Aryan Invasion Hypothesis

[niharjhatn]

Looks like Abrahamic brainwashing has gotten to you...

I have to agree with warrior extreme, ultimately all the other "lesser" gods are simply different manifestations of the divine being.

Brahma-Vishnu-Mahesh is the epitome of the cosmic force of the universe, symbolising its cycles of birth, life, death and rebirth.

Hinduism at its core is monotheistic, but it is not shoved down our throats like the abrahamical religions.

remember this is just my own interpretation, I have tried to evolve a sense of Hinduism in the millenia before it became inundated with the rituals etc that form "hinduism" today that we have lost the true meanings for

 

[TTCUSM]

Shrikant Talagheri says that the Dasyus were members of the Bhrigu clan:

The characteristic feature which sets the BhRgus apart is "open hostility to the gods themselves"¦ One of the greatest of the BhRgus is everywhere said to have served as the priest and chaplain of the asuras, the demon enemies of heaven and of order (dharma)."

 

[Rahul M]

Do you mean like this?_

thanks param for making my point.
I know how much you admire hitler and goebbels. it shows. I would stick to satyameva jayate.

nihar and others, shouldn't this be in some other thread ?

 

[Param]

thanks param for making my point.
I know how much you admire hitler and goebbels. it shows. I would stick to satyameva jayate.

nihar and others, shouldn't this be in some other thread ?

Actually it's not my kind that admires Hitler. If you have ever noticed the avatars of a few members in the past few months, you would understand who admires Hitler.
There are few fanatic religious organisations and their leaders who have openly admired Hitler. I don't need to name them.

I am not the one who wants to rewrite History to rescue Arian pride.

 

[Virendra]

Shrikant Talagheri says that the Dasyus were members of the Bhrigu clan:

Careful. Don't mug Talageri as gospel truth.
His research is disputed and one of the holes blown is that he overused translated, secondary sources to reach at major conclusions; rather than counting on untranslated original primary sources.
I haven't read him in detail yet but just wanted to caution, because other scholars have. He is not left uncritized even by some in the anti-AIT camp.

so you will change your views as soon as NCERT changes its syllabus ? good to know, it's only a matter of time now.

Since when is the NCERT an above all authority of truth. What should I expect from the State owned history books?
They will keep on changing, depending upon the type of politicians at realm and what their agenda is.

Regards,
Virendra

 

[Param]

Since when is the NCERT an above all authority of truth. What should I expect from the State owned history books?
They will keep on changing, depending upon the type of politicians at realm and what their agenda is.

Regards,
Virendra

Interpretation of History also changes with International borders. It changes from region to region, culture to culture.

You are free to believe what you believe, I have the right to believe what I believe.

I hate to say this but maybe the only solution is to not have a common Indian school or college curriculum.
Maybe this way every region and culture is free to frame its own History.

 

[Rahul M]

sure. it wasn't me who went running to hitler's quote.

 

[Virendra]

Interpretation of History also changes with International borders. It changes from region to region, culture to culture.

Yeah. So? It is India that the Aryan suppsedly invaded. Aren't we supposed to excavate the truth out?

You are free to believe what you believe, I have the right to believe what I believe.

Leave the belief system to God and Religion. Academics cannot be allowed to fall on beliefs. What we teach or learn there, should be based on the facts that stand the test of time and continous scrunity. AIT doesn't qualify and AMT is even more implausible after AIT has fallen. If the invasion didn't happen, migration is even more impossible, unless there was a Gandhi who taught ahimsa to the reigning natives of Sapta-Sindhu.
Regardless of the version this theory takes from here, at least the currently taught BS in our books should be washed out. Because it has been disowned by people of both the camps.

Regards,
Virendra

 

[Vyom]

Greek Gods - The Sanskrit Connection

Greek Gods - The Sanskrit Connection

 

[Virendra]

Dr. J.M. Kenoyer Professor of Anthropology:
"Many scholars have tried to correct this absurd theory [of an Aryan invasion], by pointing out misinterpreted basic facts, inappropriate models and an uncritical reading of Vedic texts. However, until recently, these scientific and well-reasoned arguments were unsuccessful in rooting out the misinterpretations entrenched in the popular literature.
But there is no archaeological or biological evidence for invasions or mass migrations into the Indus Valley between the end of the Harappan Phase, about 1900 BC and the beginning of the Early Historic period around 600 BC"

