Aryan Invasion Hypothesis

[Singh]

why does she look different from_

?????

Evolution and selective breeding.

By adhering too caste, tribal system, certain genes became more prominent for some and less prominent for others.

It has been proven, and that research has been posted in one of these aryan invasion threads, that all of India has an admixture of Aryan-Dravidian markers, some have more of the former and some more of the latter.

 

[niharjhatn]

So you agree that there were migrations and that there are different races?

I don't even know what "race" is mate. Current definitions of race evolved hundreds of years ago based on unscientific white supremacists with little understanding of the human chromosome.

I assume they were migrations, because that is what we have been led to believe. The same Europeans that a hundred years ago pronounced white man as god's descendants and blacks as the devils turned around and suddenly said we ALL came out of africa. To me it is just a theory riddled with flaws. Personally, I want to believe that there were multiple focal points of human evolution, but that ofcourse does not explain the tremendous homology we have in our genes.

What I was trying to say is that we know jack s*** about evolution, and hence commentary like the aryan invasion theory have little genetic basis - at which point IMO all talk of different "races" falls apart.

There are ofcourse those who argue of the "linguistic" basis of the aryan invasion, which I find to be even less believable, simply blind men searching for patterns in the sands to me.

Genes mutate, and hence why I don't look like my sister or my mother or father. Hence that pretty lady looks different to the... uh... NOT so pretty lady

Who is that pretty lady btw??

 

[Iamanidiot]

And what about color? other facial features?

Dark and light complexion people in the north eat the same food. why do they have different skin tones?

The woman in the second picture is from Chattisgarh not TN.

TN women are also gradually having a lighter complexion earlier only ayyers had that complexion

 

[LurkerBaba]

Both Sanskrit and proto dravidian influenced each other. Proto dravidian dissapeared Sanskrit exists. Old tamil comes closest to proto dravidian.

You cannot attribute every word in ancient sanskrit texts to the Sanskrit language alone.

So basically, the "Dravidian People" have even lost their original "race name" ? They have to use a word coined up by that "Aryan" Brahmin Adi Shankaracharya ?

aryan invasion is nonsense invented by europeans to massage there ego.

we are talking about migrations.

So you agree that there were migrations and that there are different races?

But there is no such thing called an "Aryan Race". The people who migrated were given the titles of "Arya".

 

[niharjhatn]

TN women are also gradually having a lighter complexion earlier only ayyers had that complexion

Is it really true? That all (most) -ayyers are fair? Must have ridiculously selective breeding

I know an "iyengar" and he isn't particularly fair...

 

[Param]

Evolution and selective breeding.

By adhering too caste, tribal system, certain genes became more prominent for some and less prominent for others.

It has been proven, and that research has been posted in one of these aryan invasion threads, that all of India has an admixture of Aryan-Dravidian markers, some have more of the former and some more of the latter.

Evolution_ right!

I agree most people have a mixture of Aryan Dravidian markers but what is the origin of these markers?
Obviously there must have been a time when these markers were separate.

 

[Param]

Is it really true? That all (most) -ayyers are fair? Must have ridiculously selective breeding

I know an "iyengar" and he isn't particularly fair...

Most Tambrams have fairer complexion than the average tamilian.

 

[Param]

TN women are also gradually having a lighter complexion earlier only ayyers had that complexion

Fair and Lovely.

 

[Param]

So basically, the "Dravidian People" have even lost their original "race name" ? They have to use a word coined up by that "Aryan" Brahmin Adi Shankaracharya ?

I don't know. Like I said earlier aryans and aryan culture has been dominant for the past 3500 years.

But there is no such thing called an "Aryan Race". The people who migrated were given the titles of "Arya"

.

Were dalits and Tribals of Central India called Arya?

 

[Singh]

Evolution_ right!

I agree most people have a mixture of Aryan Dravidian markers but what is the origin of these markers?
Obviously there must have been a time when these markers were separate.

The origin of those markers is evolution, mutation, breeding etc.

If 2 twins live in different environments over millenias they will evolve differently and then lets not forget mutations.

 

[niharjhatn]

Evolution_ right!

I agree most people have a mixture of Aryan Dravidian markers but what is the origin of these markers?
Obviously there must have been a time when these markers were separate.

Not evolution... random mutations and those people with random mutations mating with other people with random mutations to create a new "race"

Doesn't mean they were "separate" at the start.

Pan-africanists (I lived in RSA remember ) believe whites were albino blacks that were ostracized and eventually forced to leave the continent. IMO such a theory has more validity than a significant migration into India.

