Polish army "REGINA" program - Modernization of Artillery

[Saumyasupraik]

I have a few questions.

1)Is Poland not going for any towed 155mm howitzers?Are there any plans to induct light airliftable howitzers like the M777?

2)The RAK self-propelled mortar's tracked variant will be based on what chassis the Anders or the Chassis built by HSW itself?

3)Are there any plans of making the Dana NATO compatible for the time being till they get replaced by the KRYL?

4)9K76 Toczka is the RM-70/85?

 

[Damian]

1)Is Poland not going for any towed 155mm howitzers?Are there any plans to induct light airliftable howitzers like the M777?

No plans for towed, at least now.

2)The RAK self-propelled mortar's tracked variant will be based on what chassis the Anders or the Chassis built by HSW itself?

The turret is in fact separate module that can be placed on any wheeled and tracked chassis capable to hold weight of such turret and recoil of it's main weapon. There is also capability to mount this turret on any military vessel capable to use such weapon system.

3)Are there any plans of making the Dana NATO compatible for the time being till they get replaced by the KRYL?

No as far as official informations say, but "Kryl" might be in the end Dana with new gun, or something completely else. We will see.

4)9K76 Toczka is the RM-70/85?

No, this is Toczka, also known as 9K79, SS-21, Scarab:

And this is RM-70:

 

[Saumyasupraik]

The turret is in fact separate module that can be placed on any wheeled and tracked chassis capable to hold weight of such turret and recoil of it's main weapon. There is also capability to mount this turret on any military vessel capable to use such weapon system.

Yes, I am pretty sure it can be implemented on any chassis that can support the RAK but my question was are there any plans in the future to implement it in the Anders chassis if say the Anders is the future Tracked IFV of Poland?That would seem more sensible than using the HSW chassis.

No, this is Toczka, also known as 9K79, SS-21, Scarab:

Isn't the 9K76 the TMP-1 and the 9K79 the OTR-21?Aren't they two completely different systems?

 

[Damian]

Yes, I am pretty sure it can be implemented on any chassis that can support the RAK but my question was are there any plans in the future to implement it in the Anders chassis if say the Anders is the future Tracked IFV of Poland?That would seem more sensible than using the HSW chassis.

WPB Anders program was only a study, a test if we can do such vehicle, it was success, now OBRUM will recieve requirements from Land Forces Inspektorat Uzbrojenia (Armament Inspectorate) and will design a new light/medium weight universal platform, so yes perhaps in future, this new platform will be replacing currently used ones. And guess what, most probably HSW will be building that new platform, it was agreed between Bumar and HSW that Bumar will be making new MBT, HSW artillery systems and new light/medium platform and AMZ with WZM will work on platforms such as Rosomak.

Isn't the 9K76 the TMP-1 and the 9K79 the OTR-21?Aren't they two completely different systems?

Correct, well partially, it is not 9K76 but 9M76 and not TMP-1 but TR-1 Temp.

 

[Damian]

08.12.2012, 08:00 - Telewizja Polska SA

Here is TV documentary Nasza Armia (Our Army), in this episode, there is shown AHS "Krab", also with it's interior.

 

[militarysta]

New trening of the polish self-propelles 120mm motar on wheel (Wolverine APC) and tracks chassis - in codename "RAK" program ("Cancer")

Target hit by direct fire form 1,6km range. As we can see accuracy is almoust perfect.

Part of the amo store in turret - idea is simmilar to the Leclerc turret bustle autoloader, or Ob.640. Of course whole autoloader (and whole "RAK") is only polish made and polish how-know

motar on track chassis -this version of RAK will repalce all 2S1 122mm howitzer.

On AMV -polish "Rosomak"

Part of big "Rosomak" familiy.

 

[Kunal Biswas]

Can this Motar system mounter on BRDM or similar vehicle ?

 

[Damian]

Can this Motar system mounter on BRDM or similar vehicle ?

I suspect BRDM is too small, but it should fit on MTLB, as MAHSW-G on tracks, is based on MTLB.

 

[Damian]

And a small side note. The currently presented AHS Krab are first production or more correctly pre-production batch. The next vehicles will be somewhat different, for example HSW aims to replace currently used S-12U diesel, with one of diesel manufactured by German MTU. There is probably trend in armed forces to unify vehicle engines family and base it on MTU products, if possible manufactured on licence.

 

[militarysta]

News from the "REGINA" program:

155mm SPH Krab (Crab):

The program is is implemented successfully. Polish Army decided to buy not 75 but 120x SPH Krab 155mm.
It's good news for polish artylery.

WR-40 Langusta MLRS (Crayfish)

New 122mm rocket "Feniks-Z" is implemented successfull to the WR-40.
75x 20mm MLRS WR-40 "LANGUSTA" ("Crayfish") had been deliverd between last year.
Propably nex 24-48 MLRS will be buy.

155mm wheel howitzer Kryl program (Krill)
This program is in erly developmend phase. Until 2015 this phase will be end, and finall decision about this program will be taken.

227(300mm)/600(607mm) MLRS Homar program (Lobster)
This program have hight prioryty - until the fourth quarter of this year contract will be signed for the production of its elements. First MLRS Homar shoud be deliver for polish artilery in 2015. No photo is avaible, no infos abou rockets -propably will be the same as in US MLRS system.

