Indigenous Vikrant class Aircraft Carrier (IAC)

Chinmoy

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so what do you think of the TEDBF? Any chances of a quick release? I believe that its a done deal and the crew at HAL are really excited about the thought of having a fleet of these
It is not coming up to TD stage for next another decade or so. So as of now IN would only consider platforms which are in service. So its better if we talk about Rafale M, F-18, Mig 29 as of now instead of bringing in TEDBF and Mig-35 in discussions.
 

Longewala

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Obviously..
Which should be fixable on a new tranche, strengthening of that part of the structure, the 29 has enough thrust to cope with slight increase in weights

What is worrisome is the engine failures, which given how long back they were designed suggests a more unsolvable problem.
The only blessing is junk fighter uses the same engine, and that too in a single engine format!
 

Bhurki

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Which should be fixable on a new tranche, strengthening of that part of the structure, the 29 has enough thrust to cope with slight increase in weights

What is worrisome is the engine failures, which given how long back they were designed suggests a more unsolvable problem.
The only blessing is junk fighter uses the same engine, and that too in a single engine format!
No.
The 3 that i'm talking about all crashed while flying..
There's nothing 'fixable' about them.
 

Longewala

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No.
The 3 that i'm talking about all crashed while flying..
There's nothing 'fixable' about them.
Got that , apologies was unclear.
I am talking about fixing those problems if we went for a new batch of mig-29s for Vikrant
 

abingdonboy

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SH18-B3 is the best piece of naval military's hardware you can buy currently. Its preferred over F35 too. However, we would have to redesign our current aircraft carrier to 90K tons to have the power projection to be effective. Because then you'd be able to hold more SH18-B3s.
the Rafale F3++of the IAF leaves the F18 in the dust in terms of versatility and EW also there’s no way India will get US-spec equipment, it will be downgraded just like the P8s.


First of all, please do not believe any article that says the Mig 29K isnt serviceable and availability is very low; this was done to buy time in training and seting up the facilities for the fleet during its induction, 7 years ago. The fighters were bought due to their prowess and are still chosen for the same, all over the world. Now about 'strategic buy'; the SH is chosen due to backing from NATO and nothing else. The Mig-35 on paper has better ratings then all other choices being thought about. The Mig-35 can be converted to the naval variant (where The 'K' stands for Korabelniy which means the ship variant in english)very quickly.

So; why Mig-35 over the other fighters?

Because the navy needs to ease their crews by getting the same up-rated platforms instead of familiar ones due to emergencies as witnesed recently with china, this too is strategic, and being pulled by the three BRICS nations to keep the common tech at par with other offering nations.
It’s far worse than just low availability (which is unacceptable)


the 29Ks have deep fundamental issues, it will be a miracle if they can get the current fleet to the end of this decade without dipping below 2 squadrons

The Russians beefed up the LG and added an arrestor hook to the MIG-29 and declared it a naval fighter, the folly of this approach has been exposed in Indian service, whilst 3 have been lost in crashes many more have already been written off as their airframes have been over stressed on landing. I know of at least 2 that have had their longitudinal spines entirely snapped, as you can imagine this is an airframe writeoff.

There’s also the concern the navy has expressed about the single engine performance of the 29K, at least a few years ago this had meant that the Vikky has to remain within range of land bases as the OEI go-around performance of the 29K was a worry.


the MiG-35 would face the exact same issue, there’a a reason why the navy has declined to order more 29Ks that would’ve been the obvious solution to their woes.


so what do you think of the TEDBF? Any chances of a quick release? I believe that its a done deal and the crew at HAL are really excited about the thought of having a fleet of these
First flight in 6 years, 5-6 years to validate and certify.

it’s the most viable option at this point considering all the cons of the MRCBF
 

Bhurki

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the Rafale F3++of the IAF leaves the F18 in the dust in terms of versatility and EW also there’s no way India will get US-spec equipment, it will be downgraded just like the P8s.



