IAF MiG-21 shoots down Pakistani F-16

[IndianHawk]

I was watching a food vlog of Amristar and restaurant owner said he started his business few days before 1965 war and fun part is he said that after few days of continues war Pakistan started to lie that they have captured Amritsar and meanwhile chaps here were freely traveling in buses and etc and everyone used to have a good laugh on how porki lie without any moral guilt.

They think lying is justified if they could somehow win in the end. It's called Taqia. All the moderate Islam , peaceful musalman is just that taqia. An elaborate lie to survive untill time favours them. That's why no muzzie should ever be trusted .

 

[Neptune]

Perfect example of biased Western media and Indian media also:

Afghan plane crash: Mystery over crash in Taliban territory
https://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-51264744

More than 12 hours have passed since news of the crash came with various news agencies claiming it is an Afghan passenger aircraft and may have been a 737-400. Obviously the US military immediately knew it was one of their planes and may have been shot down by the Taliban but are still playing dumb along with all major new agencies.

When the Ukranian 737 was shot down the US knew immediately, however when its one of theirs they never seem to know.

Wreckage clearly shows its a Bombardier E-11A jet, a US Air Force plane.


and then we want them to confirm the PAF F-16 loss when there is no wreckage!

Hundreds of western aircraft have actually crashed or been shot down in the past decade or so with virtually no media coverage. However, if a Russian aircraft in combat crashes every western media outlet will run multiple stories about it. Just hours ago a brand new Croatian OH-58D Kiowa crashed.

Many people such as @IndianHawk have argued with me of how great and reliable western aircraft are. When the Germans operated Mig-29s and consequently badly mauled F-16s in mock combat to the point of American pilots throwing hissy fits and storming out on German pilots because of how badly humiliated they were. From then on westerns were shiting on the Mig-29, this included F-16.Net and many other publications and even pilots with no experience with the aircraft. They were claiming the Mig-29 was not reliable and was basically crap and now since the German Air Force has switched to western aircraft, their entire Air Force is grounded, for example 8 of 53 Tigers are operational while only 12 of 99 NH-90 are operational.

In the US Air Force operational availability has been dropping, now only 69.97 of aircraft air flyable, some navy squadrons have had only 25% of their aircraft for availability. Granted some of the blame may fall on the high ranking staff but nevertheless western aircraft are expensive and unreliable. Some people justify the cost by falsely claiming how great and reliable western aircraft are, many claim they are better then Russian with providing spares but even if that were true then there is sanctions and embargo’s to deal with. And even if spares are available the aircraft are difficult to work with, labor intensive, expensive and many restrictions and threats come with them.

Just so people are aware in Yemen, 46 aircraft, mostly modern western aircrafts have crashed or were shot down since 2015 ( proven by photographs)


https://lostarmour.info/yemen/



In Iraq 153 mostly western aircraft were shot down or crashed in 6 years.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_aviation_shootdowns_and_accidents_during_the_Iraq_War



In Syria since 2015 Russia only lost 15 aircraft (including drones I believe) at least 5 were destroyed on the ground, two crashed as a result of arrester cable snapping on their aircraft carrier, one crashed due to a bird hit, one crashed due to pilot error, one was accidentally shot down by a Syrian SAM, one unarmed bomber was ambushed by Turkey. A report from several years ago said they conducted over 39,000 sorties so I’m guessing they easily are at 45,000-50,000 sorting by now. This is will operating a lot of older aircraft such as SU-24s, SU-25s and vulnerable helicopters.

 

[Aaj ka hero]

Hundreds of western aircraft have actually crashed or been shot down in the past decade or so with virtually no media coverage. However, if a Russian aircraft in combat crashes every western media outlet will run multiple stories about it. Just hours ago a brand new Croatian OH-58D Kiowa crashed.

Many people such as @IndianHawk have argued with me of how great and reliable western aircraft are. When the Germans operated Mig-29s and consequently badly mauled F-16s in mock combat to the point of American pilots throwing hissy fits and storming out on German pilots because of how badly humiliated they were. From then on westerns were shiting on the Mig-29, this included F-16.Net and many other publications and even pilots with no experience with the aircraft. They were claiming the Mig-29 was not reliable and was basically crap and now since the German Air Force has switched to western aircraft, their entire Air Force is grounded, for example 8 of 53 Tigers are operational while only 12 of 99 NH-90 are operational.

