Project- 75(I). Next gen subs. RFP issued

WolfPack86

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Naval Group will offer SMX 3.0 submarine to India

Sylvain Defer, head of P-75I Project at Naval Group has confirmed that the French Naval Group formerly known as DCNS will offer its SMX 3.0 submarine to India under its Project-75I under which India plans to acquire Six Next Generation Attack Class Non-nuclear Submarine for its Navy for which it has recently shortlisted State-owned Mazagon Dock Shipbuilders Limited (MDL) and Privately owned L&T as its preferred Shipyard partners for the construction of the submarines after winning bid is declared.

idrw.org was first to report the moves made by Naval Group last year of taking back its initial offer of Super Scorpene which was an enlarged Scorpene-class submarine already inducted by Indian Navy under Project-75, but the offer was to be likely between Shortfin Barracuda and SMX 3.0 concept was showcased in 2016 for the first time.

According to Sylvain Defer, SMX 3.0 has a displacement of 3,000 tonnes which is 1000 tonnes less then Shortfin Barracuda but is over 1200 tonnes more than Scorpene submarines already inducted into Indian Navy. SMX 3.0 integrates the latest digital technologies for strengthened operational efficiency and significant versatility of use. Naval Group and Dassault Systèmes are partnering on this project to design a ship tailored to improve the level of comfort for the women and men on board. The on-board data systems are now completely interconnected, robust, secure, fast and upgrade able.

SMX 3.0 incorporates a vertical launch system which can be used for launching both drones and missiles, which has 8 vertical launch system. SMX 3.0 offered to India will use local indigenously developed Indian technologies along with what was developed for the Scorpene-class submarines in India and will be armed with Indian and French weapons systems. SMX 3.0 if selected will be armed with both Submarine-launched Mach -3 BrahMos-NG and Sub-sonic Nirbhay Cruise missiles.
 

WolfPack86

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DCNS unveils SMX®3.0, the submarine concept ship tailored to the needs of Generation Z
DCNS has unveiled its new submarine concept ship SMX®3.0 at Euronaval: The submarine has been tailored to the needs of Generation Z and will be at the control of vessels from 2025. The submarine features on board 3.0 technologies, better power management, unequalled operational performance and system upgradeability facilitating vessel maintenance.

With a displacement of 3,000 tonnes, SMX®3.0 integrates the latest digital technologies for strengthened operational efficiency and significant versatility of use. DCNS and Dassault Systèmes are partnering on this project to design a ship tailored to improve the level of comfort for the women and men onboard. The on-board data systems are now completely interconnected, robust, secure, fast and upgradeable.


Humans at the centre of the system: Tomorrow, submarine systems will produce many thousands of terabytes per day which will need to be managed and stored. In order to manage this; DCNS is developing digital solutions to enable improved responsiveness and functionality. The combat or platform-operation systems have been designed around more efficient, intuitive and fluid MMIs. The data management applications will allow operators to be more focused on their value-added functions. Capable of intervening at all times on the submarines systems, the commanding officer and their crew will be even more informed and in control of their vessel.


Unequalled operational performance: Equipped with a versatile vertical launch system which can be used for launching both drones and missiles, SMX®3.0 extends the scope of its warfare capabilities. Furthermore, SMX®3.0 has greater capacities for countering cyber-threats. Its hydrodynamic shape and masking coating ensure the submarine has unequalled acoustic discretion. Thanks to its database management systems, SMX®3.0 enjoys much improved sensor performance.


Better power management: Through this concept ship, DCNS offers the AIP FC2G (Air Independent Propulsion Fuel Cell Second Generation) anaerobic propulsion system. Certified by DCNS, this system, of which the complete shore-based system is currently being industrialised, demonstrates all the advantages of a safe and versatile solution.

Upgradeability and facilitated maintenance: System maintenance and modernisation have been addressed right from the design phase thanks to the many 3.0 technologies, including a real time diagnosis of ships, big data management and detection of weak signals. This is supported by an onboard computerized infrastructure produced on the same principle as civil data centres with a strengthened resilience. This complete infrastructure guarantees great upgradeability and capacity to adapt to evolution in technology.
 

WolfPack86

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Rs 42,000 Crore Stealth Submarine Project To Finally Kick Off
NEW DELHI: India is now finally getting set to issue the formal tender for the long-pending over Rs 42,000 crore project to make six new-generation stealth submarines domestically with foreign collaboration.




