Sukhoi Su 30MKI

[gadeshi]

Russian vice-premier of defence industry and army development Dmitriy Rogozin on Irkutsk IAZ trying-out new Su-30SM (they will be delivered to Domna, Zabaikalskiy MD where will replace old MiG-29 9-12):

 

[gadeshi]

And Su-30SM from Lipetsk Top Gun:

 

[p2prada]

X posting from PAKFA thread.
Indo-Russian military aviation projects on schedule: HAL executive | Russia & India Report

This article says 140 MKIs are to be upgraded.

The Sukhoi Su-30 MKI, a heavy, all-weather, long-range fighter is being assembled under license by HAL. "140 of these aircrafts are being upgraded now," Chakraborty said, adding the planes would have stronger radars, greater avionic sub-systems and an upgraded weapons system with an improvement in missile firing integration and firing.

 

[ztunelover]

So how well did these actually do in red flag? How do they stack up against f15s and everyones favourite f22 raptors?

 

[arnabmit]

@p2prada could you please list out the upgrades of Su-30MKI to Super Sukhoi?

X posting from PAKFA thread.
Indo-Russian military aviation projects on schedule: HAL executive | Russia & India Report

This article says 140 MKIs are to be upgraded.

 

[p2prada]

@p2prada could you please list out the upgrades of Su-30MKI to Super Sukhoi?

Known:
AESA radar
New cockpit
New RAM for stealth
Composites
New EW suite
New weapons
Operational datalink for fleet-wide usage

Speculated
More powerful engine
IMA architecture like the ones on Rafale, F-35 and F-22

et cetera

 

[arnabmit]

Known:
AESA radar
New cockpit
New RAM for stealth
Composites
New EW suite
New weapons
Operational datalink for fleet-wide usage

Speculated
More powerful engine
IMA architecture like the ones on Rafale, F-35 and F-22

et cetera

How much can RAM coating cover such a huge RCS? Would the RCS reduction be financially justified?

Any idea what the new engine could be? Were we not supposed to have received the first 2 "Super-30" in 2012?

 

[Sridhar]

Known:

Speculated
More powerful engine


et cetera

The engine will be same as FGFA.

 

[p2prada]

The engine will be same as FGFA.

There is no official info.

Anyway, you must be talking about the engine for Su-35S, that's 117S. PAKFA's engine is currently a prototype and a modification of 117S, it is called 117.

How much can RAM coating cover such a huge RCS? Would the RCS reduction be financially justified?

The primary frontal emissions come from the inlets. So the inlets will have to see RAM coating.

We will never know if the RCS reduction measures will work. Keep fingers crossed.

Any idea what the new engine could be? Were we not supposed to have received the first 2 "Super-30" in 2012?

We need official confirmation about engines. It may be a modernized AL-31FP with 13.7 tons of thrust or the 117S with 14.2 tons of thrust.

No. Things have changed since FGFA contract was signed. So IAF changed requirements from earlier electronics to FGFA level electronics.

 

[Sridhar]

There is no official info.

Anyway, you must be talking about the engine for Su-35S, that's 117S. PAKFA's engine is currently a prototype and a modification of 117S, it is called 117.
We need official confirmation about engines. It may be a modernized AL-31FP with 13.7 tons of thrust or the 117S with 14.2 tons of thrust.

No. Things have changed since FGFA contract was signed. So IAF changed requirements from earlier electronics to FGFA level electronics.

Fedorov revealed that the Super Sukhoi will have same engine as in FGFA

CASS-India

 

[p2prada]

Fedorov revealed that the Super Sukhoi will have same engine as in FGFA

CASS-India

The statement is too vague. Its good if we get the 117, but I would still like to wait for official confirmation regarding this. The Russians have developed many AL-31 variants, so a number of them are possibilities on MKI.

 

[AVERAGE INDIAN]

IAF decides on Sukhoi-30 for BrahMos, final tests from end-2014

MUMBAI: The Indian Air Force has chosen its frontline Sukhoi-30 fighter jets as the platform to mount the supersonic BrahMos missiles, whose first test launch will be carried out by the end of 2014, a top official said on Thursday.

