Gurmeet Ram Rahim - An internal security perspective

here2where

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I have three points to make sir -
1. KL court does ask the govt on killings - of stray dogs, not humans. :facepalm:
http://www.ndtv.com/kerala-news/ker...e-in-top-court-for-killing-stray-dogs-1725934

2. We/supportive media must protect the real target behind this inconsequential man Khattar. Modi's good name must be protected at all costs.

3. And the only way to do it is for Khattar to go. Modi must appear to take hard decisions and sack that numbskull. Optics matter.
 

Nicky G

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ML Khattar – Resignation Seekers




BJP Minister Resignation Seekers (BMRS) are a special class of Humans belonging to India who seek accountability from BJP leaders alone. Now a days the black coats are helping the BMRS with their activist mentality to seek brownie points from the liberal high priests. BMRS are indeed accountable to nobody except for their alien pay masters and their identity is obvious but not be told publicly People seeking the resignation of Khattar should answer the questions listed below and provide alternate answers which would justify his resignation.

Q: Did Khattar know the judgment?

A: Our judiciary is so honest that it is independent of other arms of the constitution and nobody could predict what the judgment could be. Our judiciary has given judgments based on their own interpretations of the laws and have at times gone a bit extreme when it includes minorities. Sikhs being a minority group everyone would have thought that the courts would seek their past behaviors of being softer on child rapists, murderers, etc and be lenient on Ram Rahim. Obviously the courts did not go as per their past minority bias and hence Khattar failed in predicting the end result.

Q: Is it difficult to predict the outcome?

A: Based on the probability there is only 50% chance of predicting the right result and hence we can say with confidence that it is always impossible to predict the right result. Khattar cannot be held guilty under the current circumstances.

Q: Khattar be let free from any punishment?

A: As per the criminal law procedures and any other rules a judgmental error cannot be held as evidence as crime. It it is the case then every CM at some point of time or the other has failed to protect the public property. The question remains the intent and it depends on the bias of the individual. For imaginary inaction people cannot be punished and if it is to be done, then most of the citizens would be in jails including the famous black coats.

Q: Whether RamRahim is a rapist?

A: Yes according to the courts he is a rapist and is convicted. RamRahim has still legal options available to come clean and hopefully he comes clean of the issues.

Q: Should every convict keep approaching courts and use the money and political clout to absolve their crimes?

A: The courts accept frivolous PILs, open their doors for terrorists, give chances to regular offenders, and the conviction rate being very low and too many fake cases being hoisted. With such a back ground it is not wrong and also within the right of citizen RamRahim to try every possible method to absolve himself if truth is on his side. Only Ram Rahim knows the truth and he is the best judge.

Q: Should Khattar not Resign?

A: All CMs should resign first and especially that Kerala, Bengal ones where they are aiding murders in the name of minority appeasement. Many of the north eastern states have become fascist minority states with tribals under fear, and the CMs of those states too have to resign.

Q: Khattar should resign because he failed in his duty?

A: What is the cost of the honesty certificate? When people are giving honesty certificate to Sonia, Rahul, Priyanka even when they were indulging in billions of rupee scams the honesty certificate of a few has no value and their demands be best put in garbage bin.

BMRS have a fancy of seeking resignation like the ones in BJP and now the times have changed. When BJP sought resignation, the famed corrupt and criminal ministers did not resign and hence now the BJP ministers too should not resign for any matter. Let the morality be put in bins. The political fights have been put in the context of immorality by one side and BJP should pay back in same kind. Brownie points from the white masters would never work and only power works and should be used for the welfare of the people.

The selective targeting of ML Khattar should be kept in mind and the issue of corruption investigations by Haryana government be kept in the context. Hard fought and gained power should never sacrifice just to score a few brownie points. This is the only mantra in politics.
 

OneGrimPilgrim

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Is this the bus rape case from Kerala , which involved politicians and high profile people?
yes. and nowhere near to closure. involves high-profile politicians like pj kurien. a parallel here is that the victim was a minor too at the time of some her multiple rapes (42/67, dont recall), and has several times written to authorities & bigwigs, even once rebutting SC's observation of herself!

then, there's another case where the accused is a xtian, but media usually refers him by his pre-conversion Hindu name (i think, Ganesan). do you recall about that one? @Nicky G, do you?