Defence ministry (MoD) sources on Monday said the tender or RFP (request for proposal) “should be issued by next month” to defence shipyard Mazagon Docks (MDL) and private ship-builder L&T for the submarine programme, called Project-75 India (P-75I).



It will be the first project to be launched under the strategic partnership (SP) policy promulgated by the NDA government in May 2017 to boost indigenous production under the overall “Make in India” platform. The submarine or other SP projects will not be impacted by the negative arms import list issued by MoD on Sunday, as was reported by TOI.



The two Indian shipyards or SPs will have to submit their technical and commercial bids in response to the RFP after they tie up with their preferred original equipment manufacturer (OEM) from the five short-listed by the MoD earlier.



The five OEMs are Rubin Design Bureau (Russia), Naval Group-DCNS (France), ThyssenKrupp Marine Systems (Germany), Navantia (Spain) and Daewoo (South Korea).



The Navy, grappling with an ageing and fast-depleting underwater combat arm, hopes to induct the first new submarine seven years after the P-75I contract is finally inked by 2021-2022.



The force currently has only two new Scorpene and 13 old (all commissioned well over 20 years ago) diesel-electric conventional submarines, apart from two nuclear-powered submarines. Four more of the French-origin Scorpenes will be delivered by 2022 under the ongoing over Rs 23,000 crore Project-75 at MDL.

But China, which is expanding its naval presence in the Indian Ocean region, already has 50 diesel-electric and 10 nuclear submarines. Pakistan, which has five submarines, in turn will begin inducting eight new Chinese Yuan-class submarines, with air-independent propulsion (AIP) for great underwater endurance, from next year onwards.



India’s P-75I for six new submarines, with both land-attack cruise missiles and AIP, was first granted “acceptance of necessity (AoN)” way back in November 2007 but is yet to be finalised.



None of the major six to seven “Make in India” defence projects, collectively worth over Rs 3.5 lakh crore, in fact, have actually taken off in the last six to seven years, as was reported by TOI earlier.



The MoD says P-75I, which can be finalised by December 2021 at the earliest, will bring in key technologies to ensure the next submarine-building project (P-76) is completely indigenous in design and technology.



Under the approved plans, the Navy should get 18 conventional submarines as well as six nuclear-powered attack submarines (called SSNs) and four nuclear-powered submarines with long-range nuclear-tipped missiles (SSBNs) for effective deterrence against China and Pakistan, as earlier reported by TOI.
 

WolfPack86

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Rs 42,000 Crore P-75I Stealth Submarine Project Set To Kick-Off As Defence Ministry Likely To Issue Tender By Next Month

The long-pending Rs 42,000 crore Project P-75I to manufacture six new-generation stealth submarines for the Indian Navy is finally set to kick off as the Ministry of Defence is gearing up to issue the tender or request for proposal (RFP) by next month, reports Times of India.

The project gains significance as it will be the first project to be launched under the Modi government's strategic partnership (SP) policy which had been unveiled in 2017 to give a fillip to indigenous production under Make in India initiative.

The RFP will be issued next months by the Defence Ministry to two Indian shipyards - state-owned Mazagon Docks and private sector major Larsen & Toubro (L&T).

The two shipyards will then have to submit their technical and commercial bids after they tie up with one of the five foreign original equipment manufacturers (OEMs) that have already been shortlisted by the Ministry of Defence.

The five foreign OEMs include Rubin Design Bureau (Russia), Naval Group-DCNS (France), ThyssenKrupp Marine Systems (Germany), Navantia (Spain) and Daewoo (South Korea). Once the RFP is out, the two companies will have to submit their technical and commercial bids after they tie-up with one of the five OEMs.
 

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India to start bidding process by October to procure 6 submarines costing Rs 55,000 crore

