of the naval staff, Vice Adm. Raman P Suthan to oversee the project's progress.
As late as last month, Orlov had said on the sidelines of the 4th International Maritime Defence Show in St. Petersburg that Russia would deliver three stealth frigates worth $1.6 billion to the Indian Navy in line with the "contract deadline" of 2012. (See: New batch of IN stealth frigates to be delivered on-time: Russia)
"The contract's deadline is 2012. We are not expecting any delays at this point," said Orlov, "Russia will fulfill its obligations on schedule to supply three Project 1135.6 frigates to India by 2012,'' he said.
"The first ship will be floated out this year, the second, probably, in spring 2010, and the third - a bit later," Orlov said.
A RIA Novosti report also quoted him as saying that the Indian government had provided 'sufficient and timely' project financing.
According to a recent analysis titled 'BMF RF ''Naval Military Fleet of the Russian Federation] on Foreign Warship'', published by the authoritative Moscow-based weekly - the Independent Military Review says that the Russian Navy is currently on the verge of 'irreversible collapse.'
It said that the main cause for the 'collapse' is the state of the Russian shipbuilding industry, which is "incapable of producing warships in either the quantity or at the level of quality that their navy customer requires" for the future.

 

[I-G]

India releases $122 million for Gorshkov modification

Updated on Sunday, August 16, 2009, 16:05 IST Tags:India, Gorshkov, Russia

New Delhi: India has cleared an installment of USD 122 million to Russia to ensure that the modification work on aircraft carrier Gorshkov, also known as Vikramaditya, continues till a settlement on the final price is reached.

The payment was sanctioned earlier this month by the government following demands by Rosoboronexport, the sole Russian agency designated for importing or exporting defence equipment, according to India Strategic defence magazine.


India had paid around USD 600 million initially after an agreement between the two countries in 2004, according to which the old aircraft carrier was gifted as free but India was to pay USD 974 million to modify and upgrade it in accordance with Indian Navy's specifications.

In 2007, however, the Russians said they had made a mistake in their calculations to repair and modify Gorshkov, and demanded another $1.2 billion. Recently, they have added still another USD 700 million saying that modifications, and then sea trials, would be more expensive than as considered by them earlier.

The total demand by the Russians now touches USD 2.9 billion, instead of USD 974 million, or, approximately one billion as originally contracted.

The delivery of the aircraft carrier has also been pushed from 2008 to 2012-13, although repair work on it is continuing without break at the Sevmash shipyard in northern Russia on its Arctic coast.

The Russian government had extended USD 250 million to the shipyard in 2008, and now the installment of USD 122 million being paid by India is also to ensure that there is no break in the repair work, India Strategic quoted sources as saying.

Indian naval officials have been stationed at Sevmash for the past several years to monitor the day-to-day activity and to ensure that the repair and modifications are in line with the Naval Staff Qualitative Requirements (NSQRs), the dispute over the additional monetary demands notwithstanding.

India has naturally been reluctant to meet the post-contract Russian demands, and even the Comptroller General of India (CGI) has described the deal as a mess. But the Navy needs Gorshkov as early as possible as its only existing aircraft carrier, Viraat, is on life extension and undergoing a refit to serve for another few years.

It takes nearly 8 to 10 years to acquire an aircraft carrier. Procedures within the Indian bureaucratic system require two to three years, and then a company which is ordered to build it, should take another 5 to 8 years.

Although the Indian Navy is already building one of its two aircraft carriers in design consultancy with Italy's Fincantieri, it has no choice but to go in for Gorshkov in line with its sanctioned three-carrier planning. Ideally though, a country the size of India with 7,500 km of coastline should have at least five aircraft carriers.


A Russian defence delegation was in New Delhi in July but it refused to negotiate lower than its demand for USD 2.9 billion.

Discussions though will continue.

The government's Cabinet Committee on Security (CCS) is reported to have asked the Ministry of Defence to continue the negotiations but has not acceded to the two revised Russian demands.

It may be noted that the Gorshkov deal also involves a related USD 740 million contract for 16 Mig 29K aircraft. That deal is going smoothly and the first four of these aircraft are likely to arrive at INS Hansa, the Indian Navy training facility in Goa, by year-end.