120mm self-propelles motar on wheel and tracks chassis - "RAK" program (Cancer)
Track chassis part of this program is "frozen" until new track chasiss will be chosen in "Rydwan" program (Chariot program) - "Chariot" is polish future track platform (successor of the Anders program). But wheel program is close to the successfull ending Until the end of this year (2013) first wheel-Rak module will be ended. Polish army will buy 64x motars on wheel chassis

 

[Damian]

Nice! Finally after years of stagnation there is some positive development.

I am even surprised that all of this goes so well.

 

[Damian]

Older video with one of pre production vehicles.


And introduction to the Army.

 

[militarysta]

And next good news in polish REGINA program.

Polish Army buy 12 UAV system "Fly Eye" made by polish WB Electronic manufacurer:
9 for Special Forces
3 for artilery regiments:
- 5th in Sulechów
-11th in Węgorzew
-23th in Bolesławiec
Operational range Fly Eye is 50km so it's enought for WR-2000 MLRS and 155mm SPH Krab.

What is Fly Eye?
Here is promo material:
Of course eacht system "Fly Eye" it's not equel to 1 dron. Whole single system can have more then 3-6 flying drons.

Without that, Polish Army finnaly bought first seven (7) artielery radar "Liwiec":
Radar rozpoznania artyleryjskiego Liwiec - DziennikZbrojny.pl
It's only first batch.

 

[Armand2REP]

50km from station? I doubt that...

 

[militarysta]

50km from station? I doubt that...

Yes, it's max range of transmission to and from a dron.

BTW: And I found infos how many drons have one Fly Eye system in those configuration.
12 system bought now by Polish Army have total 48 drones so 1 system have circa 4 drons

 

[Armand2REP]

Yes, it's max range of transmission to and from a dron.

Nah, its a very light micro-UAV. They don't have a strong enough transmitter at that weight to get that range. Le DRAC carries even more payload yet gets less than half that. That is just horizon/altitude viewable distance.

BTW, it is spelled drone

 

[militarysta]

Nah, its a very light micro-UAV. They don't have a strong enough transmitter at that weight to get that range. Le DRAC carries even more payload yet gets less than half that. That is just horizon/altitude viewable distance.

BTW, it is spelled drone

Well in Poland always (even during comunism times) advanced was two thinghs:
-flying modells (airplanes, helicopters, etc)
- gliders
So Im able to belive that indeed Fly Eye can achive 50km operational range - and without doubt
WB Electronics transmitter alowed for that -especially that Fly Eye is not typical drone whit manuall controle - operator on goround use only cameras (thermal, CCD, etc) in real time but whole drone is flying on previous designed fly patch -whit abilities to modyfity it during fly. But as I know WB Electronis products (BMS, C3 systems, Future Soilder systems, artylery fire control systems, etc) then 50km in case transmission is fully possible. I rather duoubt in drone posibilities - those 50km is propably without wind and whit good weather conditions. When is stron wind then operational range can be even only half of that...

 

[Armand2REP]

Well I look at WB's fact sheet on Fly Eye and it doesn't say anything about 50km from station. Hand launched micro-UAVs all around the world do not get that kind of range and neither does yours.

 

[militarysta]

Well I look at WB's fact sheet on Fly Eye and it doesn't say anything about 50km from station. Hand launched micro-UAVs all around the world do not get that kind of range and neither does yours.

Of course it have 50km:
Fly Eye – kolejna umowa niezrealizowana w 2012 - DziennikZbrojny.pl
Look at last sentence:
Mijemy nadzieję, że to rozwiązanie tymczasowe, systemy Fly Eye o zasięgu łacza radiowego rzędu 50km ma się nijak do zadań (...)

And traslate by google trnaslator: "Eye Fly systems with a range of 50km wireless link"

Enought?

btw:
http://pl.wikipedia.org/wiki/WB_Electronics_FlyEye

OsiÄ…gi
Prędkość maks. 170 km/h
Pułap 6000 m n.p.m.
Zasięg 300 km (przy przemieszczającej się stacji naziemnej)
Długotrwałość lotu 2 - 4 h
Doskonałość max. 20 (po odrzuceniu ładunku użytecznego)

Zasięg 300 km (przy przemieszczającej się stacji naziemnej) - translate: Range -300km (whit moving ground command center)
Długotrwałosć lotu 2-4h - fly time


and Coup de grâce when we are talking about "less then half of that":
http://www.polskatimes.pl/artykul/5...ecia-i-wideo,13,id,t,sg.html#galeria-material
it's about civilian version of the Fly Eye for 112 emergency services (fire brigade, ambulance, highway monitoring service etc) whit civilian, non-military, a link to the drone:
Samolot może operować w promieniu 30 km. -translate "the plane" can operate in 30km radius"
It's about cyvilian version (in that article for highway monitoring service ) so military version can have 50km - like first quoted article told.

 

[Armand2REP]

Oh, just found the spec sheet for it. It says 10km, 30km, 50km so the portable man system is only 10km. It needs a truck mounted RF mast to get 50km.