Would you want to settle down in the US?

acetophenol

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Would you want to settle down in the US?

A 2006 opinion poll by Outlook—AC Nielsen shows that 46 % of India's urban class wants to settle down in US. Interestingly, in the Hindutva heart land of Gujarat, 54 % of people want to move to US.

While I am sure there are some I dont know of any one in the USA wanting to move to India.
:confused::confused::confused:
I doesn't want to settle in there permanently, but would like to spent some time there.
 

Snuggy321

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Would you want to settle down in the US?

A 2006 opinion poll by Outlook—AC Nielsen shows that 46 % of India's urban class wants to settle down in US. Interestingly, in the Hindutva heart land of Gujarat, 54 % of people want to move to US.

While I am sure there are some I dont know of any one in the USA wanting to move to India.
:confused::confused::confused:
No I love being at home.
And yes, there are several Indians returning to India for various reasons in recent times
 

Ray

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There would be great reasons to settle down in the US.

But I would not.

I don't like the burning pace that they adopt and make everything a huge issue with a whole lot of hyperbolic gobbledygooks.

I also would not like to eat of or can and packets of processed food or have a month's food cooked in the deep freeze. Or have takeouts to survive!

I like my food fresh and home cooked daily, preferably each meal at a time, which happens in my house.
 

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I allways find it interesting when Indians regard Americans as stupid when the average IQ in India is 82 and America it is 98.
IQ by Country | EUTimes.net
Normally, one compares the middle class of nations while discussing subjective notions such as "stupidity".

Of course, I do not condone statements that the US is "stupid" - I think that is in itself a remarkably stupid generalization to make. But frankly, we are talking about a country where the literacy rate is 74%, and even then, the "barely literate" comprise a significant percentage.

If you compare the middle-class vs. middle-class in terms of IQ, that would make much more sense. Now, consider the fact that the IQ of the average Indian-American is higher than the average American (a fact that you yourself have pointed out several times), and considering that the typical Indian-American is drawn out of the same pool as the great Indian middle class in urban India, it does not reflect well on you to make IQ comparisons like this. You are just giving credence to the silly generalizations about "stupid Americans".
 

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Interestingly, in the Hindutva heart land of Gujarat, 54 % of people want to move to US.
That is because they are great businessmen and the US is loaded.

Who runs the Potels? ;)

And quite a few of them did not even know English when they went there and yet the set themselves up!

Great businessmen and they know the more you earn, the less tax you pay in the US.

It is the other way around in India.

So, US is paradise to them!

The love the tinkle of money!
 

Ray

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I wouldn't consider the Americans uneduated.


We had Sarah Palin, who would have been the Vice President of the US and would have played such a responsible role deciding the Fate of the World. She was so knowledgeable and knew everything about everything.

And such a visionary - she could see Russia from her window!

And not to forget the world beater economist - Joe the Plumber.

Highly educated!
 
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opesys

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Normally, one compares the middle class of nations while discussing subjective notions such as "stupidity".

Of course, I do not condone statements that the US is "stupid" - I think that is in itself a remarkably stupid generalization to make. But frankly, we are talking about a country where the literacy rate is 74%, and even then, the "barely literate" comprise a significant percentage.

If you compare the middle-class vs. middle-class in terms of IQ, that would make much more sense. Now, consider the fact that the IQ of the average Indian-American is higher than the average American (a fact that you yourself have pointed out several times), and considering that the typical Indian-American is drawn out of the same pool as the great Indian middle class in urban India, it does not reflect well on you to make IQ comparisons like this. You are just giving credence to the silly generalizations about "stupid Americans".
I am not judging yet as to who's got lower IQ...but

1)What makes Indian drivers (most of them are from middle class as they are ones who can afford a motor bike at least) not follow traffic rules ? Indian drivers drive on pavements meant for pedestrians... Indian drivers jump red lights as if it's legal...
2) What forces Indians not to form a simple queue ?
3) What makes Indians not to keep their streets clean..people dump garbage on streets..
4)What makes Indians pee on streets ? (There are no public toilets in the US too...except at tourist spots)

The US is not perfect either...there may be here and there a few issues in some corner of some cities but for most part once you get out of the house things are very well organised..people themselves are pretty organised... All these things are should come out of common sense forget about high IQ...
 

opesys

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There would be great reasons to settle down in the US.

But I would not.
I don't like the burning pace that they adopt and make everything a huge issue with a whole lot of hyperbolic gobbledygooks.
It's a misconception! Yankees don't slog like Indians do..Indians work long hours compared to Yankees and still lead a less comfortable life compared to them!