There is not much precedent for this as my previous post states an experienced officer. Having done so, I hope this precedent is now extended when others riot inevitably occur.

As for allowing people to converge, that's a gray area. Should there have been prohibitory orders such as 144 across all of Haryana, Punjab and Delhi? How do you exactly stop people moving? Should they have been put in preventive custody? All fair questions and I am not absolving the state of the blame, but I find it silly that people are getting carried away and blaming the government when there is not much better they could have done.

Anyway, my last post was about the courts dragging in the PM. If they want the precedent set that center should be involved in state law and order, let them pass such a judgment. It might be better in the long run. Passing comments don't mean much other than for media consumption.
some are even speculating that this event was:

1. either an attention-diversion one, away from something sinister happening in KL/Ktaka/TN

2. or that, more likely, a template/dry-run to the national herald case, when the chinese gandhis will be indicted.

That's worth an entire thread in itself.

Left attacks as a coordinated group focused on the enemy, whereas the right wing is always fragmented and riddled with in-fighting. Perhaps it has something to do with collective nature of left vs. individualistic nature of right.

Its always much harder to mobilize the right. It takes extreme situations such as ten year loot of UPA or people being fed up of establishment in US.

The left also accepts flaws and bad apples for their larger cause whereas right wingers want perfection. Perfect example right here, right wingers decrying this baba, have you heard of a leftie blaming their imams or commies? Never.
i was just wondering about this a few hours back. as someone who follows so-termed RW fellows of various hues on SM and forums, i see a staggering number of fissures in this landscape! unlike the left, the right seems to be like a chaotic scene 9f party-poopers, who had converged for some single idealistic/ideological party, after much travails & then deliberation, but it turns into a mutual fisticuff-scene when members begin to open their mouth! an example - i follow an architect on fatwabook, who has an RSS background; brilliant chap, shares very informative stuff, is brutal & unapologetic, proud, hardcore Hinduttvawaadi, erudite, articulate, goes to the enemy camps of leftists & jihadis, gives them a chokeslam & returns like a badass after getting blocked by them or otherwise, has been put in 'kufr correctional' facility by fatwabook multiple times now & it has even snatched away the 'share' button from his posts, and yada yada yada....to my amazement & dismay, some days back, he took a jibe at jaggi vasudev & ravishankar, etc., demeaning them for propagating Hinduttva 'wrongly', and was joined in by some more erudite but rabid Hinduttvawaadis spewing vile abuses at JV & RS. one fellow, like a child standing & sulking in a corner of a classrom & vying for attention of his other classmates creating a racket, suddenly declared that JV & RS are funded by missionaries! i got sucked into the vacuum of bewilderment for a few moments upon seeing that, & not able to restrain myself, wrote a sarcastic reply to his comment. and without getting the import of my comment, that fellow showed his agreement to what i had written. :dude:

this afterall is our state! we are totally, absolutely, अधकचरे-like i feel. someone once, i think @Dovah or @Project Dharma had commented, that the RW is a caricature of itself.

Do you think bullets
were bullets also fired when the jihadis organised by the same reza academy had burnt 2-3 policemen alive in a similar 'protest' in bhiwandi more than a decade ago? despite that, they were given the permission to organise another 'peaceful protest' in 2012. may be because like in 2012, they squeezed themselves out of the noose by tendering an apology.

Sir, remember - it is more important to APPEAR to do the rightful thing, than to actually do the right thing.
Modi must APPEAR to be fair to all religions. Therein lies Bharat's future
haha. saar, you are well aware who'd be then sizing the neck of NaMo, arent you? @Hemu Vikram Aditya already hinted in a subsequent post. again, one of the classic symptoms of the malady that affects the so-called RW.
 
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Hiranyaksha

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Sir, i would like to believe i live in a country where rule of law is supreme, religion be damned. And not in a place where they stone a woman to death just because she looked at 'another' man.
For all its flaws, i believe in our judiciary and in our law enforcement.
In the long run, things average out and truth will prevail. Everything else is how we perceive it.
Sweden .
__________________________________________
 

Project Dharma

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were bullets also fired when the jihadis organised by the same reza academy had burnt 2-3 policemen alive in a similar 'protest' in bhiwandi more than a decade ago? despite that, they were given the permission to organise another 'peaceful protest' in 2012. may be because like in 2012, they squeezed themselves out of the noose by tendering an apology.
Sir, you just gotta look at who is protesting and where they are protesting to get the answer of why bullets were fired. Poor illiterate people burning property in VVIP neighborhoods where Haryana's elite live.
 