"We have chosen Sukhoi-30. That is a deep penetration aircraft which is being produced at Hindustan Aeronautics Limited's Nashik facility in collaboration with the Russians," BrahMos Aerospace managing director and chief executive AS Pillai told reporters here.

He said an air version of the BrahMos missile is ready, but testing, simulations and aircraft modifications will take a year more and the final flight with the missile will happen only by the end of 2014.

Under a contract, BrahMos Aerospace has to deliver the supersonic cruise missile to the IAF starting 2015 and Pillai exuded confidence that the deadline will be met.

Pillai said the IAF asked for the weight of the missile to be reduced to 2.5 tonne from the general 3 tonne as the launch at high speeds requires lesser components on propulsion, and his company has been able to do it.

The BrahMos was jointly developed in the early 2000s and has since been inducted by the Army and the Navy. An air platform, has however, not been completed yet.

Pillai claimed it is the only supersonic cruise missile platform in the world which travels at supersonic speeds and can be launched from both sea and land.

BrahMos Aerospace is a 50.5:49.5 partnership between India's Defence Research and Development Organisation and Russia's NOPM, and it has been tasked with manufacturing the missile for use by the armed forces of both the countries.

Asked about the failure of the company to convince the Russian armed forces to induct the missile system even after a decade of its launch, Pillai said the company will take up the matter with the Russians for induction.

"We are making all out effort for this. As per the inter-governmental agreement, India and Russia both have to induct the JV product and also, we can sell to some friendly countries ... we are telling the Russian government it is time they inducted it," Pillai said.

He said recently Indian engineers fitted the missile system on a Talwar class frigate being built at a Russian shipyard, and added Russia can also emulate it.

Pillai, however, said each country's individual threat perceptions and strategies may differ.

IAF decides on Sukhoi-30 for BrahMos, final tests from end-2014 - The Times of India

 

[Neil]

@p2prada sir...:: if Su-30 mki gets an engine upgrade - either 117 or 117S - does that take su 30 to surpass su-35...??

 

[p2prada]

@p2prada sir...:: if Su-30 mki gets an engine upgrade - either 117 or 117S - does that take su 30 to surpass su-35...??

1. Su-35 has seen a major change in RCS compared to MKI. Not sure if all the measures taken on Su-35 will be possible on MKI, let alone exceed.

2. It has 11.5 tons of fuel vs 9.6 on MKI. If MKI's air brakes are removed, it is possible to add another tonne of fuel, but that requires major changes in FBW, followed by testing. It is a possibility, but not guaranteed. We lost one tonne of fuel because of the second seat.

3. Engine. A new engine is only a rumor as of now. There is not a single official word on a new engine, but an upgrade of the AL-31FP, with near 117S equivalent thrust, to a new standard is possible.

4. Su-35 is supposed to be two-three tonnes lighter than MKI. Supposed to be a little over 15 tonnes empty.

So, without equivalent changes from points 1 to 3, MKI won't be a real match to Su-35 in terms of aircraft performance. Point 4 is impossible to match. MKI will have more composites, but it won't match Su-35's empty weight for obvious reasons.

Su-35S (current version) was a Su-27 mod while MKI is a Su-30 mod with Su-35(!= Su-35S, different aircraft) FBW controls. So, even the basic design is different.

In terms of avionics, MKI will far surpass Su-35. So, the performance disadvantage may offset the avionics advantage. This is similar to how Rafale has air to air parity or near superiority with EF due to an avionics advantage even though EF is better in performance.

 

[gadeshi]

Russian sportsman has flew above Baikal lake on Su-30SM carying an Olympic Torch:

 

[AVERAGE INDIAN]

'Astra' carriage trials with Su-30 begins

HYDERABAD: Corridors in the Missile Complex here are abuzz with the extensive carriage trials of 'Astra' with Sukhoi-30 aircraft in Pune. 'Astra,' the Beyond- Visual-Range (BVR), Air-to-Air Missile, has been indigenously developed by the Defence Research and Development Laboratory (DRDL) here under the Integrated Guided Missile Development Programme of India. A team of scientists and other officials from DRDL are already in Pune and the carriage trials which began on November 29 are expected to continue until mid or last week of December spread over at least two scores of sorties.