Ten pilots, initially trained by the US Navy for carrier landing at its Naval Air Station, Pensacola training facility, are now in Russia training on the Mig 29Ks.

Four of these Mig 29Ks are twin-seaters for training and the remaining 12 for routine operational flying.

The Navy will continue to operate the Mig 29Ks from its ground stations as all 16 of them are likely to be in India before the arrival of Gorshkov.

IANS


New Delhi: India has cleared an installment of USD 122 million to Russia to ensure that the modification work on aircraft carrier Gorshkov, also known as Vikramaditya, continues till a settlement on the final price is reached.

The payment was sanctioned earlier this month by the government following demands by Rosoboronexport, the sole Russian agency designated for importing or exporting defence equipment, according to India Strategic defence magazine.


India had paid around USD 600 million initially after an agreement between the two countries in 2004, according to which the old aircraft carrier was gifted as free but India was to pay USD 974 million to modify and upgrade it in accordance with Indian Navy's specifications.

In 2007, however, the Russians said they had made a mistake in their calculations to repair and modify Gorshkov, and demanded another $1.2 billion. Recently, they have added still another USD 700 million saying that modifications, and then sea trials, would be more expensive than as considered by them earlier.

The total demand by the Russians now touches USD 2.9 billion, instead of USD 974 million, or, approximately one billion as originally contracted.

The delivery of the aircraft carrier has also been pushed from 2008 to 2012-13, although repair work on it is continuing without break at the Sevmash shipyard in northern Russia on its Arctic coast.

The Russian government had extended USD 250 million to the shipyard in 2008, and now the installment of USD 122 million being paid by India is also to ensure that there is no break in the repair work, India Strategic quoted sources as saying.

Indian naval officials have been stationed at Sevmash for the past several years to monitor the day-to-day activity and to ensure that the repair and modifications are in line with the Naval Staff Qualitative Requirements (NSQRs), the dispute over the additional monetary demands notwithstanding.

India has naturally been reluctant to meet the post-contract Russian demands, and even the Comptroller General of India (CGI) has described the deal as a mess. But the Navy needs Gorshkov as early as possible as its only existing aircraft carrier, Viraat, is on life extension and undergoing a refit to serve for another few years.

It takes nearly 8 to 10 years to acquire an aircraft carrier. Procedures within the Indian bureaucratic system require two to three years, and then a company which is ordered to build it, should take another 5 to 8 years.

Although the Indian Navy is already building one of its two aircraft carriers in design consultancy with Italy's Fincantieri, it has no choice but to go in for Gorshkov in line with its sanctioned three-carrier planning. Ideally though, a country the size of India with 7,500 km of coastline should have at least five aircraft carriers.

A Russian defence delegation was in New Delhi in July but it refused to negotiate lower than its demand for USD 2.9 billion.

Discussions though will continue.

The government's Cabinet Committee on Security (CCS) is reported to have asked the Ministry of Defence to continue the negotiations but has not acceded to the two revised Russian demands.

It may be noted that the Gorshkov deal also involves a related USD 740 million contract for 16 Mig 29K aircraft. That deal is going smoothly and the first four of these aircraft are likely to arrive at INS Hansa, the Indian Navy training facility in Goa, by year-end.

Ten pilots, initially trained by the US Navy for carrier landing at its Naval Air Station, Pensacola training facility, are now in Russia training on the Mig 29Ks.

Four of these Mig 29Ks are twin-seaters for training and the remaining 12 for routine operational flying.

The Navy will continue to operate the Mig 29Ks from its ground stations as all 16 of them are likely to be in India before the arrival of Gorshkov.

IANS

India releases $122 million for Gorshkov modification

 

[nitesh]

read full
“I hope she’ll last 30 years and more”

We’re quite happy with the quality and pace of work on the Vikramaditya. We’ve changed tonnes of steel in the ship. A large amount of work that was not foreseen earlier has been done. Hence the issue of whether or not this should be paid for by us. I have conveyed to Russia our view [when it demanded an addition $1.2 billion for the refit]. A contract is a contract. You win some, you lose some. “We have been your major defence partner for some time now and so we can’t have this kind of ad hoc increase in price put into effect,” I said.