In the US Air Force operational availability has been dropping, now only 69.97 of aircraft air flyable, some navy squadrons have had only 25% of their aircraft for availability. Granted some of the blame may fall on the high ranking staff but nevertheless western aircraft are expensive and unreliable. Some people justify the cost by falsely claiming how great and reliable western aircraft are, many claim they are better then Russian with providing spares but even if that were true then there is sanctions and embargo’s to deal with. And even if spares are available the aircraft are difficult to work with, labor intensive, expensive and many restrictions and threats come with them.

Just so people are aware in Yemen, 46 aircraft, mostly modern western aircrafts have crashed or were shot down since 2015 ( proven by photographs)


https://lostarmour.info/yemen/



In Iraq 153 mostly western aircraft were shot down or crashed in 6 years.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_aviation_shootdowns_and_accidents_during_the_Iraq_War



In Syria since 2015 Russia only lost 15 aircraft (including drones I believe) at least 5 were destroyed on the ground, two crashed as a result of arrester cable snapping on their aircraft carrier, one crashed due to a bird hit, one crashed due to pilot error, one was accidentally shot down by a Syrian SAM, one unarmed bomber was ambushed by Turkey. A report from several years ago said they conducted over 39,000 sorties so I’m guessing they easily are at 45,000-50,000 sorting by now. This is will operating a lot of older aircraft such as SU-24s, SU-25s and vulnerable helicopters.

Dude, thanks for information but you can't say same about India C-17,it is performing perfectly.

 

[Neptune]

Dude, thanks for information but you can't say same about India C-17,it is performing perfectly.

And yet the US has threatened to hit India with sanctions for buying Russian equipment and now is extorting 6 billion in concession for trade. In the past they put sanctions on India and to this day the United States gives “aid” aka F-16s to Pakistan to fight “terrorism”.

Those C-17 have come at a cost, they were expensive to purchase and will be expensive to maintain especially if in the future if the US decided to embargo India.

 

[Foxbat]

Official Citation for Vir Chakra of Wing Commander Abhinandan

 

[Jameson Emoni]

And yet the US has threatened to hit India with sanctions for buying Russian equipment and now is extorting 6 billion in concession for trade. In the past they put sanctions on India and to this day the United States gives “aid” aka F-16s to Pakistan to fight “terrorism”.

Those C-17 have come at a cost, they were expensive to purchase and will be expensive to maintain especially if in the future if the US decided to embargo India.

Russia at that time was in a bad shape and its IL-76 assembly lines were shut off. C-17 was the only airplane in that category which was available.

BTW, has Russia resumed building IL-76s?

 

[IndianHawk]

Hundreds of western aircraft have actually crashed or been shot down in the past decade or so with virtually no media coverage. However, if a Russian aircraft in combat crashes every western media outlet will run multiple stories about it. Just hours ago a brand new Croatian OH-58D Kiowa crashed.

Many people such as @IndianHawk have argued with me of how great and reliable western aircraft are. When the Germans operated Mig-29s and consequently badly mauled F-16s in mock combat to the point of American pilots throwing hissy fits and storming out on German pilots because of how badly humiliated they were. From then on westerns were shiting on the Mig-29, this included F-16.Net and many other publications and even pilots with no experience with the aircraft. They were claiming the Mig-29 was not reliable and was basically crap and now since the German Air Force has switched to western aircraft, their entire Air Force is grounded, for example 8 of 53 Tigers are operational while only 12 of 99 NH-90 are operational.

In the US Air Force operational availability has been dropping, now only 69.97 of aircraft air flyable, some navy squadrons have had only 25% of their aircraft for availability. Granted some of the blame may fall on the high ranking staff but nevertheless western aircraft are expensive and unreliable. Some people justify the cost by falsely claiming how great and reliable western aircraft are, many claim they are better then Russian with providing spares but even if that were true then there is sanctions and embargo’s to deal with. And even if spares are available the aircraft are difficult to work with, labor intensive, expensive and many restrictions and threats come with them.

