India to kick-off 5th-Gen. fighter aircraft-AMCA development project

Immanuel

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Rafael is needed because of simple fact, IAF needs itar free, non russian combat aircraft which is an alternative to Su-30 mki( which suffers from only 60% availability). LCA is short ranged, carries less payload compared to Rafael.
ITAR free doesn't guarantee jack actually. US pressure on the French easily led to cancelling of Mistral deliveries. MKI availability will be at between 75-80% by end of year. Rafale has an availability of 55% in the French AF, at best we will have roughly the same.
 

Immanuel

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French are reliable suppliers.
.......................................................
The only thing reliable about the French is, spread our legs wide open and they'll screw us. These were the same pimps last year when the DM hinted at cancelling the Rafale deal immedietly starting to send msgs of selling Rafale to Pak. The day we realise we have no friends and only interests, thats the day we are ready to be a global super power.
 

Srinivas_K

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The only thing reliable about the French is, spread our legs wide open and they'll screw us. These were the same pimps last year when the DM hinted at cancelling the Rafale deal immedietly starting to send msgs of selling Rafale to Pak. The day we realise we have no friends and only interests, thats the day we are ready to be a global super power.
French are after money, they will not sanction India in times of war .... this is what I meant in my post.
 

warrior monk

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My suggestion is that Make lca mk2 of Navy First. That is long and of the size of Gripen NG with perfectly OK fitting ratio where the wave drag is minimum. It will have a lavcon at wing root also and shall have a 116 to 120 KN Engine. If we derive Mk2 of air force from it. It will become a very potent plane of Gripen NG class which shall carry around 6.0 tons of weight and fit into MMRCA role at a very cost effective rate. We shall have a top class AESA and Astra by that time with Mini Brahmos. This fighter will become a primier fighter of the that time and directly compete with Gripen NG and shall cost almost half. What we need is a proper plan, proper allocation of resources in terms of money and manpower along with a proper leadership. Navy can make it happen and idiots of airforce may be benefited out of that.

LCA MK2 will have the engine GE-F414-INS6 which has 98 kn thrust with TWR of 9:1 and compression ratio of 30:1 which is sufficient for Navy .
 

Immanuel

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French are after money, they will not sanction India in times of war .... this is what I meant in my post.
Actually, I don't see anybody sanctioning us, let's be honest all these folks need India and business opportunties. I am actaully so certain that we should do a underground thermo nuke test.
 

guru-dutt

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Actually, I don't see anybody sanctioning us, let's be honest all these folks need India and business opportunties. I am actaully so certain that we should do a underground thermo nuke test.
exactly if sanctions was such a issue P8i , C-17 , C130J and now apache and chinooks would have never been considrred let alone buying them
 

salute

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The only thing reliable about the French is, spread our legs wide open and they'll screw us. These were the same pimps last year when the DM hinted at cancelling the Rafale deal immedietly starting to send msgs of selling Rafale to Pak. The day we realise we have no friends and only interests, thats the day we are ready to be a global super power.
paki beggers gonna afford rafale ???
 

guru-dutt

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paki beggers gonna afford rafale ???
sirji after all pakis are very unpredictable im sure if they play right and do as saudies and arbas want them too they just might get latest M2K's and F-16 Blk60 from arabs and a few F15s aswell apart from 15-25 billion $$s and free crude supplies for decades
 

warrior monk

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The AMCA is being designed with the capability to swing roles.

The aircraft will have trapezoidal wing, all moving horizontal tails and twin canted vertical tails.Beyond-Visual Range (BVR) combat capabilities of the aircraft are low radar signature especially in frontal region and an an all-aspect RCS of -20 DBsm , extended detection range and targeting, supersonic persistence and high speed weapon release. The close-combat operations are facilitated by the high angle of attack capability , low infrared signature and all round missile warning system. The stealth mission features the SEAD ,DEAD precision strike and maritime operations.

Among the advanced technologies that confer stealth capabilities are serpentine air intake, internal weapon bay, RAS, RAM, FSS , Radome and Conformal air data probes. The Avionic system features IMA supporting net-centric warfare capabilities, PVI ,pilot associate and IVHM. The integrated flight and propulsion control system will combine the traditional flight control functions with thrust vectoring and engine control functions.

Ability to super cruise i.e to sustain supersonic speeds for long durations without the need to engage its afterburners as wet thrust increase IR signature . It would help in ingress and egress from the area of operation in a shorter time , it can also extend the maximum range of guided and unguided munitions and missiles by virtue of a higher initial velocity when released from the aircraft.
 

warrior monk

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After 1974 nuke test only France congratulated India even Soviet union was silent but supporting rest of the western countries went ape shit.
 

warrior monk

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K-10 Engine will be used with a reworked core , improved OPR , TET , BPR , supersonic compressor improved BLISK , mass flow rate etc
 

HariPrasad-1

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LCA MK2 will have the engine GE-F414-INS6 which has 98 kn thrust with TWR of 9:1 and compression ratio of 30:1 which is sufficient for Navy .
No Navy need a 116 KN engine. Same Ge 414 in its advance avatar will deliver this power.
 