Maybe India really is the origin of all that is in the world? IMO that is the only good explanation that would satisfy both of us

 

[Param]

The origin of those markers is evolution, mutation, breeding etc.

If 2 twins live in different environments over millenias they will evolve differently and then lets not forget mutations.

So did dark complexioned Northies evolve in a place different from light complexioned ones?

 

[Galaxy]

Evolution_ right!

I agree most people have a mixture of Aryan Dravidian markers but what is the origin of these markers?
Obviously there must have been a time when these markers were separate.

There is nothing called Aryan, the way you are thinking. It's Western self-made theory. I can give tons of articles which rejects such claims.

As far as different color and & physical appearance is concerned, it's because of Climate, Evolution, Migration (Mainly within country and some from outside specially central Asia some 2,000 years back). Tribal belts are full of dense forests, tough terrain and difficult to live compare with Gujarat and Mahrashtra. Add sea coast too. some people must have migrated too. The complexion is more due to genetic, living condition and climate. Within a family, There is lots of differences.

Even water also makes difference. Example: Mumbai/Punjab water is good for complex compare with Delhi/Jharkhand.

 

[Param]

Maybe India really is the origin of all that is in the world? IMO that is the only good explanation that would satisfy both of us

That is what the pro aryanists also advocate.

But science and the rest of the world says otherwise.

 

[Param]

There is nothing called Aryan, the way you are thinking. It's Western self-made theory. I can give tons of articles which rejects such claims.

As far as different color and & physical appearance is concerned, it's because of Climate, Evolution, Migration (Mainly within country and some from outside specially central Asia some 2,000 years back). Tribal belts are full of dense forests, tough terrain and difficult to live compare with Gujarat and Mahrashtra. Add sea coast too. some people must have migrated too. The complexion is more due to genetic, living condition and climate. Within a family, There is lots of differences.

I have seen Punjabis, delhites and UP ites from the same region having vastly different skin tone.Do thier localities have different climates?

 

[niharjhatn]

That is what the pro aryanists also advocate.

But science and the rest of the world says otherwise.

Meh, that "science" as I have tried to argue, is flawed. Its like trying to explain chemical bonds without understanding the atom.

I'll either believe that or that we truly were brought here by aliens as their playthings. And in a 1000 years they will come back to hunt us... hmm.. sounds like a good movie

 

[Galaxy]

I have seen Punjabis, delhites and Up ites from the same region having vastly different skin tone.

Yes, It is.

Even i have seen few Tamil people in Delhi who are fair, but few from U.P. who are not fair. When i see their other family members, It's opposite.

Even 2 kids of any parents have different color as well as physic depends on father or mother gene. So, it goes on....

 

[Virendra]

And what about color? other facial features?

Dark and light complexion people in the north eat the same food. why do they have different skin tones?

The woman in the second picture is from Chattisgarh not TN.

It is futile to conclude geographic, genetic or racial origin of people on basis of physical appearence. The visible characteristics of genes are not scientific way to figure out the underlying genetics. Will always lead to contradicting conclusions.
Please segregate it between genotype and phenotype.
A phenotype is an organism's observable characteristics or traits. While the Genotype of an organism is the inherited instructions it carries within its genetic code.
Not all organisms with the same genotype look or act the same way because appearance and behavior are modified by environmental and developmental conditions. Likewise, not all organisms that look alike necessarily have the same genotype.
A particular genotype, in a particular environment, having a particular type of interaction with that environment - will lead to a particular phenotype materialized.

Regards,
Virendra

 

[Param]

Yes, It is.

Even i have seen few Tamil people in Delhi who are fair, but few from U.P. who are not fair. When i see their other family members, It's opposite.

Even 2 kids of any parents have different color as well as physic depends on father or mother gene. So, it goes on....

Historically there was a lot of migration from North to South. There was intermixing.

I have mentioned earlier that most tambrams are fair but most non uppercaste have darker complexion in our state.

 

[Param]

It is futile to conclude geographic, genetic or racial origin of people on basis of physical appearence. The visible characteristics of genes are not scientific way to figure out the underlying genetics. Will always lead to contradicting conclusions.
Please segregate it between genotype and phenotype.
A phenotype is an organism's observable characteristics or traits. While the Genotype of an organism is the inherited instructions it carries within its genetic code.
Not all organisms with the same genotype look or act the same way because appearance and behavior are modified by environmental and developmental conditions. Likewise, not all organisms that look alike necessarily have the same genotype.

Regards,
Virendra

My question is simple_ why are there people having dark complexion as well as people having light complexion in North west India?

The southern phenomenon can be explained by various migrations and Invasions from North to south. almost all happened in recorded History.