Just so people are aware in Yemen, 46 aircraft, mostly modern western aircrafts have crashed or were shot down since 2015 ( proven by photographs)


https://lostarmour.info/yemen/



In Iraq 153 mostly western aircraft were shot down or crashed in 6 years.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_aviation_shootdowns_and_accidents_during_the_Iraq_War



In Syria since 2015 Russia only lost 15 aircraft (including drones I believe) at least 5 were destroyed on the ground, two crashed as a result of arrester cable snapping on their aircraft carrier, one crashed due to a bird hit, one crashed due to pilot error, one was accidentally shot down by a Syrian SAM, one unarmed bomber was ambushed by Turkey. A report from several years ago said they conducted over 39,000 sorties so I’m guessing they easily are at 45,000-50,000 sorting by now. This is will operating a lot of older aircraft such as SU-24s, SU-25s and vulnerable helicopters.

We have argued on different topics I believe. See I don't believe in propaganda neither western nor Russian and let the truth stand on its own merit.

If you'll read my post history I have defended su30 from critics too.

Does USA / west lies about their aircraft records yes they do!

Does western engine are more reliable yes they are.

Let's the fact come out of everything.

 

[Aaj ka hero]

BTW, has Russia resumed building IL-76s?

You do know il-76 md 90-A,they are manufacturing it but definitely not in the class of c-17,we must have gotten this plane manufacturing rights.

 

[shankyz]

WC Abhinandan Varthaman's Vir Chakra citation

Seems he used his AI (Airborne Intercept) radar to inform other IAF a/c of small batch of low flying PAF fighters ready to ambush them as they thwarted the bigger formation.

 

[Neptune]

WC Abhinandan Varthaman's Vir Chakra citation

Seems he used his AI (Airborne Intercept) radar to inform other IAF a/c of small batch of low flying PAF fighters ready to ambush them as they thwarted the bigger formation.View attachment 42054

This would explain why Averger1 was flying at lower altitudes then most F-16s. As a result the range from the R-77 (like all missiles) was degraded thus it was difficult to get a high probability missile launch and kill.

 

[Neptune]

Russia at that time was in a bad shape and its IL-76 assembly lines were shut off. C-17 was the only airplane in that category which was available.

BTW, has Russia resumed building IL-76s?

Yes they have new IL-76s and new medium to light IL-112s as well as the heavy IL-106 which is in development and is meant to replace IL-76s.

 

[sayareakd]

Official Citation for Vir Chakra of Wing Commander Abhinandan
View attachment 42044

Now IAF, through Official Gazzetta of India has given "Advance fourth Generation" title to Junk Fighter. Same ones who called SU30MKI as 4th generation fighter before Hon'ble SC.

 

[trisonics]

See that in the context of the air battle - where a vintage Mig21 not only fought bravely against multiple 4 Gen air crafts but shot one down. The one shot down is also the priced possession of the PAF. The bhandar ran away as soon as it sensed a bison. I like the wording since it portrays facts! it only takes a couple of Mig 21s of the IAF to beat back and shoot down what are supposed to be 4 Gen AC of the PAF!

 

[Sayaaf]

Seeing lots of bhakts and members of feku tribe on this thread is always a sight for sore eyes. Quoting a post from another forum

CITATION DISSECTED

So the Indian President himself finally acknowledges that

1. JF-17 is advanced fourth generation aircraft.
2. PAF possess advanced high calibre air to ground stand-off weapons.
3. PAF aircraft were under seamless airborne radar cover and control in the morning of February 27th 2019.

This is how the story progresses:

1. The "hero" pilot was provided with updates on likely air threats flying at very high altitudes.

Comment: So IAF situation awareness was not to its full capacity (no AWACS were in air). A nasty surprise from PAF!!!!

2. But he took the initiative to scan the low altitude airspace with his AI radar and picked on PAF aircraft flying low to ambush the Indian fighter interceptor aircraft.

Comment: Deadly and successful ambush is always from above, because aircraft gains higher speed while diving down. How did the "hero" pilot ascertain that the PAF aircraft was flying low to ambush the Indian fighter interceptor aircraft???? Must be telepathy, after all he is an Indian "hero"

3. After alerting the other formation pilots towards the surprise threat, our “hero” and his wingman in an offensive formation rushed against the lone PAF aircraft which was then dropping weapons on the Indian Army positions.

