ADA Tejas (LCA) News and Discussions

[HariPrasad-1]

You can thank Eurofighter's specialist who helped you to studied LCA ! Nice job.

Correct English please. Unable to understand what you say.

 

[BON PLAN]

Correct English please. Unable to understand what you say.

Oh so sorry ! I don't studied in Oxford..... I beg your pardon.

What don't you understand?

"you can thank the specialists at Eurofighter that helped you develop your plane" It sound better to your sensitive ears ???

 

[Kharavela]

Oh so sorry ! I don't studied in Oxford..... I beg your pardon.

What don't you understand?

"you can thank the specialists at Eurofighter that helped you develop your plane" It sound better to your sensitive ears ???

Will you provide any source for your claim ? AFAIK, Dassault engineers had helped LCA project, not Eurofighter.

 

[HariPrasad-1]

Oh so sorry ! I don't studied in Oxford..... I beg your pardon.

What don't you understand?

"you can thank the specialists at Eurofighter that helped you develop your plane" It sound better to your sensitive ears ???

Are you a chinese??? because this sort of English and ignorance are chinese specific.

And forget about Euro fighter. We are all set to make something much better than Eurofighter. Ours i a country of innovations and R & D and not the copy cat like yours. Eurofighter guys offered us a partnership Eurofighter project but we denied. Our LCA Navy MK2 shall be comparable to euro fighter in many specifications including weight carrying and maneuvering ability, avionics, Radar and EW. We do not need Eurofighter guys help. We just need some time to make better plane than eurofighter.

 

[Indx TechStyle]

Bengaluru to be interim home for IAF’s early LCAs

The Indian Air Force will initially station and operate from Bengaluru the first batch of four indigenous Tejas Light Combat Aircraft, two of them due to be delivered in June, according to the chief of the LCA’s production partner.

The early fighters would be housed at the facilities of Hindustan Aeronautics Ltd. and will move over to Air Force Station Sulur near Coimbatore when more numbers are supplied.

The four are part of the first order of 20 LCAs that HAL is executing for the IAF. The third aircraft from the ongoing production-grade or ‘series production’ version is ready and the fourth is targeted for handover around June, according to HAL CMD T.Suvarna Raju.

Two more are planned to be brought out towards December this year. The next deliveries are spread in phases through 2018.

Mr. Raju recently said that post-2018, HAL would start move into an improved version, the LCA Mark 1A, for which the IAF is said to have an indicated requirement for 100 aircraft. For its many improvements, Mark 1A is slated to have the important AESA radar which is being discussed with its Israeli manufacturer; aerial refuelling fitments, jammer and a host of electronic warfare devices.

The fighters are designed and developed by the Aeronautical Development Agency (ADA) and manufactured by HAL. The single-engine LCA, conceived and kick-started as the world's lightest agile fighter for the country's security requirements about 25 years back, has missed often development and production schedules, some of them blamed on delays by component suppliers.

The State-owned defence company says it has been trying to speed up the production of the fighters by setting up a special assembly line and inviting industry vendors to take up manufacturing larger portions of the aircraft. ADA is also developing Navy and trainer versions.

 

[garg_bharat]

@Chinmoy, a fighter is expected to fly at least 200 hours per year.

The life of LCA will not be less than 6000 hours. I doubt iaf will accept less than this.

Your calculation of max military power for cruise may be incorrect. I think less power is needed to maintain speed, once cruise speed is attained. So the aircraft can fly longer on internal fuel.

 

[G10]

Why HAL seeks SAAB help for LCA? Sense something is not right.

 

[garg_bharat]

Why HAL seeks SAAB help for LCA? Sense something is not right.

HAL has a very risk averse culture. It is a hand me down company. It is afraid to use own grey cells.

HAL will look for anything other than itself. No surprises here.

 

[harsh]

Bengaluru to be interim home for IAF’s early LCAs

The Indian Air Force will initially station and operate from Bengaluru the first batch of four indigenous Tejas Light Combat Aircraft, two of them due to be delivered in June, according to the chief of the LCA’s production partner.

The early fighters would be housed at the facilities of Hindustan Aeronautics Ltd. and will move over to Air Force Station Sulur near Coimbatore when more numbers are supplied.The four are part of the first order of 20 LCAs that HAL is executing for the IAF. The third aircraft from the ongoing production-grade or ‘series production’ version is ready and the fourth is targeted for handover around June, according to HAL CMD T.Suvarna Raju.

Two more are planned to be brought out towards December this year. The next deliveries are spread in phases through 2018.