India is all set to launch the bidding process by next month for a Rs 55,000-crore mega project to build six conventional submarines for the Indian Navy to narrow the gap with China’s growing naval prowess, government sources said on Sunday. The submarines will be built in India under the much-talked-about strategic partnership model that allows domestic companies to join hands with leading foreign defence majors to produce high-end military platforms in the country and reduce import dependence. The sources said the groundwork like specifications of the submarines and other critical requirements for issuance of the RFP (request for proposal) for the mega project, named as P-75 I, has been completed by separate teams of the defence ministry and the Indian Navy. The RFP will be issued by October, they added. The defence ministry has already shortlisted two Indian shipyards and five foreign defence majors for the project, being billed as one of biggest “Make in India” ventures. The shortlisted Indian entities were L&T group and state-owned Mazagaon Docks Ltd (MDL) while the select foreign entities included ThyssenKrupp Marine Systems (Germany), Navantia (Spain) and Naval Group (France). Initially, the defence ministry will issue RFPs to MDL and L&T and the two firms will have to submit their detailed bid after receiving the document. Subsequently, the L&T and MDL will have to select a foreign partner out of the five shortlisted entities, the sources said. The Indian Navy plans to acquire 24 new submarines, including six nuclear attack submarines, to bolster its underwater fighting capability. It currently has 15 conventional submarines and two nuclear submarines. The Navy has been focusing on significantly bolstering its overall capabilities in view of China’s growing efforts to increase its military presence in the Indian Ocean Region. The Indian Ocean, considered the backyard of the Indian Navy, is critical to the country’s strategic interests. According to global naval analysts, Chinese navy currently has over 50 submarines and about 350 ships. The total number of ships and submarines is projected to go past 500 in next 8-10 years. The Indian Navy is also in the process of procuring 57 carrier-borne fighter jets, 111 Naval Utility Helicopters (NUH) and 123 multi-role helicopters under the strategic partnership model. The policy envisages the establishment of long-term strategic partnerships with Indian defence majors through a transparent and competitive process wherein they would tie up with global original equipment manufacturers (OEMs) to seek technology transfers. Initially, the strategic partners will be selected in four segments – fighter aircraft, helicopters, submarines and armoured fighting vehicles/main battle tanks. It is expected to be expanded to other segments. In the last few months, the government has unveiled a series of reform measures and initiatives to make India a hub of defence manufacturing. On August 9, Defence Minister Rajnath Singh announced that India will stop the import of 101 weapons and military platforms like transport aircraft, light combat helicopters, conventional submarines, cruise missiles and sonar systems by 2024. In May, the government announced increasing the FDI limit from 49 per cent to 74 per cent under the automatic route in the defence sector. India is one the largest importers of arms globally. According to estimates, the Indian armed forces are projected to spend around USD 130 billion in capital procurement in the next five years. The government now wants to reduce dependence on imported military platforms and has decided to support the domestic defence manufacturing. The defence ministry has set a goal of a turnover of USD 25 billion (Rs 1.75 lakh crore) in defence manufacturing in the next five years that included an export target of USD 5 billion (Rs 35,000 crore) worth of military hardware.
 

WolfPack86

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India To Start Bidding Process By Oct To Procure 6 Submarines Costing ₹55,000 Cr
NEW DELHI: India is all set to launch the bidding process by next month for a ₹55,000-crore mega project to build six conventional submarines for the Indian Navy to narrow the gap with China's growing naval prowess, government sources said on Sunday.




The submarines will be built in India under the much-talked-about strategic partnership model that allows domestic companies to join hands with leading foreign defence majors to produce high-end military platforms in the country and reduce import dependence.



The sources said the groundwork like specifications of the submarines and other critical requirements for issuance of the RFP (request for proposal) for the mega project, named as P-75 I, has been completed by separate teams of the defence ministry and the Indian Navy.



The RFP will be issued by October, they added.



The defence ministry has already shortlisted two Indian shipyards and five foreign defence majors for the project, being billed as one of biggest "Make in India" ventures.



The shortlisted Indian entities were L&T group and state-owned Mazagaon Docks Ltd (MDL) while the select foreign entities included ThyssenKrupp Marine Systems (Germany), Navantia (Spain) and Naval Group (France).



Initially, the defence ministry will issue RFPs to MDL and L&T and the two firms will have to submit their detailed bid after receiving the document. Subsequently, the L&T and MDL will have to select a foreign partner out of the five shortlisted entities, the sources said.



The Indian Navy plans to acquire 24 new submarines, including six nuclear attack submarines, to bolster its underwater fighting capability. It currently has 15 conventional submarines and two nuclear submarines.

The Navy has been focusing on significantly bolstering its overall capabilities in view of China's growing efforts to increase its military presence in the Indian Ocean Region.



The Indian Ocean, considered the backyard of the Indian Navy, is critical to the country's strategic interests.



According to global naval analysts, Chinese navy currently has over 50 submarines and about 350 ships. The total number of ships and submarines is projected to go past 500 in next 8-10 years.