I also would not like to eat of or can and packets of processed food or have a month's food cooked in the deep freeze. Or have takeouts to survive!

I like my food fresh and home cooked daily, preferably each meal at a time, which happens in my house.
There is no law in the US which would stop you from cooking at home daily...It's a choice, you can either eat frozen food or fresh food...nobody would stop from eating fresh cooked meal everyday in the US!
 

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There are no public toilets in the US too...except at tourist spots
You are sure that they don't stop on the Highway and have a quick pee?

There is no law in the US which would stop you from cooking at home daily.
The US is not China that personal preference are controlled by Law.

Yet, where do you find fresh food? In Walmart?

In England, people have to go to the Farmers Market in the countryside and that too it is not established every day!
 
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opesys

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You are sure that they don't stop on the Highway and have a quick pee?
All gas stations along the highway have restrooms and anyone can use it...people normally use them...


The US is not China that personal preference are controlled by Law.

Yet, where do you find fresh food? In Walmart?

In England, people have to go to the Farmers Market in the countryside and that too it is not established every day!
There are a lot of farmers market in the US within the cities forget countryside! The amount organic vegetables that are available in the US is much more than you get in India nowadays...
 
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Ray

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What modern retail in the west has done is introduced food produce not just on an industrial scale but on an industrial quality too. And this is where my "prefer vegetarian in U.S but okay with non-veg in India" choice kicks in. That massive ten-pound pack of chicken breast at dirt cheap price...we really have no idea of its origins or vintage. Wait...we do have a rough idea. It was raised in a massive chicken farm owned by a corporate monopoly in methods and circumstances that will make you puke. Chicken (or cattle) that are cooped up in the dark, medicated, and force-fed continuously so that they attain maximum weight in the minimum time with minimum movement and metabolism. That's how corporates maximize profit. In India, you still have to the option of seeking out the healthier free-range or home-grown chicken, fresh locally grown- or sourced vegetables and fruits. You could be saying goodbye to all that (or at least end up paying much much more) with the FDI fiesta.

India's FDI in retail saga: From Wal-Mart to Agarwal-Mart? - Page 2 - Economic Times
The columnist lives in the US and he is telling it as it is!
 

Ray

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All gas stations along the highway have restrooms and anyone can use it...people normally use them...
I am aware of that.

But my question was do they not pee on the HIghways? Never?




There are a lot of farmers market in the US within the cities forget countryside! The amount organic vegetables that are available in the US is much more than you get in India nowadays...
Organic food is not farmers market!

There are no farmers markets in the US cities!

If so, where?

If you had any idea, you would have trotted it out pronto!

The fact that you don't know, indicates how many Americans go to such markets if indeed they exists in towns!
 

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I am not judging yet as to who's got lower IQ...but

1)What makes Indian drivers (most of them are from middle class as they are ones who can afford a motor bike at least) not follow traffic rules ? Indian drivers drive on pavements meant for pedestrians... Indian drivers jump red lights as if it's legal...
2) What forces Indians not to form a simple queue ?
3) What makes Indians not to keep their streets clean..people dump garbage on streets..
4)What makes Indians pee on streets ? (There are no public toilets in the US too...except at tourist spots)

The US is not perfect either...there may be here and there a few issues in some corner of some cities but for most part once you get out of the house things are very well organised..people themselves are pretty organised... All these things are should come out of common sense forget about high IQ...
As a counter question, let me ask you why the same Indian drivers drive perfectly well and in a disciplined fashion once they go to the US or Europe? Does the IQ magically jump a few notches the moment they touch down on Western shores, and jump down the moment they come back to the East?

The answer to your question is simply the overcrowding and lack of infrastructure in India, which of course, is a direct result of a poor economy all these decades. If you drill down to the root cause of it, you will see that the basic cause of all the shit is a poor economy.

And in any case, these things like jumping red lights are actually exceptions. I have been driving in Bangalore for more than a decade now, and I can see that things have improved to a great extent. I still do see traffic violations, but the violators are in a small minority and the exception, not the norm.

If you provide good and adequate infrastructure, rules will be followed. On roads like the NICE (Nandi Infrastructure Corridor) expressway in Bangalore, people follow lanes scrupulously and the drive there is as good as anywhere else in the world.