Mr. Raju recently said that post-2018, HAL would start move into an improved version, the LCA Mark 1A, for which the IAF is said to have an indicated requirement for 100 aircraft. For its many improvements, Mark 1A is slated to have the important AESA radar which is being discussed with its Israeli manufacturer; aerial refuelling fitments, jammer and a host of electronic warfare devices.

The fighters are designed and developed by the Aeronautical Development Agency (ADA) and manufactured by HAL. The single-engine LCA, conceived and kick-started as the world’s lightest agile fighter for the country’s security requirements about 25 years back, has missed often development and production schedules, some of them blamed on delays by component suppliers.

The State-owned defence company says it has been trying to speed up the production of the fighters by setting up a special assembly line and inviting industry vendors to take up manufacturing larger portions of the aircraft. ADA is also developing Navy and trainer versions.

 

[Chinmoy]

@Chinmoy, a fighter is expected to fly at least 200 hours per year.

The life of LCA will not be less than 6000 hours. I doubt iaf will accept less than this.

Your calculation of max military power for cruise may be incorrect. I think less power is needed to maintain speed, once cruise speed is attained. So the aircraft can fly longer on internal fuel.

Well, it may be true about what you and I have mentioned about typical flight hrs of IAF pilot. This is what IAF pilots too say...

"What counts in commercial flying is the number of flying hours. A typical sortie for a fighter pilot lasts 20-30 minutes while our transport counterparts are airborne for much longer duration. While we focus on our mission and are guided by controllers, the transport pilots' role is ferrying from point A to point B," an IAF fighter pilot told Business Line.

http://www.thehindubusinessline.com/todays-paper/article2186466.ece

If we consider this 6000 hrs of flight time for one LCA means 60 years in service without any major overhaul which is very unlikely. I think IAF would take any thing from 3000 to 4000 hrs as what they have asked for in IOC.

As far as my calculation about fuel consumption and thrust is concerned, I may be wrong, but my calculations are very near to reality based on this outputs.

Minimum Thrust of GE F404 47 kN
Fuel consumption of GE F404 82.6 kg/kN h

https://defenseissues.wordpress.com/2014/12/06/fighter-aircraft-engine-comparision/

it implies that to produce minimum thrust of 47 kN for 1 hr it would consume 3882 kg of fuel. you could add or delete couple of hundred from this. So in clean configuration mode you can't expect Tejas to be in air for 1 hr in one sortie. Along with this if we club the average flight hrs of an IAF pilot, my projection of 185 hrs of Tejas flight time per year is a high probability.

But again we can only predict these things unless and until we get our hands on any official document.

 

[Chinmoy]

Why HAL seeks SAAB help for LCA? Sense something is not right.

HAL is relatively an infant in aircraft production. It earlier venture in Marut too had been undertaken by German engineering team. It did employed Dessault as technical consultant during the early phase of LCA programe. Due to its limitation of technical know how and why in aviation, it had sought help of SAAB to smoothen up some rough spots. Its not a matter of grave concern when you are a newbie in any field.

 

[SilverSabre]

Well, it may be true about what you and I have mentioned about typical flight hrs of IAF pilot. This is what IAF pilots too say...



http://www.thehindubusinessline.com/todays-paper/article2186466.ece

If we consider this 6000 hrs of flight time for one LCA means 60 years in service without any major overhaul which is very unlikely. I think IAF would take any thing from 3000 to 4000 hrs as what they have asked for in IOC.

As far as my calculation about fuel consumption and thrust is concerned, I may be wrong, but my calculations are very near to reality based on this outputs.

Minimum Thrust of GE F404 47 kN
Fuel consumption of GE F404 82.6 kg/kN h

https://defenseissues.wordpress.com/2014/12/06/fighter-aircraft-engine-comparision/

it implies that to produce minimum thrust of 47 kN for 1 hr it would consume 3882 kg of fuel. you could add or delete couple of hundred from this. So in clean configuration mode you can't expect Tejas to be in air for 1 hr in one sortie. Along with this if we club the average flight hrs of an IAF pilot, my projection of 185 hrs of Tejas flight time per year is a high probability.

But again we can only predict these things unless and until we get our hands on any official document.

Your calculations pit the GE 404 47kn as the cruise consumption where as thrust is needed only during acceleration, the thrust consumption numbers shared above are the after burner numbers the actual average consumption numbers change based on the type of mission.

1 hour total thrust as you mentioned is more likely the case of interceptor role where you have to be quick to intercept and destroy, but this could very well be extended to 90-120 mins if the mission is air support for other bombers.

Note: I am a newbie here, so if you feel what I am saying is off the target please bear with me and guide me with your understanding.