OneGrimPilgrim

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Sir, you just gotta look at who is protesting and where they are protesting to get the answer of why bullets were fired. Poor illiterate people burning property in VVIP neighborhoods where Haryana's elite live.
what about in Punjab? shots fired, protesters dropped there too? sorry, i have not been following this incident in news. only intermittently gathering updates from SM and forum.
BTW, hope your folks back there are safe and your village is not touched by this fire.
 

Nicky G

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some are even speculating that this event was:

1. either an attention-diversion one, away from something sinister happening in KL/Ktaka/TN

2. or that, more likely, a template/dry-run to the national herald case, when the chinese gandhis will be indicted.
There is definitely something larger and more sinister at play here. More than national herald, which is just looting money and corporate mischief, I am more interested in what Qureshi whom the ED picked up today reveals. There are serious ISI links there.

i was just wondering about this a few hours back. as someone who follows so-termed RW fellows of various hues on SM and forums, i see a staggering number of fissures in this landscape! unlike the left, the right seems to be like a chaotic scene 9f party-poopers, who had converged for some single idealistic/ideological party, after much travails & then deliberation, but it turns into a mutual fisticuff-scene when members begin to open their mouth! an example - i follow an architect on fatwabook, who has an RSS background; brilliant chap, shares very informative stuff, is brutal & unapologetic, proud, hardcore Hinduttvawaadi, erudite, articulate, goes to the enemy camps of leftists & jihadis, gives them a chokeslam & returns like a badass after getting blocked by them or otherwise, has been put in 'kufr correctional' facility by fatwabook multiple times now & it has even snatched away the 'share' button from his posts, and yada yada yada....to my amazement & dismay, some days back, he took a jibe at jaggi vasudev & ravishankar, etc., demeaning them for propagating Hinduttva 'wrongly', and was joined in by some more erudite but rabid Hinduttvawaadis spewing vile abuses at JV & RS. one fellow, like a child standing & sulking in a corner of a classrom & vying for attention of his other classmates creating a racket, suddenly declared that JV & RS are funded by missionaries! i got sucked into the vacuum of bewilderment for a few moments upon seeing that, & not able to restrain myself, wrote a sarcastic reply to his comment. and without getting the import of my comment, that fellow showed his agreement to what i had written. :dude:

this afterall is our state! we are totally, absolutely, अधकचरे-like i feel. someone once, i think @Dovah or @Project Dharma had commented, that the RW is a caricature of itself.
I have observed RW both in my time in India and abroad and obviously over the net. They behave the same everywhere. As I said, they want perfection - do what I want done, my way. Anyone who strays is an agent for something else.

Left is similar to Islam in its focus and ability to digest bad apples for their larger goal. We are no match in that regard.

What breaks left is reality and attack on the basis premise that they are for a more fair and just society - which is BS. They are all closet fascists, even if they don't realize it since they don't have the brains to take their thoughts to the logical extreme or completely devoid of any knowledge of history of socialism or communism.

They associate Hitler to right when his party had teh word 'socialist' in it. They have no clue that Mussolini was a Marxist.

To be fair though, most RW have no clue either and thus have no idea how to counter lefties.

were bullets also fired when the jihadis organised by the same reza academy had burnt 2-3 policemen alive in a similar 'protest' in bhiwandi more than a decade ago? despite that, they were given the permission to organise another 'peaceful protest' in 2012. may be because like in 2012, they squeezed themselves out of the noose by tendering an apology.
Again, most in RW will not even bring this up. There is little hope for RW. Its only when the left goes too far that people in RW find something egregious enough to coalesce against. This is also why right does not retain power for a significant time.
 

Project Dharma

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what about in Punjab? shots fired, protesters dropped there too? sorry, i have not been following this incident in news. only intermittently gathering updates from SM and forum.
BTW, hope your folks back there are safe and your village is not touched by this fire.
@Zero-Sum-Game was talking about how dera protestors are roaming on motorcycles while normal people are under curfew lol


My village is in malwa but is Jatt Sikh dominant and all the premis have been boycotted by the Sikh community even if they are Jatts. I don't think anything is going to happen there. Mom's side is in majha and not much premi activity there. Thank you for your wishes.
 

