Aryan Invasion Hypothesis

[AUSTERLITZ]

The whole thing was politicized by the british and made a sensitive issue over nothing.That there was a migration is undeniable by genetics.So what ,that was 4000 years ago,pretty much every indian today is mixed- we are neither the people that came in,nor the ones that were there who had come earlier -we are the synthesis of the 2 plus subsequent entries..There was no invasion,and the IVC collpased due to flood and climatic factors.Its only with the coming of iron tools that forests in the gangetic plains were cleared and they started building cities and settling down enmasse.We are perhaps the only country so sensitive about migration.Turkey and england are countries built on migration far more recent ,nobody seems to be insecure about it over there.

 

[Suryavanshi]

Also I believe the concept of Aryan as Propagated by Hitler has nothing to do with Aryan Invasion Theory.

 

[Shaitan]

The whole concept of a pure race, or a pure class of people, etc. is completely garbage now. We are all mixed in some way, some of us even have archaic human genes. The small difference we talk about in steppe peoples, tribals, etc. is so small and irrelevant in the large picture. But never the less for people interested in the movement of peoples and history, it is interesting, but we are a few.

 

[Haldilal]

The whole thing was politicized by the british and made a sensitive issue over nothing.That there was a migration is undeniable by genetics.So what ,that was 4000 years ago,pretty much every indian today is mixed- we are neither the people that came in,nor the ones that were there who had come earlier -we are the synthesis of the 2 plus subsequent entries..There was no invasion,and the IVC collpased due to flood and climatic factors.Its only with the coming of iron tools that forests in the gangetic plains were cleared and they started building cities and settling down enmasse.We are perhaps the only country so sensitive about migration.Turkey and england are countries built on migration far more recent ,nobody seems to be insecure about it over there.

The Subclade R1a1a RM 17 RM178 is most commonly associated with Indo-European speakers, although the Subclade R1b1a has also been linked to the Centum branch of Indo-European. Data so far collected indicate that there are two widely separated areas of high frequency, one in Eastern Europeans, around Poland and the Russian core, and the other in India, around Ganga Plains. The historical and prehistoric possible reasons for this are the subject of on-going discussion and attention amongst population geneticists and genetic genealogists, and are considered to be of potential interest to linguists and archaeologists also.

 

[Suryavanshi]

also It would be fun to have a thread on Egyptians, days arent far when we will be claiming Egyptian ancestry.

 

[Heat]

Except the 1500BC bs AMT event, Steppe migration is fine with me. Human migration has happened since we exited Africa and still happens today. They are a crucial part of our history.

 

[Suryavanshi]

@Peter also I think language is not the most solid indicator of Ancestry. We can see similarities in Japanese and Hindi if we really try.

 

[Haldilal]

The Krugan Hypotheses, as of 2017 the theory, depends on linguistic and archaeological evidence is not universally accepted.

 

[Suryavanshi]

@Haldilal Steppe People are credited with the domestication of Horses, but the evidence found in India seem to suggest otherwise.

 

[Haldilal]

@Haldilal Steppe People are credited with the domestication of Horses, but the evidence found in India seem to suggest otherwise.

Horses were of Middle eastern origin with the changes in the climatic conditions spread to the other parts so. Domestication of the horses has been found in the many parts of the world. Like in Kazakhstann Ukraine Iran Iraq etc as 4,000 BCE older.

 

[Haldilal]

Recent studies suggest as I have already posted that the Steppe DNA have originated in Armenia or Iran. The Launguage studies also point out to this.

 

[Suryavanshi]

Recent studies suggest as I have already posted that the Steppe DNA have originated in Armenia or Iran. The Launguage studies also point out to this.

 

[LurkerBaba]

There was no invasion,and the IVC collpased due to flood and climatic factors.Its only with the coming of iron tools that forests in the gangetic plains were cleared and they started building cities and settling down enmasse.We are perhaps the only country so sensitive about migration.Turkey and england are countries built on migration far more recent ,nobody seems to be insecure about it over there.

+100
A migration happened. Genetics is proof. The Rakhigarhi DNA studies proves this rather than discredit it. IVC started collapsing due to monsoon failures and possible death of river Saraswati. The "Indo Aryans" came and mixed with the IVC people.

@Shaitan people get triggered because some folks have a "Unlike other places there is no such thing as Indian civilisation. Its just some place where a bunch of invasions took place" argument.