The Indian Navy is also in the process of procuring 57 carrier-borne fighter jets, 111 Naval Utility Helicopters (NUH) and 123 multi-role helicopters under the strategic partnership model.



The policy envisages the establishment of long-term strategic partnerships with Indian defence majors through a transparent and competitive process wherein they would tie up with global original equipment manufacturers (OEMs) to seek technology transfers.



Initially, the strategic partners will be selected in four segments - fighter aircraft, helicopters, submarines and armoured fighting vehicles/main battle tanks. It is expected to be expanded to other segments.



In the last few months, the government has unveiled a series of reform measures and initiatives to make India a hub of defence manufacturing.

On August 9, Defence Minister Rajnath Singh announced that India will stop the import of 101 weapons and military platforms like transport aircraft, light combat helicopters, conventional submarines, cruise missiles and sonar systems by 2024.



In May, the government announced increasing the FDI limit from 49% to 74% under the automatic route in the defence sector.



India is one the largest importers of arms globally. According to estimates, the Indian armed forces are projected to spend around $130 billion in capital procurement in the next five years.



The government now wants to reduce dependence on imported military platforms and has decided to support the domestic defence manufacturing.

The defence ministry has set a goal of a turnover of $25 billion (₹1.75 trillion) in defence manufacturing in the next five years that included an export target of $5 billion (₹35,000 crore) worth of military hardware.
 

omaebakabaka

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India To Start Bidding Process By Oct To Procure 6 Submarines Costing ₹55,000 Cr
Hopefully this is the last purchase from abroad and we catch up on tech and manufacturing and incorporate into homegrown designs, insane amounts of money! I don't think we can sustain it forever...
 

Bhurki

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Hopefully this is the last purchase from abroad and we catch up on tech and manufacturing and incorporate into homegrown designs, insane amounts of money! I don't think we can sustain it forever...
This project is still long ways out.
Back in 2018, Indian navy had stated that if RFI starts by 2019, contract will happen by 2021 at earliest and the first boat would arrive 7 years from that point.(2028)

Considering the slip in timeline, all 6 or whatever number is signed for will be in service only by 2035.
 

omaebakabaka

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That is what makes it ideal for us to make our minds to get off these expensive imports and go mostly home grown even if it lags a bit in certain things. This gives us time to make a policy to prepare with that goal. Actually my worry is not absorbing the technology and building on it, they buy and build and repeat the same thing again....whats the point in doing that?
 

Bhurki

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That is what makes it ideal for us to make our minds to get off these expensive imports and go mostly home grown even if it lags a bit in certain things. This gives us time to make a policy to prepare with that goal. Actually my worry is not absorbing the technology and building on it, they buy and build and repeat the same thing again....whats the point in doing that?
Policy and tech absorption can't do crap without money.
Indian navy's share of budget is only 11.8% this year. The budget itself is one of the lowest in terms of capital funding. (as a ratio of econony)

There were many chances of tech absorption in the past like type 219( which inspired the SoKo sub program) and Kilo( which inspired the PLAN sub program), but the current setup doesn't allow for exploiting any circumstance.
 

omaebakabaka

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Policy and tech absorption can't do crap without money.
Indian navy's share of budget is only 11.8% this year. The budget itself is one of the lowest in terms of capital funding. (as a ratio of econony)

There were many chances of tech absorption in the past like type 219( which inspired the SoKo sub program) and Kilo( which inspired the PLAN sub program), but the current setup doesn't allow for exploiting any circumstance.
Then how is it different from just buying it? What you are saying is assembly shops leading to some job creation and some superficial skill development and perhaps QC? Thats why its hard to understand or trust any of our institutions when they say indigenous.....they built Arihant, didn't they? I am sure they imported sub assemblies but I hope they bought some critical tech to build upon?
 

Bhurki

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Then how is it different from just buying it? What you are saying is assembly shops leading to some job creation and some superficial skill development and perhaps QC? Thats why its hard to understand or trust any of our institutions when they say indigenous.....they built Arihant, didn't they? I am sure they imported sub assemblies but I hope they bought some critical tech to build upon?
The best way is to extend current production lines and add numbers. Not constrain it to 6. Like +3 or even +6 of the same P75
 

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India to start bidding process by October to procure 6 submarines costing Rs 55,000 crore

India is all set to launch the bidding process by next month for a Rs 55,000-crore mega project to build six conventional submarines for the Indian Navy to narrow the gap with China's growing naval prowess, government sources said on Sunday.

