India should de-recognize Tibet as an autonomous region of China

marshal panda

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All Hindu places of pilgrimage are in mainland India. Can one imagine that an important centre like Kailash/Mansarovar will be outside India ? Tibet was just a cultural extension of Hinduism. Padmasambhava,who introduced lamaism in Tibet was from Sambalpur in Odisha. Incrementally we will have to take steps in this regard.Something must be done during the life time of the present Dalailama.The day India is capable of airing its security concerns regarding Tibet properly, Indian security/foreign policy will have come of age.
 

hello_10

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This one looks a little better than that other cheapo site I have seen, but how can France rank behind UK? We have more nukes, a CVN, 30% more soldiers, 25% more fighters 32% more helicopters, 23% more armour, I don't get it...
i dont really believe in these western rankings. I dont think UK would be ranked above Argentina, while I would put Britain somewhere close to Bangladesh, in fact. Japan is more deserving to be placed on 5th place, with Germany, France following, i think. and then Brazil, Israel the next, I believe.......

apart from that, its commonly talked that, how much strength China really has, no one knows. every big country has secret projects, and how much success they have got till now, is the question. we may have a look on these ranks but they dont really say the real picture...... :ranger:
 

Armand2REP

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i dont really believe in these western rankings. I dont think UK would be ranked above Argentina, while I would put Britain somewhere close to Bangladesh, in fact. Japan is more deserving to be placed on 5th place, with Germany, France following, i think. and then Brazil, Israel the next, I believe.....
I wouldn't call them Western, more like fanboy rankings because anyone with a sense of reality would rate France higher.

apart from that, its commonly talked that, how much strength China really has, no one knows. every big country has secret projects, and how much success they have got till now, is the question. we may have a look on these ranks but they dont really say the real picture...... :ranger:
All China has is numbers. Their qualitative ranking is near the bottom. One French Blue Division would smash through a Red Field Army.
 

sesha_maruthi27

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Atleast we India has a smaller threat, the Chinesehave a bigger threat in the form of pakistan, whom they are encouraging and providing support for. They are still in the shadow of the snake thinking that this pakistani snake will not and cannot bite them......
 

no smoking

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All Hindu places of pilgrimage are in mainland India. Can one imagine that an important centre like Kailash/Mansarovar will be outside India ? Tibet was just a cultural extension of Hinduism. Padmasambhava,who introduced lamaism in Tibet was from Sambalpur in Odisha. Incrementally we will have to take steps in this regard.Something must be done during the life time of the present Dalailama.The day India is capable of airing its security concerns regarding Tibet properly, Indian security/foreign policy will have come of age.
If India gov PUBLICLY speak of its support towards Tibet exile and encourage their riot within Tibet, it will force Chinese PUBLICLY support India's domestic insurgence. Both sides will end up in a money buring race resulting in nothing but more security problems to each other.
 

Armand2REP

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If India gov PUBLICLY speak of its support towards Tibet exile and encourage their riot within Tibet, it will force Chinese PUBLICLY support India's domestic insurgence. Both sides will end up in a money buring race resulting in nothing but more security problems to each other.
China already supports Indian insurgance so what is the difference if they do it publicly? India should return the favour and arm Tibet.
 

Bhadra

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If India gov PUBLICLY speak of its support towards Tibet exile and encourage their riot within Tibet, it will force Chinese PUBLICLY support India's domestic insurgence. Both sides will end up in a money buring race resulting in nothing but more security problems to each other.
But the Chinese have been supporting insurgencies in North East of India since 1947. That has not stopped. Chinese publically pronounced their support for the Maoists and other insugents.

All terrorists in India including the Pakistani are armed with Chinese arms and weapons. On Indai's western border every Pakistani soldier is armed to teeth with Chinese weapons.

Pakistan is pointing Chinese guns, missiles, nuclear bombs and aircrafts at India.

So what is this pretension and threat?

It be very wise for Indians to pay back China in the same coin.

Wait let India collect some money.... India will pay back..
 

ice berg

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But the Chinese have been supporting insurgencies in North East of India since 1947. That has not stopped. Chinese publically pronounced their support for the Maoists and other insugents.

Really, where is the link?

