The Atheism/Agnosticism Thread

Do you think God exists?


  • Total voters
    262

p2prada

Senior Member
Joined
May 25, 2009
Messages
10,234
Likes
4,015
Well organized religions are not exactly knows for their tolerant views,,Are they ?

The clauses in Hinduism are aplenty and vary with each sect/belief...For example I personally don't worship ord Krishna much..but more of a Shaivite..So what happens ? Hinduism is much more than that.
The rules are the same. You merely worship Spiderman instead of Superman. I was talking about the Gita specifically. I don't have in depth knowledge of Hinduism to comment on every God.

You can't simply say, "Look I worship this character in the legend and not that, so that means I will go to a different heaven than you who worship Vishnu or Brahma." The ending is all the same.

God isn't tolerant, right? He is always angry.

Realistically there are somethings which can be proven and somethings which cannot. For eg: Evolution can be proven but as DD mentioned an event in creation of life which happened billions of years ago cannot be practically proven. Science can differentiate between the two.

Then there are somethings which can be called Nonsense. Religion falls under this category.
 

KS

Bye bye DFI
Senior Member
Joined
Aug 3, 2010
Messages
8,005
Likes
5,758
The rules are the same. You merely worship Spiderman instead of Superman. I was talking about the Gita specifically. I don't have in depth knowledge of Hinduism to comment on every God.

You can't simply say, "Look I worship this character in the legend and not that, so that means I will go to a different heaven than you who worship Vishnu or Brahma." The ending is all the same.

God isn't tolerant, right? He is always angry.

Realistically there are somethings which can be proven and somethings which cannot. For eg: Evolution can be proven but as DD mentioned an event in creation of life which happened billions of years ago cannot be practically proven. Science can differentiate between the two.

Then there are somethings which can be called Nonsense. Religion falls under this category.
One sentence in Gita can have 1000 different intepretations. You can't base something on how you interpret it.
 

Poseidon

Senior Member
Joined
May 28, 2011
Messages
2,001
Likes
6,471
Country flag
I am not an atheist but I don't follow any rules.I barely even pray.
 

W.G.Ewald

Defence Professionals/ DFI member of 2
Professional
Joined
Sep 28, 2011
Messages
14,139
Likes
8,594
Egyptian tycoon faces ‘tweet’ trial - FT.com


In a move that has alarmed liberals, a prosecutor in Cairo on Monday ordered the referral of the Christian business leader to court on accusations of contempt of Islam after a complaint against him lodged in the summer by a group of Islamist lawyers.
Mr Sawiris had retweeted last year a cartoon of Mickey Mouse sporting a beard and Minnie Mouse wearing a face veil, prompting outrage among conservative Muslims who saw it as an insult to their religion.
 

LurkerBaba

Super Mod
Joined
Jul 2, 2010
Messages
7,882
Likes
8,125
Country flag
Government changes Free School model funding agreement to ban creationist schools

The British Humanist Association (BHA) has welcomed a new revision of the model funding agreement for Free Schools by the Government in order to preclude 'the teaching, as an evidence-based view or theory, of any view or theory that is contrary to established scientific and/or historical evidence and explanations.' This highly significant change has been made in order to ban creationism from being taught in Free Schools, and prevent creationist groups from opening schools. The change follows the BHA coordinating the 'Teach evolution, not creationism!' campaign, which called for this precise change.
Full article here :Government changes Free School model funding agreement to ban creationist schools

-----

GoI should derecognize schools which teach creationism and similar garbage
 

HeinzGud

Senior Member
Joined
Nov 26, 2011
Messages
2,558
Likes
1,070
Country flag
I love this Jeffry flying baby......... and I think if any one interested in these videos to check out the one called "God VLOG" which is hilarious....
 
