India-Pakistan LoC/IB Skirmishes in the Aftermath of August 5 2019

[Assassin 2.0]

You forget one thing sirji these aircraft we were supposed to start retirement from 2014 then 2017 then 2019 and now 2020 all this time IAF knew that these were last upgraded in 2006.

We don't hear much in the news but these aircraft themselves are beyond their limit don't fly much at all and suffer from extreme airframe usage and spare problems.

Also we must keep in mind many aircrafts have crashed many have been retired many stripped for spares it quite a blurry picture and you cannot drag them anymore.

Them leaving us in 2020-2021 timeframe is inevitable.

In my calculations I had taken the remaining squadrons of su-30mki which are not formed yet and rafale to so in this timeframe mig-21 will surely go.

New 33 MIG-29 are also coming.
We Have bought second hand mig-29 from Russia.

 

[Knowitall]

New 33 MIG-29 are also coming.
We Have bought second hand mig-29 from Russia.

Sir ji I cleared this already.

https://m.economictimes.com/news/de...khoi-30-fighter-jets/articleshow/70894263.cms

https://www.indiatoday.in/mail-toda...india-wary-of-hidden-costs-1207247-2018-04-08

Jab deal sign hojaye then we can celebrate.

Nothing is final as of now so I will not count them at all.

 

[ladder]

New 33 MIG-29 are also coming.
We Have bought second hand mig-29 from Russia.

News about them have dried up. Do you have positive confirmation?

 

[Narasimh]

New 33 MIG-29 are also coming.
We Have bought second hand mig-29 from Russia.

Its 21 Mig 29s that is to be bought but its still in the proposal stage. This has not been approved.

 

[Knowitall]

I think it is prudent to list out all mig-21 types and their induction years along with their upgrade timelines we have in our inventory, to have an informed discussion. Maybe in a different thread.

Fact remains that they perform their job they were designed to do pretty well even to this day I.e interception.

Your points become valid from 2025 and 2030.

These jets started their induction in 1960s and their production continued till 1985.


https://www.orfonline.org/expert-speak/the-mig-21-a-legacy-well-past-its-due-date-48916/?amp

https://www.opindia.com/2019/03/com...0-glorious-years-of-service-indian-air-force/

So that means even if I take the aircraft for 1985 they have already completed 35 years of service and the older ones have already done 50 years of service.

These jets are responsible for the deaths of over 170 pilots and 40 civilians.

They are and will be retired by 2022 all of them according to the timeline.

2025 and 2030 timeline you are being too generous.

 

[nongaddarliberal]

Was going to post this in the jf-17 thread but decided it was more relevant here.

Let me play the devil's advocate today.

So from the detailed production timeline that was posted here for jf-17. We can see that they have produced 120 units till date.

Now the quality of this aircraft is not good I agree.
But improvements are noteworthy.

From new missiles both for air to air engagements and AWACS killer missiles .

MAWS an aesa radar hud the improvements block wise for a poor candidate sorry excuse for a country are quite good.

But that's not the thing.
What I don't find funny is when we say things like easy meat for Tejas haha.

Wo to Mai bhi manta hu Tejas in mk1a and ?k2 form is way ahead but ab mudde ki bat Tejas hai kaha.

They have produced 120 units till date and continue to produce even it's junk remember this sentence

Quantity has a quality of its own.

Now let's see:-

Sukhoi-30mki:- 272 jets in total
15 squadrons (each squadron has 18 jets)

Mig-29:- 69 add crashes etc and maybe 66 you can correct me here but the number is in this range and the squadron strength remains same.
3 squadrons

Mirage2000:-49 jets the recent crash might make it 48 or 49 is the number after the crash.
Anyways
3 squadrons.

So 21 squadrons in total and yes Sukhoi30 deliveries are not done yet.

But the total will be 21 squadrons only.

Now mig-21 will start retiring from 2020 onwards so I will not count them. The process was started in 2019 itself but is being done slowly to shore up the numbers.

Mig-27 has been retired.

So we are left with jaguar only about 120 aircraft forming 6 squadrons.