This leads to emotional folks on our side swinging the opposite way and coming up with theories based on nonsensical interpretations of Vedas. Move on. A better use of resources would be deconstructing cuckoo Dravidian theories involving lemuria. I mean there are friggin political parties based on that.

 

[Suryavanshi]

A better use of resources would be deconstructing cuckoo Dravidian theories involving lemuria. I mean there are friggin political parties based on that.

Its the most retarded theory ever. And what parties harp this theory?

Spoiler

 

[Haldilal]

+100
A migration happened. Genetics is proof. The Rakhigarhi DNA studies proves this rather than discredit it. IVC started collapsing due to monsoon failures and possible death of river Saraswati. The "Indo Aryans" came and mixed with the IVC people.

@Shaitan people get triggered because some folks have a "Unlike other places there is no such thing as Indian civilisation. Its just some place where a bunch of invasions took place" argument.

This leads to emotional folks on our side swinging the opposite way and coming up with theories based on nonsensical interpretations of Vedas. Move on. A better use of resources would be deconstructing cuckoo Dravidian theories involving lemuria. I mean there are friggin political parties based on that.

Bharata varshe was Vishal not based on a geographic linguistic or Climatic. We trend to see through the modern lens. People used to migrate due to changing Climatic sea level and other causes. So this Invansion theory of @Shaitan Caused huge commentary. I just posted a loose translation of the books from a site and then everyone jumped to the bandwagon.

 

[Heat]

Not even the invasion theory, but untenable timelines muddle this even more. When asked about data, people outright try to shift the goal posts.

If we do not accept our ignorance, then how will we gain any knowledge.

 

[Shaitan]

+100
A migration happened. Genetics is proof. The Rakhigarhi DNA studies proves this rather than discredit it. IVC started collapsing due to monsoon failures and possible death of river Saraswati. The "Indo Aryans" came and mixed with the IVC people.

@Shaitan people get triggered because some folks have a "Unlike other places there is no such thing as Indian civilisation. Its just some place where a bunch of invasions took place" argument.

This leads to emotional folks on our side swinging the opposite way and coming up with theories based on nonsensical interpretations of Vedas. Move on. A better use of resources would be deconstructing cuckoo Dravidian theories involving lemuria. I mean there are friggin political parties based on that.

Man, that is what I am trying to say The mainstream Indian academia have already moved on, and they are moving on fast!! They are on to different topics now in relations to these movements, etc.. Many Indians on the web think there is some sort of conspiracy against India, etc. The most propaganda I've been seeing of late is from Indians themselves.

The migration and the mixing that occurred is unlike any in Indian history, the movement of people that occurred also is unlike any in Indian history - it completely dwarfs the affects of the Indo-Pak border migration that occurred. We, the whole subcontinent have shared lineage from these events and it's mind boggling.

And it's not as simple as they gave us civilization, but it was the blending of peoples coming together that made Indian civilization. All of the successful Indo-European civilization - Rome, Greece, Persia, and India were a blend of outside and local forces.

By the time Alexander the Great invaded Indo-European peoples of Persia, Scythia, and India all these groups diverged in significant ways. That was due to the mixing with local peoples, extreme adaption to the locality.

 

[Heat]

The mainstream Indian academia have already moved on, and they are moving on fast!!

What new horizons are they really exploring nowadays ?

 

[Shaitan]

Bharata varshe was Vishal not based on a geographic linguistic or Climatic. We trend to see through the modern lens. People used to migrate due to changing Climatic sea level and other causes. So this Invansion theory of @Shaitan Caused huge commentary. I just posted a loose translation of the books from a site and then everyone jumped to the bandwagon.

First of all I dont discard or rule out a invasion or conflict, unlike you. These steppe peoples were pastoralist looking for grazing land for their herds. No one willingly gives up land to feed some foreign alien tribe's life stock. Why dont you let some Chinese guy take over you backyard and let him plant okra there? These were complete alien populations meeting each other for the first time. Its not going to be roses and sunshine, especially back in those days.

 

[Haldilal]

First of all I dont discard or rule out a invasion or conflict, unlike you. These steppe peoples were pastoralist looking for grazing land for their herds. No one willingly gives up land to feed some foreign alien tribe's life stock. Why dont you let some Chinese guy take over you backyard and let him plant okra there? These were complete alien populations meeting each other for the first time. Its not going to be roses and sunshine, especially back in those days.