All terrorists in India including the Pakistani are armed with Chinese arms and weapons. On Indai's western border every Pakistani soldier is armed to teeth with Chinese weapons.

How will you know? You interviewed all of them personally?ROFL

Pakistan is pointing Chinese guns, missiles, nuclear bombs and aircrafts at India.

So what is this pretension and threat?

It be very wise for Indians to pay back China in the same coin.

Wait let India collect some money.... India will pay back..
Pakistan also got US, French made, Russian made weapons pointed at you. I dont hear you bitchering about them.
 

Ray

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Pakistan also got US, French made, Russian made weapons pointed at you. I dont hear you bitchering about them.
Pointed maybe.

Not being used as of now.

Lots of difference.

The difference is so obvious that one wonders how it got missed.
 

ice berg

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Pointed maybe.

Not being used as of now.

Lots of difference.

The difference is so obvious that one wonders how it got missed.
What is your point? Of course they are not being used as of now.
Pakistan and India is not at war atm.

However if there is a war between India and Pakistan, you can be damn sure that they will throw every weapon they got against you, be it french, russian, chinese or whatever.

And I am sure India will do the same. It is what armsdealers do. They sell weapons to both sides.
 

Ray

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What is your point? Of course they are not being used as of now.
Pakistan and India is not at war atm.

However if there is a war between India and Pakistan, you can be damn sure that they will throw every weapon they got against you, be it french, russian, chinese or whatever.

And I am sure India will do the same. It is what armsdealers do. They sell weapons to both sides.
The issue is 'if and when'.

Pakistan's use is in the future tense.

The Chinese weapons being supplied to the Maoists is in the present tense.
 

ice berg

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The issue is 'if and when'.

Pakistan's use is in the future tense.

The Chinese weapons being supplied to the Maoists is in the present tense.
There are chinese made weapons in many places. It dosnt means they are sanctioned by the government.

There is after all a black market for that.

AFAIK the maoists have various weapons from different countries. You cant use the origin of weapons as an argument for direct government support.
 

Ray

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There are chinese made weapons in many places. It dosnt means they are sanctioned by the government.

There is after all a black market for that.

AFAIK the maoists have various weapons from different countries. You cant use the origin of weapons as an argument for direct government support.
Of course, Chinese weapons all around in the black market!

Maybe you should read Brig Yousaf's account of Chinese arms accounting in his book on Afghanistan and ISI, "The Bear Trap'.

How many know of the active support of China to the militants in Afghanistan?

The same militants are now biting China in Xinjaing.

The Chinese Govt is not daft to officially hand over weapons as a 'state gift'!
 
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t_co

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Of course, Chinese weapons all around in the black market!

Maybe you should read Brig Yousaf's account of Chinese arms accounting in his book on Afghanistan and ISI, "The Bear Trap'.

How many know of the active support of China to the militants in Afghanistan?

The same militants are now biting China in Xinjaing.

The Chinese Govt is not daft to officially hand over weapons as a 'state gift'!
You're moving the goalposts, Ray. Iceberg clearly refuted your claim that China was handing out free goodies to Indian Maoists and Naxalites, so then you go and imply (but do not prove) that because China is not 'daft' enough to hand over weapons as gifts, then any Chinese sales of arms must equate to direct governmental support.

This is disingenuous, slippery argumentation at best. I expect better from you.

When you have direct proof China is arming Indian rebels, come back and post here. Until then, you have no winning argument there, and hence your use of equivocation to justify RAW support for Tibetan rebels (a documented fact) holds no meaning.

Until you can come back with some solid reasons, for the purposes of this debate, we must accept that there are no legitimate justifications for any Indian attempt to decrease the level of sway China holds in Tibet. Any action India pursues to that end is morally in the wrong.
 
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Ray

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You're moving the goalposts, Ray. Iceberg clearly refuted your claim that China was handing out free goodies to Indian Maoists and Naxalites, so then you go and imply (but do not prove) that because China is not 'daft' enough to hand over weapons as gifts, then any Chinese sales of arms must equate to direct governmental support.

This is disingenuous, slippery argumentation at best. I expect better from you.

When you have direct proof China is arming Indian rebels, come back and post here. Until then, you have no winning argument there, and hence your use of equivocation to justify RAW support for Tibetan rebels (a documented fact) holds no meaning.

