Project- 75(I). Next gen subs. RFP issued

Aniruddha Mulay

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What about the leak of acoustic signatures and other confidential information in the public domain.thats the only problem
That's why an improved Scorpene version, SMX 3.0 is a contender.
Data leak might be the reason another 3 Scorpene subs were not considered.
A few changes were made to somewhat reduce the effect of data leak on the Scorpene
 

BON PLAN

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What about the leak of acoustic signatures and other confidential information in the public domain.thats the only problem
It's a cold case. The leaked documents were marketing datas, nothing more.

It was a german black manoeuvre... It didn't affect the mother of all deal, the Australian one. So not an issue, really.
 
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BON PLAN

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That's why an improved Scorpene version, SMX 3.0 is a contender.
Data leak might be the reason another 3 Scorpene subs were not considered.
A few changes were made to somewhat reduce the effect of data leak on the Scorpene
SMX3 is another beast. a bigger sub (3000T when Scorpene is 1700T), with a native AIP. Tailored for P75I, when Scorpene is P75 answer.

You can't compare the two.
 

Aniruddha Mulay

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SMX3 is another beast. a bigger sub (3000T when Scorpene is 1700T), with a native AIP. Tailored for P75I, when Scorpene is P75 answer.

You can't compare the two.
Does the SMX 3.0 have VLS cells, because that is one important capability the IN wants in its P75I submarine.
 

J Praveen

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Face off between L&T with Russian's Rubin Design Bureau and MDL with French Naval Group

Naval Group, which has manufactured the Scorpene class of submarines in India with MDL, says that the industrially secure way’ would be to have an exclusive arrangement with just one Indian Strategic Partner.

The project is being processed on the Strategic Partnership model that will require the winning Indian company to manufacture six submarines in India. However, given that only two Indian shipyards are shortlisted, they have a choice of multiple foreign collaborators, leading to a potential clash of commercial interests.

“An exclusive arrangement with one SP might give more time to both the Original equipment manufacturer and the SP to prepare a thorough and exhaustive response to the RFP and thus provide Indian Navy with an offer with best possible solutions to all the identified requirements and minimum risks for the program over the long term. Indeed, exclusivity with a shipyard may be best cost effective and industrially secure way of responding to P75(I),” Alain Guillou, Senior Executive Vice President, Naval Group has said.

The senior executive said that the company was in touch with both the Indian companies since the shortlisting. “Like many other OEMs, we are having discussions with both SPs (L&T and MDL), who have been shortlisted rightly by the experienced Indian Navy and the government. MDL remains at core of Indian naval ship and submarine building while L&T is undoubtedly one of the biggest and qualified Indian national industrial for several sectors including strategic naval projects,” he said.

Besides the Naval Group, TKMS (Germany), Navantia (Spain), Rubin Design Bureau (Russia) and DSME (South Korea) have been shortlisted for the mega project. The next stage will be preparation of techno-commercial bids by the Indian companies in collaboration with a foreign partner of their choosing.

There are still doubts however if the foreign players will need to make offers with both Indian yards or can choose to have an exclusive arrangement with just one. “As OEM, we are not in position to comment and we shall follow the process as per SP guidelines. However it is true that the time required and the associated costs to make an offer of such magnitude are very high, sometimes as high as several millions of Euros. In addition to this the confidentiality of data related to the performance and subsequent “Chinese wall” arrangement to deal between partners will cost time, dedications and efforts of all parties involved,” Guillou said.

While technically, all five foreign technology collaborators have an equal chance of forming a winning partnership with the Indian company, the contest is expected to be a straight face off between the French Naval Group and Russia’s Rubin Design Bureau.

If the process goes smoothly, the final winner could be shortlisted within two years after an exhaustive trial and evaluation exercise. However, complications in the future include the ability of foreign collaborators to adhere with Indian conditions for technology transfer, delivery timelines and the responsibility for performance.
 

WolfPack86

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After IAF Rafales, MBDA’s Naval SCALP On ‘Super Scorpene’ For India’s Project 75I

European missile house MBDA’s long range Naval Cruise Missile (NCM) will be part of the weapons package tied to the improved Scorpene submarine that’s vying for Project 75I, India’s ambitious plan to build six new generation conventional attack submarines in country. The NCM, a ship/submarine version of the SCALP cruise missile that the Indian Air Force gets with its 36 Rafales, is receiving headline treatment at MBDA’s presence in the DefExpo 2020 show that kicked off today in Lucknow, India.


The contest, which has shortlisted two Indian shipyards and five foreign submarine types, is widely being seen as a straight fight between the Naval Group-MDL Scorpene and Russia’s United Shipbuilding Corp-L&T for the Amur 1650. Livefist visited production facilities for the latter last year for this detailed report on the Russian pitch.


The decision to field the NCM is unsurprising. Russia’s Amur 1650 pitch comes with options for the Kalibr/Club series of land attack cruise missiles. It was therefore expected that in addition to the Scorpene’s Exocet anti-ship missiles, the package needed a deep strike cruise missile capability, now fulfilled with the NCM.