Last edited by a moderator:

Nagraj

Regular Member
Joined
Jan 7, 2011
Messages
804
Likes
254
Side effects of Religion

 
Last edited by a moderator:

Nagraj

Regular Member
Joined
Jan 7, 2011
Messages
804
Likes
254
Warning: Side Effects of Religion May Include...
The Danger of Squeezing God Out of Religion (Matthew 6:1-6, 16-21)

In our litigious society, warning labels are affixed to most products in order to reveal possible negative consequences of using a product. Some warning labels are humorous and unnecessary.

"Do not use in shower" - on a hair dryer
"For external use only" - on a curling iron
"Do not drive with sunshield in place" - on a cardboard windshield sunscreen
"This product not intended for use as a dental drill" - on an electric rotary tool
"Do not use for drying pets" - on a microwave oven

The preponderance of such labels leads us to the conclusion that some kind of warning label should probably be attached to the people who need such warning labels! Maybe something like: Warning - naïve and foolish human on the loose! Engage at your own risk!

But not all warning labels are unnecessary. Sometimes there are serious consequences that the consumer should be aware of when using a product. Cigarettes have been proven to cause cancer. Alcohol will impair your ability to drive and use heavy equipment. Drugs do have harmful side effects. Most warning labels are affixed to a product, not because the product is bad in itself, but because a product is so good that it can be misused. It is because the danger is not apparent that a warning must be given.

Warning: Hypocrisy

Jesus believed that religion should come with a warning label. There are possible negative consequences of practicing religion - side effects that can be toxic. Jesus warns of one dangerous side effect of religion: "Beware of practicing your piety before others in order to be seen by them; for then you have no reward from your Father in heaven" (Matthew 6:1).

Jesus' warning can be reduced to one word: Warning - hypocrisy!

Jesus offers three concrete examples of toxic religion to prove his point. He warns of the potential dangers of almsgiving, prayer, and fasting - three fundamental practices of religious people. (Note: Jesus does not command these practices because he assumed that religious people will practice these things.)

But Jesus does not simply give a warning; he offers solutions to counter the negative side effects of religion. His solution is not to abandon religion. Contrary to conventional wisdom, Jesus was religious. Throughout his entire life, Jesus faithfully attended synagogue and participated in worship festivals.

Jesus counsels us to practice our religion with care and integrity. He reveals that we must pay attention not only to what we do, but how and why we do what we do! Certainly, what we do matters - we must do the right things. But how and why we do what we do matters even more. We must practice our religion in the right way and for the right reason.

Practicing Piety

Giving is to be done without public fanfare and with no regard for how it will positively affect one's reputation. It should not be done in order to receive praise, but in order that God may be praised. When it is practiced in order to gain the approval of others, it achieves its intended goal - it gains the applause of others. But that is all it gains! Hypocritical practices are not without a payoff - they bring their own "reward." But this reward falls far short of the practices' intended result - the promise of heavenly reward, the pleasure of God.

It is a spiritual axiom: We find what we seek. Jesus' solution to hypocritical giving is simple: "But when you give alms, do not let your left hand know what your right hand is doing, so that your alms may be done in secret; and your Father who sees in secret will reward you" (Matthew 6:3). Jesus' counsel is not that we would give unconsciously - this is impossible - but that our giving would be in silence, in secret, without fanfare.

Likewise, prayer is to be offered without regard to other's approval. Jesus' description refers to the Jewish custom of pausing from one's work at 3:00 p.m. to offer prayers in conjunction with the evening sacrifice in the temple. Jesus' solution is not that we would only pray in private, but that our public prayers would arise from time spent alone with the God "who sees in secret" and "who is in secret."

In Jesus' Jewish culture, everyone was required to fast on Yom Kippur, the Day of Atonement (Lev. 16:29; see Acts 27:9). Pious Pharisees, in order to demonstrate their extreme devotion, fasted twice a week on Monday and Thursday (Luke 18:12).[1] Jesus' solution - like his previous solutions - is to fast in secret, without fanfare.

