India-China 2020 Border Dispute - Military and Strategic Discussion

[another_armchair]

No chance. By winter we'll have 8 Rafales, quite a few of our emergency procurements will be fulfilled.

It's the PLA that should be worried. If they can't pull off anything in August-September, they're in trouble come winter.

I would be happier if we have 800-1400 nos of Dhanush or any 155/45, 155/52 in APU or truck mounted mode along with mounted 105's, more Grads and Pinakas by winter.

If Rafales are a beauty, Arty is the beast we are sorely in need, preferably howitzers.

 

[Bhadra]

If China was hell bent on war, it would have done a lot more than sitting tight in no man's land.

The best mothod of Warfighting is to defeat your enemy without fighting. They have thrown a challenge at India to pock up a gauntlet. India, not responding is one-fourth of perception war being won. They have thrown at challenge at the world especially at the USA that they are ready to attack a perceived ally and USA is incapable of doing anything. So the massage is directed at world at large. In the entire cold war, that is how USSR and USA conducted the conflict.

If China was intent on humiliating India, it would not have allowed India even the fig leaf of saying that LAC perceptions differ. China would have occupied land which was indisputably beyond any Chinese claim line. An example would be sitting on DSDBO Road itself.. or having a battalion sit on Daulat beg oldi runway.. China has done nothing like that. It is only continuing its salami slicing.

What about the morality and ethics of the massage to the neutral and opposing parties. Any power that wishes to dominate the world must have some ideological grounds to stand on.

China would not like to convey a massage of being on the wrong groound. India must be agressor or must fire the first bullet or provide enough ground for Chan to attack India.

Things are not so simple. By amassing troops and threatening India, China is watching world reaction as also a reaction by India. It has already attracted some negative consequences. China will pause, assess the situation and then commence the hostilities if that fits into the new strategy.

A boxer does not start punching the moment he enters a ring unless that is part of the game plan.

 

[mokoman]

No chance. By winter we'll have 8 Rafales, quite a few of our emergency procurements will be fulfilled.

It's the PLA that should be worried. If they can't pull off anything in August-September, they're in trouble come winter.

isn't it the other way around ?

When winter comes our routes in Ladakh and AP will be snowed in.

Which is also why our troops are rushing to store stocks before winter.

some of the roads in AP especially Tawang are not all weather , and these places will be cut off .

 

[garg_bharat]

You think people of GB or Sindh-Balochistan would be happy to be a part of India ? If yes, what makes you feel that way ?

What kind of proof do you want?

 

[Shashank Nayak]

The best mothod of Warfighting is to defeat your enemy without fighting. They have thrown a challenge at India to pock up a gauntlet. India, not responding is one-fourth of perception war being won. They have thrown at challenge at the world especially at the USA that they are ready to attack a perceived ally and USA is incapable of doing anything.

Why does the US need to do anything, when China has not done anything out of the ordinary. China has been pushing the LAC during MMS regime, when we lost patrolling rights over a thousand square kilometers of land. China is continuing the same tradition during Modi regime. The accretion of forces by the chinese side to upto 3 divisions took place because India started mirror deployments. Also, infrastructure on the indian side has improved a lot during the past 6 years. Hence, the Chinese wanted to be ready for the hypothetical indian pushback. There is no need to attribute some 9 dimensional chess wizardry to the chinese to justify Indian impotence.

 

[Sanglamorre]

Lmao China and their tofu construction.


For people who don't know what I mean, people have found that to maximise profits, Chinese contractors construct even crucial architecture like bridges out of stuffed corn, cardboard, Ramen (I'm serious) wood and then apply a layer of plaster like painting.

 

[Synergy]

I wish you had asked that question since 1962 or at laest recently since 2000...

Chinese intrusions in Penang Tso and patrol clashes there has been happening for last twenty years. Chinese built a raod upto Finger4 in 1999.
Depsand intrusions and patrol facing each other is a regular feature. In 2013 Chinese sat there for more than a month.
Hot Springs and Gogra have also been Chinese intrusion points.
Only Galwan was a new are of intrsuin which was removed.

Why are you asking questions from Modi only> Why did you not make noise earlier. Why are you blaming present Govt only. Why not ask what India did before?

Because you are a dishonest interested poster who wants to make a political statement. You have no love lost for India or you should have been aware of earlier acts of Congress governments,

Sir, with all due respect...

why haven't you asked in 1962 or before doesn't make any sense.
people voted this govt to see something different than previous govts used to do. but still now, this govt has completely failed in present LAC crisis.

still we are unhappy with Nehru for 1962 but in 1962 at least he tried something. that result could have been a bit different if they were not that much inefficient.

anybody has to reply salami slicing with force. inaction won't solve the problem.

surprisingly, the tone in your comment reflects suppression of material facts and blaming others to suppress own failure. I've not seen any other comment from you like this. I'm very much confused.