Zero-Sum-Game

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http://indianexpress.com/article/in...a-sacha-sauda-ram-rahim-rape-verdict-4814008/
the situation on the ground remains calm, though curfew is imposed at my city faridkot yet there is no clashes over here. there was a short wave of violence and arson yesterday but there were no incidents today. deras are being disarmed and many premis has been nabbed for possession of explosives.
though the extent of the damage remains much less than what has been done at panchkula...
note:- the people listed dead were the ones belonging to Punjab who were killed in police action in panchkula..
I DONT KNOW WHAT MALIGNANT AGENDA PEOPLE ARE RUNNING OVER HERE BUT THERE HAS BEEN CONSTANT EFFORT TO SHIFT THE BLAME FROM HARYANA GOVERNMENT. I HOPE THEY COME TO THEIR SENSES.
 

Nicky G

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How people lie, so much calm in Punjab.

Again interesting how people even here want to pretend Punjab is tranquil and problem is in Haryana. I wonder what's their agenda.

IMG_20170827_010045.jpg


 

OneGrimPilgrim

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There is definitely something larger and more sinister at play here. More than national herald, which is just looting money and corporate mischief, I am more interested in what Qureshi whom the ED picked up today reveals. There are serious ISI links there.
something slightly unrelated, but seemed apt to share, hence....

He is right hand of Sonia Gandhi, planner and executioner similar to “A Sniper Killer” who kills his enemy and no one knows the Killer. Killer leaves the place with gun powder in air. Everyone worked under his order virtually except Sonia Gandhi.He is the owner of almost all Madarsas in India. His family members are VC of Deoband Institutions. His many cousins run Chain of Madarsas. He has married off his family member to Farooq Abdullah’s family. He has his links in Kerala. He is in one word allegedly known as “A Mafia of Muslims and Gateway of Arab money to India”.Common people don’t know who is the man or Cartel who commands media to outrage on certain topic. How Chandigarh’s unfortunate incident take all media space for 3 days where Girl has faced nothing physically or verbally but death of Hindu Girl who was in Delhi to become Air Hostess killed by continuous stabbing by Adil Khan in broad day light don’t get media space. Those who are in Power Corridor and media groups openly say it’s all on orders of Ahmad Patel. No one dares to write against Ahmad Patel. He is the man who control daily debates. You just Google for 10 minutes about Ahmad Patel and Media Personalities and know the result. It is allegedly said that 70-80% of media house still take command of Ahmad Patel and Prime result of Ahmad Patel power was Arnab Goswami. He was thrown out of “Times Now” not because Vineet Jain wanted it but because media cartel complained to Ahmad Patel that Arnab Goswami made them fail to set the JNU narrative. He single handedly defeated the command of Patel and thus faced the consequences.Ahmad Patel also allegedly controls Corporate Cartel and it is also visible when you connect how media gets fund – People like Nilekani, Kiran Mazumdar Shaw and many NGOs that run social camps like Narayan Murthy know that it is Ahmad Patel.

Do you know How Mainstream Media suddenly change their Platform from TV to Digital?

The Quint, The Print, The Wire, Alt_News, News Laundary, thenewsminute, JantaKaReporter, Huffmanpost etc are some of many web portals where Main Star Journalist suddenly changed and adopted to. People like Barkha Dutt is no longer on TV, she is with The Quint. People like Sekhar Gupta came up with The Print. You don’t need to do anything, you just need to know who fund them? You will see common names – Kiran Mazumdar Shaw, Nilkenis, Murthys , Azim Premzis , Amir Khans etc are some common names as fund raisers. They allegedly work on the reference basis and if the reference letter contains the name of Ahmad Patel then it is a Command.

Ahmad Patel is allegedly the one who backtracked three orders and missed the planned opportunity when RAW had got Dawood. People blame Sonia Gandhi but actually he was the man who did.Ahmad Patel was the man who planned to coin the concept “Saffron Terror”. He himself is a Muslim but keep his title Patel. From Samjhauta Blast to Ajmer Blast to Mumbai Blast, he orchestrated everything from media narrative to Home Ministry. Many people in Power Corridor openly say on platform like Twitter that he has links with ISI – Intelligence Agency of Pakistan and he executed many of their plans successfully between 2004-2014.