The submarines will be built in India under the much-talked-about strategic partnership model that allows domestic companies to join hands with leading foreign defence majors to produce high-end military platforms in the country and reduce import dependence.

The sources said the groundwork like specifications of the submarines and other critical requirements for issuance of the RFP (request for proposal) for the mega project, named as P-75 I, has been completed by separate teams of the defence ministry and the Indian Navy.


The RFP will be issued by October, they added.

The defence ministry has already shortlisted two Indian shipyards and five foreign defence majors for the project, being billed as one of biggest "Make in India" ventures.

The shortlisted Indian entities were L&T group and state-owned Mazagaon Docks Ltd (MDL) while the select foreign entities included ThyssenKrupp Marine Systems (Germany), Navantia (Spain) and Naval Group (France).

Initially, the defence ministry will issue RFPs to MDL and L&T and the two firms will have to submit their detailed bid after receiving the document. Subsequently, the L&T and MDL will have to select a foreign partner out of the five shortlisted entities, the sources said.

The Indian Navy plans to acquire 24 new submarines, including six nuclear attack submarines, to bolster its underwater fighting capability. It currently has 15 conventional submarines and two nuclear submarines.

The Navy has been focusing on significantly bolstering its overall capabilities in view of China's growing efforts to increase its military presence in the Indian Ocean Region.

The Indian Ocean, considered the backyard of the Indian Navy, is critical to the country's strategic interests.

According to global naval analysts, Chinese navy currently has over 50 submarines and about 350 ships. The total number of ships and submarines is projected to go past 500 in next 8-10 years.

The Indian Navy is also in the process of procuring 57 carrier-borne fighter jets, 111 Naval Utility Helicopters (NUH) and 123 multi-role helicopters under the strategic partnership model.

The policy envisages the establishment of long-term strategic partnerships with Indian defence majors through a transparent and competitive process wherein they would tie up with global original equipment manufacturers (OEMs) to seek technology transfers.

Initially, the strategic partners will be selected in four segments - fighter aircraft, helicopters, submarines and armoured fighting vehicles/main battle tanks. It is expected to be expanded to other segments.

In the last few months, the government has unveiled a series of reform measures and initiatives to make India a hub of defence manufacturing.

On August 9, Defence Minister Rajnath Singh announced that India will stop the import of 101 weapons and military platforms like transport aircraft, light combat helicopters, conventional submarines, cruise missiles and sonar systems by 2024.

In May, the government announced increasing the FDI limit from 49 per cent to 74 per cent under the automatic route in the defence sector.

India is one the largest importers of arms globally. According to estimates, the Indian armed forces are projected to spend around $130 billion in capital procurement in the next five years.

The government now wants to reduce dependence on imported military platforms and has decided to support the domestic defence manufacturing.

The defence ministry has set a goal of a turnover of $25 billion (Rs 1.75 lakh crore) in defence manufacturing in the next five years that included an export target of $5 billion (Rs 35,000 crore) worth of military hardware.

 

omaebakabaka

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Posting here the link to my detailed piece on P75I, do read & let me know your inputs.
Comprehensive overview of P75I program
Well, on paper Russia offer seems to be the best and no brainer but whats the real experience of working with them and how reliable and timely are they and also us in absorbing the tech transfer and build the domestic base to upgrade on those designs for next gen competetion?
 

bengalraider

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Well, on paper Russia offer seems to be the best and no brainer but whats the real experience of working with them and how reliable and timely are they and also us in absorbing the tech transfer and build the domestic base to upgrade on those designs for next gen competetion?
Russia has worked with India in upgrading the Indian Navy kilos to use Indian Equipment & provided a lot of the base technical knowhow for the Arihant program as well. As far as next gen is concerned let me say that apart from the KILO 636.6 all other SSK designs are untested in combat .
 

omaebakabaka

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Russia has worked with India in upgrading the Indian Navy kilos to use Indian Equipment & provided a lot of the base technical knowhow for the Arihant program as well. As far as next gen is concerned let me say that apart from the KILO 636.6 all other SSK designs are untested in combat .
Well, with a deal like what Russia is offering....shouldn't we just get away from imports in the following next 15 years? If not what is the point, same buying will continue....correct?
 

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