I don't give a damn to RaGa or people like Shukla. but 20 of our brothers died and now it seems PLA will be at f4, depsang etc. so their death has gone in vain. and we are being fed multipolar-bipolar $hit and befitting reply.
btw, who has given befitting reply? only the local commanders. what the govt has done so far except talking rubbish? apart from app ban and some $B project cancellation? do you really think that will even be able to scratch China?

I don't like ranting. but suppression of facts are more dangerous than ranting. constructive critisism is needed.

to fight, at first the mentality to fight is needed but that's completely missing here.

I'm not a poster boy of BJP but I'm of our country. and sorry to say, this govt is not doing better than previous govts (wrt China).

still not acknowledging intrusion and supporting that is nothing but a politically motivated step.

hoping it's not over yet...

again very sorry to write this comment but your last para compelled me to write this. again sorry. nothing personal...

 

[ezsasa]

Sir, with all due respect...

why haven't you asked in 1962 or before doesn't make any sense.
people voted this govt to see something different than previous govts used to do. but still now, this govt has completely failed in present LAC crisis.

still we are unhappy with Nehru for 1962 but in 1962 at least he tried something. that result could have been a bit different if they were not that much inefficient.

anybody has to reply salami slicing with force. inaction won't solve the problem.

surprisingly, the tone in your comment reflects suppression of material facts and blaming others to suppress own failure. I've not seen any other comment from you like this. I'm very much confused.

I don't give a damn to RaGa or people like Shukla. but 20 of our brothers died and now it seems PLA will be at f4, depsang etc. so their death has gone in vain. and we are being fed multipolar-bipolar $hit and befitting reply.
btw, who has given befitting reply? only the local commanders. what the govt has done so far except talking rubbish? apart from app ban and some $B project cancellation? do you really think that will even be able to scratch China?

I don't like ranting. but suppression of facts are more dangerous than ranting. constructive critisism is needed.

to fight, at first the mentality to fight is needed but that's completely missing here.

I'm not a poster boy of BJP but I'm of our country. and sorry to say, this govt is not doing better than previous govts (wrt China).

still not acknowledging intrusion and supporting that is nothing but a politically motivated step.

hoping it's not over yet...

again very sorry to write this comment but your last para compelled me to write this. again sorry. nothing personal...

So, by your logic what exactly should be GoI’s response? keep in mind, PLA hasn’t fired a shot yet.

 

[Synergy]

So, by your logic what exactly should be GoI’s response? keep in mind, PLA hasn’t fired a shot yet.

I don't think I'm efficient enough to suggest any but if we don't have any other option to apply, at least do the same to them, sit on their land and reciprocate their response.

they haven't fired a single shot but they have killed 20 of our bravehearts.

 

[Bhadra]

I would be happier if we have 800-1400 nos of Dhanush or any 155/45, 155/52 in APU or truck mounted mode along with mounted 105's, more Grads and Pinakas by winter.

If Rafales are a beauty, Arty is the beast we are sorely in need, preferably howitzers.

No,,No... in spite of your name you can not be armchair...
1400 Dhanush by year-end is baseless dreaming...
From an order of 114 they have been able to make only six over two and a half years... Even if OFB, Kalyani, TATA, L&T and ATHOS get together .. they can not deliver 1400 by year-end...

However, 400 odd Bofors, 200 Sarangs, 125 ULH plus some more are good enough..
I point out these realities and get a lot of flakes from the fanboys here..

 

[cereal killer]

What kind of proof do you want?

Few months ago I was reading some article. Those people of GB ideally want is more jobs & Pakistan to give it a state like status. There are little pro India sentiments but after removal of Art 370 they are pretty much gone. Less said about so called AJK the better.

 

[Bhadra]

Sir, with all due respect...

why haven't you asked in 1962 or before doesn't make any sense.
people voted this govt to see something different than previous govts used to do. but still now, this govt has completely failed in present LAC crisis.

still we are unhappy with Nehru for 1962 but in 1962 at least he tried something. that result could have been a bit different if they were not that much inefficient.

anybody has to reply salami slicing with force. inaction won't solve the problem.

surprisingly, the tone in your comment reflects suppression of material facts and blaming others to suppress own failure. I've not seen any other comment from you like this. I'm very much confused.

I don't give a damn to RaGa or people like Shukla. but 20 of our brothers died and now it seems PLA will be at f4, depsang etc. so their death has gone in vain. and we are being fed multipolar-bipolar $hit and befitting reply.
btw, who has given befitting reply? only the local commanders. what the govt has done so far except talking rubbish? apart from app ban and some $B project cancellation? do you really think that will even be able to scratch China?

I don't like ranting. but suppression of facts are more dangerous than ranting. constructive critisism is needed.

to fight, at first the mentality to fight is needed but that's completely missing here.

I'm not a poster boy of BJP but I'm of our country. and sorry to say, this govt is not doing better than previous govts (wrt China).

still not acknowledging intrusion and supporting that is nothing but a politically motivated step.

hoping it's not over yet...

again very sorry to write this comment but your last para compelled me to write this. again sorry. nothing personal...