IAF will retire 2 squadrons the oldest ones in early 2020 and will be left with 80 jets.
These 80 jets have huge spare issues as the factory has been shutdown don't expect big flight time by them severe lack of spares is present here.

The upgrade has been cancelled as the price was high and Honeywell has lost all interest to keep up with this bullshit.

So these jets won't last long but let's add 4 squadrons.

So now the total number of squadrons are a grand 25 squadrons
After one adds the 2 rafale squadrons and 1 Tejas it becomes 28.

But mind you here guys think logically after jaguar upgrade was cancelled the remaining 4 squadrons won't fly till 2030.

So as these two rafale squadrons come in we will lose 2 squadrons of jaguars as well and using them for spare parts to keep the remaining to worthy.

To ghum firake

26 squadrons.
2 Netra and 3 falcon AWACS 6 refullers witg low availability.

Ab haslo friends.

Pakistan has 22 squadrons and yes they have old aircraft too but in jf-17 block 3 they have found a good successor and God hopes China doesn't give them something else.

They have more AWACS than us.

And this is when I don't take China in the equation.

And please ye mat bolna mmrca hai 83 Tejas hai jab sign hojaye deal tab bolna.

Our condition is pathetic and yet we laugh at others.

Both China and Pakistan have a better roadmap than us for their respective airforces.
Thoda zada socho hasi nahi ayegi.

I'm also frustrated with this. We have an economy 10 times their size, yet it's not reflected in our military arsenal. India only has 2.5 times more 4th gen fighters than pakistan. We only have 2 times more tanks. We actually have fewer AWACS and fewer self propelled artillery. Yes, we have a qualitative advantage, but we are facing a two front scenario. We need to have huge numbers to deal with both fronts.

Coming back to fighter jets, JF 17, if it is combined with AWACS and long range missiles is good enough. The Chinese will give whatever tech they have to pakis. You can bet a few J 31's will be sold to Pakistan once they're in production. China will also integrate their latest long range missiles with JF 17s. We will have an edge with our sukhois and Rafales, but it will still remain an extremely messy environment where we will also lose significant numbers in a war.

But our air force's attitude towards Tejas and HAL's organizational problems have fucked up our chances of maintaining numbers. If pakis can make 120 JF 17's, then we should have made 400 Tejas already.

 

[ezsasa]

I'm also frustrated with this. We have an economy 10 times their size, yet it's not reflected in our military arsenal. India only has 2.5 times more 4th gen fighters than pakistan. We only have 2 times more tanks. We actually have fewer AWACS and fewer self propelled artillery. Yes, we have a qualitative advantage, but we are facing a two front scenario. We need to have huge numbers to deal with both fronts.

Coming back to fighter jets, JF 17, if it is combined with AWACS and long range missiles is good enough. The Chinese will give whatever tech they have to pakis. You can bet a few J 31's will be sold to Pakistan once they're in production. China will also integrate their latest long range missiles with JF 17s. We will have an edge with our sukhois and Rafales, but it will still remain an extremely messy environment where we will also lose significant numbers in a war.

But our air force's attitude towards Tejas and HAL's organizational problems have fucked up our chances of maintaining numbers. If pakis can make 120 JF 17's, then we should have made 400 Tejas already.

Tasalli ke liye.......

You have to factor in multiple layers of SAM that are being deployed/inducted from our side, along with standoff weapons being bought and developed.

 

[Brimstone]

Chinese President XI Jinping order to write modified version of Quran for Muslims in China. In this Chinese version of the Quran,35 verses that promote enmity against other religions & support terrorism will b removed.Will Islamic republic of Pakistan oppose it? I don't think so

Gotta give it to them. I always viewed Chinks as cocky and arrogant. But damn, they're doing what we only dream about.

 

[Bleh]

.They have produced 120 units till date and continue to produce even it's junk remember this sentence

Quantity has a quality of its own.

Very good points. Indian military & strategic leaders are known for being corrupt, not farsighted.

But once important thing... Jf-17 are not bolstering their numbers but keeping up squadron strength, just like ours. Those didn't even replace their older Mirage-5s but J-7s.
All in all only few dozen F-16s & 100+ Jf-17s are all they got.