Squeezing God Out of Religion

The ultimate danger in all three cases can be summarized in one word: Hypocrisy. And the worst outcome of hypocrisy is that it squeezes God out of religion. Hypocrisy converts religion into an exercise in self-centered preoccupation. Self, rather than God, becomes the center and self-glory, rather than God's glory, becomes the all-important goal.

Religion without God becomes an exercise in public relations rather than the pursuit of an authentic engagement with God. In each of Jesus' examples, the practitioner seeks self-glory rather than God's glory - the praise of others rather than praise to God. When the practice is emptied of its real meaning, the person is reduced to playing a role - performing for other's approval and applause. This short-circuits the true reason for the religious practice. The practice becomes superficial rather than substantial, rote ritual rather than a means of nurturing an authentic relationship with God, a performance rather than an expression of true piety, a display of self-righteousness rather than humility.

But no matter how hard we try, we cannot truly squeeze God out of our lives. For this reason, hypocrisy is a soul-deadening practice - it exposes a heart dead to God's presence, a heart only concerned with the applause of others, a heart that wants to be worshipped rather than to give itself in worship to God.

This is why Jesus attaches the warning label of hypocrisy to religion. Hypocrisy is a corruption of true religion. A hypocrite is an actor and not a practitioner; his religion is merely external. A hypocrite misrepresents himself by appearing to be something that he is really not. He possesses no integrity - there is no real connection between his inner and outer life. By being untrue to others, he is also untrue to God and to himself. Tragically, his attempt to present a false front in order to deceive others ultimately leads to his own self-deception.

The hypocrite's motive is simple: he plays a role "in order to be seen by men." The goal of his religion is not to produce authentic piety but to establish a pious reputation. The hypocrite desires the approval and affirmation of others, and if he plays his cards right, he will receive what he seeks (for God will give him what he wants): the approval and applause of others. His external actions may win him a godly reputation among other people, but they do not fool God, who knows the heart. Ultimately, the hypocrite demonstrates that God's evaluation is not nearly as important to him as human affirmation.

The hypocrite not only distorts the purpose of giving, prayer and fasting, but, in the process, presents a distorted and demeaning view of God. The hypocrite's God is superficial, concerned only with externals. The hypocrite's God is not the mysteriously wondrous God "who is in secret" and "who sees in secret" but a shallow God who is interested only in outward performance - a God who is easily deceived and quickly discarded.

A Religion of the Heart

Jesus' warning must be heeded. Religion becomes toxic when divorced from God. If we are not careful, God can get squeezed out of religion - even in the very act of being religious!

Religious practices become distorted if we do not do them first and foremost for God's pleasure and approval. Our chief concern should not be with what others think of us - our reputation - but what God thinks of us. We dare not conflate the first and greatest commandment with its counterpart. We are to love God with all our heart, soul, strength, and mind. This command has priority for a reason. Only with this purpose firmly established can we truly love our neighbor as ourselves. Without this priority, we become too preoccupied with our own self-interests and reputation, and are not free to take the necessary risks that allow us to truly love others.

The question we must wrestle with is: Whose recognition do we seek through our religious practices? Whose reputation are we most concerned with? If Jesus had worried about his reputation he wouldn't have become known as the friend of sinners - a glutton, drunkard, law-breaker, even irreligious. We must never forget that Jesus was crucified because he wasn't religious enough!

The temptation to perform for other's approval is a particular problem for clergy, worship leaders, and other office-bearers in the church. It is far too easy to shift attention to ourselves in religious practices. However, when we do, we become mere actors, playing a part, rather than children of God nurturing an authentic relationship with God.

This danger highlights the necessity of integrity. The ever-present possibility of hypocrisy calls us to make sure our inner life matches our outward actions - a theme at the heart of Jesus' Sermon on the Mount from which this teaching comes. Both our inner life and outward actions must be focused on the God "who sees in secret." We perform for an audience of One. God alone knows us completely. It is God's approval alone that matters.