Until you can come back with some solid reasons, for the purposes of this debate, we must accept that there are no legitimate justifications for any Indian attempt to decrease the level of sway China holds in Tibet. Any action India pursues to that end is morally in the wrong.
No goal posts have been moved. Nothing slippery. Sheer understanding of international and political matrices applied.

That Chinese weapons are with the Maoists, is no secret. It has been recovered ad nauseum. However, in your opinion, do you think that China will officially endorse that it is giving weapons to Maoists to destablilise India?

The Mumbai carnage was plotted by ISI is a well known international fact and yet Pakistan denied it all till very recently when the David Headley case burst on the US scene.

How many people knew that China was actively supporting the Taliban against USSR in Afghanistan? There was evidence in the media that the US was supplying arms, but China?


Yet Brig Yousaf, the Deputy in the ISI, who was responsible for Afghanistan, has written in his book 'The Bear Trap' (the first admission from Pakistan) and corroborated by Cooley in his book, 'Unholy Wars' about Chinese assistance. In fact, the Pakistani freighter Rustam, which had arrived from Pakistan carrying 8000 tons of arms and ammunition from China unloaded at Karachi and the stuff was moved to Peshawar.

It may interest you that some of the Chinese military equipment was sent directly to Sholah e Javid (the Eternal Flame) which was a bit Maoist in ideology and that the training of the jihadis by the Chinese were carried out by the Military Intelligence Department of the PLA called the Er Bu. Its head was Major General Xiong Guankai and his personal assistance was Colonel Li NIng. In fact, later these two officers were tasked to trace and hunt down the Uighurs terrorists who they had also trained against the Soviets to operate in Afghanistan and who were later fighting the Chinese in Xinjaing.

Now, has China ever indicated that she assisted the Mujahideens in Afghanistan against the Soviets?

So, at times, it would do a world of good for you,o know the facts before accusing others with slimy remarks.
 
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GromHellscream

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Frankly speaking, a communist India controlled by Maoist will cause much more troubles to China than the current loosely organized one.

We don't have the reason or position to gift weapons to them.

If someday Maoist accidently boom to win the victory around India, I won't be surprised if China and other imperialists work together to suppress them, just like what happened shortly after USSR's foundation.
 

roma

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exactly to the contrary !!

india should give ultimatum to the world that it will not
solely carry the burden of Tibetan Gov in exile (TGE)
while the rest of the world talks freedom
but in fact is hypocritically doing business with dragon
they benefit big time , while india earns the wrath of dragon

we should have told the world a long long time ago
look ...... we will hand this dalai into the hands of mao zedong unless
you pay us the bill for his upkeep plus etc and etc
plus recognise us as THE pillar of democracy
including permanent seat at UNSC

india has history of selling ourselves short
we had 90 000 pakcland pows and gave them back free
we held haji pir pass - gave it back free
we were 4 days short of taking all kashmir - gave half away free

iit seems the lives of our jawans
who fought to take those in the first place
are worth nothing ? can we reverse their deaths ?

india should say we give TGE ultimatum to re-locate to europe
or the usa, austrlalia, canada , wherever

unless ...... the free world pays india
a whopping premium for carrying the whole worlds burdens vis a vis dalai

india is at the moment doing the whole worlds job
of ensuring democracy for tibet via TGE
and getting hardly any value in return for that
while the rest of the wolrd goes scot -free

unbelievable that the sucessive goi's
have had such a subservient attitude !
 
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Ray

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I don't think the current Govt has the gumption to de-recognise Tibet as an autonomous region of China.

India has never said it is 'a pert of' China.
 

W.G.Ewald

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india should give ultimatum to the world that it will not
solely carry the burden of Tibetan Gov in exile (TGE)
while the rest of the world talks freedom
but in fact is hypocritically doing business with dragon
they benefit big time , while india earns the wrath of dragon

we should have told the world a long long time ago
look ...... we will hand this dalai into the hands of mao zedong unless
you pay us the bill for his upkeep plus etc and etc
plus recognise us as THE pillar of democracy
including permanent seat at UNSC
I'm afraid that tack would be called attempted extortion. Extortion should remain the Chinese game only.
 

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