Meanwhile, the Ministry of Defence realised that so much work has been done on the ship and maybe there’s a case to give some more money. The engines have been changed. Right now we’re at the stage where a very large amount of cabling, about 3,000 km, has to be redone. Initially the plan was to re-cable wherever it was necessary. Then they thought it would be best to change it entirely. So what we’re going to get at the end of it, as far as I’m concerned, is a nice, brand-new ship which will doubtless remain operational for 25 to 30 years. That’s the stipulated period, but I hope she’ll last 30 years and more. The Vikramaditya will have some wonderful capabilities and with a versatile aircraft [the MiG 29K], which is integral to its fleet, it would be an ideal platform for us to cover all of the Indian Ocean.

We’ve done an in-depth study to ascertain the genuineness of the price issue. Both countries will now sit across and renegotiate the price. There could be some give and take, but what we’ll arrive at would be a justifiable price.

 

[redpearl75]

Have a look at this guys: INS Vikramaditya: Waiting for Gorshkov…

Its very interesting.

 

[RPK]

Gorshkov’s escalated price to be finalised in two days: Navy chief

New Delhi, Aug 27 (IANS) The final price of the Russian-built aircraft carrier Admiral Gorshkov will be arrived at in two days time, Indian Navy chief Admiral Sureesh Mehta said Thursday.
The price negotiation for the aircraft carrier, which will be commissioned in the Indian Navy as INS Vikramaditya, had taken a back seat following the government’s auditor punching holes in the deal. Currently a Russian delegation is in the country to finalise the hiked price for the warship.

“Price negotiations are well underway. The Russian team is visiting us,” Mehta told reporters here.

“The time frame (for the price fixation) is short. Hopefully day after tomorrow,” Mehta added.

The original deal, signed in 2004, was for India to pay $1.5 billion for the vessel, mothballed since a devastating fire in 1995. Of this, $948 million was to be spent on refitting the 45,000 tonne vessel and the balance on the MiG-29 combat jets and Kamov anti-submarine warfare helicopters that would be deployed on the ship.

Since 2007, however, Russia has steadily been asking for more money, saying the extent of repairs to the vessel had been grossly underestimated. Various reports say Russia is now asking for between $2.2 billion and $2.9 billion.

Protracted negotiations, even at the level of the Indian and Russian defence ministers have so far failed to resolve the impasse.

The negotiations were on the final stage in July this year when the Comptroller and Auditor General (CAG) said that the second hand vessel was 60 percent costlier than a new carrier.

The issue had figured in parliament last month, with Defence Minister A.K. Antony saying that a fresh contract for the carrier would be signed after verifying the CAG’s findings.

The navy had contested the audit report, with Mehta himself claiming to “write a cheque” if an aircraft carrier could be found for less than $2 billion.

Originally scheduled to be delivered in 2008, the vessel is now likely to arrive in 2012.

 

[RPK]

Gorshkov price to be finalised soon @ The Hindu

Chief of Naval Staff Admiral Sureesh Mehta on Thursday said the Indian Navy would soon be receiving a Russian nuclear submarine, even as the programme to build French Scorpene submarines here was running behind schedule.

Addressing a press conference ahead of his last day in office on Monday, Admiral Mehta said the country would soon complete negotiations over the price of Russian aircraft carrier Admiral Gorshkov (INS Vikramaditya) for possible delivery by 2012.

The arrival of the Gorshkov would augment the Navy’s quest to have three such warships in its fleet. Currently, it has INS Viraat, which has just undergone an extensive refit, and the third aircraft carrier is under construction at the Kochi shipyard.

Two more nuclear submarines
Admiral Mehta also said the project of building the country’s indigenous nuclear submarine, which was heralded with INS Arihant, envisages constructing two more nuclear powered submarines.

The INS Arihant was launched for sea trials last month, and Admiral Mehta said India would soon have the proven delivery capability that would make the adversary “face far more damage than they can bear.”

The Navy Chief distanced himself from a report quoting senior Defence scientist K. Santhanam that the 1998 nuclear tests by India did not yield the desired results, adding that the country’s nuclear deterrent capabilities were “proven and capable enough.”

“As far as we are concerned, we go by the views of the scientists. They have given us certain capability and that is capable enough to provide deterrence and they are proven,” he said in response to questions about the capabilities of the country’s nuclear arsenal.