warrior monk

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No Navy need a 116 KN engine. Same Ge 414 in its advance avatar will deliver this power.
If you are talking off F414 Enhanced Performance Engine then its a good news but we don't know when the engine will be ready with reworked core .
 

prasadr14

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sirji after all pakis are very unpredictable im sure if they play right and do as saudies and arbas want them too they just might get latest M2K's and F-16 Blk60 from arabs and a few F15s aswell apart from 15-25 billion $$s and free crude supplies for decades
Considering the low oil prices, I doubt the Arabs can anymore 'maintain' a wh0re like Pakistan ;)
 

roma

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QUOTE="HariPrasad-1, post: 1126916, member: 19302"]Identify bottleneck first. The most important ne is 3D thrust victor engine, Rather than going to Europe and talk for 10 years, Prefer russia as the partner and gate their AL31 down graded version. There should not be a big problem in engine making. AMCA is a 2 engine plane so some what less reliable Russian engine will also do the job. Make 120 KN engines. if they found very reliable, we may use same in Naval LCA also. Or we may build a LCA MK3 stealth version like Gripen NG. We must have a reliable engine in our hand and that is a primary requirement. We can make AMCA A state
of art plane like LCH and ALH.[/QUOTE]

that would be my thinking too , but unfortunately we are not in the decision-making circuits of the IAF

all these IAF decision making are not just MBA quality but actually they are PHD quality , so far ahead of me that i just can't figure out what they are doing ...they should be writing case studys for complicated decision making on any harvard business school mba program or other top usa university

they are far too talented to be in a mere air force ?


India is a Naval power and Navy will become the dominant branch of the three.
...and yet our main problems are from china ( army and airforce ) and similarly with Pakistan it is the air force and army which are more important....but we keep Navy at the fore-front .....again i think these folks who make such decisions are too good for india .....they should be doctorate decision makers teaching at usa univs ...not just any ol uni , but only at the very very best

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kstriya

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QUOTE="HariPrasad-1, post: 1126916, member: 19302"]Identify bottleneck first. The most important ne is 3D thrust victor engine, Rather than going to Europe and talk for 10 years, Prefer russia as the partner and gate their AL31 down graded version. There should not be a big problem in engine making. AMCA is a 2 engine plane so some what less reliable Russian engine will also do the job. Make 120 KN engines. if they found very reliable, we may use same in Naval LCA also. Or we may build a LCA MK3 stealth version like Gripen NG. We must have a reliable engine in our hand and that is a primary requirement. We can make AMCA A state
of art plane like LCH and ALH.
that would be my thinking too , but unfortunately we are not in the decision-making circuits of the IAF

all these IAF decision making are not just MBA quality but actually they are PHD quality , so far ahead of me that i just can't figure out what they are doing ...they should be writing case studys for complicated decision making on any harvard business school mba program or other top usa university

they are far too talented to be in a mere air force ?


...and yet our main problems are from china ( army and airforce ) and similarly with Pakistan it is the air force and army which are more important....but we keep Navy at the fore-front .....again i think these folks who make such decisions are too good for india .....they should be doctorate decision makers teaching at usa univs ...not just any ol uni , but only at the very very best

@angeldude13@Abhijat@Ancient Indian@anupamsurey@aliyah @Alien@angeldude13@Abhijat@Ancient Indian@anupamsurey @aliyah @Alien @Aravind Sanjeev @A chauhan @asingh10 @asianobserve @BATTLE FIELD@bose @Bornubus @brational@blueblood@Blackwater@Blood+ @bhai-117
@Bangalorean @bengalraider @cobra commando @Chirag @Chris Jude @Chinmoy@Cadian @DingDong@ersakthivel @FRYCRY @guru-dutt@Hari Sud@hit&run @HeinzGud @indiandefencefan @I_PLAY_BAD @Indian Devil @Indibomber @Jangaruda @jackprince@Kunal @Kshatriya87 Biswas@LETHALFORCE@laughingbuddha @mhk99 @maomao @Neil @Nicky G @OneGrimPilgrim@pmaitra @PaliwalWarrior @Pulkit @Rowdy@Razor@Rashna @[email protected] @Sakal Gharelu Ustad @Srinivas_K @sunnyv @sgarg@sabari @Sameet2 @saik @sorcerer @sydsnyper @Sridevi @SREEKAR @TejasMK3@The enlightened
@tejas warrior@tharun@thethinker@tsunami@Screambowl @Sylex21 @VIP @Vishwarupa @Vishal Guts @Yusuf@Yumdoot @Zebra[/QUOTE]
I read sometime back that we are working with the Russians on 3D thrust vectoring to be used in any engine of Indian make or with TOT.
 

aliyah

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govt of india agreed with russia on fgfa n deal will be signed soon.
now we can borrow lil fgfa tech on our amca too.
 

guru-dutt

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govt of india agreed with russia on fgfa n deal will be signed soon.
now we can borrow lil fgfa tech on our amca too.
ruskies dint even shared the technology to make gun barrels with us do you realy think they will part with FGFA-PAKFA tech with us i dont think so

we have no option but to go alone with AMCA with strategik partnership with israel and parts from USA and if rafale deal goes thru count dassult in too
 

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