Comments: Role of the spotted PAF aircraft is suddenly changed. Instead of ambushing the Indian fighter interceptor aircraft, the "hostile" PAF aircraft was found dropping weapons on the Indian Army position.

Earlier, in the citation, it was acknowledge that PAF aircraft were armed with advanced high calibre air to ground stand-off weapons. None of the six targets selected by PAF aircraft for bombing was more than 100 km away from LoC. Then why a lone PAF aircraft was found flying in the airspace of Indian Occupied Kashmir? Or our brave “hero” proceeded courageously to engage the PAF aircraft package with utter disregard to his personal safety, crossed LoC and found a lone PAF aircraft flying low and dropping weapons on IA positions

Comments: Then how PAF aircraft managed to drop bombs on six different “targets”?
No, it was other way around. On the night of February 26, 2019, during so-called "Balakot surgical strike", the audacious and aggressive maneuver by PAF interceptors forced IAF aircraft into tactical chaos. That is why they drop and jettison their precious payload on the trees and rushed back to their side of the territory.

4. Then our "hero" pilot pursued a retreating fighter bomber aircraft, and in the ensuing aerial combat, shot down an F-16 aircraft with his on board missile.

Comments: PAF displayed remains of all four on-board missiles of the crashed Mig-21.

When a missile successfully hit the target aircraft directly or its warhead detonates near the target due to proximity fuse, the complete missile is ruptured into pieces and spread in number of kms depending on the height at which the impact occurred, wind heading, the approach direction of the missile and aircraft. It is almost impossible to retrieve the debris of such missile that too in mountainous terrain of Kashmir.

Furthermore all F-16 in PAF inventory were accounted and confirmed by USA. Even Carol Christine Fair (a pro-India American political scientist) in her recent talk in front of Indian military regime acknowledge that no PAF F-16 was shot down by IAF.

5. Finally, in the melee one of the PAF aircraft fired multiple advanced BVR missiles, one of which hit his aircraft forcing him to eject in Pakistani territory.

Comment: According to Wikipedia, the kill ratio of AIM-120 is 63.15%. Why a PAF pilot will fire multiple AIM-120 C missiles ($400,000 a piece) to hit a "sitting duck" flying inside Pakistani airspace???

Moral of the story:

"In every lie lies a truth" In short, truth cannot be hidden.

 

[Narasimh]

Seeing lots of bhakts and members of feku tribe on this thread is always a sight for sore eyes.

CITATION DISSECTED

View attachment 42266

So the Indian President himself finally acknowledges that

1. JF-17 is advanced fourth generation aircraft.
2. PAF possess advanced high calibre air to ground stand-off weapons.
3. PAF aircraft were under seamless airborne radar cover and control in the morning of February 27th 2019.

View attachment 42267


This is how the story progresses:

1. The "hero" pilot was provided with updates on likely air threats flying at very high altitudes.

Comment: So IAF situation awareness was not to its full capacity (no AWACS were in air). A nasty surprise from PAF!!!!

2. But he took the initiative to scan the low altitude airspace with his AI radar and picked on PAF aircraft flying low to ambush the Indian fighter interceptor aircraft.

Comment: Deadly and successful ambush is always from above, because aircraft gains higher speed while diving down. How did the "hero" pilot ascertain that the PAF aircraft was flying low to ambush the Indian fighter interceptor aircraft???? Must be telepathy, after all he is an Indian "hero"

3. After alerting the other formation pilots towards the surprise threat, our “hero” and his wingman in an offensive formation rushed against the lone PAF aircraft which was then dropping weapons on the Indian Army positions.

Comments: Role of the spotted PAF aircraft is suddenly changed. Instead of ambushing the Indian fighter interceptor aircraft, the "hostile" PAF aircraft was found dropping weapons on the Indian Army position.

