Project-75I class SSK Submarines

[Adioz]

There is new info that German leaked the data on scorpene sub and if proven true then they are out so that leaves the French and the Russian only but due to the data leak of scorpene ,only the Russian remain
http://www.financialexpress.com/ind...alry-tkms-dcns-manohar-parrikar-india/425809/
http://indianexpress.com/article/in...enkrupp-marine-systems-dcns-parrikar-3093991/

And due to the prior experience with Russians, no one remains. Damn the Japanese and their pacifist policies regarding weapons export. Would have loved their help in 75-I.

if we can develop a nuclear submarine then we can also develop a
diesel electric submarine.

Sure, we can. But the minimum acceptable levels of noise in SSKs are far below that of an SSBN. SSK, therefore, represent a much more formidable design challenge in terms of signature reduction. Making a sub is easy. Making a stealthy sub is tough. Very tough. Nevertheless, its a good challenge that will teach us well; and we will succeed.

 

[airtel]

What kind of 12000+ tons are you (or were you) studying ???

we are Building 4 nuclear submarines ..............1st is INS arihant which is already inducted , 2nd is INs arithmaan which will be inducted in 2018 ............these 2 are 6000 ton submarines .

rest two will be inducted before 2020 , and these will be 12000 Ton Nuclear submarine .<<< i Got this information from this forum or any other forum , so I am not sure .

 

[airtel]

Sure, we can. But the minimum acceptable levels of noise in SSKs are far below that of an SSBN. SSK, therefore, represent a much more formidable design challenge in terms of signature reduction. Making a sub is easy. Making a stealthy sub is tough. Very tough. Nevertheless, its a good challenge that will teach us well; and we will succeed.

Nuclear submarines create More Noise because of Nuclear reactors .

but AIP diesel-electric based submarines create Less Noise .

noise reduction in Nuclear submarines is much more difficult .

 

[BON PLAN]

Nuclear submarines create More Noise because of Nuclear reactors .

but AIP diesel-electric based submarines create Less Noise .

noise reduction in Nuclear submarines is much more difficult .

It's not always the case.

The french SSBN, in cruise speed (ie low speed) don't use pumps to activate the water flow : it use the natural convection, so the nuclear part is totally quiet. At higer speed.... it's another history, but in this case all the vessel is noisy.

 

[airtel]

It's not always the case.

The french SSBN, in cruise speed (ie low speed) don't use pumps to activate the water flow : it use the natural convection, so the nuclear part is totally quiet. At higer speed.... it's another history, but in this case all the vessel is noisy.

You mean to say that Your conventional Barracuda-class submarine more Noisy than Your Nuclear Barracuda-class submarine ??

 

[uoftotaku]

You mean to say that Your conventional Barracuda-class submarine more Noisy than Your Nuclear Barracuda-class submarine ??

For SSN / SSBN the reactor itself is not the main source of noise. Sub reactors running on normal power setting are very silent because as BON PLAN mentioned, they use natural convection currents for cooling. Only if running on high speed / high power, the convection is not enough to keep temperature under control so additional cooling pumps have to be run, which are noisy as with any mechanical device. Normally the noisiest parts in a nuke sub are the turbo-machinery and reduction gear attached to the main steam turbines and associated pumps for cooling.

 

[BON PLAN]

You mean to say that Your conventional Barracuda-class submarine more Noisy than Your Nuclear Barracuda-class submarine ??

1) We (the french) have no conventionnal Barracuda (called Shortfin Barracuda) in our fleet. Now and tomorrow. It's, for the moment, a dedicated Australia product.
2) I was speaking about our SSBN (Triomphant class). Barracuda is a SSN. Not the same.
3) When I say our SSBN ar quiet at low speed, it doesn't mean classical sub are noisy.

Stop drug and/or alcool Sir (LOL)

 

[BON PLAN]

The last two scorpene will not received the indigenously developped AIP....

This raise the question about the maturity of this technology in india.

 

[HariPrasad-1]

The last two scorpene will not received the indigenously developped AIP....

This raise the question about the maturity of this technology in india.

What is there in maturity of technology. Every technology takes some time to develop. If it is not ready by the time submarine is ready does not mean that technology is not mature. By the time k15 get ready, Arihant was not. Does it mean that technology of arihant is not mature?