It’s far worse than just low availability (which is unacceptable)


the 29Ks have deep fundamental issues, it will be a miracle if they can get the current fleet to the end of this decade without dipping below 2 squadrons

The Russians beefed up the LG and added an arrestor hook to the MIG-29 and declared it a naval fighter, the folly of this approach has been exposed in Indian service, whilst 3 have been lost in crashes many more have already been written off as their airframes have been over stressed on landing. I know of at least 2 that have had their longitudinal spines entirely snapped, as you can imagine this is an airframe writeoff.

There’s also the concern the navy has expressed about the single engine performance of the 29K, at least a few years ago this had meant that the Vikky has to remain within range of land bases as the OEI go-around performance of the 29K was a worry.


the MiG-35 would face the exact same issue, there’a a reason why the navy has declined to order more 29Ks that would’ve been the obvious solution to their woes.



First flight in 6 years, 5-6 years to validate and certify.

it’s the most viable option at this point considering all the cons of the MRCBF
So if Mig 29 is down and SH18 / Rafale don't fit, then what would IAC do for next 10 years? Till TEDBF comes online?
 

abingdonboy

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So if Mig 29 is down and SH18 / Rafale don't fit, then what would IAC do for next 10 years? Till TEDBF comes online?
What the rest of the fleet has been doing as they’ve inducted ships at a faster rate than ASW helos

Today you have destroyers and frigates of the Indian navy going to sea with empty hangers or with freaking Chetaks

It’s not likely that both carriers will be on deployment at the same time anyway (which is why the navy has always wanted a minimum of 3) BUT having even 1 on constant deployment is going to put the 2 29K squadrons under extreme pressure

Like I said, it’s going to be a very painful decade.
 

Thunderbolter

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the Rafale F3++of the IAF leaves the F18 in the dust in terms of versatility and EW also there’s no way India will get US-spec equipment, it will be downgraded just like the P8s.



It’s far worse than just low availability (which is unacceptable)


the 29Ks have deep fundamental issues, it will be a miracle if they can get the current fleet to the end of this decade without dipping below 2 squadrons

The Russians beefed up the LG and added an arrestor hook to the MIG-29 and declared it a naval fighter, the folly of this approach has been exposed in Indian service, whilst 3 have been lost in crashes many more have already been written off as their airframes have been over stressed on landing. I know of at least 2 that have had their longitudinal spines entirely snapped, as you can imagine this is an airframe writeoff.

There’s also the concern the navy has expressed about the single engine performance of the 29K, at least a few years ago this had meant that the Vikky has to remain within range of land bases as the OEI go-around performance of the 29K was a worry.


the MiG-35 would face the exact same issue, there’a a reason why the navy has declined to order more 29Ks that would’ve been the obvious solution to their woes.



First flight in 6 years, 5-6 years to validate and certify.

it’s the most viable option at this point considering all the cons of the MRCBF
Basically the Migs are following through with Sea Harriers we had. By the way are your points genuine? They seem lop sided, ignorant, and very 'non hands on' point of view, to me. From the journos is what I mean. Not to say you might be not be ex military. Basically non military fan boy sort.
 

abingdonboy

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Basically the Migs are following through with Sea Harriers we had. By the way are your points genuine? They seem lop sided, ignorant, and very 'non hands on' point of view, to me. From the journos is what I mean. Not to say you might be not be ex military. Basically non military fan boy sort.
I have never claimed to be ex-military

The points I have made are based on evidence I’ve seen, it’s up to you how you interpret them.
 

Bhurki

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Basically the Migs are following through with Sea Harriers we had. By the way are your points genuine? They seem lop sided, ignorant, and very 'non hands on' point of view, to me. From the journos is what I mean. Not to say you might be not be ex military. Basically non military fan boy sort.
How many mig 29 (uncrashed) have been written off as per you?
 

Bhurki

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Basically the Migs are following through with Sea Harriers we had. By the way are your points genuine? They seem lop sided, ignorant, and very 'non hands on' point of view, to me. From the journos is what I mean. Not to say you might be not be ex military. Basically non military fan boy sort.
How many mig 29 (uncrashed) have been written off as per you?
 

scatterStorm

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So if Mig 29 is down and SH18 / Rafale don't fit, then what would IAC do for next 10 years? Till TEDBF comes online?
It could be used to host SH18 deck for operations only, like US Navy could ask a nearby AC to hold few more SH18s if the need arises.
 

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