He is the witness of all crime because factually he was unofficial executioner.

Ahmad Patel was also in charge of recruiting officials on key posts between 2004-2014 from Judiciary to Secretary to Media Editors. He appointed IB Head, RAW Heads and Chief of Staffs. He placed his men in all departments to control the whole nation’s narrative.You can imagine Patel’s power that he jailed sitting Home Minister of State Amit Shah for more than 4 months and his whole State Intelligence Team for 8 Years led by Vanzara. He was so powerful that He grilled sitting CM Narendra Modi for 13 hours. He compelled Shah to leave Gujarat.From Augusta Westland to Spectrum, he was the man. He was the prime broker. He and Rahul Gandhi had a tussle because people backing Rahul Gandhi wanted more powers in decision making. But Sonia Gandhi favoured Ahmad Patel more than Rahul. Yesterday also when Sonia Gandhi called for Emergency AICC meeting to make plan to save Ahmad Patel, Rahul Gandhi didn’t came to participate and excused with the reason of Viral Fever. Everyone within Congress Party too knew that there are two blocks which is managed by Sonia Gandhi who along with Motilal Vohra responsible for Finance. One Block is of Rahul Gandhi and his men and other block is led by silent Ahmad Patel. Many believe that Sonia does more favour to Ahmad Patel than Rahul Gandhi for unknown reasons.Travel to Jammu, Noida, interior of Himachal, Chennai, Interior of Udaipur, Ajmer and Jodhpur etc in Rajasthan and might be many other places where you can witness the work of Ahmad Patel. How Ahmad Patel take all those Rohingya Muslims thrown out of Myanmar to make them settle across India? These are warrior or you can say “Sleeper Cells” of Ahmad Patel and can do anything on his command in emergency. This man never came into limelight so that he can do his work easily. Yesterday’s incident at last exposed him in public and people now know who is this man, for whom the Congress was so desperate.He openly capture 44 MLA wasted crores in Resort. No Law No Media No one ask him How can he do that.

Today also had shown his power when he required 45 MLAs votes but he knew that he will get 44 Votes. Thus, he went to EC and EC disqualified 2 votes within hours. Video shows no malpractice – You can see both Video, it’s available in Public Domain. Despite the presence of NDA Cabinet Ministers, Ahmad Patel made sure EC make him winner.

This is equivalent to winning a State Election. Congress was reduced from 57 to 42 seats in Gujarat but Congress made sure he wins. You can imagine his importance to Sonia Gandhi. He is the lifeline of Sonia Gandhi.

Now, as Amit Shah and Ahmad Patel both are entering Rajya Sabha, tussle between two will bring more stories to read and understand.

I have observed RW both in my time in India and abroad and obviously over the net. They behave the same everywhere. As I said, they want perfection - do what I want done, my way. Anyone who strays is an agent for something else.

Left is similar to Islam in its focus and ability to digest bad apples for their larger goal. We are no match in that regard.

What breaks left is reality and attack on the basis premise that they are for a more fair and just society - which is BS. They are all closet fascists, even if they don't realize it since they don't have the brains to take their thoughts to the logical extreme or completely devoid of any knowledge of history of socialism or communism.

They associate Hitler to right when his party had teh word 'socialist' in it. They have no clue that Mussolini was a Marxist.

To be fair though, most RW have no clue either and thus have no idea how to counter lefties.

Again, most in RW will not even bring this up. There is little hope for RW. Its only when the left goes too far that people in RW find something egregious enough to coalesce against. This is also why right does not retain power for a significant time.
i just took a peek again, and the kind and number of UTTERLY fragmented, incoherent, self-defeating, & some serially self-contradicting opinions & outpourings am seeing in the 'RW' spectrum, is seriously off-putting! its as if someone put a latth in between the spinning spokes of the jubilant fellows coming cycling from court securing a win on instant 3T! now that is dust & a new headache smack on your face is ready for you to grapple with! some dhimmilanimous secular schumcks of the congrass breed are also taking dips in the flowing sewage. just poked & pinched one such shitposting auntyji. but, yes, what you wrote seems true (even though expectations and hope desire the opposite), & its dismaying!
 

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