Here is not-so-nice road, but still far better than what India had in the 1990s and earlier:



My point is that these things have nothing to do with commonsense or IQ. It is just the way people have been conditioned, due to a poor economy and poor infrastructure. With improvements in both these, things will only get better.
 
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opesys

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The columnist lives in the US and he is telling it as it is!
This issue is true..cheap places like walmart sell such things..but there are a lot of options to buy organically raised chicken and vegetables in the US and people who are aware of this issues don't buy from walmart...point is there are other options as well..walmart is not the only place to buy chicken in the US..
 

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Let me help you.

Availability of fresh food, exercise linked to healthy living
by Stephanie Hemphill, Minnesota Public Radio
October 6, 2009

St. Paul, Minn. — Efforts to bring a supermarket into an underserved St. Paul neighborhood shine a light on a often overlooked fact: where we live has a direct effect on how we eat, exercise and ultimately, how healthy we are.

At the corner of Maryland Avenue and Clarence Street, just south of Lake Phalen in St. Paul, there's a Cub Foods store. A year ago, there was no supermarket here. There was a bar, an express lube, and a car wash.

Back then, people in this neighborhood had to travel at least a mile to get to a supermarket. Now, the grocery store is filled with fresh fruits and vegetables, ethnic foods of all kinds, and lots of choices.

Chuck Repke, executive director of the North East Neighborhoods Development Corporation, says it's just what he pictured.

"You come in and you're immediately into the fresh produce, and that's what people in the community were looking for. So it's pretty nice."

Repke's non-profit group worked with neighbors for years to bring a store here. The development group helped buy the land for the supermarket. And the city of St. Paul paid for extra foundation work needed because the site was marshy.

The store wouldn't be here without that help. Most full-service grocery stores locate in the suburbs, where land is cheap. About 26,000 people live in this neighborhood--many of them low-income, many without cars.

Families from different backgrounds are trolling the aisles. There are Asian immigrants here, Somali families, a large Hmong population in this neighborhood.

One customer, Bee Vang, lives a couple of blocks away.

"Before, there wasn't anything here, but now that they built this store it's closer to home, and when I need something I just run to the store," Vang says. "All the food and fruits and everything here is fresh."

Studies show poor people, and people of color, often live in neighborhoods without full-service grocery stores. One study in New Orleans found nearly twice as many fast-food restaurants in black neighborhoods as in white areas.

Fast food tends to be fatty and salty -- bad for health. But if no healthier options are around, people will eat poorly. African-Americans and Latinos are more likely to be obese than whites. In fact, people of color suffer a lot more from health problems than do whites.

And kids are especially vulnerable, according to Dr. David Wallinga, who runs the Food and Health Program at the non-profit Institute for Agriculture and Trade Policy in Minneapolis.

Children who have poor diets are more likely to become obese as adults, or to get cancer or heart problems. Wallinga says science has shown pregnant women with poor diets may be setting their unborn children up for developmental disabilities.

"The fetus for example is really quite vulnerable, when the brain is developing, when other organ systems are developing," says Wallinga. "That's when we need not only to reduce our exposure to pollution but also to have good access to good diets and healthy eating."

Exercise is another important part of health; sometimes it's hard to find appropriate places to exercise, but here in the Twin Cities we're lucky to have a lot of lakes. Just north of the Cub Food store is Lake Phalen. It's ringed with a walking and biking path; there's a beach for swimming, and a golf course nearby. The park provides a lot of good ways to get outdoor exercise here in the neighborhood.

Not every neighborhood is blessed with a lake. But parks and sidewalks encourage walking. And walking improves health. Planning cities with health in mind can make a difference.

"This does work but you've got to have a vision and a long view of the promotion of health in a community," says Dr. Richard Jackson, chair of Environmental Health Sciences at the University of California-Los Angeles.

Public health officials are starting to address the problems of obesity and lack of fitness at the neighborhood level. Jackson says in California and some other states, public health workers have been going to planning meetings to argue, for example, that schools should be put in neighborhoods so kids can walk or bike every day -- not on the edge of town where there happens to be a lot of land.

"In the beginning, the planning commissioners were saying, 'What are you doing here? You people are not planning experts,'" notes Jackson. "But over time, a lot of these are common-sense ideas. Everyone knows old people, young people ought to be able to go about their lives without being completely dependent on cars. Everybody knows that people ought to have access to healthy fresh fruits and vegetables and a diverse diet."

People are working on these issues in St. Paul. They're not counting on new grocery stores in every neighborhood; instead, one group is trying to make it easier to set up small farmers' markets in neighborhoods around the city. That would provide access to fresh fruits and vegetables during at least part of the year.