I think you watch this video and listen to a Pakistani to understand why six years Prime Minister Modi can not suddenly change that mindset in our bureaucracy which is prevailing... particularly National Security architecture and MEA. MEA has been outrightly appeasing China,
On taking over as PM. Modi could not have thrown out ITBP from LAC and Change one DG, Hundred of IGs, and thousands of DIGs. It takes one or two generations to bring some change/

 

[Cheran]

Lol Unjhawala ji always gives befitting reply to machli chor chini amb.

 

[ezsasa]

I don't think I'm efficient enough to suggest any but if we don't have any other option to apply, at least do the same to them, sit on their land and reciprocate their response.

they haven't fired a single shot but they have killed 20 of our bravehearts.

Ok, let’s go with your line of thinking.

How do you plan to sit on their (our) land, without connectivity?

Keep in mind, up until a few years ago it took two weeks to reach some parts of LAC while today it takes a day. can troops be deployed in forward locations without supply routes?

and is it the case that Indian troops can walk into the territory beyond LAC when the adversary is on high alert and forward deployed in all sectors.

And as far as soldiers killed, response was given then and there. ball was in PLA’s court, and they didn’t respond in kind or escalate since.

Edit: in my opinion the biggest take away from this episode is that CCP is on everybody’s mind, and this is not just in India but across the world. Indian security establishment can no longer ignore the threat of PLA. it is front and centre.

 

[Synergy]

I think you watch this video and listen to a Pakistani to understand why six years Prime Minister Modi can not suddenly change that mindset in our bureaucracy which is prevailing... particularly National Security architecture and MEA. MEA has been outrightly appeasing China,
On taking over as PM. Modi could not have thrown out ITBP from LAC and Change one DG, Hundred of IGs, and thousands of DIGs. It takes one or two generations to bring some change/

got it.

really sorry for disagreement.

 

[Chandragupt Maurya]

Is it true that China is no longer the factory of the world and India is replacing China at a very fast pace I am asking this because FOREX reserves of India in this pandemic are rising like never before its already 534+ billion dollars

 

[nick_indian]

What kind of proof do you want?

Anything ?

 

[Sehwag213]

Is it true that China is no longer the factory of the world and India is replacing China at a very fast pace I am asking this because FOREX reserves of India in this pandemic are rising like never before its already 534+ billion dollars

Their forex is also growing rapidly.
Main reason for forex growth in last 2 to 3 weeks is depreciation of USD wrt other currencies such as Euro, pound, yen.

Their merchandise exports is 9 to 10 times ours. While their service export is 50% more than us. Our remittance is more than them.
So their overall export is 4 to 5 times ours.

 

[patriots]

The sinking tank...

 

[Bhadra]

Sir, with all due respect...

why haven't you asked in 1962 or before doesn't make any sense.
people voted this govt to see something different than previous govts used to do. but still now, this govt has completely failed in present LAC crisis.

still we are unhappy with Nehru for 1962 but in 1962 at least he tried something. that result could have been a bit different if they were not that much inefficient.

anybody has to reply salami slicing with force. inaction won't solve the problem.

surprisingly, the tone in your comment reflects suppression of material facts and blaming others to suppress own failure. I've not seen any other comment from you like this. I'm very much confused.

I don't give a damn to RaGa or people like Shukla. but 20 of our brothers died and now it seems PLA will be at f4, depsang etc. so their death has gone in vain. and we are being fed multipolar-bipolar $hit and befitting reply.
btw, who has given befitting reply? only the local commanders. what the govt has done so far except talking rubbish? apart from app ban and some $B project cancellation? do you really think that will even be able to scratch China?

I don't like ranting. but suppression of facts are more dangerous than ranting. constructive critisism is needed.

to fight, at first the mentality to fight is needed but that's completely missing here.

I'm not a poster boy of BJP but I'm of our country. and sorry to say, this govt is not doing better than previous govts (wrt China).

still not acknowledging intrusion and supporting that is nothing but a politically motivated step.

hoping it's not over yet...

again very sorry to write this comment but your last para compelled me to write this. again sorry. nothing personal...

I wish to respond again very very breifly.

India China-LAC is sixty-year-old problems where claims, counterclaims, intrusions, patrolling has been going on. However, except once and twice no bullets have been fired. So much so that led MEA and Defence forces to belive that the issue of LAC is settled and the main war front is the border with Pakistan. That border made many Generals, many politicians, bureaucrats even OFB and DRDO remained posed on Pakistan border. China got away with low cost of holding Tibet and India with low cost of maintaining LAC.

No one except once or twice ever stood up to the Chinese and beat the hell out of them. When there was apprehension that the army has started doing that post Wangdung , they almost removed the Army from LAC. Indian intelligence is also so used to misreading the Chineses.
Kuchh Nahin hota.

Modi govt has got trapped in Corona apprehensions, intelligence failure, and chalta hai attitude of ITBP that was prevalent amongst security forces since 1962. Modi has taken very significant steps and those who are making noises on LAC crisis are telling lies and lies... by their version, DBO would have been captured by now..