Jim G. Shaffer, Archaeologist and Professor of Anthropology
"Current archaeological data do not support the existence of an Indo-Aryan or European invasion into South Asia any time in the pre- or protohistoric periods. Instead, it is possible to document archaeologically a series of cultural changes reflecting indigenous cultural developments from prehistoric to historic periods."
Source -- "The Indo-Aryan Invasions : Cultural Myth and Archaeological Reality," p. 88

Kenneth A. R. Kennedy an Anthropologist
"Biological anthropologists remain unable to lend support to any of the theories concerning an Aryan biological or demographic entity. What the biological data demonstrate is that no exotic races are apparent from laboratory studies of human remains excavated from any archaeological sites. All prehistoric human remains recovered thus far from the Indian subcontinent are phenotypically identifiable as ancient South Asians. In short, there is no evidence of demographic disruptions in the north-western sector of the subcontinent during and immediately after the decline of the Harappan culture"

 

[Param]

Leave the belief system to God and Religion. Academics cannot be allowed to fall on beliefs. What we teach or learn there, should be based on the facts that stand the test of time and continous scrunity. AIT doesn't qualify and AMT is even more implausible after AIT has fallen. If the invasion didn't happen, migration is even more impossible, unless there was a Gandhi who taught ahimsa to the reigning natives of Sapta-Sindhu.
Regardless of the version this theory takes from here, at least the currently taught BS in our books should be washed out. Because it has been disowned by people of both the camps.

Regards,
Virendra

If the current History is washed out , I believe there won't be much difference between History taught in India and propaganda History taught in Pakistan.

Currently taught stuff maybe BS to others but not me and hundreds of millions others. Like I mentioned earlier that the attempts to rewrite history as well as the opposition to such a move have a regional as well as caste related angle.

AMT is Fact. It may not stand your scrutiny or historians quoted by you but for me it is valid. It is accepted by most historians outside the Subcontinent

In my earlier comment I made a climb down when I said "You are free to believe what you believe, I have the right to believe what I believe."

Now I realising that some people want to impose their own version on History I say that any any rewritten History should be thrown into the dustbin . If some people want AMT to be officially discarded they don't have a right to impose it on people who do not agree with it.

 

[Vyom]

If the current History is washed out , I believe there won't be much difference between History taught in India and propaganda History taught in Pakistan.

Currently taught stuff maybe BS to others but not me and hundreds of millions others. Like I mentioned earlier that the attempts to rewrite history as well as the opposition to such a move have a regional as well as caste related angle.

AMT is Fact. It may not stand your scrutiny or historians quoted by you but for me it is valid. It is accepted by most historians outside the Subcontinent

In my earlier comment I made a climb down when I said "You are free to believe what you believe, I have the right to believe what I believe."

Now I realising that some people want to impose their own version on History I say that any any rewritten History should be thrown into the dustbin . If some people want AMT to be officially discarded they don't have a right to impose it on people who do not agree with it.

The matter should be settled in court. Wrong history is equally infringing.

 

[Param]

Dr. J.M. Kenoyer Professor of Anthropology:
"Many scholars have tried to correct this absurd theory [of an Aryan invasion], by pointing out misinterpreted basic facts, inappropriate models and an uncritical reading of Vedic texts. However, until recently, these scientific and well-reasoned arguments were unsuccessful in rooting out the misinterpretations entrenched in the popular literature.
But there is no archaeological or biological evidence for invasions or mass migrations into the Indus Valley between the end of the Harappan Phase, about 1900 BC and the beginning of the Early Historic period around 600 BC"

Jim G. Shaffer, Archaeologist and Professor of Anthropology
"Current archaeological data do not support the existence of an Indo-Aryan or European invasion into South Asia any time in the pre- or protohistoric periods. Instead, it is possible to document archaeologically a series of cultural changes reflecting indigenous cultural developments from prehistoric to historic periods."
Source -- "The Indo-Aryan Invasions : Cultural Myth and Archaeological Reality," p. 88

Kenneth A. R. Kennedy an Anthropologist
"Biological anthropologists remain unable to lend support to any of the theories concerning an Aryan biological or demographic entity. What the biological data demonstrate is that no exotic races are apparent from laboratory studies of human remains excavated from any archaeological sites. All prehistoric human remains recovered thus far from the Indian subcontinent are phenotypically identifiable as ancient South Asians. In short, there is no evidence of demographic disruptions in the north-western sector of the subcontinent during and immediately after the decline of the Harappan culture"

Ancient Indus Writing by Asko Parpola Text Version

Many hypotheses have been put forward about the affinity of the Indus language, but only two alternatives have had wider support.