Admiral Mehta denied that the Navy grounded the entire fleet of Sea Harriers after the recent crash. He said a board of inquiry had been constituted to probe the incident, and checks were taking place on the remainder of the fleet that would be flying soon.

“No overseas bases”
On Defence Minister A.K. Antony’s recent visit to the Maldives and reports of India setting up a base there, he said it was neither the policy nor the intention of the Government to set up naval bases overseas.

Reacting to his early comments on China’s naval dominance, Admiral Mehta clarified that while China is a power in the Indian Ocean region, he had never mentioned that its navy was more superior to India’s.

 

[AJSINGH]

well after all the negotions i still think that Groshkov is good deal after all....think of it ..an aircraft carrier of that dimension for 2.9 billiion dollor that cheap my friend ...for building a new one it would have taken 10billion and alomt 10 years to make it...as of now its is a good deal ...unfortunate that russians did not estimate the price of the carrier accurately ..but think of it ..which other country would have sold us their aircraft carrier ...and at that price...if usa did ..they would have offered us Forrestal class super carriers which we dont need ...plus the money involved would be maximum ...plus 30-40 Mig 29 is effective weapon on board ...since the Gorshkov lacks steam catapult ...Mig 29 K WOULD NOT BE ABLE TO TAKE OFF WITH FULL PAYLoad .....well it does not need to actually ...plus KA 31 anti sub helicopter is also combat proven ...so IT IS A GOOD DEAL AFTER ALL ...NO DOUBT ABOUT THAT

 

[s_bman]

...for building a new one it would have taken 10billion and alomt 10 years to make it..
.as of now its is a good deal ..
.unfortunate that russians did not estimate the price of the carrier accurately ..but think of it ..which other country would have sold us their aircraft carrier ...and at that price...


dude howcome 10 billion figure (
do you know mig 29k has to be separately paid for
your post make it sound like you represent russians

 

[AJSINGH]

...for building a new one it would have taken 10billion and alomt 10 years to make it..
.as of now its is a good deal ..
.unfortunate that russians did not estimate the price of the carrier accurately ..but think of it ..which other country would have sold us their aircraft carrier ...and at that price...


dude howcome 10 billion figure (
do you know mig 29k has to be separately paid for
your post make it sound like you represent russians

first ..dont go by CAG report ...our admiral suresh mehta knows when he said that ( i write a cheaue if a aircraft carrier is bellow 2billion mark )

yeh it take that much to bulid aircraft carrier from begining...in this case it the hull was already there and needed some serious modification

and i yeh i know i sound like russians and support russia because they have supported and provided india with weapons when every NATO country rejected us ...now since they see market ...they are offering us their weapons

 

[natarajan]

well after all the negotions i still think that Groshkov is good deal after all....think of it ..an aircraft carrier of that dimension for 2.9 billiion dollor that cheap my friend ...for building a new one it would have taken 10billion and alomt 10 years to make it...as of now its is a good deal ...unfortunate that russians did not estimate the price of the carrier accurately ..but think of it ..which other country would have sold us their aircraft carrier ...and at that price...if usa did ..they would have offered us Forrestal class super carriers which we dont need ...plus the money involved would be maximum ...plus 30-40 Mig 29 is effective weapon on board ...since the Gorshkov lacks steam catapult ...Mig 29 K WOULD NOT BE ABLE TO TAKE OFF WITH FULL PAYLoad .....well it does not need to actually ...plus KA 31 anti sub helicopter is also combat proven ...so IT IS A GOOD DEAL AFTER ALL ...NO DOUBT ABOUT THAT

10 billion dollars for a cv with 40,000tons displacement(without nuke propulsion)
Gerald R. Ford class aircraft carrier itself cost only 9 billion dollars(1lakh tons displacement with nuke propulsion) and including research cost it comes around 14 billion dollar.I accept that except russia no one will offer such a ship but cant accept your 10billion blah blah

 

[AJSINGH]

10 billion dollars for a cv with 40,000tons displacement(without nuke propulsion)
Gerald R. Ford class aircraft carrier itself cost only 9 billion dollars(1lakh tons displacement with nuke propulsion) and including research cost it comes around 14 billion dollar.I accept that except russia no one will offer such a ship but cant accept your 10billion blah blah

that 10 billion price is with combat aircraft and specific indian requirments plus all the support and infastructure needed with it ......plus that large aircraft is not needed ...kinda overkill ..for IN ....