In literature released ahead of Def Expo this year, MBDA said in a statement, ‘This very long-range surface attack stand-off cruise missile is designed to attack deep into enemy territory. Given its range, it will provide navies and surface and sub-surface vessels with the ability to maintain a prolonged dissuasive force in theatre unlike an aircraft launched missile. Drawing on elements of the combat-proven SCALP/Storm Shadow and weighing some 1,400 kg with an overall length of around 6.50m and a diameter of 0.5m, NCM offers destructive power against key infrastructure targets. Maximum precision and minimum collateral damages are assured thanks to the weapon’s guidance system which combines inertial guidance, terrain matching, and GPS with an imaging infrared seeker to achieve metric accuracies in the terminal phase. The missile has already been tested for both surface ship and submarine launch (vertically launched for the former and via the torpedo tubes for the latter with the submarine version housed in a special sea to air transition container). Surface ship operational capability was declared in May 2015 after a series of test firings had been successfully completed.’


The NCM is operational on the French Navy’s FREMM mutipurpose frigates, and will be on its current and future Barracuda-class nuclear submarines. The NCM has also seen combat, with French frigate Aquitane launching an undisclosed number of the weapon system during the 2018 land-attack bombings in Syria alongside air-launched SCALP missiles.


The SCALP air-launched cruise missile, of which the NCM is a derivative, will be in service with the Indian Air Force soon — the first IAF Rafale jets arrive in India in May, with deliveries of the first SCALPS expected to take place any time now.

Separately, it is widely expected that the P75I’s specifications, once further defined, will also formally demand the capability to deploy BrahMos supersonic cruise missiles. Livefist can confirm that BrahMos Corp. has completed discussions previously with all 5 shortlisted submarine vendors on integration of the BrahMos. The submarines shortlisted in P75I are the French Naval Group Scorpene (the baseline submarine built currently in India at Mazagon Docks0, the Russian Rubin Design Bureau Amur 1650, German Thyssenkrupp Type 214, Spanish Navantia S80 and an offering from South Korea’s DSME.
 

BON PLAN

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After IAF Rafales, MBDA’s Naval SCALP On ‘Super Scorpene’ For India’s Project 75I

European missile house MBDA’s long range Naval Cruise Missile (NCM) will be part of the weapons package tied to the improved Scorpene submarine that’s vying for Project 75I, India’s ambitious plan to build six new generation conventional attack submarines in country. The NCM, a ship/submarine version of the SCALP cruise missile that the Indian Air Force gets with its 36 Rafales, is receiving headline treatment at MBDA’s presence in the DefExpo 2020 show that kicked off today in Lucknow, India.


The contest, which has shortlisted two Indian shipyards and five foreign submarine types, is widely being seen as a straight fight between the Naval Group-MDL Scorpene and Russia’s United Shipbuilding Corp-L&T for the Amur 1650. Livefist visited production facilities for the latter last year for this detailed report on the Russian pitch.


The decision to field the NCM is unsurprising. Russia’s Amur 1650 pitch comes with options for the Kalibr/Club series of land attack cruise missiles. It was therefore expected that in addition to the Scorpene’s Exocet anti-ship missiles, the package needed a deep strike cruise missile capability, now fulfilled with the NCM.

In literature released ahead of Def Expo this year, MBDA said in a statement, ‘This very long-range surface attack stand-off cruise missile is designed to attack deep into enemy territory. Given its range, it will provide navies and surface and sub-surface vessels with the ability to maintain a prolonged dissuasive force in theatre unlike an aircraft launched missile. Drawing on elements of the combat-proven SCALP/Storm Shadow and weighing some 1,400 kg with an overall length of around 6.50m and a diameter of 0.5m, NCM offers destructive power against key infrastructure targets. Maximum precision and minimum collateral damages are assured thanks to the weapon’s guidance system which combines inertial guidance, terrain matching, and GPS with an imaging infrared seeker to achieve metric accuracies in the terminal phase. The missile has already been tested for both surface ship and submarine launch (vertically launched for the former and via the torpedo tubes for the latter with the submarine version housed in a special sea to air transition container). Surface ship operational capability was declared in May 2015 after a series of test firings had been successfully completed.’


The NCM is operational on the French Navy’s FREMM mutipurpose frigates, and will be on its current and future Barracuda-class nuclear submarines. The NCM has also seen combat, with French frigate Aquitane launching an undisclosed number of the weapon system during the 2018 land-attack bombings in Syria alongside air-launched SCALP missiles.


The SCALP air-launched cruise missile, of which the NCM is a derivative, will be in service with the Indian Air Force soon — the first IAF Rafale jets arrive in India in May, with deliveries of the first SCALPS expected to take place any time now.

Separately, it is widely expected that the P75I’s specifications, once further defined, will also formally demand the capability to deploy BrahMos supersonic cruise missiles. Livefist can confirm that BrahMos Corp. has completed discussions previously with all 5 shortlisted submarine vendors on integration of the BrahMos. The submarines shortlisted in P75I are the French Naval Group Scorpene (the baseline submarine built currently in India at Mazagon Docks0, the Russian Rubin Design Bureau Amur 1650, German Thyssenkrupp Type 214, Spanish Navantia S80 and an offering from South Korea’s DSME.
The two only contenders able to deliver a ban free naval cruise missile are : France and Russia.
All the others can only propose a foreign missile.
A first class asset for Russia and France.
 

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