Indo-Aryan languages have been spoken in the area once occupied by the Indus civilisation and gradually all over North India since at least 1000 B.C. It is natural to assume that they were spoken there even earlier. Speakers of Hindi, Bengali and other Neo-Indo-Aryan languages especially have been prone to interpret the Indus texts as Sanskrit (understood in the broad sense of Old Indo-Aryan), from which their own mother tongues have evolved.

The Sanskrit hypothesis, however, is difficult to reconcile chronologically with the date of the Indus civilisation (about the second half of the third millennium B.C.) and antecedent Early Harappan neolithic cultures which were responsible for its creation. Comparison of the Vedic texts with the Avesta and with the West Asian documents relating to the Aryan kings of Mitanni suggests that the Vedic Aryans entered the Indian subcontinent from Northeast Iran and Central Asia in the second millennium B.C.

 

[Param]

Ancient Indus Writing by Asko Parpola Text Version

The Indus script represents logo-syllabic writing. This means that it does not constitute such a closed system of single-valued graphemes as the syllabic and alphabetic scripts, which could be cracked as wholes. Rather, individual signs may be interpreted one by one, and many of the graphemes are likely to remain eternal mysteries.

The interpretations presented above, few in number but cross-checked, suggest that the Indus script was essentially similar to the other pictographic scripts created before the middle of the third millennium B.C., that the language of the Indus people was Dravidian, and that they professed a religion that was genetically related to the religions of both the ancient West Asia and the later India.

The Harappan religion emerging from these interpretations is in an interesting way reflected in the Indus pictograms. As iconic signs making use of the picture puzzle (or rebus) principle, they can simultaneously communicate two separate messages, one pictorial, one phonetic. It seems to me that the creators of the script were at pains to invent such iconic symbols that the two messages would be in harmony with each other. Witness the 'roofed fish' (pictorial message) as the rebus for the 'black star' (phonetic message), both symbols for the deified dark planet Saturn, conceived as riding the slow-creeping tortoise.

 

[The Messiah]

Only a foolish person would think there were no migrations into India.

There are different racial features among Indians and that alone proves all didn't arrive in one group.

Invasion bit is phoren invention and it is bs.

 

[Param]

Impact of Dravidians on the Development of Civilisation in India

 

[Param]

Only a fool would think there were no migrations into India.

There are different racial features among Indians and that alone proves all didn't arrive in one group.

Invasion bit is phoren invention and it is bs.

True I too have doubts about AIT but I believe in AMT.

Some people want to portray that there are no racial or ethnic differences. That's absurd. The racial differences from South to North, east to wst and the jungles of central India is striking.

The reason is they want the Aryans to take full credit for ancient Indian civilization and culture. This is the easiest method to discredit the non Aryan cultures.
And by taking all credit they can once again impose their hegemony by consolidating power and ruling the masses.

Everybody knows race and caste have a connection in the subcontinent. Why is it that most of the upper castes have fairer complexion, caucasion features compared to the rest of the castes?

 

[The Messiah]

Unity in diversity didn't drop out of the sky.

We have differences yet we are similar. Every region is unique.

 

[LurkerBaba]

The reason is they want the Aryans to take full credit for ancient Indian civilization and culture. This is the easiest method to discredit the non Aryan cultures.
And by taking all credit they can once again impose their hegemony by consolidating power and ruling the masses.

Everybody knows race and caste have a connection in the subcontinent. Why is it that most of the upper castes have fairer complexion, caucasion features compared to the rest of the castes?

The only "Non-Aryan" culture I know of is the one which members of DMK practice

 

[Param]

Only a foolish person would think there were no migrations into India.

There are different racial features among Indians and that alone proves all didn't arrive in one group.

Invasion bit is phoren invention and it is bs.

Through out our History in the past 2500 years plenty of tribes migrated or Invaded from Central Asia like Scythians, Parthians, Sakas, Kushans, Huns.

How is it feasible that there were no migrations from Central Asia before 2500 BC?

If Aryans did not migrate then how come there are plenty of people with Dark skin even in the North west?

How did people with different physical attributes and skin tone evolve in the same area?

Why does the color of the skin often vary between the dominant varnas and the lowest varna?