Sent from my SM-G920I using Tapatalk

 

[SilverSabre]

HAL is relatively an infant in aircraft production. It earlier venture in Marut too had been undertaken by German engineering team. It did employed Dessault as technical consultant during the early phase of LCA programe. Due to its limitation of technical know how and why in aviation, it had sought help of SAAB to smoothen up some rough spots. Its not a matter of grave concern when you are a newbie in any field.

I have a trick question here. India made 147 Maruts with 18 trainers. Aerodynamically it was said Marut's frame could bear the stress of high speeds, but due to availability of only limited performance Orpheus engines it used to limit to the transonic speeds of 1,100 km/s. Can't we retrofit the remaining Maruts with GE 404 and upgrade avionics and other equipments which we make for Tejas and get them up again.

We have the frames with us even if 20 survived till date, it will give some cushion till we build the required Tejas numbers??

Note : Orpheus had only 25 KN thrust and GE 404 has almost double of that.

Sent from my SM-G920I using Tapatalk

 

[BON PLAN]

Will you provide any source for your claim ? AFAIK, Dassault engineers had helped LCA project, not Eurofighter.

Eurofighter was approached by india to help reducing weight.

 

[BON PLAN]

Are you a chinese??? because this sort of English and ignorance are chinese specific.

And forget about Euro fighter. We are all set to make something much better than Eurofighter. Ours i a country of innovations and R & D and not the copy cat like yours. Eurofighter guys offered us a partnership Eurofighter project but we denied. Our LCA Navy MK2 shall be comparable to euro fighter in many specifications including weight carrying and maneuvering ability, avionics, Radar and EW. We do not need Eurofighter guys help. We just need some time to make better plane than eurofighter.

If my english don't pleased to you, you know where you can put it, my english??? .....

With the record of HAL, don't expect to match eurofighter.
Even if I'm convinced Rafale globally much better than EF, it remains EF is a good AtoA fighter. And Airbus engineers are far from being noobs. Just see Airbus success....

Give me just one top HAL product? Tejas is on the drawing board for how many times ? the answer is cruel.... but it's a fact.

 

[garg_bharat]

@Chinmoy you are reading some blog and reaching wrong conclusions.

You keep on pressing your points despite not having good knowledge.

Please lose your attitude.

A practical modern fighter has life of 6000 hours or more. An aircraft can easily do 200 hours or more in one year.

 

[garg_bharat]

If my english don't pleased to you, you know where you can put it, my english??? .....

With the record of HAL, don't expect to match eurofighter.
Even if I'm convinced Rafale globally much better than EF, it remains EF is a good AtoA fighter. And Airbus engineers are far from being noobs. Just see Airbus success....

Give me just one top HAL product? Tejas is on the drawing board for how many times ? the answer is cruel.... but it's a fact.

Tejas is not designed to compete with Euro fighter.

So the question does not arise.

I feel it will be mostly used as an attack aircraft with su30 or mig29 in air superiority roles. The secondary role is air defence for less strategic areas where more capable fighters are not needed.

 

[SilverSabre]

Tejas is not designed to compete with Euro fighter.

So the question does not arise.

I feel it will be mostly used as an attack aircraft with su30 or mig29 in air superiority roles. The secondary role is air defence for less strategic areas where more capable fighters are not needed.

I second the idea. Any light combat aircraft like Tejas or BAE HAWK 200 are good for quick interception or reconnaissance missions.

Sent from my SM-G920I using Tapatalk

 

[saagar943]

I second the idea. Any light combat aircraft like Tejas or BAE HAWK 200 are good for quick interception or reconnaissance missions.

Sent from my SM-G920I using Tapatalk

in the time of bvr, we need planes that goes up, lock target launch bvr, come back... go up again.
more u have smaller and cheaper platform -- more enemy planes u can simultaneously lock on. they are going to busy doing counter measures.
was costly till now but with astra and tejas -- its possible.

 

[Rahul Singh]

Eurofighter was approached by india to help reducing weight.

It was reported long time back that HAL wants EADS as consultant in an effort to reduce weight of undercarriage. But no subsequent news came to say much or that EADS did really helped.

It is however other thing that baseless news quoting unknown officials are in regular circulations since LCA program begun. Take the example of a news where HAL is said to be seeking SAAB's help in upgradind Tejas. What upgradations? AESA MMR is indo isreali effort, IFR job is sole responsibility of HAL, it has Jaguar project as experience and maintenance intensive rearrangement of electronics and systems is also HAL's job and its just rearrangement. So where is SAAB helping HAL? This is something beyond comprehension.

BTW N-LCA MK-2 is just called N-LCA MK-2, not Tejas.

Credibility of defence news reporting by large has been on lower side of standard. This is why there is something called DDM ( desi dorky media) in use.