This is particular important in a culture so caught up in image-management and image-control. We blindly accept people who "look" the part. We buy products based on image rather than substance. We, of all people, should remember that the penetrating gaze of God extends below the surface to the heart: "The Lord does not see as mortals see; they look on the outward appearance, but the Lord looks on the heart" (1 Samuel 16:7).

The God "Who Sees in Secret"

There is one general antidote to hypocrisy. The common feature in Jesus' advice to counter hypocrisy is to practice solitude. We must seek to be present to the God "who sees in secret" and "who is in secret." We give, pray and fast "for God's eyes only." Like the intimate moments shared between married couples - moments not meant for public disclosure but simply treasured exclusively by two - the moments between God and the seeker are deeply intimate and personal. Who are you when you are alone, when no one's looking? When you are exclusively in the presence of God?

The goal is not image-management for public relations but heart-work - the pursuit of an authentic relationship with God. This is the principle Jesus drives home with his concluding comments: "Do not store up for yourselves treasures on earth, where moth and rust consume and where thieves break in and steal; but store up for yourselves treasures in heaven, where neither moth nor rust consumes and where thieves do not break in and steal. For where your treasure is, there your heart will be also" (Matthew 6:19-21).

Contrary to conventional wisdom, Jesus' focus in this passage is not primarily on heaven in the future, but heaven's presence come to earth in the here and now. The treasure he speaks of is enjoyed both now and in the future. It is the "reward" that possesses eternal significance.

Jesus calls us to live in light of eternity and not just for the moment. Jesus calls us to learn to love and serve God right now - with all our heart, soul, strength, and mind. Jesus does not advocate the removal of desire, but the purifying of desire. Jesus wants us to be so eager to love and please God that we will do everything we should do for his eyes alone. Only then can we experience the freedom necessary to allow us to love others as God loves us.

Put simply: The manner in which religious obligations are fulfilled is more important than the fulfillment itself. This principle can be applied to other religious practices. What we do is important, but how and why we do what we do is equally as important.

True religion is a matter of the heart. Religious practices without the heart do not nurture a relationship with God, but actually squeeze God out of our lives. In order to counter the danger of hypocrisy, we must be ever vigilant in searching our heart and weighing our motives. We must consider for whom we practice religion - for the applause of others or for God's pleasure?

[1] This practice continued in the ancient church (Didache 8:1 specifies Wednesdays and Fridays as Christian days of fasting). But one fears that the ancient church missed Jesus' point by simply switching the days.
Warning: Side Effects of Religion May Include... - TheoCenTriC
 

Nagraj

Regular Member
Joined
Jan 7, 2011
Messages
804
Likes
254
The more i think about it the more side effects seems to weigh more then any benefits........
sigh.....
 

Nagraj

Regular Member
Joined
Jan 7, 2011
Messages
804
Likes
254
What do u mean when u say religion??
i believe in religion as a philosophy of life but i do not believe in any personal god.
How many of you believe in God or gods, but do not believe in any religion; alternatively, how many of you believe that different religions are different ways to attain the same God or gods?

[please do not convolute with post #42]
 

Nagraj

Regular Member
Joined
Jan 7, 2011
Messages
804
Likes
254
if god exists he is not only useless he is doing a shitty job. i mean look at this world that idiot has designed it with so much misery and pain. the whole design is flawed.
if he working some where he would be fired and his contract will be cancelled.
I do not know whether God exists or not, but I wish God is real. I want God to know that he is an ***hole.
 

Godless-Kafir

DFI Buddha
Senior Member
Joined
Aug 21, 2010
Messages
5,842
Likes
1,837
Country flag
Some of these Atheists sound like down right morons, they just deny everything for the sake of being Atheists. Atheism is only good if its mixed with non-duality...
 
Thread starter Similar threads Forum Replies Date
geoBR Atheism and Orthodoxy in Modern Russia General Multimedia 1
The3Amigos China auto thread China 332
JaguarWarrior Russian civil aviation thread Europe and Russia 44
JaguarWarrior Russia auto thread Europe and Russia 930
Similar threads




Latest Replies

New threads

Articles

Top