 

[HariPrasad-1]

Nuclear submarines create More Noise because of Nuclear reactors .

but AIP diesel-electric based submarines create Less Noise .

noise reduction in Nuclear submarines is much more difficult .

May be because the diesel sub work on battery most of the time. diesel engine operates only at the time of charging of battery. Am I right or wrong?

 

[BON PLAN]

What is there in maturity of technology. Every technology takes some time to develop. If it is not ready by the time submarine is ready does not mean that technology is not mature. By the time k15 get ready, Arihant was not. Does it mean that technology of arihant is not mature?

No. I
t was just that an indigenous AIP was intended for a long time in the last Scorpene. And when you add that the Indian Scorpene are produced later than intended, the result is that indigenous indian AIP is twice late or unmature.

 

[BON PLAN]

May be because the diesel sub work on battery most of the time. diesel engine operates only at the time of charging of battery. Am I right or wrong?

You must compare comparable things !
A SSN is able to run at more than 25 knots (and some even much more) during weekss...
A AIP SSK is able to run at 5 knots during 1 or 2 weeks or 20 knots during some few hours.
A classical SSK is able to run at 5 knots during few days or 20 knots durinf few hours.

A SSN cruising at 5 knots is probably as stealthy as another modern SSK, with or without AIP, because what is noisy in a nuclear reactor? the pumps. And a lot of modern N. reactor can run at small power (ie 5 knots) without pump, but using natural convection.

So at small speed I think all are very quiet.
At high speed, more than the pump, it's the hydrodynamic noise that prevails. So no classical sub advantage.

 

[tharun]

Here is the submarine performance with batteries...reference Japanese submarine

 

[HailIndia]

What about French Barracuda-class submarine conventional one which is purchased by Australian Navy
It is quietest submarine in the world because of its pump jet propulsion.

 

[Bahamut]

What about French Barracuda-class submarine conventional one which is purchased by Australian Navy
It is quietest submarine in the world because of its pump jet propulsion.

Short finned barracuda is to expensive and not suited for close to sea operation, it is for open sea for which nuclear sub are better.

 

[HailIndia]

Yes I know that it is expensive but like Australians purchasing modified subs from DCNS we can ask scaled down version from DCNS.

 

[HailIndia]

Yes I know that it is expensive but like Australians purchasing modified subs from DCNS we can ask scaled down version from DCNS.

But AMCA is still in design phase and now HAL is just dreaming to launch AMCA on 2025. So IN have to choose any foreign bird right now. But IN still backing AMCA for future replacement of Mig 29.

 

[HailIndia]

But AMCA is still in design phase and now HAL is just dreaming to launch AMCA on 2025. So IN have to choose any foreign bird right now. But IN still backing AMCA for future replacement of Mig 29.

Sorry wrong reply on wrong post. I apologise.

 

[Indx TechStyle]

But AMCA is still in design phase and

WTF?? Design had already been completed, it is in second phase of development.
Tunnel testings of a full scale version will be done this year's end.

now HAL is just dreaming to launch AMCA on 2025.

2019.

So IN have to choose any foreign bird right now. But IN still backing AMCA for future replacement of Mig 29.

IN has rejected Tejas Mk1A but they have sniped the project and asked for specs.

 

[HailIndia]

WTF?? Design had already been completed, it is in second phase of development.
Tunnel testings of a full scale version will be done this year's end.

2019.

IN has rejected Tejas Mk1A but they have sniped the project and asked for specs.

1. In 2019 they are thinking to launch just prototype but when it will come to commission that bird it will be in 2025 if all will be on plan then only.

2. Yes my friend you are right IN backing AMCA but for which AC? For INS Vishal they are already finding foreign aircraft. So when N-AMCA will be ready to commission at that time Mig 29 will be ready for decommission.

3. Bro. Still Concept Design is finalised now they are working on Detailed Design and there is major gap between these two terminology. And another thing is from PMO HAL or ADA didn't get clearance to start the development so how they can start they develop the machine.

Read This. :-
http://idrw.org/aero-india-2017-amc...tage-first-flight-likely-by-2025/#more-126364