People of unlike stating their JF 17 number d how it is quality over quantity... It's not quantity. Just a barely capable jet, with decent basics.

So that means even if I take the aircraft for 1985 they have already completed 35 years of service and the older ones have already done 50 years of service.

Only the latest 120-130 are still in service. HAL used to churm out more than 40 a year... So, I doubt we have Mig-21 older than 1980.

 

[Narasimh]

Tasalli ke liye.......

You have to factor in multiple layers of SAM that are being deployed/inducted from our side, along with standoff weapons being bought and developed.

Well dont have to go that far..our su30s are good enough for tasalli. and in any case Nuclear factor is always there.

 

[Holy Triad]

Watch
@indiatvnews
Exclusive - Pakistan Post destroyed by #IndianArmy
@ChinarcorpsIA
Pakistan Cluster 2 location of Bugina area of Leepa comes under 5 #PoK Brigade of 12 Infantry Division of #Pakistan.
@adgpi



No wonder their "sugar daddy" is worried
=====================================


I can't confirm whether the below pic is taken from the same location as the above one,but interesting to look at

 

[sorcerer]

Chinese President XI Jinping order to write modified version of Quran for Muslims in China. In this Chinese version of the Quran,35 verses that promote enmity against other religions & support terrorism will b removed.Will Islamic republic of Pakistan oppose it? I don't think so




paki porks!

 

[ezsasa]

Well dont have to go that far..our su30s are good enough for tasalli. and in any case Nuclear factor is always there.

SU-30 are not the first line of defence, first line of defence are Tejas, Mig-21, mirage & mig-29(donno about UPG).

Interceptors are more likely to go into dog fights with F-16 & Jf-17, as recent events have proved.

 

[ezsasa]

Watch
@indiatvnews
Exclusive - Pakistan Post destroyed by #IndianArmy
@ChinarcorpsIA
Pakistan Cluster 2 location of Bugina area of Leepa comes under 5 #PoK Brigade of 12 Infantry Division of #Pakistan.
@adgpi



No wonder their "sugar daddy" is worried
=====================================


I can't confirm whether the below pic is taken from the same location as the above one,but interesting to look at

What would a post be doing in middle of a paddy/wheat field?

 

[Jaymax61]

It possible, at multiple locations the boundary falls on agricultural land still being worked on. The posts are built in the fields and farmers - they are just asked to live with it.


Pasting a sample image for reference

 

[sorcerer]

Imran Khan says powerful Indian lobby in America strengthening narrative against Pakistan


https://www.financialexpress.com/in...ngthening-narrative-against-pakistan/1806405/

nobody need to do anything against pakistan..they themselves will glorify their terrorists in UN and Call for Jihad..like Imran khan did at UNGA

 

[Nicky G]

Chinese President XI Jinping order to write modified version of Quran for Muslims in China. In this Chinese version of the Quran,35 verses that promote enmity against other religions & support terrorism will b removed.Will Islamic republic of Pakistan oppose it? I don't think so




paki porks!

Probably the only Chini import worth considering. Might be good to see Liberati and Commies opposing it in India when their Chini masters are using the same thing.

 

[Deathstar]

Chinese President XI Jinping order to write modified version of Quran for Muslims in China. In this Chinese version of the Quran,35 verses that promote enmity against other religions & support terrorism will b removed.Will Islamic republic of Pakistan oppose it? I don't think so




paki porks!

Hats off to China....onky China has the balls to do such things

 

[Shashank Nayak]

Probably the only Chini import worth considering. Might be good to see Liberati and Commies opposing it in India when their Chini masters are using the same thing.

Is there any subscription facility for the Quran Chicom version... I would love a copy..Would love it if there was a grand release in India lol...

 

[Sanglamorre]

Chinese President XI Jinping order to write modified version of Quran for Muslims in China. In this Chinese version of the Quran,35 verses that promote enmity against other religions & support terrorism will b removed.Will Islamic republic of Pakistan oppose it? I don't think so




paki porks!

@Waanar Lo, ye mangwa lo Alibaba se apni wali k liye. Xd