Other projects to improve environmental health are ongoing. Back in the Lake Phalen neighborhood, the Roosevelt Public Housing project and other housing units have been rehabbed -- which means no more exposure to lead paint, and cleaner indoor air.

Of course it costs money to re-hab an apartment building. But it can mean saving money if people don't need to go to the emergency room for an asthma attack.

Planners are learning that building with health in mind can bring other benefits: our cities could be cleaner with fewer cars, they could be cooler with more trees, cheaper to run with well-insulated buildings.

When it comes right down to it, a city is like a human being -- to be healthy, all its parts have to work together.

Availability of fresh food, exercise linked to healthy living | Minnesota Public Radio News
Note the hoop la over the fresh food issue!

It is something extraordinary.

It is natural and normal in India. No hoop la!

Note:

1. Efforts to bring a supermarket into an underserved St. Paul neighborhood shine a light on a often overlooked fact Efforts are being made. Shows that it was not there and so no fresh food before that!

2. Back then, people in this neighborhood had to travel at least a mile to get to a supermarket. Now, the grocery store is filled with fresh fruits and vegetables, ethnic foods of all kinds, and lots of choices. So, everything had to be at arms length or else no go! Note the world 'grocery store'! ;)

3. Repke's non-profit group worked with neighbors for years to bring a store here. So, it was not business driven!

4. The store wouldn't be here without that help. Most full-service grocery stores locate in the suburbs, Grocery store and not supermarket! In short a Mom and Pop store that the Walmart types drive out!

5. here are Asian immigrants here, Somali families, a large Hmong population in this neighborhood Indicative that the Americans don't mind living of can and packeted processed food, but the Asian prefer their food fresh.

6. one group is trying to make it easier to set up small farmers' markets in neighborhoods around the city. That would provide access to fresh fruits and vegetables during at least part of the year.. Indicates that the concept of Farmers' Market does not exist in the US.
 
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opesys

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As a counter question, let me ask you why the same Indian drivers drive perfectly well and in a disciplined fashion once they go to the US or Europe? Does the IQ magically jump a few notches the moment they touch down on Western shores, and jump down the moment they come back to the East?
The ratio of Indian drivers to American drivers in the US is like 1:99. I guess they just learn it seeing the rest of the crowd...
The answer to your question is simply the overcrowding and lack of infrastructure in India, which of course, is a direct result of a poor economy all these decades. If you drill down to the root cause of it, you will see that the basic cause of all the shit is a poor economy.

And in any case, these things like jumping red lights are actually exceptions. I have been driving in Bangalore for more than a decade now, and I can see that things have improved to a great extent. I still do see traffic violations, but the violators are in a small minority and the exception, not the norm.

If you provide good and adequate infrastructure, rules will be followed. On roads like the NICE (Nandi Infrastructure Corridor) expressway in Bangalore, people follow lanes scrupulously and the drive there is as good as anywhere else in the world.
This is just an excuse...the way people honk at traffic is unbelievable...what has honking got to do with poor economy or even bad roads for that matter ? I have driven in Bangalore too! I have seen people (mostly software engineers) entering the tech park on their bikes drive on footpath..so what if the infrastructure is bad they can leave their house early to adjust for the delay because of the bad infrastructure!



My point is that these things have nothing to do with commonsense or IQ. It is just the way people have been conditioned, due to a poor economy and poor infrastructure. With improvements in both these, things will only get better.
I get your point...but what has poor economy got to do with people spitting on roads, people peeing on roads, honking like crazy, not forming queues ??
Aren't these things somewhat related to common sense ?
 

Ray

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I admire the US on many counts.

However, I am not blind to the negative side either.

I understand the food issue since I am the only one in India from the family.

They are either US or British citizens.

I am astonished the way, when they hit India, they rush to the market to buy field fresh vegetable, fish, home range chicken (didn't know what that meant then) and realised it meant desi and not broiler, mutton (actually goat is what you get in India and which are not force fed) and so on.

When I told someone from the US how lucky he was that he got good food, he said that not to forget the real blessing that still is there in India regarding 'real' food!

And having read that article 'Walmart to Agarwal Mart', I am off to buy desi murgi and desi eggs, even though they cost more!
 

opesys

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Let me help you.



Note the hoop la over the fresh food issue!

It is something extraordinary.