Development trials of Astra in December 2012 from Integrated Test Range at Chandipur, Odisha, were successful in targeting, Lakshya, the Pilotless Target Aircraft (PTA). However, the litmus test after integrating the Beyond-Visual-Range Air-to-Air Missile (BVRAAM) with Su-30 is still pending. It is to be mentioned that after much wait and delay involving almost 10 years of development trials by Defence Research and Development Organisation (DRDO) since 2003, the missile has finally been integrated with Su-30 for the user trials by the Indian Air Force (IAF).

The missile is being developed to lace up or arm various IAF aircrafts including Tejas, Mirage 2000, Su-30 MKI and even the Sea Harrier. Official sources disclosed that every system and sub-system along with various parameters is being tested one by one to avoid any repetition of these tests. These carriage trials shall be assessed on a modified Su-30 aircraft involving various parameters with respect to missile's compatibility with the aircraft in terms of avionics etc.

Astra can carry a 15kg High Explosive warhead at a Mach 4 speed. It can engage maneuvering targets moving at high supersonic speeds and varying distances and heights and has a proximity fuse. A laser fuse has been developed by DRDO while Software Development Institute (SDI) of the IAF in Bangalore using the Sukhoi test rig has been carrying out the electronic integration of aircraft avionics with Astra on-board equipment. The missile itself can be launched from various altitudes with varying ranges

The 3.8 metre long, single stage, solid fuelled missile is finally expected to have two different versions for different altitudes and ranges including Astra Mark-I which shall have a range of 44km and Astra Mark-II with a range of over 100km. Astra can cruise at various altitudes while evading radar and intercepting and engaging the 'supersonic targets' by manoeuvring its speed accordingly. Armed with superior Electronic Warfare capabilities, its Electronic Counter-Counter Measures lends it immunity from being followed and targeted.

In the absence of a low-cost indigenous BVRAAM, IAF has been importing missiles from Israel, Russia and France to equip its fighter fleet. DRDO is aiming at clearing 'Astra' for induction into the IAF by 2015. So far, the successfully tested systems of the missile include the aerodynamics, propulsion system, control and guidance systems, dual mode guidance, night trials, various angles of attack and performance under various weather conditions etc. during its development trials.

'Astra' carriage trials with Su-30 begins - The Times of India

 

[Agnostic_Indian]

so we are inducting 44 km range bvr missile on 2015 ? while our enemies are having better ranged missiles.(

 

[ersakthivel]

so we are inducting 44 km range bvr missile on 2015 ? while our enemies are having better ranged missiles.(

The missile can cover 110 Km when launched from 15 Km altitude,

The missile can cover 44 Km when launched from 8 Km altitude,


The missile can cover 20 Km when launched from sea level

is the DRDO estimate of range of Astra.Now this range quoted above is specified for Astra Mk-2

Then they revised Astra mk-1's max range to be 80 Km at highest altitude.

It is entirely possible that journo may have deiced to use the 44 Km range as his "AVAERAGE RANGE " calculation.

See this is the interview of the missile division head giving out ranges for Astra mk-1,

http://newindianexpress.com/states/odisha/article1390559.ece

India on Saturday successfully test-fired a reconfigured version of its beyond visual range (BVR) new generation air-to-air missile 'Astra' from the integrated test range (ITR) at Chandipur off the Odisha coast.

Defence sources said, the missile was fired from the launching complex – II of the ITR at about 3.30 pm. The missile successfully intercepted a pilotless target aircraft (PTA) – Lakshya, flown around 15 minutes prior to the launching of the missile, mid air. The test came a day after a similar trial conducted from the same test range.

ITR Director MVKV Prasad said the mission was successful as it validated all data as expected. "The missile was fired against a live pilotless target aircraft. The interception was done at an altitude of 4 km. All the mission objectives have been met," he told 'The New Indian Express'.