Earlier, in the citation, it was acknowledge that PAF aircraft were armed with advanced high calibre air to ground stand-off weapons. None of the six targets selected by PAF aircraft for bombing was more than 100 km away from LoC. Then why a lone PAF aircraft was found flying in the airspace of Indian Occupied Kashmir? Or our brave “hero” proceeded courageously to engage the PAF aircraft package with utter disregard to his personal safety, crossed LoC and found a lone PAF aircraft flying low and dropping weapons on IA positions

View attachment 42268

Comments: Then how PAF aircraft managed to drop bombs on six different “targets”?
No, it was other way around. On the night of February 26, 2019, during so-called "Balakot surgical strike", the audacious and aggressive maneuver by PAF interceptors forced IAF aircraft into tactical chaos. That is why they drop and jettison their precious payload on the trees and rushed back to their side of the territory.

4. Then our "hero" pilot pursued a retreating fighter bomber aircraft, and in the ensuing aerial combat, shot down an F-16 aircraft with his on board missile.

Comments: PAF displayed remains of all four on-board missiles of the crashed Mig-21.

When a missile successfully hit the target aircraft directly or its warhead detonates near the target due to proximity fuse, the complete missile is ruptured into pieces and spread in number of kms depending on the height at which the impact occurred, wind heading, the approach direction of the missile and aircraft. It is almost impossible to retrieve the debris of such missile that too in mountainous terrain of Kashmir.

Furthermore all F-16 in PAF inventory were accounted and confirmed by USA. Even Carol Christine Fair (a pro-India American political scientist) in her recent talk in front of Indian military regime acknowledge that no PAF F-16 was shot down by IAF.

5. Finally, in the melee one of the PAF aircraft fired multiple advanced BVR missiles, one of which hit his aircraft forcing him to eject in Pakistani territory.

Comment: According to Wikipedia, the kill ratio of AIM-120 is 63.15%. Why a PAF pilot will fire multiple AIM-120 C missiles ($400,000 a piece) to hit a "sitting duck" flying inside Pakistani airspace???

Moral of the story:

"In every lie lies a truth" In short, truth cannot be hidden.

Excellent analysis!! You must get much more JF-17s since citation is clearly mentioning its advanced 4th gen fighter. That should be made the backbone of your air force.

 

[Sayaaf]

Pakistan Airforce Inviting all the Analysts to come and observe the remains of Missiles @13:52. If India has nothing to hide, why they havent accepted Pakistani invitation?

 

[aarav]

JF blunder can't do vertical loop baki,Al baki fizzaya has been rendered impotent,from cmh hospital doosra banda to your paki conspiracy of a Sikh pilot ,you even declared IAF Sikh officer KIA when refuted on air Force day,Al baki gone to his holes ,you changed the propaganda,now your same repeated propaganda has no meaning,build another mazaar cuz might need soon.

 

[Sayaaf]

Excellent analysis!! You must get much more JF-17s since citation is clearly mentioning its advanced 4th gen fighter. That should be made the backbone of your air force.

Don't get jealous. Not only Pakistan, Qatar and Egypt is in talks To buy Block-III JF-17. As we Speak, 2 JF-17 is in Qatar TO conduct Extensive exercises with Qatar Airforce Mirages and Rafael with Codename "ZILZAL-1"

 

[Indx TechStyle]

JF-17 is advanced

It was a just a glorification statement while honoring a soldier.

JF-17 is old airframe based low cost fighter, far from being advanced or even proper fourth generation in overall aspects.

If you are going to desperately run after statements instead of actual analysis which is already out there, you aren't supposed to call yourself defence enthusiast.

JF-17 is something Pakistan can afford, not something that can make Pakistan win.

 

[Sayaaf]

JF blunder can't do vertical loop baki,Al baki fizzaya has been rendered impotent,from cmh hospital doosra banda to your paki conspiracy of a Sikh pilot ,you even declared IAF Sikh officer KIA when refuted on air Force day,Al baki gone to his holes ,you changed the propaganda,now your same repeated propaganda has no meaning,build another mazaar cuz might need soon.View attachment 42273

What happen To Shahzuz ud in Or Shahbaz haider Getting killed? LOL You are as shameless as Feku brigade. I was raising doubt GC Luthra was nowhere to be seen. Finally he was shown to Public. So what?

Doosra Banda story was retracted by ISPR. Because they had guts to speak truth. When Feku Indians will take back claims of F-16 shoot down ?