It is natural and normal in India. No hoop la!
Haven't you seen Aamir's show ? Forget organic vegetables even mother's breast milk was contaminated with pesticides because of the intake of vegetables that were grown using pesticides. Unless you ask for organic vegetables in India what you get is vegetables that are grown using pesticides.. I love India as much as you but why hide problems and fool ourselves.. There is problem is the US too but not as much as it is in India..

1. [I said:
Efforts to bring a supermarket into an underserved St. Paul neighborhood shine a light on a often overlooked fact[/I] Efforts are being made. Shows that it was not there and so no fresh food before that!

2. Back then, people in this neighborhood had to travel at least a mile to get to a supermarket. Now, the grocery store is filled with fresh fruits and vegetables, ethnic foods of all kinds, and lots of choices. So, everything had to be at arms length or else no go! Note the world 'grocery store'! ;)

3. Repke's non-profit group worked with neighbors for years to bring a store here. So, it was not business driven!

4. The store wouldn't be here without that help. Most full-service grocery stores locate in the suburbs, Grocery store and not supermarket! In short a Mom and Pop store that the Walmart types drive out!

5. here are Asian immigrants here, Somali families, a large Hmong population in this neighborhood Indicative that the Americans don't mind living of can and packeted processed food, but the Asian prefer their food fresh.

6. one group is trying to make it easier to set up small farmers' markets in neighborhoods around the city. That would provide access to fresh fruits and vegetables during at least part of the year.. Indicates that the concept of Farmers' Market does not exist in the US.
As you have pointed out these problem are mostly in the poor neighborhood...kinda understandable... It will not workout for businessmen to set up organic shops in poor neighborhoods... Also they are looking for shops within a mile distance (~1.5KM) but in most of the cities if you go around for 5-10 miles you will get good shops... But we are talking in general about middleclass...Does American middle class has this problem ?
 

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The ratio of Indian drivers to American drivers in the US is like 1:99. I guess they just learn it seeing the rest of the crowd...

This is just an excuse...the way people honk at traffic is unbelievable...what has honking got to do with poor economy or even bad roads for that matter ? I have driven in Bangalore too! I have seen people (mostly software engineers) entering the tech park on their bikes drive on footpath..so what if the infrastructure is bad they can leave their house early to adjust for the delay because of the bad infrastructure!


I get your point...but what has poor economy got to do with people spitting on roads, people peeing on roads, honking like crazy, not forming queues ??
Aren't these things somewhat related to common sense ?
Even I get very angry when people ride on the footpath but frankly, these are exceptions. You make it sound as if the entire footpath is converted into a lane for use by motorbikes.

Everything boils down to economy and infrastructure. People do not honk when the traffic is free flowing and smooth, or while stationary at a signal. In developed nations, people have stopped honking due to years of experience with good infrastructure. In India, two things are happening: people are getting better infra, and people are gradually realizing that honking is futile. It comes back to the point that as development increases, stupid things like unnecessary honking decrease.

Peeing on roadside and spitting on roadside happens simply because "everyone else does it". This is something that will improve as overall standards improve. It is already noticeable.

All this stuff about queuing up has nothing to do with "commonsense" - it is about the rush and grind that Indians have been subjected to, and conditioned to.

And let me tell you something interesting. Spitting is something that is "typically Asian". If you go to the East Asian nations you will see instances of spitting, even in the developed nations, more in the less developed ones. There is also a cultural element involved here, which will only reduce with time.
 

opesys

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Even I get very angry when people ride on the footpath but frankly, these are exceptions. You make it sound as if the entire footpath is converted into a lane for use by motorbikes.
I saw this everyday when I was in Bangalore.. at-least there would be couple of bikers on footpath...and you are defending saying not all of the footpath was used by the bikers ?


Peeing on roadside and spitting on roadside happens simply because "everyone else does it". This is something that will improve as overall standards improve. It is already noticeable.
you said it, everyone else does it..that's the whole point of this argument...Americans never have done it at least in the last 100 years and I don't think they will do it the future too..

All this stuff about queuing up has nothing to do with "commonsense" - it is about the rush and grind that Indians have been subjected to, and conditioned to.

And let me tell you something interesting. Spitting is something that is "typically Asian". If you go to the East Asian nations you will see instances of spitting, even in the developed nations, more in the less developed ones. There is also a cultural element involved here, which will only reduce with time.
you spit on road in Singapore you will be fined $250 or will get jail time! have you seen South korea? Japan ? Malaysia ? Honk kong ?
 

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