The trial was reportedly carried out to test the missile's reconfigured guidance systems, avionics and the functioning of the communication in Radio Frequency. Entirely a complex missile Astra has been designed to intercept fast-moving aerial targets at supersonic speeds.

Developed by the Defence Research and Development Organisation (DRDO), Astra is designed for an 80-km range in head-on mode and 20 km-range in tail-chase mode. As an anti-aircraft missile it can be fired after receiving a signal from the far away target through its onboard manoeuvres based on radio frequency.

"One of its versions having 90 to 110 km range can cruise at an altitude of 15 km, another having a range of 44 km can destroy a target at an altitude up to 30,000 ft while the third one with a range of 30 km is capable of hitting the target at sea level altitude," said a defence scientist.

After the post mission analysis, a source informed that though the missile did not directly hit the PTA, but it destroyed the target through its onboard proximity fuse, which means the missile passed very close to the aircraft and hence the mission was accomplished.

Astra is a 'state of the art' being developed for the air force. The 3.8 metres long missile, which has launch weight about 154 kg, uses solid-fuel propellant and a 15 kg high-explosive warhead, activated by a proximity fuse.

Sources said there would be another test on Monday when the missile is expected to intercept a simulated electronic target, which will be followed by launches from various aerial platforms.

"After the developmental trials, the DRDO would go for aerial tests of the missile. Though it is an air-to-air missile, the tests on Friday and Saturday were conducted from specially built ground launchers," Prasad said.

The launch was witnessed by Scientific Adviser to Defence Minister and DRDO chief Vijay Kumar Saraswat, CC R&D (Missiles and Strategic Systems) Avinash Chander, DRDL Director AK Chakrabarti, Astra Program Director N Prabhakar and Project Director S Venugopal.

So it is entirely possible that our DDM has decided to fix the range of Astra mk-1 at 44 Km , just like average fuel consumptions for cars!!!!!!!!!

Rajat Pandit is a card carrying member of DDM. So you can expect such stupid range figures from folks like him.

You won't normally expect our DDM guys who cover DRDO matters with same zeal and energy reserved for Bollywood beat to know the importance of quoting altitude along with target range for BVR missiles.

http://www.thehindu.com/todays-paper/tp-national/third-astra-launch-too-a-success/article4236870.ece

The launch of Astra, India's air-to-air missile, for the third day on Monday from a static launcher on the ground at Chandipur, Odisha, proved to be a success. The flight-trials on December 21 and 22 from fixed launchers were equally successful.

On Monday, Astra manoeuvred at 22g (gravitational force) and intercepted an electronic target with 6g. The three triumphs in a row have paved the way for its launch from an aircraft next year. While Friday's launch too was against an electronic target, Astra destroyed Lakshya, a pilotless target aircraft, the next day.

"It is ready for air-to-air launch," asserted S. Venugopal, Project Director, Astra, on Monday. He attributed the success of the launches to a young team of engineers of the Defence Research and Development Organisation (DRDO), aged between 25 and 35 years. They did it by striking "a balance among the stability, controllability and agility of the missile, its vehicle dynamics, control algorithms and on-board technology," Mr. Venugopal said. "They have developed some of the best technologies for Astra. No country in the world has demonstrated such a successful system in three consecutive launches." The Astra launched last week and on Monday was a totally reconfigured vehicle. "The configuration is absolutely new. Everything has been changed," he said. While the earlier Astra weighed 300 kg, the present one weighs 168 kg and is 3.8-metres long.

After three more ground-to-air launches next year, Astra will be fired from aircraft such as Sukhoi-30 MI, MiG-29 and the Light Combat Aircraft, Tejas, DRDO officials said. It can be launched from different altitudes and the distance at which it can kill an enemy aircraft depends on the altitude from which it is fired.

 

[gadeshi]

Su-30SM in Domna (Eastern MD):

 

[gadeshi]

@Agnostic_Indian:
Relax, man. It is only a Indias first step on the AAMs road, so be patient.
Don't you think, that the first Indian AAM will be at once 95% KP and 180+km ranged? Wait for some time, when your engineeres will grow in their skills and you'll see the light.