 

[s_bman]

that 10 billion price is with combat aircraft and specific indian requirments plus all the support and infastructure needed.

what are you talking about............. indian mmrca is worth 10 billion (

 

[AJSINGH]

what are you talking about............. indian mmrca is worth 10 billion (

what i was trying to say is that the admiral Groshlov is a good deal for India ..if we decided to build aircraft carrier from begning it would have costed us more and plus would have taken us time ...10 billion and 10-12 years ....i think u misunderstood my last post

 

[RPK]

Russia, India to sign new deal on Admiral Gorshkov overhaul | Top Russian news and analysis online | 'RIA Novosti' newswire

MOSCOW, September 3 (RIA Novosti) - A new deal on the funds Russia needs to finish a refit of the Admiral Gorshkov aircraft carrier for India will be signed in mid-October, the head of the state technology corporation said on Thursday.

"An additional agreement will be signed," Sergei Chemezov, head of Rostekhnologii, told a news conference in Moscow.

Under the original $1.5 billion 2004 contract between Russia's state-run arms exporter Rosoboronexport and the Indian Navy, which includes delivery of MiG-29K Fulcrum carrier-based fighters, the work on the aircraft carrier was to have been completed in 2008.

However, Russia later claimed it had underestimated the scale and the cost of the modernization, and asked for an additional $1.2 billion, which New Delhi said was "exorbitant."

After long-running delays and disputes, India offered in February 2008 to raise the refit costs for the aircraft carrier, docked at the Sevmash shipyard in northern Russia for the past 12 years, by up to $600 million.

Russia said it was not satisfied with the proposed amount and the issue of the additional funding remains unresolved.

Talks on the additional funding agreement are currently underway. Russia has pledged to finish the Admiral Gorshkov's overhaul as soon as possible and deliver it to India in 2012 if the additional $1.2 bln funding is provided by New Delhi.

According to Russian media, India has no alternative but to allocate the required funds, despite recent objections from the government's accounting office, because the Indian Navy desperately needs to replace its INS Viraat, which, although currently operational, is now 50 years old.

After modernization, the carrier will join the Indian Navy as INS Vikramaditya, and is expected to be seaworthy for 30 years.

Admiral Gorshkov is a modified Kiev class aircraft carrier, originally named Baku.

The ship was laid down in 1978 at the Nikolayev South shipyard in Ukraine, launched in 1982, and commissioned with the Soviet Navy in 1987.

It was renamed after the collapse of the Soviet Union in 1991.

In 1994, following a boiler room explosion, the Admiral Gorshkov sat in dock for a year for repairs. After a brief return to service in 1995, it was finally withdrawn from service in 1996 and put up for sale.

The ship's displacement is 45,000 tons. It has maximum speed of 32 knots and an endurance of 13,500 nautical miles (25,000 km) at a cruising speed of 18 knots.

 

[RPK]

Additional agreement on Gorshkov refit by mid-October :: Samay Live

Moscow, Sep 3 Russia and India will sign an additional agreement in October over the much-delayed upgradation and delivery of aircraft carrier Admiral Gorshkov, a senior Russian official said today.

"The negotiations are still on and we hope to ink the additional agreement by mid-October," Chief of the Russian Technologies Corporation Sergei Chemezev told reporters in the Kremlin as President Pratibha Patil began her high-level talks with the Russian leadership.

Defence cooperation was one of the key issues of Patil's parleys with Russian President Dmitry Medvedev today.

In addition to the original USD 616 million cost of upgradation, the Severodvinsk-based Sevmash shipyard is demanding additionally up to USD 2 billion for the refit of the 45000 tonner Kiev class aircraft carrier to be inducted as INS Vikramaditya.

Originally, Russian shipyard was to deliver it in August 2008, however, due to extra work and dispute over the refit cost its delivery has been deferred till 2012.

In July visiting the Sevmash shipyard President Medvedev had described the Gorshkov issues as the 'sole irritant' in bilateral relations with India and ordered to complete negotiations and deliver the ship within the agreed deadline